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loratadine
28-05-08, 10:50 PM
ok, no direct topic for this :S



so thort id create one



soooo thoughts people?



im not very optimistic to be honest



my early predictions are



first test



south africa 24

wales 19



second test



south africa 29

wales 20

danny
29-05-08, 05:33 AM
After the grand slam Wales should be in confident mood ahead of these Tests. Its a shame about the players who are not going on tour but hopefully they can put that behind them and do well. Its hard to see Wales winning but I feel they will make a game of it and lose the test series by quite a slender margin. Looking forward to seeing Tom Cheeseman(the new Lomu) rip holes in the Springbok defence.

Steve-o
29-05-08, 08:36 AM
We got a new coach with new tactics so quite frankly I'm not sure of anything. I do think we'll win both though. Whoever chose the fixtures really wanted to put Wales up **** creek. The Boks are extremely hard to beat in Bloemfontein and Pretoria, Bloem is probably the 2nd, literally, hard field in the country after Kimberley. European teams tend to struggle on a hard surface.
I expect Kankowski to have more fans after this. He's been handing off the likes of McCaw all season, such an athlete.
If I've checked the stats right Wales has beaten the Boks once in a 100 years of playing against each other, and that was a 6 point victory in Cardiff. The last time Wales played in Pretoria they got beat 96-12 or around there. So history is on our side, which makes me feel a hella alot better.
Not gonna make predictions until a starting XV is announced.

dullonien
29-05-08, 08:43 AM
This can't be the same Lora? Predicting a Welsh loss, that doesn't usually happen. What's happened to your posts, why the gaps between each sentence? Oh well, nice to see you back mate, though some might not agree!


Looking forward to seeing Tom Cheeseman(the new Lomu) rip holes in the Springbok defence. [/b]
Lol, very good danny.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm a bit undecided about these tests. We've lost a few players who are very hard to replace. Loosing our first three scrum halves has hit us hard, it would any team. But maybe Gatland can get the best out of Cooper again?

Martyn Williams is another huge loss, but I think Jonathan Thomas will do a good job. Everyone ready to see the biggest back row in Welsh history? Mobility could be a problem!

The other major loss is Gavin Henson. He makes the backline tick, he will be the hardest to replace imo. Andrew Bishop is my favourite to start, just hope Gatland doesn't go for Parker.

Lee Burne won't be a huge loss imo. It'll give a chance to one of Jamie Roberts or Morgan Stoddard, both of which are more talented. Jamie Roberts should start imo, as Stoddard is defensively and positionally weak (though an absolute beast in attack).

The other debate is who will fill the right wing? Mark Jones will be back from injury, but I think Tom James deserves his chance. Highest try scorer in the Magners League in his first full season, a true athlete in every way. He's the future, give him his chance.

I'm not going to predict scores, my heart is ruling my head, which is never good.

Steve-o
29-05-08, 09:54 AM
Biggest backrow ever? Should an interesting match up since our backrow will be the fittest they're ever been after a hectic S14 under the ELV's.

Jer1cho
29-05-08, 10:05 AM
Biggest backrow ever? Should an interesting match up since our backrow will be the fittest they're ever been after a hectic S14 under the ELV's.[/b]

Yeah. Dont think there are any loosies in the welsh team that will catch Kankowski and Spies (who should start)

loratadine
29-05-08, 10:13 AM
i dont kno what happend there mate, with the spaces :S got a bit carried away

i read somewhere that pdv wants to abandon south africas traditional forward game for a much more elusive running game with the idea of running the welsh of the park at high altitude. i think that would be a mistake as the welsh fitness by all accounts has imrpoved again since the six nations, and lets be fair our fitness levels was one of the reasons we won a grand slam.

i really cant see south africa running away with it. its not in our mindset now to be smashed or blown away by sides. be good to see if our forwards will be able to step up there physicality another notch and compete with the world champs.

but i think wales are faster, fitter and stroner than they have ever, EVER been. so nows as good a chance as any

and another thing, ive really enjoyed listening to ryan jones in the build up. the ways he talks, im sure really motivates and inspires the welsh boys, if he isnt lions captain next year, than something definatly wrong.



Biggest backrow ever? Should an interesting match up since our backrow will be the fittest they're ever been after a hectic S14 under the ELV's.[/b]

Yeah. Dont think there are any loosies in the welsh team that will catch Kankowski and Spies (who should start) [/b]



i would disagree with that, i think the fact that they are big is gunna be quite deceptive for you guys, i mean jt nd ryan jones are both fairly mobile for big mean, jt especially is very athletic. and ryan is no slouch



and any gloucester/bath fan im sure will tell you that gareth delve is extremely extremeley fast for a back row forward, if he starts that is....which he should.

Steve-o
29-05-08, 10:30 AM
If those guys who mentioned can give NZ backs stick, then i'd say your right on the money

loratadine
29-05-08, 10:52 AM
i certainly wouldnt say there as fast as spies or kankowski, but the point im making is they are certainly no slouches. i think theyll be able to hold there own.

and on another point, what do the south africans feel will be the starting xv, im especially interested in the front row, the hlf backs, and the back three.

dullonien
29-05-08, 11:18 AM
Yeah. Dont think there are any loosies in the welsh team that will catch Kankowski and Spies (who should start) [/b]
Just tackle them before they get anywhere :P .

On a more serious note, the backrow battle will definitely be interesting. As Lora said, the probable Welsh backrow will be Ryan Jones, Jonathan Thomas and Gareth Delve. None are slow lumbering players, but they're not in the same league as Kankowski and Spies, speed wise. What they do posses though is power. All three are excellent ball carriers who are able to break the gain line.

We will deffinatly miss Martyn Williams crativity and poatching ability, but he has never been a quick player and that didn't hold us back during the six nations.

gingergenius
29-05-08, 11:21 AM
After the grand slam Wales should be in confident mood ahead of these Tests. Its a shame about the players who are not going on tour but hopefully they can put that behind them and do well. Its hard to see Wales winning but I feel they will make a game of it and lose the test series by quite a slender margin. Looking forward to seeing Tom Cheeseman(the new Lomu) rip holes in the Springbok defence.
[/b]

I thought that was wendell sailor? no, wait it was tuilagi. hang on, wasn't vainikolo the new lomu? some say there's this guy halai. others say matt banahan.......

<_<

Steve-o
29-05-08, 11:29 AM
My pick:
1 - Beast
2 - Smit
3 - BJ Botha
4 - Botha
5 - Matfield
6 - Watson
7 - Smith
8 - Kankowski
9 - Januarie
10 - James
11 - Habana
12 - De Villiers
13 - Steyn
14 - Chavhanga
15 - Monty

But me and PdV don&#39;t seem have the same line of thinking so I expect some surprises.

loratadine
29-05-08, 11:30 AM
matt banahan lol

Prestwick
29-05-08, 11:31 AM
You&#39;re ALL wrong! Everyone knows its Fransisco Leonelli!! Look at how he shook off not-so-super gnome in the HEC Semi! :lol:

loratadine
29-05-08, 11:33 AM
habana and chavanga on either flank :o some serious gas right there

i wouldnt be surprised actually to see spies starting at 6 for the boks :/

tom james is the new lomu!! better than lomu ever was, gunna just run in try after try againt the boks who wont be able to live with the sheer super human strength of the man

Steve-o
29-05-08, 11:48 AM
Funny you say that, the legend himself never managed to score against us, so his wannabes have the odds stacked against them ;)

loratadine
29-05-08, 11:56 AM
tom james aint a wannabe, hes almost superhuman, its uncanny :)

Steve-o
29-05-08, 01:39 PM
tom james aint a wannabe, hes almost superhuman, its uncanny :)
[/b]
Lora rating a Welsh player highly?! I&#39;ll have to keep an eye on him for sure!

danny
29-05-08, 04:47 PM
Funny you say that, the legend himself never managed to score against us, so his wannabes have the odds stacked against them ;)
[/b]
If thats true it is an amazing stat, I cant personally remember Lomu scoring against the Boks so it sounds right. James Small was the only winger in the world in those days who was crazy enough to tackle the big man.

dullonien
29-05-08, 08:59 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
tom james aint a wannabe, hes almost superhuman, its uncanny :)
[/b]
Lora rating a Welsh player highly?! I&#39;ll have to keep an eye on him for sure! [/b][/quote]


Lora&#39;s being very tongue in cheek, but Tom James will be a star. He&#39;s 15stone 8 (99kg) and very quick (not lightning) with a good step and knows his way to the try line. He&#39;s only been playing rugby for 2 years or so (he&#39;s an ex 400m runner, ran for Wales I believe). He&#39;s still very raw, but was the Magners League top try scorer this season. I can&#39;t even emagine how good he&#39;ll be when he&#39;s learn&#39;t the game properly!

dullonien
01-06-08, 09:03 PM
Well the Welsh team has been announced.



http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_unio...lsh/7430027.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/7430027.stm)

Wales team to play South Africa at Bloemfontein on June 7: Jamie Roberts; Mark Jones, Tom Shanklin, Sonny Parker, Shane Williams; Stephen Jones, Gareth Cooper; Gethin Jenkins, Matthew Rees, Adam Jones, Ian Gough, Alun-Wyn Jones, Jonathan Thomas, Dafydd Jones, Ryan Jones (capt)

Replacements: Duncan Jones, Richard Hibbard, Ian Evans, Gareth Delve, Warren Fury, James Hook, Morgan Stoddard

There&#39;s a couple of interesting decisions.

In the backrow, Gatland has decided to play Dafydd Jones at no 7 instead of moving Jonathan Thomas.

At 10, Gatland has gone with the reliable Stephen Jones, though expect Hook to have a good 20-30mins.

Unfortunately Sonny Parker has been given the 12 shirt. I&#39;ve never been a fan of the Parker-Shanklin midfield, mainly because the ball rarely get&#39;s passed Parkers hands. But I suppose I have to trust Gatland decisions, he&#39;s made the right calls in every game till now.

Mark Jones retains his wing position, whilst Jamie Roberts comes in for the injured Lee Burne at full back.

What does everyone think? Has Gatland made the right calls? Suppose only time will tell!

Sir Speedy
01-06-08, 09:18 PM
I&#39;m just happy Tom James wasn&#39;t picked. He&#39;s just too slow, and Habana and Chavanga (sp?) would have had a field day chipping over him and regathering.

Incredible Schalk
01-06-08, 09:42 PM
Cant wait for this game B)

Steve-o
02-06-08, 10:15 AM
Cant wait for this game B)
[/b]
Me too. This should be a great match for a neutral. Two passionate rugby nations going head to head. And I expect nothing but 100% from the Welsh, I really want to see a good contest.

Also, I read a headline on the home page that Stephen Jones is gonna get the nod instead of Hook. That appointment and the fact the Welsh scrum is bigger than usual, suggests Gatland is gonna try grind out a victory with some conservative play. Good idea I say, but only if we gonna pick Watson and Spies.

loratadine
02-06-08, 11:22 AM
prediction

wales 40
south africa 13

Jer1cho
02-06-08, 12:26 PM
prediction

wales 40
south africa 13
[/b]

:lol2tn: :lol2tn: :lol2tn: :lol2tn: :lol2tn: :lol2tn: :lol2tn: :lol2tn:

loratadine
02-06-08, 12:52 PM
lol the saffas think there going to bully us, but in the words of warren gatland "ID LIKE TO SEE THESE SOUTH AFRICANS TRY AND BULLY US"

were taking you to school lads!! gunna pummell your buttocks into oblivion :P

xxxxxx

Jer1cho
02-06-08, 01:16 PM
We are by no means going to bully the Welsh...... just run around them!!! :P

dullonien
02-06-08, 01:56 PM
prediction

wales 40
south africa 13 [/b]

There&#39;s the Lora we know and love. lol.

Steve-o
02-06-08, 02:18 PM
<div class='quotemain'> prediction

wales 40
south africa 13 [/b]

There&#39;s the Lora we know and love. lol.
[/b][/quote]
... and pity

Sir Speedy
02-06-08, 02:51 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'> prediction

wales 40
south africa 13 [/b]

There&#39;s the Lora we know and love. lol.
[/b][/quote]
... and pity
[/b][/quote]
You pity the truth? :huh:

Jer1cho
02-06-08, 03:09 PM
:wall:

loratadine
02-06-08, 03:34 PM
cant wait to get physcial with some big strong south africans on saturday :P always love playing with the saffas :P woooiieeeeee :P
xxxxxx

Steve-o
02-06-08, 03:43 PM
cant wait to get physcial with some big strong south africans on saturday :P always love playing with the saffas :P woooiieeeeee :P
xxxxxx
[/b]
Calm down there cowboy, keep it in your pants :lol:
Please.. tell me those x&#39;s aren&#39;t what I think they are

Macsen
02-06-08, 04:07 PM
Can&#39;t see Wales losing this one. Gatland&#39;s got a 5/5 record, while de Villiers hasn&#39;t won a match yet. :P

Steve-o
02-06-08, 04:22 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'> prediction

wales 40
south africa 13 [/b]

There&#39;s the Lora we know and love. lol.
[/b][/quote]
... and pity
[/b][/quote]
You pity the truth? :huh:
[/b][/quote]
If Lora&#39;s show name is "the truth", then yes :huh:

:P

loratadine
02-06-08, 04:47 PM
be quiet danny, its not my fault i dont like england...


but the saffas on the other hand... diff story completely

huge, physical, warriors of men :o i just cant wait, saturdays going to be incredible :P

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Steve-o
02-06-08, 04:56 PM
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[/b]
oh dear, he&#39;s climaxing

Bullitt
02-06-08, 05:02 PM
first test
south africa 24
wales 19

second test
south africa 29
wales 20[/b]

He started off being realistic at least...

Steve-o
03-06-08, 12:54 PM
http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=6&am...81318115C238532 (http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=6&click_id=194&art_id=nw20080602181318115C238532)

John Smit&#39;s lucky number 50


John Smit will become the first Springbok captain to lead South Africa in 50 tests when they face Wales in Bloemfontein on Saturday.

"It&#39;s a fantastic honour," said Smit after coach Peter de Villiers confirmed his selection in a media release on Monday.

But he added: "Believe me it&#39;s the last thing on my mind - Wales give us more than enough of a challenge to keep our minds totally on winning the match."

De Villiers said: "We are all immensely proud of what he will achieve on Saturday. He&#39;s too modest to admit it himself, but it really is something big - especially when you consider the modern day merry-go-round of test captains."
Under former coach Jake White, Smit led the Springboks to World Cup triumph in France last year and lifted the Tri-Nations trophy in 2004.

Smit, the fifth most-capped Springbok of all time, will be winning his 76th cap on Saturday. [/b]



Amazing milestone for Smit, so glad it&#39;s gonna happen on home soil.

loratadine
03-06-08, 02:47 PM
john smit appears to be a wonderful human being, he is well built, stocky and very macho. im sure the welsh boys will look forward to getting physicall with such a bear.
xxxxxxx

Incredible Schalk
03-06-08, 04:43 PM
john smit appears to be a wonderful human being, he is well built, stocky and very macho. im sure the welsh boys will look forward to getting physicall with such a bear.
xxxxxxx
[/b]
:lol: quality post man

Sir Speedy
03-06-08, 05:35 PM
So, is anyone going to the game?
Wish I could, but SA is all the way down there, and I&#39;m all the way up here. :c

Steve-o
04-06-08, 05:47 PM
Good news, no rain is forecasted for Saturday. Just a brisk north-wester blowing

Sir Speedy
04-06-08, 05:51 PM
Good news, no rain is forecasted for Saturday. Just a brisk north-wester blowing
[/b]
Yep, we&#39;ll see some good attacking rugby from both teams a la:

Cooper ==> Jones ==> Shanklin ==> Parker ==> Habana ==> try.

<_<

Boggle
04-06-08, 06:03 PM
So, is anyone going to the game?
Wish I could, but SA is all the way down there, and I&#39;m all the way up here. :c [/b]

I was really thinking of going to the Loftus game the next week, it&#39;d be my first time going to a Springbok match.

Unfortunately I have no idea where to begin with buying my tickets, I checked Computicket but they&#39;ve only got a small amount and not the stand I&#39;m looking for. (I knew tickets were expensive but I wasn&#39;t expecting R375.

I&#39;m also writing my last exam on the same day though :(

I might take a walk to Loftus after my exam on friday though, just to check if they&#39;ve got any of the seats left that I&#39;m looking for, you can buy tickets -at- Loftus right ?

Steve-o
04-06-08, 07:33 PM
Boggle, there were still quite a few tickets left last week. I also went to computicket 1st and they only had expensive tickets near the corner. Was told they sell cheaper tickets at Loftus. The 2 cheaper tickets are the scholar seats behind the posts and the top section of the eaststand (R250).

Boggle
04-06-08, 08:00 PM
and the top section of the eaststand (R250). [/b]



hhmmm, those were the ones I was looking for, every time I&#39;ve been at loftus I&#39;ve sat on the east stand and as far as I&#39;m concerned it&#39;s an excellent spot, just a bit disappointed that only the top seats seem to be cheap.



I&#39;ll definitely go and make a stop there though, I&#39;ll get in contact with some of my buddies see if they have the time (and cash) to go watch the game with me. I&#39;ve been absolutely -duying- to go watch a Springbok game for years now.

Cymro
04-06-08, 08:18 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_unio...lsh/7434310.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/7434310.stm)

Luke Chateris has been called up due to Bradley Davies having ankle ligaments injury!

Steve-o
04-06-08, 09:06 PM
<div class='quotemain'> and the top section of the eaststand (R250). [/b]



hhmmm, those were the ones I was looking for, every time I&#39;ve been at loftus I&#39;ve sat on the east stand and as far as I&#39;m concerned it&#39;s an excellent spot, just a bit disappointed that only the top seats seem to be cheap.



I&#39;ll definitely go and make a stop there though, I&#39;ll get in contact with some of my buddies see if they have the time (and cash) to go watch the game with me. I&#39;ve been absolutely -duying- to go watch a Springbok game for years now.
[/b][/quote]
Yeah the eaststand is fine, I was surprised how much you see from there, you hardly need to check the big screen out. Although R250 is still steep!

danny
05-06-08, 09:39 AM
Good luck to both sides and I hope its a competitive match. Prediction: South Africa 42 Wales 12.

Jer1cho
05-06-08, 10:17 AM
I have a feeling the team is not going to be the best available.... Adrian Jacobs at centre insted of Steyn... Luke Watson in the loose trio replacing Kankowski, Jantjes instead of Montgomery... (Thanks you Oregen Hoskins you piece of **** )

My prediction:

South Africa 32
Wales 28

I&#39;ts gonna be close because of our stupid quota selection policy. If Wales were at full strength, i wouldn&#39;t have been surprised by a win from them.

silent_shadow
05-06-08, 12:47 PM
Ricky Januarie you fool!
Januarie&#39;s been dropped for disciplinary reasons. This means we have Bolla Conradie at 9 and and out-of-form Ruan Pienaar on the bench. I don&#39;t know which is worse. Plus, this means Pienaar will effectively be replacing Steyn on the bench. Also, no Kankowski!
SA Team:
15. Conrad Jantjes
14. Tonderai Chavhanga
13. Adrian Jacobs
12. Jean de Villiers
11. Bryan Habana
10. Butch James
9. Bolla Conradie
8. Pierre Spies
7. Juan Smith
6. Luke Watson
5. Andries Bekker
4. Bakkies Botha
3. Brian Mujati
2. John Smit &copy;
1. Gurthro Steenkamp.

Subs: Bismarck du Plessis, CJ van der Linde, Victor Matfield, Danie Rossouw , Ruan Pienaar, Peter Grant, Percy Montgomery.

I don&#39;t think PdV cares much about who&#39;s starting, or maybe he wants the experienced old heads of Percy and Matfield for the end of the game.
Steyn&#39;s omission is understandable considering Grant and Percy have to be there and Pienaar can cover 9. But Rossouw ahead of Kankowski?! Just because he can cover lock and loosie?
I&#39;m being optomistic here and guessing that next week he&#39;ll experiment and replace Spies with Kankowski. Still though, Rossouw didn&#39;t even start for the bulls.

nam97
05-06-08, 12:52 PM
Is Jaque Fourie injured?

Jer1cho
05-06-08, 01:12 PM
No Francois Steyn, or Ryan Kankowski? Retard coach!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I knew he would do it.

Steve-o
05-06-08, 02:55 PM
Is Jaque Fourie injured?
[/b]
Yep, he&#39;ll probably be ready for the Tri Nations.

Well well, Conradie is a starting Springbok now. Great stuff. De Villiers&#39; Cape favouritism is starting to show. Is Conradie better than Kockett, hey Peter? Is he?! Maybe he wants to make things fair and choose our 5th choice scrum as well? FFS..
8 months ago the Bulls and the Sharks brought the William Webb Ellis cup home, now the team is starting to resemble the Rudolf Straulie era.

jeffb
05-06-08, 02:57 PM
Looking forward to this match. Just hope it goes well for Shaun Edwards.

Sir Speedy
05-06-08, 02:59 PM
Oh yes, it&#39;s looking very god for us <strike>no-hopers</strike> Welsh. ;)

*cue Shane Williams injury ruling him out of both tests*

Jer1cho
05-06-08, 03:01 PM
Yep, he&#39;ll probably be ready for the Tri Nations.

Well well, Conradie is a starting Springbok now. Great stuff. De Villiers&#39; Cape favouritism is starting to show. Is Conradie better than Kockett, hey Peter? Is he?! Maybe he wants to make things fair and choose our 5th choice scrum as well? FFS..
8 months ago the Bulls and the Sharks brought the William Webb Ellis cup home, now the team is starting to resemble the Rudolf Straulie era.


--------------------
IPB Image[/b]


He left out Ryan Kankowski. He is not on the bench. One of the best loose forwards in years. Such a young talent, being compared to greats such as Zinzan Brooke. Yet he is not even on the bench??? Danie Rossouw, better than Ryan Kankowski? WTF???

mike-o-l
05-06-08, 03:16 PM
Big surprises in the squad. Don&#39;t think Guthro should be there, we have better Props than him. Nice to see the Bekker and Janties are getting chances but the teams looks like were playing an average team, not the Six nations champions. Bolle doesn&#39;t start for the Stormers so he definately play for the Boks. Kankoski is the biggest surprise after taking so many teams to pieces when running with the ball. Maybe Pienaars in for his ability to play anywhere.
Could this be the chance the Welsh have being waiting for

Steve-o
05-06-08, 03:18 PM
Yep, he&#39;ll probably be ready for the Tri Nations.

Well well, Conradie is a starting Springbok now. Great stuff. De Villiers&#39; Cape favouritism is starting to show. Is Conradie better than Kockett, hey Peter? Is he?! Maybe he wants to make things fair and choose our 5th choice scrum as well? FFS..
8 months ago the Bulls and the Sharks brought the William Webb Ellis cup home, now the team is starting to resemble the Rudolf Straulie era.


--------------------
IPB Image[/b]


He left out Ryan Kankowski. He is not on the bench. One of the best loose forwards in years. Such a young talent, being compared to greats such as Zinzan Brooke. Yet he is not even on the bench??? Danie Rossouw, better than Ryan Kankowski? WTF???
[/b]
Yeh, all that talk about players selected on merit doesn&#39;t hold water. Hopefully he knows what he&#39;s doing by lying like that. Quotas are still alive and kicking

silent_shadow
05-06-08, 04:07 PM
If Januarie didn&#39;t mess up, this team wouldn&#39;t be half bad (except for Kankowski&#39;s exclusion). That means Bolla is in the starting line up and Pienaa replaces Steyn. Vermaak >>> Kocksh*t though ;)
Even then this team is still a good team if you forget our scrumhalf and Wales are missing their first choice 3 scrummies as well if I remember correctly. Spies is a quality player. Just because the team doesn&#39;t look quite as awesome as it could if Kankowski was playing, doesn&#39;t mean we&#39;re going to get ripped to shreds.

Sir Speedy
05-06-08, 05:27 PM
If Januarie didn&#39;t mess up, this team wouldn&#39;t be half bad (except for Kankowski&#39;s exclusion). That means Bolla is in the starting line up and Pienaa replaces Steyn. Vermaak >>> Kocksh*t though ;)
Even then this team is still a good team if you forget our scrumhalf and Wales are missing their first choice 3 scrummies as well if I remember correctly. Spies is a quality player. Just because the team doesn&#39;t look quite as awesome as it could if Kankowski was playing, doesn&#39;t mean we&#39;re going to get ripped to shreds.
[/b]
It just means you&#39;re going to lose.

Prestwick
05-06-08, 05:28 PM
If Januarie didn&#39;t mess up, this team wouldn&#39;t be half bad (except for Kankowski&#39;s exclusion). That means Bolla is in the starting line up and Pienaa replaces Steyn. Vermaak >>> Kocksh*t though ;)
Even then this team is still a good team if you forget our scrumhalf and Wales are missing their first choice 3 scrummies as well if I remember correctly. Spies is a quality player. Just because the team doesn&#39;t look quite as awesome as it could if Kankowski was playing, doesn&#39;t mean we&#39;re going to get ripped to shreds. [/b]

Oh god, now look what you idiots have done! You&#39;ve only gone and put the Welsh in a good mood!

Now we have put up with a load of circus midgets covered in coal dust gabbering on in Welsh excitedly! THANKS :ranting:

silent_shadow
05-06-08, 05:30 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
If Januarie didn&#39;t mess up, this team wouldn&#39;t be half bad (except for Kankowski&#39;s exclusion). That means Bolla is in the starting line up and Pienaa replaces Steyn. Vermaak >>> Kocksh*t though ;)
Even then this team is still a good team if you forget our scrumhalf and Wales are missing their first choice 3 scrummies as well if I remember correctly. Spies is a quality player. Just because the team doesn&#39;t look quite as awesome as it could if Kankowski was playing, doesn&#39;t mean we&#39;re going to get ripped to shreds.
[/b]
It just means you&#39;re going to lose. [/b][/quote]

We&#39;ll see about that...

silent_shadow
05-06-08, 05:55 PM
<div class='quotemain'> If Januarie didn&#39;t mess up, this team wouldn&#39;t be half bad (except for Kankowski&#39;s exclusion). That means Bolla is in the starting line up and Pienaa replaces Steyn. Vermaak >>> Kocksh*t though ;)
Even then this team is still a good team if you forget our scrumhalf and Wales are missing their first choice 3 scrummies as well if I remember correctly. Spies is a quality player. Just because the team doesn&#39;t look quite as awesome as it could if Kankowski was playing, doesn&#39;t mean we&#39;re going to get ripped to shreds. [/b]

Oh god, now look what you idiots have done! You&#39;ve only gone and put the Welsh in a good mood!

Now we have put up with a load of circus midgets covered in coal dust gabbering on in Welsh excitedly! THANKS :ranting:
[/b][/quote]

And here I thought I was the only South African being optomistic. :rolleyes:
To be honest I still don&#39;t think we&#39;ll lose. The only real weak spot in that team is scrumhalf and that&#39;ll also be a weak point for Wales. Jacobs&#39; defensive is also worrying, but at least he provides some attacking flair. In any case we have an asweome backline with Chavanga, Jean, Jacobs, Habana and Jantjes we should break the line at will and Butch is in fine form at the moment.
The forwards are also strong and in case Wales start troubling us we have Matfield and Percy to come off the bench and provide some experience and of course quality.
I do agree that some strange choices were made, but I think a lot of people are overreacting.

danny
05-06-08, 06:53 PM
I hate to say I told you so but De Villiers is hellbent on implementing the nations majority agenda. This should come as no surprise to any South Africans and I can see this guy and his backers putting the famous Boks back years. This is the start of something terrible for a proud rugby nation

Thingimubob
05-06-08, 10:29 PM
ah come on, give him a chance. It&#39;s his first game, and he wants to experiment! It&#39;s not as if this is the most important game going, and considering a fair few of the WC stars are getting on a bit, and moving on to European Clubs, he&#39;s gotta start considering who&#39;s gonna replace them.
But anyway, I honestly think that Wales are capable of sneaking a result, and I;m not going just on starting line-ups. We&#39;ve got some very decent players settled in teh team, and others (like Cooper, Daffydd Jones and Jamie Roberts) who are certain to be deperate to get a long term place in teh team. Not gonna predict anything, because I&#39;ve had crap predictions this season (apart from the Six Natiosn anyway).

shtove
06-06-08, 12:06 AM
I honestly think that Wales are capable of sneaking a result, and I;m not going just on starting line-ups. We&#39;ve got some very decent players settled in teh team, and others (like Cooper, Daffydd Jones and Jamie Roberts) who are certain to be deperate to get a long term place in teh team. Not gonna predict anything, because I&#39;ve had crap predictions this season (apart from the Six Natiosn anyway).
[/b]
If Wales win there&#39;s no way you could describe that as sneaking - a big result that must be down to Gatland bringing in underperformers or newbies who instantly fit with a team that knows how to take a tight game.

Coming out of SA with even one win after losing a handful of big game players will put Wales on a new level.

C&#39;mon ye boyos!

Jer1cho
06-06-08, 05:06 AM
I hate to say I told you so but De Villiers is hellbent on implementing the nations majority agenda. This should come as no surprise to any South Africans and I can see this guy and his backers putting the famous Boks back years. This is the start of something terrible for a proud rugby nation[/b]

How sad is it hey? All the assholes here care about is "True representation." Can someone tell me what the sole purpose of the sport is? Is it to take the best your country has to offer, and show the world that you are the best, and play with pride, while TRULY REPRESENTING your country? Or is the purpose of sport perhaps to show the world how many black players you have in comparison with how many white players you have.

That **** bag Sport minister of ours Mike Stofile, said that if we lose every game we play, but "represent our country racially" then so be it. I hope he dies miserably. Even our national hockey team was threatened that if half (50%) of the men and woman teams are not black, they are not going to the Olympics.

We have a national crisis where Immigrants are getting burned alive, exiled, and forced out of the country, yet ****ing with rugby is more important. I hate it so much.

Bull
06-06-08, 06:21 AM
Some stupid black woman of parliament in SA once said that teams should be representative of the majority. That is utter bull****, look at the US black people are a vast minority but take the NFL and NBA there they represent or make up 70% + of the teams and it&#39;s not because they are black but because they are the best at what they do, the same with the NHL where there are almost no black people.

South Africa needs to move away from this you get the job or you get picked for the team because your skin is black. You need to be picked on the basis of experience, merit and qualifications. Finish and klaar. That&#39;s why this country is in such a shambles with things like Eskom and service delivery.

Steve-o
06-06-08, 07:33 AM
<div class='quotemain'>I honestly think that Wales are capable of sneaking a result, and I;m not going just on starting line-ups. We&#39;ve got some very decent players settled in teh team, and others (like Cooper, Daffydd Jones and Jamie Roberts) who are certain to be deperate to get a long term place in teh team. Not gonna predict anything, because I&#39;ve had crap predictions this season (apart from the Six Natiosn anyway).
[/b]
If Wales win there&#39;s no way you could describe that as sneaking - a big result that must be down to Gatland bringing in underperformers or newbies who instantly fit with a team that knows how to take a tight game.

Coming out of SA with even one win after losing a handful of big game players will put Wales on a new level.

C&#39;mon ye boyos! [/b][/quote]

If anything, the Bok team are the newbies. Got this off keo.co.za.



SPRINGBOKS

1. Gurthro Steenkamp (13 Tests)
2. John Smit (75 Tests)
3. Brian Mujati (0 Tests)
4. Bakkies Botha (45 Tests)
5. Andries Bekker (0 Tests)
6. Luke Watson (1 Test)
7. Juan Smith (42 Tests)
8. Pierre Spies (7 Tests)
9. Bolla Conradie (15 Tests)
10. Butch James (26 Tests)
11. Bryan Habana (36 Tests)
12. Jean de Villiers (33 Tests)
13. Adi Jacobs (10 Tests)
14. Tonderai Chavhanga (2 Tests)
15. Conrad Jantjes (11 Tests)

Total of 316 caps, average of just over 21 caps per player



WALES:

1. Adam Jones (48 Tests)
2. Matthew Rees (21 Tests)
3. Gethin Jenkins (58 Tests)
4. Ian Gough (50 Tests)
5. Alun-Wyn Jones (21 Tests)
6. Jonathan Thomas (44 Tests)
7. Dafydd Jones (29 Tests)
8. Ryan Jones (21 Tests)
9. Gareth Cooper (35 Tests)
10. Stephen Jones (70 Tests)
11. Shane Williams (56 Tests)
12. Sonny Parker (30 Tests)
13. Tom Shanklin (52 Tests)
14. Mark Jones (39 Tests)
15. Jamie Roberts (1 Test)

TOTAL: 575 caps, average 38 caps per player

---

Even if all those experienced players on the bench came on, it doesn&#39;t represent our strongest team. Will the world ever see our best 15 players wear the green and gold in the game? I hope so. You&#39;ll probably have to watch the Tri-Nations, assuming that PdV is using the 3 June Test matches to experiment. Hopefully in the 2nd Test we&#39;ll bring out the big guns, give them a good a proper thrashing just to show the Boks mean business in thier own backyard. Not this water down version of a Bok starting 15. Wales are champions of Europe! Come on PdV, have a go!






That **** bag Sport minister of ours Mike Stofile, said that if we lose every game we play, but "represent our country racially" then so be it. I hope he dies miserably. Even our national hockey team was threatened that if half (50%) of the men and woman teams are not black, they are not going to the Olympics.


[/b]

I thank Bob Marley everyday that Stofile lost in the running to become the SARU president this year. Racial discrimination is against iRB policy, we learnt about that when the Boks got banned during the apartheid years, but now they turn a blind eye to this circus? The international rugby community must stand up against this BS.

Jer1cho
06-06-08, 07:51 AM
Oh well. Chavhanga and Habana at one wing is still a promising aspect. The only real thing i am cheesed about is Jacobs at centre. How good would De Villiers and Steyn be together? Lethal i think!!! PdV is gonna get whacked so hard by the media if we lose this.

*worried bok fan retreats while thinking about the Welsh smiles busy accumulating* :(

KZNSharksFan
06-06-08, 08:42 AM
I hate to say I told you so but De Villiers is hellbent on implementing the nations majority agenda. This should come as no surprise to any South Africans and I can see this guy and his backers putting the famous Boks back years. This is the start of something terrible for a proud rugby nation
[/b]

I knew it was over when those politically aligned ******** at SA rugby appointed a coach who has no proven track record, instead of Heyneke Meyer, who has won the super 14, numerous currie cups, been to 3(i think) s14 semi finals and who incidentally doesnt spout nonsensical ****e and contradictions from his rectum like De Villiers does. God i hate S African Politicians!!!!!

The Boks will win, but after that.... im not so sure. I really do think this may be the beginning of a long spell of Springbok calamity and bs.

Sorry to overshadow what should be a good game with some of my pent up frustration

loratadine
06-06-08, 10:23 AM
i think the springboks are going to be in for one MIGHTY MIGHTY shock.

wales 30
south africa 19

Jer1cho
06-06-08, 11:04 AM
i think the springboks are going to be in for one MIGHTY MIGHTY shock.

wales 30
south africa 19[/b]

Dont you mean the representatives? Because Wales might beat the representatives, but come back and talk to us when they beat the Springboks. LOL. Adrian Jacobs, ridiculous.

Incredible Schalk
06-06-08, 11:46 AM
Springboks 62
Wales 7 ;)

Macsen
06-06-08, 12:48 PM
Springboks 62
Wales 7 ;) [/b]
You forgot one &#39;0&#39; at the end there.

Sir Speedy
06-06-08, 01:08 PM
<div class='quotemain'> If Januarie didn&#39;t mess up, this team wouldn&#39;t be half bad (except for Kankowski&#39;s exclusion). That means Bolla is in the starting line up and Pienaa replaces Steyn. Vermaak >>> Kocksh*t though ;)
Even then this team is still a good team if you forget our scrumhalf and Wales are missing their first choice 3 scrummies as well if I remember correctly. Spies is a quality player. Just because the team doesn&#39;t look quite as awesome as it could if Kankowski was playing, doesn&#39;t mean we&#39;re going to get ripped to shreds. [/b]

Oh god, now look what you idiots have done! You&#39;ve only gone and put the Welsh in a good mood!

Now we have put up with a load of circus midgets covered in coal dust gabbering on in Welsh excitedly! THANKS :ranting:
[/b][/quote]
Oh fek off with the midget stuff Prest, we all know you love our language! http://img.gamespot.com/gamespot/shared/emoticons/mad.gif

And for the prediction:

South Africa 17
Wales 23

Steve-o
06-06-08, 01:22 PM
We should still win. With the current team I&#39;d say +20... If we were to pick a team on merit +50
If the Welsh lose to us by more than +20 points, they should feel very ashamed

Sir Speedy
06-06-08, 01:32 PM
With the current team I&#39;d say +20... If we were to pick a team on merit +50
[/b]
20+ to Wales? Sounds good to me. :cheers:

Steve-o
06-06-08, 01:42 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
With the current team I&#39;d say +20... If we were to pick a team on merit +50
[/b]
20+ to Wales? Sounds good to me. :cheers:
[/b][/quote]
Wow! That&#39;s really clever

Sir Speedy
06-06-08, 01:45 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'>
With the current team I&#39;d say +20... If we were to pick a team on merit +50
[/b]
20+ to Wales? Sounds good to me. :cheers:
[/b][/quote]
Wow! That&#39;s really clever
[/b][/quote]
I pride myself over my clever...

loratadine
06-06-08, 02:07 PM
lmao
to be honest i think the south africans are gunna be in for one hell of an afternoon

this side gatland nd edwards have built, are far far far too intense to loose by 20 points

it is going to be a war, and south africa will not bully us, theyll try it, nd just like a heavyweight champion we&#39;ll come back nd knock them down.

we will win this test.

dullonien
06-06-08, 02:10 PM
Springboks 62
Wales 7 ;) [/b]

We should still win. With the current team I&#39;d say +20... If we were to pick a team on merit +50 [/b]
Wow, talk about underestimating us! We did only concede 2 try&#39;s throughout the entire 6 nations you know.

My prediction: SA 21 - 15 Wales (If Parker plays his usual rubbish self).

If Parker plays well, closer, if not a Welsh win :mellow: .

Boggle
06-06-08, 02:26 PM
<div class='quotemain'> Springboks 62
Wales 7 ;) [/b]
You forgot one &#39;0&#39; at the end there.
[/b][/quote]



Springboks 620

Wales 7 ?



I dunno, that -does- sound a bit far fetched.

Steve-o
06-06-08, 03:08 PM
<div class='quotemain'> Springboks 62
Wales 7 ;) [/b]

We should still win. With the current team I&#39;d say +20... If we were to pick a team on merit +50 [/b]
Wow, talk about underestimating us! We did only concede 2 try&#39;s throughout the entire 6 nations you know.
[/b][/quote]
Yip I do.
We&#39;ve got James, De Villiers, Chavhanga, Spies, Smith and Habana you know.

Cymro
06-06-08, 03:37 PM
South Africa should nip a win here, I dont think some of the scores banded round are a fair reflection, im with dullonien on his predicition!

Incredible Schalk
06-06-08, 03:55 PM
<div class='quotemain'> Springboks 62
Wales 7 ;) [/b]
You forgot one &#39;0&#39; at the end there.
[/b][/quote]


:D

Seriously this should be great, the summer internationals after a world cup always have a sense of unpredictability. Trying to look at it from a neutrals point of view i dont see how Wales can win, the Boks should win by 20 points imo. Wales have some of their best players out and the Springboks are a better side anyway, we will see.



<div class='quotemain'> Springboks 62
Wales 7 ;) [/b]

We should still win. With the current team I&#39;d say +20... If we were to pick a team on merit +50 [/b]
Wow, talk about underestimating us! We did only concede 2 try&#39;s throughout the entire 6 nations you know.

My prediction: SA 21 - 15 Wales (If Parker plays his usual rubbish self).

If Parker plays well, closer, if not a Welsh win :mellow: .
[/b][/quote]


Yea 2 tries :huh: From my calculations wasnt it 15?

I was joking with the 62 point scoreline, the scores put up here are biased both ways, Bok fans and Wales fans is mainly what the thread of is made up of as you would expect.

I&#39;d expect it to be somewhere in the middle as i said around a 20 Springbok win. I would just love to see Chavanga in full flight.

Sir Speedy
06-06-08, 03:58 PM
Yea 2 tries :huh: From my calculations wasnt it 15?

[/b]
No. :huh:

loratadine
06-06-08, 03:59 PM
15 tries conceaded :S wat? are you joking around?

toby flood scored against us and castrogiovani
cross kick and overthrown line out 5 metres out

silent_shadow
06-06-08, 06:37 PM
Wow, talk about underestimating us! We did only concede 2 try&#39;s throughout the entire 6 nations you know.
[/b]

Yeah, but that says more about the quality of the six nations than your defense.

Unlike some people here who are seemingly already signaling the death of SA rugby, I&#39;ll wait and see how we perform before taking the coach apart.

Sir Speedy
06-06-08, 07:02 PM
<div class='quotemain'>

Wow, talk about underestimating us! We did only concede 2 try&#39;s throughout the entire 6 nations you know.
[/b]

Yeah, but that says more about the quality of the six nations than your defense.

[/b][/quote]
Oh obviously. There&#39;s no way that any NH team could ever have defence good enough to withstand the SH&#39;ers. :huh: Seriously, what a stupid thing to say...

Incredible Schalk
06-06-08, 07:02 PM
<div class='quotemain'>

Yea 2 tries :huh: From my calculations wasnt it 15?

[/b]
No. :huh:
[/b][/quote]


Oh sorry i thought you meant scored :ph34r:

Sir Speedy
06-06-08, 07:09 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'>

Yea 2 tries :huh: From my calculations wasnt it 15?

[/b]
No. :huh:
[/b][/quote]


Oh sorry i thought you meant scored :ph34r:
[/b][/quote]
In that case: 217

:)

silent_shadow
06-06-08, 07:17 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'>

Wow, talk about underestimating us! We did only concede 2 try&#39;s throughout the entire 6 nations you know.
[/b]

Yeah, but that says more about the quality of the six nations than your defense.

[/b][/quote]
Oh obviously. There&#39;s no way that any NH team could ever have defence good enough to withstand the SH&#39;ers. :huh: Seriously, what a stupid thing to say... [/b][/quote]

This has nothing to do with SH vs NH. I watched this year&#39;s six nations and it was probably one of the worst in a long time. No team really looked penetrative on attack other than the French (and that was before they started experimenting with their side).
I&#39;m not saying your defense is bad, it&#39;s obviously good, but the fact that you only conceded 2 tries in 6 games was more down to quality of opposition.



<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'>

Wow, talk about underestimating us! We did only concede 2 try&#39;s throughout the entire 6 nations you know.
[/b]

Yeah, but that says more about the quality of the six nations than your defense.

[/b][/quote]
Oh obviously. There&#39;s no way that any NH team could ever have defence good enough to withstand the SH&#39;ers. :huh: Seriously, what a stupid thing to say... [/b][/quote]

This has nothing to do with SH vs NH. I watched this year&#39;s six nations and it was probably one of the worst in a long time. No team really looked penetrative on attack other than the French (and that was before they started experimenting with their side).
I&#39;m not saying your defense is bad, it&#39;s obviously good, but the fact that you only conceded 2 tries in 6 games was more down to quality of opposition.

Sir Speedy
06-06-08, 07:21 PM
This has nothing to do with SH vs NH. I watched this year&#39;s six nations and it was probably one of the worst in a long time. No team really looked penetrative on attack other than the French (and that was before they started experimenting with their side).
I&#39;m not saying your defense is bad, it&#39;s obviously good, but the fact that you only conceded 2 tries in 6 games was more down to quality of opposition.
[/b]
Obviously. :rolleyes: If I said that the Tri-Nations had poor defence because tries were being scored left, right and centre, the arguement would be that the attacking was just too good. :huh: There were many try-scoring oppurtunities for the opposition, but most of the time, our organised defence just pressured them into making mistakes or eventually kicking the ball away.

Cymro
06-06-08, 07:27 PM
Still reckon this game will be close but a very entertaining one, there will be a dubious decision that will cost either Wales or South Africa by the referee!

silent_shadow
06-06-08, 07:37 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
This has nothing to do with SH vs NH. I watched this year&#39;s six nations and it was probably one of the worst in a long time. No team really looked penetrative on attack other than the French (and that was before they started experimenting with their side).
I&#39;m not saying your defense is bad, it&#39;s obviously good, but the fact that you only conceded 2 tries in 6 games was more down to quality of opposition.
[/b]
Obviously. :rolleyes: If I said that the Tri-Nations had poor defence because tries were being scored left, right and centre, the arguement would be that the attacking was just too good. :huh: There were many try-scoring oppurtunities for the opposition, but most of the time, our organised defence just pressured them into making mistakes or eventually kicking the ball away. [/b][/quote]

Good attack will always trump good defense. For you to have only let in 2 tries in 6 matches means your defense was either supernatural or the oppoition&#39;s attacking play was poor. After watching the 6 nations I feel safe in saying it was the latter.

Cymro
06-06-08, 07:42 PM
<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'>
This has nothing to do with SH vs NH. I watched this year&#39;s six nations and it was probably one of the worst in a long time. No team really looked penetrative on attack other than the French (and that was before they started experimenting with their side).
I&#39;m not saying your defense is bad, it&#39;s obviously good, but the fact that you only conceded 2 tries in 6 games was more down to quality of opposition.
[/b]
Obviously. :rolleyes: If I said that the Tri-Nations had poor defence because tries were being scored left, right and centre, the arguement would be that the attacking was just too good. :huh: There were many try-scoring oppurtunities for the opposition, but most of the time, our organised defence just pressured them into making mistakes or eventually kicking the ball away. [/b][/quote]

Good attack will always trump good defense. For you to have only let in 2 tries in 6 matches means your defense was either supernatural or the oppoition&#39;s attacking play was poor. After watching the 6 nations I feel safe in saying it was the latter.
[/b][/quote]

Somehow I doubt Wales defence was down to poor attacking play by the opposition <_<

The fact of the matter is that if Wales would have played SA a year ago without the Gatland and Edwards influence (not including the game in November), Wales defence was probably one of the worst in the NH, but to say that teams were poor in the 6 nations is not exactly a fair comment!
Wales 2 tries in 5 games (I cant see how its 6? You only play 5 times in the 6 nations!) shows that the defence is a good one! If if was not then more teams would have scored and that is a fact!

Sir Speedy
06-06-08, 07:42 PM
<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'>
This has nothing to do with SH vs NH. I watched this year&#39;s six nations and it was probably one of the worst in a long time. No team really looked penetrative on attack other than the French (and that was before they started experimenting with their side).
I&#39;m not saying your defense is bad, it&#39;s obviously good, but the fact that you only conceded 2 tries in 6 games was more down to quality of opposition.
[/b]
Obviously. :rolleyes: If I said that the Tri-Nations had poor defence because tries were being scored left, right and centre, the arguement would be that the attacking was just too good. :huh: There were many try-scoring oppurtunities for the opposition, but most of the time, our organised defence just pressured them into making mistakes or eventually kicking the ball away. [/b][/quote]

Good attack will always trump good defense. For you to have only let in 2 tries in 6 matches means your defense was either supernatural or the oppoition&#39;s attacking play was poor. After watching the 6 nations I feel safe in saying it was the latter.
[/b][/quote]
That&#39;s a fairer statement to make rather than:
The other teams were ****, rather than you being good.

Anyway, it&#39;s annoying how everyone&#39;s saying, "I can&#39;t wait to see [Insert South African player here] run loose tomorrow" as if we are even going to let these guys run loose. I don&#39;t see South Africa beating us by 20 points tomorrow, and I certainly don&#39;t see them scoring more than two tries against us.

loratadine
06-06-08, 07:54 PM
good attack will always beat good defence :/
lmaoo id love to believe that but unfortunately all the great sides through history have been bedrocked by having a near inpregnable defence. attacking rugby just gets the headlines

but im afraid defence wins matches.

silent_shadow
06-06-08, 08:30 PM
good attack will always beat good defence :/
lmaoo id love to believe that but unfortunately all the great sides through history have been bedrocked by having a near inpregnable defence. attacking rugby just gets the headlines

but im afraid defence wins matches. [/b]

I thought we were talking about scoring tries? Good, strong sustained attack will always leaves gaps in the defense. It&#39;s that simple.

Cymro
06-06-08, 08:36 PM
<div class='quotemain'> good attack will always beat good defence :/
lmaoo id love to believe that but unfortunately all the great sides through history have been bedrocked by having a near inpregnable defence. attacking rugby just gets the headlines

but im afraid defence wins matches. [/b]

I thought we were talking about scoring tries? Good, strong sustained attack will always leaves gaps in the defense. It&#39;s that simple.
[/b][/quote]

Not always, a strong attack may create gaps, but its whether they score off it and whether the defence recovers from the gap created shows how good a defence is.

silent_shadow
06-06-08, 08:42 PM
<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'>
This has nothing to do with SH vs NH. I watched this year&#39;s six nations and it was probably one of the worst in a long time. No team really looked penetrative on attack other than the French (and that was before they started experimenting with their side).
I&#39;m not saying your defense is bad, it&#39;s obviously good, but the fact that you only conceded 2 tries in 6 games was more down to quality of opposition.
[/b]
Obviously. :rolleyes: If I said that the Tri-Nations had poor defence because tries were being scored left, right and centre, the arguement would be that the attacking was just too good. :huh: There were many try-scoring oppurtunities for the opposition, but most of the time, our organised defence just pressured them into making mistakes or eventually kicking the ball away. [/b][/quote]

Good attack will always trump good defense. For you to have only let in 2 tries in 6 matches means your defense was either supernatural or the oppoition&#39;s attacking play was poor. After watching the 6 nations I feel safe in saying it was the latter.
[/b][/quote]

Somehow I doubt Wales defence was down to poor attacking play by the opposition <_<

The fact of the matter is that if Wales would have played SA a year ago without the Gatland and Edwards influence (not including the game in November), Wales defence was probably one of the worst in the NH, but to say that teams were poor in the 6 nations is not exactly a fair comment!
Wales 2 tries in 5 games (I cant see how its 6? You only play 5 times in the 6 nations!) shows that the defence is a good one! If if was not then more teams would have scored and that is a fact!
[/b][/quote]

My bad, for some reason I counted the game against France as a final. :huh:
If you actually read properly you&#39;d see that I already said your defense was good. But that doesn&#39;t mean it&#39;s as good as you make it out to be especially when the opposition played below par.

Sir Speedy
06-06-08, 08:43 PM
<div class='quotemain'> good attack will always beat good defence :/
lmaoo id love to believe that but unfortunately all the great sides through history have been bedrocked by having a near inpregnable defence. attacking rugby just gets the headlines

but im afraid defence wins matches. [/b]

I thought we were talking about scoring tries? Good, strong sustained attack will always leaves gaps in the defense. It&#39;s that simple.
[/b][/quote]
Definately, it&#39;s just maintaining your attack that&#39;s difficult. And the quality of the attack needs to be good. Problem is, most teams get disheartened by really strong defences (i.e. France v Argentina in the 3rd place-off, where France barely made half a metre just near the Pumas&#39; line), so if you don&#39;t get players running lines, no gaps will be made and the attacking side will be knocking on concrete walls for a good two minutes.

Cymro
06-06-08, 08:47 PM
<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'>
This has nothing to do with SH vs NH. I watched this year&#39;s six nations and it was probably one of the worst in a long time. No team really looked penetrative on attack other than the French (and that was before they started experimenting with their side).
I&#39;m not saying your defense is bad, it&#39;s obviously good, but the fact that you only conceded 2 tries in 6 games was more down to quality of opposition.
[/b]
Obviously. :rolleyes: If I said that the Tri-Nations had poor defence because tries were being scored left, right and centre, the arguement would be that the attacking was just too good. :huh: There were many try-scoring oppurtunities for the opposition, but most of the time, our organised defence just pressured them into making mistakes or eventually kicking the ball away. [/b][/quote]


Good attack will always trump good defense. For you to have only let in 2 tries in 6 matches means your defense was either supernatural or the oppoition&#39;s attacking play was poor. After watching the 6 nations I feel safe in saying it was the latter.
[/b][/quote]

Somehow I doubt Wales defence was down to poor attacking play by the opposition <_<

The fact of the matter is that if Wales would have played SA a year ago without the Gatland and Edwards influence (not including the game in November), Wales defence was probably one of the worst in the NH, but to say that teams were poor in the 6 nations is not exactly a fair comment!
Wales 2 tries in 5 games (I cant see how its 6? You only play 5 times in the 6 nations!) shows that the defence is a good one! If if was not then more teams would have scored and that is a fact!
[/b][/quote]

My bad, for some reason I counted the game against France as a final. :huh:
If you actually read properly you&#39;d see that I already said your defense was good. But that doesn&#39;t mean it&#39;s as good as you make it out to be especially when the opposition played below par.
[/b][/quote]

Mate go and re-read, I never hyped up our defence! All I said was that the defence is a good one because whatever the teams they played they are still of a international quality and still to only concede 2 tries in 5 games is something to behold. Yes it is over hyped by some but Im not dancing up and down and doing cartwheels! Just remember no international game should be called a poor standard just because some of the rugby played was not attractive to viewers does not make it poor. Wales defended and attacked well. Im not coming here to get bollocked by others now saying that im only saying this just because Im Welsh, the fact of the matter is the Welsh defence has improved and looks strong as ever. Hence I reckon the game will be a close one!

silent_shadow
06-06-08, 09:10 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'> good attack will always beat good defence :/
lmaoo id love to believe that but unfortunately all the great sides through history have been bedrocked by having a near inpregnable defence. attacking rugby just gets the headlines

but im afraid defence wins matches. [/b]

I thought we were talking about scoring tries? Good, strong sustained attack will always leaves gaps in the defense. It&#39;s that simple.
[/b][/quote]
Definately, it&#39;s just maintaining your attack that&#39;s difficult. And the quality of the attack needs to be good. Problem is, most teams get disheartened by really strong defences (i.e. France v Argentina in the 3rd place-off, where France barely made half a metre just near the Pumas&#39; line), so if you don&#39;t get players running lines, no gaps will be made and the attacking side will be knocking on concrete walls for a good two minutes. [/b][/quote]

My point is: very strong attack > very strong defense. Therefore as I said with only 2 tries conceded in 5 games, Wales defense was either amazing or the opposition&#39;s attacking was poor. And in my opinion it was a mixture of Wales having good defense and especially the other teams having below par offense.


<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'>
This has nothing to do with SH vs NH. I watched this year&#39;s six nations and it was probably one of the worst in a long time. No team really looked penetrative on attack other than the French (and that was before they started experimenting with their side).
I&#39;m not saying your defense is bad, it&#39;s obviously good, but the fact that you only conceded 2 tries in 6 games was more down to quality of opposition.
[/b]
Obviously. :rolleyes: If I said that the Tri-Nations had poor defence because tries were being scored left, right and centre, the arguement would be that the attacking was just too good. :huh: There were many try-scoring oppurtunities for the opposition, but most of the time, our organised defence just pressured them into making mistakes or eventually kicking the ball away. [/b][/quote]


Good attack will always trump good defense. For you to have only let in 2 tries in 6 matches means your defense was either supernatural or the oppoition&#39;s attacking play was poor. After watching the 6 nations I feel safe in saying it was the latter.
[/b][/quote]

Somehow I doubt Wales defence was down to poor attacking play by the opposition <_<

The fact of the matter is that if Wales would have played SA a year ago without the Gatland and Edwards influence (not including the game in November), Wales defence was probably one of the worst in the NH, but to say that teams were poor in the 6 nations is not exactly a fair comment!
Wales 2 tries in 5 games (I cant see how its 6? You only play 5 times in the 6 nations!) shows that the defence is a good one! If if was not then more teams would have scored and that is a fact!
[/b][/quote]

My bad, for some reason I counted the game against France as a final. :huh:
If you actually read properly you&#39;d see that I already said your defense was good. But that doesn&#39;t mean it&#39;s as good as you make it out to be especially when the opposition played below par.
[/b][/quote]

Mate go and re-read, I never hyped up our defence! All I said was that the defence is a good one because whatever the teams they played they are still of a international quality and still to only concede 2 tries in 5 games is something to behold. Yes it is over hyped by some but Im not dancing up and down and doing cartwheels! Just remember no international game should be called a poor standard just because some of the rugby played was not attractive to viewers does not make it poor. Wales defended and attacked well. Im not coming here to get bollocked by others now saying that im only saying this just because Im Welsh, the fact of the matter is the Welsh defence has improved and looks strong as ever. Hence I reckon the game will be a close one!
[/b][/quote]

You were telling me that you&#39;re defense was good. I reminded you that I already said your defense was good. What must I re-read?
Since when did I say the 6 nations was bad just because no attractive rugby was played? It was bad bacuse every other team barring Wales played poorly throughout most of it.

I think we should just call this argument quits and judge Wales&#39; defense tomorrow. This has really gotten off off topic. To clarify, my original point was that Wales conceding only 2 tries during the whole of the 6 nations isn&#39;t quite as good as it sounds. But that doesn&#39;t mean to say their defense is at all poor.

Cymro
06-06-08, 09:15 PM
It has not gone off topic, you called the 6 Nations poor, and its porbably down to the fact that the rugby was not attractive!

And as I did point out in the past the game will be a close one!

silent_shadow
06-06-08, 09:22 PM
It has not gone off topic, you called the 6 Nations poor, and its porbably down to the fact that the rugby was not attractive!

And as I did point out in the past the game will be a close one! [/b]

I called this year&#39;s 6 Nations&#39;s poor! Wasn&#39;t there a whole topic asking if this was the worst 6 nations ever? England came 2nd despite almost losing to Italy and playing terribly throughout (with the excpetion of the game against France). Doesn&#39;t that say enough? Why must everyone always take everything as a SH vs NH debate?
And yes it has gone off topic because we&#39;re currently discussing the 6 nations and good offense vs good defense.

Cymro
06-06-08, 09:25 PM
<div class='quotemain'> It has not gone off topic, you called the 6 Nations poor, and its porbably down to the fact that the rugby was not attractive!

And as I did point out in the past the game will be a close one! [/b]

I called this year&#39;s 6 Nations&#39;s poor! Wasn&#39;t there a whole topic asking if this was the worst 6 nations ever? England came 2nd despite almost losing to Italy and playing terribly throughout (with the excpetion of the game against France). Doesn&#39;t that say enough? Why must everyone always take everything as a SH vs NH debate?
And yes it has gone off topic because we&#39;re currently discussing the 6 nations and good offense vs good defense.
[/b][/quote]

Read and see where I said this 6 Nations was not poor?

Anyway back on topic

Pity im playing sport tomorrow and cannot watch the game, wont put a score prediction down because I always get them wrong!

silent_shadow
06-06-08, 09:47 PM
I still think we&#39;ll win it, though I have no clue by how much.
I have a really bad feeling though that if we lose this first test, then we&#39;ve got a bumpy few years ahead of us. Either way, can&#39;t wait for it.
I just hope neither JdV or Chavana decides to get injured. I also hope Mujati has a good game and forgets all that crap about his father that&#39;s circulating around. And I hope Bekker plays well and that Matfield has a storming game when he comes off the bench. Oh, yes and Pienaar rediscovers his form. That&#39;s dearly needed with 2 potential weak points in Conradie and Jacobs that he may need to cover.

Incredible Schalk
06-06-08, 09:57 PM
So many predictions the game is only 14 hours away, Conradie is a big mistake at half back but Cooper&#39;s hardly much better. This could be a classic although it is more likely to be a slog with the Boks adjusting to the old rules again.

Picking up on the defensive point in the 6 nations, i would say its a bit of both, no imagination in attack from other teams and very good defense by Wales. I liked the way they set their defense against France they committed no one to the ruck and made the French try and come up with brilliance to get through, which French teams no longer do. You cant really count Scotland as a team who could score tries as we have Dan Parks, the worsest most badest flyhalf evaaa :lol:

Macsen
06-06-08, 10:55 PM
I&#39;m going for the double! Ireland to beat the All Blacks and Wales to beat SA. It&#39;ll be the 6th of October all over again, mark my words. :P

loratadine
06-06-08, 11:15 PM
couldnt give a **** about ireland, i want them to loose to be honest

anyways back on topic, ummm im rlly rlly excited, doubt ill get much sleep, just watching some old welsh matches, watching wales vs england at wembley :) lol awesome stuff, guna watch the 6 nations dvd after that then get some shut eye, ready to wake up for the nz game

KZNSharksFan
07-06-08, 12:46 AM
lmao
to be honest i think the south africans are gunna be in for one hell of an afternoon

this side gatland nd edwards have built, are far far far too intense to loose by 20 points

it is going to be a war, and south africa will not bully us, theyll try it, nd just like a heavyweight champion we&#39;ll come back nd knock them down.

we will win this test.
[/b]

Every year you poor ******** get your hopes up when the June tours roll round. Remember what happened last time a European nation sent a half depleted team to South Africa? :P

SA 38-12 Wales.

ps. Good defense does win games, as (and correct me if i&#39;m wrong) the team with the least points conceded usually wins the game. Look at what Graeme Henry said last year, "good attacking play wins world cups" etc. etc. What happened there mr Henry?

The best defensive teams won in 95,03 and 07?

Yes, this isnt a world cup but its still a test match.

loratadine
07-06-08, 01:12 AM
you seem like a good lad (Y) just throwing that out there

anyways best of luck to the south africans, have nothing but respect for your country nd your rugby team, and ive always found the majority of south africans ive encountered to be very knowledgable and extremely passionate rugby fans

this game has it all really

two fiercely patriotic and proud rugby nations
the 6nations grand slam winners against the reigning world champions
the 6 nations player of the year vs the world player of the year

i stick by what i said, wales are gunna meet fire with fire, and i firmly believe this will be a war

and absolute slugfest

i cant wait :)

mike-o-l
07-06-08, 06:07 AM
I wonder who is gonna kick for polls for South Africa. James has never being known for his poll kicking.
I wouldn&#39;t like to be De Villiers if we lose. It would be the first loss at home to Wales. Could be a really slow game, to strong defenses
Should be a great game

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 06:10 AM
<div class='quotemain'>
lmao
to be honest i think the south africans are gunna be in for one hell of an afternoon

this side gatland nd edwards have built, are far far far too intense to loose by 20 points

it is going to be a war, and south africa will not bully us, theyll try it, nd just like a heavyweight champion we&#39;ll come back nd knock them down.

we will win this test.
[/b]

Every year you poor ******** get your hopes up when the June tours roll round. Remember what happened last time a European nation sent a half depleted team to South Africa? :P

SA 38-12 Wales.

ps. Good defense does win games, as (and correct me if i&#39;m wrong) the team with the least points conceded usually wins the game. Look at what Graeme Henry said last year, "good attacking play wins world cups" etc. etc. What happened there mr Henry?

The best defensive teams won in 95,03 and 07?


[/b][/quote]


You missed the ultimate in defense of the Wallabies in 1999, only one try conceded in the whole tournament.

loratadine
07-06-08, 08:27 AM
as ive kept saying i think its going to be a really huge high intensity game

cos i can assure you south africans that this welsh side has NEVER been this aggressive or as intense. and as we already kno the saffas are always intense, so gunna be a fire meets fire game definatly :)

Steve-o
07-06-08, 10:24 AM
as ive kept saying i think its going to be a really huge high intensity game

cos i can assure you south africans that this welsh side has NEVER been this aggressive or as intense. and as we already kno the saffas are always intense, so gunna be a fire meets fire game definatly :)
[/b]
Yeah, I&#39;m interested to see this size record breaking back row at work. I think that&#39;s why PdV included Rossouw instead of Kankowski (the form no.8 of the S14).
Should be quiet a sight seeing Wales trying to out grind the grind kings. They could get a bit caught up in that and underestimate the rocket shoes on the wings. If Chavhanga gets some space, no one chases him.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 10:42 AM
If the Saffa&#39;s play like NZ did earlier today, I have a feeling we will win. Although, Cooper will need to avoid the SA backrow or he&#39;ll become a liability. And lets hope Jamei Roberts holds his own at fullback; it&#39;d be great to see him have a good game (maybe run over Habana or Chavanga once or twice ;)).

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 11:03 AM
If the Saffa&#39;s play like NZ did earlier today, I have a feeling we will win. Although, Cooper will need to avoid the SA backrow or he&#39;ll become a liability. And lets hope Jamei Roberts holds his own at fullback; it&#39;d be great to see him have a good game (maybe run over Habana or Chavanga once or twice ;)).
[/b]


There not playing in a monsoon though the hard fast pitches are a completely different proposition.

Steve-o
07-06-08, 11:05 AM
http://blogofbam.wordpress.com/2008/06/06/...-vs-wales-2008/ (http://blogofbam.wordpress.com/2008/06/06/springboks-vs-wales-2008/)

For the Welsh who don&#39;t know some of the Saffa players, and it&#39;s quite funny to.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 11:06 AM
<div class='quotemain'>
If the Saffa&#39;s play like NZ did earlier today, I have a feeling we will win. Although, Cooper will need to avoid the SA backrow or he&#39;ll become a liability. And lets hope Jamei Roberts holds his own at fullback; it&#39;d be great to see him have a good game (maybe run over Habana or Chavanga once or twice ;)).
[/b]


There not playing in a monsoon though the hard fast pitches are a completely different proposition.
[/b][/quote]
What I mean is, if South Africa have a start-of-season nightmare match like NZ apparantly had, apart from the 2nd half, then I think we&#39;ll win. If this becomes a forwards vs forwards pummelling-each-other-until-their-cheek-bone-sticks-out-of-their-face game, then I think we&#39;ll lose, but I still don&#39;t think we&#39;ll lose (we won&#39;t though :P) by more than 8 points.

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 11:20 AM
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'>
If the Saffa&#39;s play like NZ did earlier today, I have a feeling we will win. Although, Cooper will need to avoid the SA backrow or he&#39;ll become a liability. And lets hope Jamei Roberts holds his own at fullback; it&#39;d be great to see him have a good game (maybe run over Habana or Chavanga once or twice ;)).
[/b]


There not playing in a monsoon though the hard fast pitches are a completely different proposition.
[/b][/quote]
What I mean is, if South Africa have a start-of-season nightmare match like NZ apparantly had, apart from the 2nd half, then I think we&#39;ll win. If this becomes a forwards vs forwards pummelling-each-other-until-their-cheek-bone-sticks-out-of-their-face game, then I think we&#39;ll lose, but I still don&#39;t think we&#39;ll lose (we won&#39;t though :P) by more than 8 points.
[/b][/quote]


You didnt even watch it? well how do you know NZ played badly then, personally i thought it was an heroic effort by Ireland. Wales would have done no better imo, the All Black forwards are the strongest in the business.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 11:32 AM
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'>
If the Saffa&#39;s play like NZ did earlier today, I have a feeling we will win. Although, Cooper will need to avoid the SA backrow or he&#39;ll become a liability. And lets hope Jamei Roberts holds his own at fullback; it&#39;d be great to see him have a good game (maybe run over Habana or Chavanga once or twice ;)).
[/b]


There not playing in a monsoon though the hard fast pitches are a completely different proposition.
[/b][/quote]
What I mean is, if South Africa have a start-of-season nightmare match like NZ apparantly had, apart from the 2nd half, then I think we&#39;ll win. If this becomes a forwards vs forwards pummelling-each-other-until-their-cheek-bone-sticks-out-of-their-face game, then I think we&#39;ll lose, but I still don&#39;t think we&#39;ll lose (we won&#39;t though :P) by more than 8 points.
[/b][/quote]


You didnt even watch it? well how do you know NZ played badly then, personally i thought it was an heroic effort by Ireland. Wales would have done no better imo, the All Black forwards are the strongest in the business.
[/b][/quote]
So you&#39;re telling me that New Zealand played well? Like they&#39;ve done for the past 5 years? Or are you saying that Ireland played so well that they pushed NZ close enough until the very end? The Irish have been optimistic all week. In fact, this was said by many to be their best oppurtunity to put one over NZ, and to be honest, they blew it. I&#39;ve seen NZ&#39;s first try, and O&#39;Driscoll was completely outpaced by the centre that waira-cullen reckons is the slowest in the business (not anymore eh?), and apparantly, Reddan was dreadful. People have been calling for his head now so Stringer should start.
I&#39;ve been on the 606 boards, and on the other thread, and whereas some Irish fans are happy with the performance, others are completely ****** off. This Irish side isn&#39;t a shadow of the one two years ago, but maybe Declan Kidney can change that. But still, you seriously aren&#39;t telling me that NZ played their best rugby today are you? If SA play like NZ did today (i.e. not at their best), then I think Wales will win.

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 11:39 AM
Whatever you say, but making an opinion on someone else&#39;s isnt always reliable. We will wait and see, only morons underestimate the All Blacks though, they have been the greatest side in the world for 100 years for a reason. But to compare the All Blacks in the wet and the Boks in the dry hard pitch at Bloemfentein without even watching the match is very stupid.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 11:49 AM
Stupid. Just like saying, "Wales would have done no better imo." That&#39;s a valid statement right there. :rolleyes:

esoj
07-06-08, 11:55 AM
weather was a huge factor in the ireland v abs game.

I think in the dry SA could still win even if they don&#39;t play at their best. the boks have a very good looking backline which I think will cut loose if they can get enough ball. wales will have to be right on their game I think to get a close victory over the boks.

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 11:56 AM
Stupid. Just like saying, "Wales would have done no better imo." That&#39;s a valid statement right there. :rolleyes:
[/b]


Nor would any other side except the Bokke in my opinion. Are Wales as good in the wet as Ireland? basically the All Blacks are so strong up front they would have splintered Wales through the middle just like Ireland as their packs arent as strong. Anyway... :)



weather was a huge factor in the ireland v abs game.

I think in the dry SA could still win even if they don&#39;t play at their best. the boks have a very good looking backline which I think will cut loose if they can get enough ball. wales will have to be right on their game I think to get a close victory over the boks.
[/b]


Indeed, its the type of game where the back could get alot of the ball. In the last 4 visits to SA,Wales have conceded around 45 points a game, i dont think it will be like that again but defenses will be broken alot i feel.

Prestwick
07-06-08, 12:05 PM
Now if you want my opinion, I think if the conditions were as bad as people are saying they were earlier for the NZ - Ireland game then I&#39;d say Scotland would be best suited.

Think about it, in that kind of game, with lots of slippery mud to get bogged down in, lots of time to clear and kick long with the wind to your back and not worry about accuracy...that game it simply custom made for the Scotland pack and Dan Parks!

nam97
07-06-08, 12:25 PM
This game will be an absolute bath. SA will walk all over a Welsh side which will get dominated in every single department imaginable.

Prestwick
07-06-08, 12:52 PM
Apparently Shaun Edwards is running Wales through the pre-match drills screaming:


"THEY (South Africa) DON&#39;T RATE US! THEY (South Africa) DON&#39;T RESPECT US!"[/b]

Repeatedly...

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 01:15 PM
6 - 3 in fifteen minutes to SA.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 01:27 PM
This game will be an absolute bath. SA will walk all over a Welsh side which will get dominated in every single department imaginable.
[/b]
We&#39;ve hammered their scrum twice now. ^.^

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 01:33 PM
ach for fek sake, have we lost all our dicipline? and we&#39;re mucking up all the basics, seriously have to settle down and just play.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 01:37 PM
ach for fek sake, have we lost all our dicipline? and we&#39;re mucking up all the basics, seriously have to settle down and just play.
[/b]
And to top it off, now our defence has gone to pot. <_< If we&#39;re not within ten points by the break then I don&#39;t see us coming back.

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 01:41 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
ach for fek sake, have we lost all our dicipline? and we&#39;re mucking up all the basics, seriously have to settle down and just play.
[/b]
And to top it off, now our defence has gone to pot. <_< If we&#39;re not within ten points by the break then I don&#39;t see us coming back. [/b][/quote]

...yup, Shaun Edwards should be sharpening his axe as we speak...

candybum
07-06-08, 01:44 PM
Over red rover? lol

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 01:45 PM
Shane Williams, where&#39;ve you been all game? D: Brilliant by Shane...three times, good try for Jamie Roberts:

19 - 8, touchline conversion.....over. 19 - 10

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 01:45 PM
Over red rover? lol [/b]
maybe not, Shane Williams and Jamie Roberts I fekking love you.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 01:47 PM
And THIS, ladies and gentlemen, is why Ryan Jones is NOT the best no. 8 in Europe.
:rolleyes:
22 - 10 at the moment.

Prestwick
07-06-08, 01:48 PM
Well that was just the tonic Wales needed. Try by Roberts with a conversion by Jones.

South Africa are indeed, it appears, fallible.

SmokeyMonkey
07-06-08, 01:50 PM
F*** off Pearson you f***ing homer, you hate the Ospreys and you hate the Scarlets and now you&#39;re out to grab every opportunity to gift the Bokke 3 points. f*** off you brainless c***. Come on Wales. Remember Twickenham 2008!

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 01:51 PM
I can picture, as I type, Shaun Edwards glaring, without expression at the Welsh team, silver, gleaming axe in hand, vein bulging from temple.
It&#39;s a warning.

rsea
07-06-08, 01:51 PM
Whats with all the handling errors from Wales on a perfect pitch?
Should be SA spewing wall all over the turf since its their 1st hit out

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 01:54 PM
f*** off Peasron you f***ing homer, you hate the Ospreys and you hate the Scarlets and now you&#39;re out to grab every opportunity to gift the Bokke 3 points. f*** off you brainless c***. Come on Wales. Remember Twickenham 2008!
[/b]
Try blaming Ryan Jones instead. What player, nevermind a ****ing captain, catches the high ball with the chaser a good 5 metres away, falls over, gets up and stands still as he prepares for the tackle? Absolutely ridiculous.

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 01:56 PM
Bit of a scruffy first half, im relatively pleased with the lead but there&#39;s been a few to many errors. Could yet be a half century.

munross
07-06-08, 01:58 PM
Yippy the Boks are leading at half time.Hope to see some tries from Habana and Chavanga in the second half! :bana:

Go BOKKE!

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 01:59 PM
Bit of a scruffy first half, im relatively pleased with the lead but there&#39;s been a few to many errors. Could yet be a half century.
[/b]
The way our discipline has been, it&#39;ll be via penalties. :D

Prestwick
07-06-08, 02:05 PM
Whats with all the handling errors from Wales on a perfect pitch?
Should be SA spewing wall all over the turf since its their 1st hit out [/b]

I believe England had the same trouble last year in Bokland.

Then again, England never have learnt how to handle the ball properly. Ever.

munross
07-06-08, 02:15 PM
F**king amazing try by Jean de Villiers!

John Smit is on fire in his 50th test as captain!

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 02:17 PM
Even the replacement decision making is ****. Stephen Jones and Jamie Roberts, our best backs today have been replaced whereas Shanklin and Parker have been crap all day and are still on. :huh:
AND LOL! As soon as Stoddart comes on, he misses a tackle and SA score... Utter genius work by Gatland in this case. :rolleyes:

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 02:18 PM
SPIESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!

Prestwick
07-06-08, 02:20 PM
Even the replacement decision making is ****. Stephen Jones and Jamie Roberts, our best backs today have been replaced whereas Shanklin and Parker have been crap all day and are still on. huh.gif
AND LOL! As soon as Stoddart comes on, he misses a tackle and SA score... Utter genius work by Gatland in this case. rolleyes.gif [/b]

Gatland and Edwards let Gareth Jenkins act as caretaker coach on match day while they went big game fishing...

rsea
07-06-08, 02:21 PM
All over red rover
Glad my bet on Wales who were paying $4.50 head to head didn&#39;t go through

Not looking like 6 Nations champions atm



AND LOL! As soon as Stoddart comes on, he misses a tackle and SA score... Utter genius work by Gatland in this case. :rolleyes:
[/b]

and stood up by a bloody scrum half!!!!

candybum
07-06-08, 02:23 PM
<div class='quotemain'> Even the replacement decision making is ****. Stephen Jones and Jamie Roberts, our best backs today have been replaced whereas Shanklin and Parker have been crap all day and are still on. huh.gif
AND LOL! As soon as Stoddart comes on, he misses a tackle and SA score... Utter genius work by Gatland in this case. rolleyes.gif [/b]

Gatland and Edwards let Gareth Jenkins act as caretaker coach on match day while they went big game fishing... [/b][/quote]

:lol2tn: :lol2tn: :lol2tn:

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 02:25 PM
meh, as soon as I heard &#39;and they&#39;ve brought Stoddard on to try and find some spaces&#39; I though &#39;Ach crap, we have lost the last of our defensive capability&#39;... Stoddard can&#39;t kind and can&#39;t tackle, while Jamie Roberts can do both, and is very good in attack. Great choice by Gatland...

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 02:30 PM
<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'> Even the replacement decision making is ****. Stephen Jones and Jamie Roberts, our best backs today have been replaced whereas Shanklin and Parker have been crap all day and are still on. huh.gif
AND LOL! As soon as Stoddart comes on, he misses a tackle and SA score... Utter genius work by Gatland in this case. rolleyes.gif [/b]

Gatland and Edwards let Gareth Jenkins act as caretaker coach on match day while they went big game fishing... [/b][/quote]

:lol2tn: :lol2tn: :lol2tn:
[/b][/quote]
That&#39;s actually looking like a true statement. This Welsh team reminds me of Jenkins&#39; side, not the side that dominated Europe this year. <_< Serious work needs to be done or we&#39;ll be abolutely mauled next week.

Shane Williams - genius. A little late for something like that though.

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 02:32 PM
heh, good old Shane, skinning Habana :P

gingergenius
07-06-08, 02:32 PM
I hate to say I told you so... ALRIGHT!!!

haha for all those Welsh fans and Justin Marshall who said Wales would be a major force in rugby after the 6 Nations victory, THINK AGAIN. Beating SH teams is the measure of a team, not winning a tournament which is noted for its lottery factor.

--------------

I know I sound like a prick and I hate to gloat, but really I had it up to here when Wales won the 6 nations and none of them would listen to me when i said they weren&#39;t that great a team.

Excuse me all the Welsh fans who were a bit more realistic, I don&#39;t mean to rub it in for you

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 02:32 PM
heh, good old Shane, skinning Habana :P
[/b]
That was Habana? Someone needs to make a GIF of that! :D

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 02:35 PM
what the hell? how come they can get away with forward passes and we can&#39;t?

SmokeyMonkey
07-06-08, 02:36 PM
SA have been lucky, yes they are better than us but nowhere near this much better, MAYBE 10 points at the most. Stoddart is ****ehouse.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 02:40 PM
I hate to say I told you so... ALRIGHT!!!

haha for all those Welsh fans and Justin Marshall who said Wales would be a major force in rugby after the 6 Nations victory, THINK AGAIN. Beating SH teams is the measure of a team, not winning a tournament which is noted for its lottery factor.

--------------

I know I sound like a prick and I hate to gloat, but really I had it up to here when Wales won the 6 nations and none of them would listen to me when i said they weren&#39;t that great a team.

Excuse me all the Welsh fans who were a bit more realistic, I don&#39;t mean to rub it in for you
[/b]
Oh sod off. You&#39;re basically telling us that we should never be optimistic and that winning the 6N meant nothing at all. Seriously, iI figured any Brit with sense would support a fellow British team, but I guess you are, obviously, lacking any sense whatsoever as that was quite the twattish post. Regardless, I&#39;ll be supporting England against NZ anyway.
Get f**ked.
Your friendly neighbourhood Welshman,
Speedy.



what the hell? how come they can get away with forward passes and we can&#39;t?
[/b]
It&#39;s Dave Pearson. <_< &#39;nuff said.

Prestwick
07-06-08, 02:41 PM
God what an almighty disaster. Next saturday is going to be really depressing all night if England and Ireland can&#39;t get their acts together.

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 02:41 PM
I hate to say I told you so... ALRIGHT!!!

haha for all those Welsh fans and Justin Marshall who said Wales would be a major force in rugby after the 6 Nations victory, THINK AGAIN. Beating SH teams is the measure of a team, not winning a tournament which is noted for its lottery factor.

--------------

I know I sound like a prick and I hate to gloat, but really I had it up to here when Wales won the 6 nations and none of them would listen to me when i said they weren&#39;t that great a team.

Excuse me all the Welsh fans who were a bit more realistic, I don&#39;t mean to rub it in for you [/b]

Yeah, this ISN&#39;T the team that won the Grandslam. We don&#39;t have Henson, who is a superb all-round player, and we&#39;ve really missed his defensive capability&#39;s in mid-field. The Parker - Shanklin combination just doesn&#39;t work... We&#39;re missing BOTH our best Scrum-Halves, as well as our 3rd choice one (Andy Williams is miles better than Cooper), and tbh, it&#39;s Phillip&#39;s physicality around the breakdown that we&#39;re missing the most. Lee Byrne, the probably the best fullback in this years Six Nations is out, so we&#39;re having to play our youngsters their. Martyn Williams, well, he&#39;s just superb, so it&#39;s kinda obvious why the South Africans have had the upper hand in the breakdown.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 02:51 PM
Positives:
They didn&#39;t hit 50 points.
Shane Williams.
Jamie Roberts.
Stephen Jones.
I won&#39;t even bother listing the negatives.

Negatives:
*see above*

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 02:51 PM
SA have been lucky, yes they are better than us but nowhere near this much better, MAYBE 10 points at the most. Stoddart is ****ehouse.
[/b]

rubbish, Wales just came up against a much,much better team, it would have happened to any NH side.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 02:52 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
SA have been lucky, yes they are better than us but nowhere near this much better, MAYBE 10 points at the most. Stoddart is ****ehouse.
[/b]

rubbish, Wales just came up against a much,much better team, it would have happened to any NH side.
[/b][/quote]
Yeh, its quite obvious that the umpteen errors Wales made had no influence on the final score. :rolleyes:

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 02:53 PM
they SA were better, but the score would have been a lot closer if Wales had a full strength team. SA would still have beaten us, they were just so clinical today, but it probably would have been more like 23 - 17 than 43 -17.

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 02:59 PM
Pathetic excuses :zzz:

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 02:59 PM
http://www.huwevansimages.com/media/gallery/south-africa-v-wales-070608/CDF_SAFRICA_V_Wales_11.jpg

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 03:00 PM
they SA were better, but the score would have been a lot closer if Wales had a full strength team. SA would still have beaten us, they were just so clinical today, but it probably would have been more like 23 - 17 than 43 -17.
[/b]


They were better, what game were you watching? they also butchered 4 line breaks in the second half.

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 03:01 PM
come on! would you call that a full strength Wales squad? I think not, not saying we lost because of that, just saying it would have have been a closer game. I mean, Cooper is ****, Staddard is ****, Parker has too many **** games, and doesn&#39;t really do much when it&#39;s he&#39;s 12 and Shanklins 13 (Bishop should definately start at 12 next week). I won&#39;t give in to ******* Sky...

SmokeyMonkey
07-06-08, 03:05 PM
Pearson missed a 2m knock on for Montgomery&#39;s try, and 5 penalties didn&#39;t help. I&#39;m still optimistic about the 2nd test, as long and Stoddart, Parker, but most importantly Pearson aren&#39;t on the pitch.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 03:06 PM
Oh God, Gatland looks totally ****** off. It&#39;s as if he&#39;ll bite someone&#39;s head off if they make any sudden movements. :c
Also, rep point for anyone who makes a GIF of Shane&#39;s try; slow-motion for the part where he completely skims Habana.

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 03:10 PM
come on! would you call that a full strength Wales squad? I think not, not saying we lost because of that, just saying it would have have been a closer game. I mean, Cooper is ****, Staddard is ****, Parker has too many **** games, and doesn&#39;t really do much when it&#39;s he&#39;s 12 and Shanklins 13 (Bishop should definately start at 12 next week). I won&#39;t give in to ******* Sky...
[/b]


Nope, but also it was not anything like the full strength SA team. They had to go back to the old laws,new coach,Burger,Fourie,Du Preez missing..

Boggle
07-06-08, 03:12 PM
they SA were better, but the score would have been a lot closer if Wales had a full strength team. SA would still have beaten us, they were just so clinical today, but it probably would have been more like 23 - 17 than 43 -17. [/b]

and the score would have been about the same if SA -also- had a full strength squad.

you know
January
Schalk
Fourie

;)

I must say, Bolla didn&#39;t play half bad, and all the new guys (especially Luke and Bekker) were AWESOME. Lukie -made- 2 tries.

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 03:12 PM
Oh God, Gatland looks totally ****** off. It&#39;s as if he&#39;ll bite someone&#39;s head off if they make any sudden movements. :c
Also, rep point for anyone who makes a GIF of Shane&#39;s try; slow-motion for the part where he completely skims Habana.
[/b]


To be fair Habana was running across field and slipped on his ass, Williams is such a good stepper and had so much space it would have been a crime not to have scored.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 03:14 PM
The difference between SA&#39;s replacements to injured players and Wales&#39; is that SA&#39;s replacements are actually good. Parker is ridiculously ****, and a Parker - Shanklin midfield is ridiculously ****. Stoddart was dreadful when he came on, and Cooper offered nothing. Can&#39;t say Hook or Ryan Jones impressed me either.
But oh well, I&#39;m just making excuses now. :rolleyes:

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 03:15 PM
<div class='quotemain'> they SA were better, but the score would have been a lot closer if Wales had a full strength team. SA would still have beaten us, they were just so clinical today, but it probably would have been more like 23 - 17 than 43 -17. [/b]

and the score would have been about the same if SA -also- had a full strength squad.

you know
January
Schalk
Fourie

;)

I must say, Bolla didn&#39;t play half bad, and all the new guys (especially Luke and Bekker) were AWESOME. Lukie -made- 2 tries.
[/b][/quote]


Yup Conradie was very good, Watson,Smith,De Villiers and James as well. A few dropped balls but not bad with so many changes, Percy scoring was the highlight for me, he still has it. ;)

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 03:16 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
Oh God, Gatland looks totally ****** off. It&#39;s as if he&#39;ll bite someone&#39;s head off if they make any sudden movements. :c
Also, rep point for anyone who makes a GIF of Shane&#39;s try; slow-motion for the part where he completely skims Habana.
[/b]


To be fair Habana was running across field and slipped on his ass, Williams is such a good stepper and had so much space it would have been a crime not to have scored.
[/b][/quote]
Still, it at least enhances William&#39;s reputation, since he is vastly underrated by you SH&#39;ers. So for him to skim Habana, twice, in a game is surely worthy of a GIF? ;)

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 03:17 PM
The difference between SA&#39;s replacements to injured players and Wales&#39; is that SA&#39;s replacements are actually good. Parker is ridiculously ****, and a Parker - Shanklin midfield is ridiculously ****. Stoddart was dreadful when he came on, and Cooper offered nothing. Can&#39;t say Hook or Ryan Jones impressed me either.
But oh well, I&#39;m just making excuses now. :rolleyes:
[/b]

We can put that under analysis :P, your right except Parkers nice offload for the first try he was very laboured and slow in attack, surely there is a better centre available?

silent_shadow
07-06-08, 03:17 PM
Good game considering it&#39;s our first together. Butch and Jean both played very well. I expect us to be more fluent next week though. The new combinations are still getting to know each other. And, I&#39;ll admit Bolla didn&#39;t play all that badly. But I still want Januarie there next week and Kankowski to at least be on the bench.

Incredible Schalk
07-06-08, 03:19 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'>
Oh God, Gatland looks totally ****** off. It&#39;s as if he&#39;ll bite someone&#39;s head off if they make any sudden movements. :c
Also, rep point for anyone who makes a GIF of Shane&#39;s try; slow-motion for the part where he completely skims Habana.
[/b]


To be fair Habana was running across field and slipped on his ass, Williams is such a good stepper and had so much space it would have been a crime not to have scored.
[/b][/quote]
Still, it at least enhances William&#39;s reputation, since he is vastly underrated by you SH&#39;ers. So for him to skim Habana, twice, in a game is surely worthy of a GIF? ;)
[/b][/quote]


Im from from the NH but am a Springboks fan. He&#39;s not underated by me, i **** it every time he gets the ball, amazing that he has found his best form at 31.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 03:20 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
The difference between SA&#39;s replacements to injured players and Wales&#39; is that SA&#39;s replacements are actually good. Parker is ridiculously ****, and a Parker - Shanklin midfield is ridiculously ****. Stoddart was dreadful when he came on, and Cooper offered nothing. Can&#39;t say Hook or Ryan Jones impressed me either.
But oh well, I&#39;m just making excuses now. :rolleyes:
[/b]

We can put that under analysis :P, your right except Parkers nice offload for the first try he was very laboured and slow in attack, surely there is a better centre available?
[/b][/quote]
No idea. We have some youngsters coming through a la Andrew Bishop (uncapped), Jon Davies (who is playing excellent at U20 level) and Gavin Evans (capped once but has been **** at Llanelli this year), so I expect Gatland to try Bishop next week because Parker is just a lost cause. Jon Davies is the future at inside centre though. He&#39;s really strong and fast, and could add a lot to midfield, and will be a great replacement/succeeder to Henson.

SmokeyMonkey
07-06-08, 03:21 PM
surely there is a better centre available? [/b]
There is but he&#39;s injured, same for 7 and 9, key postions really.

Boggle
07-06-08, 03:21 PM
...Percy scoring was the highlight for me, he still has it. ;) [/b]



brilliant wasn&#39;t it ?



Percy = a certified points machine every single match, either through tries or his excellent kicking, and to think South africas most capped and highest scoring player was booed and hissed only a decade ago. I can&#39;t wait for him to come back to the Cape.

Thingimubob
07-06-08, 03:23 PM
look, dunno if I mucked up what I meant.
What I meant was, just after the Six Nations, this was hailed to be &#39;the ultimate tour&#39; because Gatland promised to bring his strongest squad to SA. But, as usual after we win something, half our team gets injured, and we just don&#39;t have the strength in depth of the SH sides. And SA really showed that today, and as Sir Speedy said, you lot have just got some great replacements.
So, fair play South Africa, you deserved this win (btw how much did Pearson cost :P jocan, jocan.) you deserved the win, I just honestly think it would have been a much closer game if it was Full Strength SA V Full Strength Wales.
And yeah, didn&#39;t see the forward pass (heard it though) so how far forward was it, and how the hell did they get away with it for Percy to score?

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 03:30 PM
http://www.huwevansimages.com/media/gallery/south-africa-v-wales-070608/CDF_SAFRICA_V_Wales_18.jpg

Oh man, Wales actually played the ol&#39; switcharoo with Habana and Williams and still lost the game! D: And there was me thinking Williams had skimmed Habana twice when it was actually Habana in disguise doing it to himself!
Uh, that made total sense!

Steve-o
07-06-08, 03:33 PM
All I can say is "YES!!! YES!!! YES!!!"



You know some people said I was underestimating the Welsh by saying a +20 victory with the current starting 15 was on the cards... Ahem... If we pull out the big guns it will be +50 next week, marks my words.

Shane Williams try was good, he showed why he&#39;s considered one the best wingers in Europe, but seriously stop having an orgy over Habana getting side stepped, coming from across the field.



We worked well as a unit with alot of new players in the side, good on you PdV. Conradie did what he needed to do, and Watson had a stormer. I&#39;m quite pleased but I would love to see a full strength side next week.

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 03:35 PM
All I can say is "YES!!! YES!!! YES!!!"



You know some people said I was underestimating the Welsh by saying a +20 victory with the current starting 15 was on the cards... Ahem... If we pull out the big guns it will be +50 next week, marks my words.

Shane Williams try was good, he showed why he&#39;s considered one the best wingers in Europe, but seriously stop having an orgy over Habana getting side stepped, coming from across the field.



We worked well as a unit with alot of new players in the side, good on you PdV. Conradie did what he needed to do, and Watson had a stormer. I&#39;m quite pleased but I would love to see a full strength side next week.
[/b]
Pfft, we&#39;ve (Us Welsh and the Saffa&#39;s) have already concluded that Wales would definately have won if we hadn&#39;t made those errors and had been at full strength. So there! :P

dundeesmiffy
07-06-08, 03:46 PM
I was amazed.
Percy actually went into contact and didn&#39;t kick the ball away...and then scored a try.
I wonder what colour the moon will be tonight...blue I reckon.

Steve-o
07-06-08, 03:51 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
All I can say is "YES!!! YES!!! YES!!!"



You know some people said I was underestimating the Welsh by saying a +20 victory with the current starting 15 was on the cards... Ahem... If we pull out the big guns it will be +50 next week, marks my words.

Shane Williams try was good, he showed why he&#39;s considered one the best wingers in Europe, but seriously stop having an orgy over Habana getting side stepped, coming from across the field.



We worked well as a unit with alot of new players in the side, good on you PdV. Conradie did what he needed to do, and Watson had a stormer. I&#39;m quite pleased but I would love to see a full strength side next week.
[/b]
Pfft, we&#39;ve (Us Welsh and the Saffa&#39;s) have already concluded that Wales would definately have won if we hadn&#39;t made those errors and had been at full strength. So there! :P [/b][/quote]

Force errors due to the pressure ;)

I must say when ever one of the backrow players had the ball (6,7,8) they definitely put some strain on the defense, very strong ball carriers indeed. But the Boks had it pretty easy in the rucks, mobility was always gonna be a problem with such a big backrow. I think Wales had an opportunity to capitalise by having a scrum 60kg heavier than ours, and with Steenkamp and Mujati being a bit shaking imo, they should of put more effort into scrum.

I&#39;m so pleased with the boys, playing under the &#39;old&#39; rules for the 1st time this year and they slotted right in. I hope next week our wingers can see some more ball and Kankowski gets a run

gingergenius
07-06-08, 04:38 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
I hate to say I told you so... ALRIGHT!!!

haha for all those Welsh fans and Justin Marshall who said Wales would be a major force in rugby after the 6 Nations victory, THINK AGAIN. Beating SH teams is the measure of a team, not winning a tournament which is noted for its lottery factor.

--------------

I know I sound like a prick and I hate to gloat, but really I had it up to here when Wales won the 6 nations and none of them would listen to me when i said they weren&#39;t that great a team.

Excuse me all the Welsh fans who were a bit more realistic, I don&#39;t mean to rub it in for you
[/b]
Oh sod off. You&#39;re basically telling us that we should never be optimistic and that winning the 6N meant nothing at all. Seriously, iI figured any Brit with sense would support a fellow British team, but I guess you are, obviously, lacking any sense whatsoever as that was quite the twattish post. Regardless, I&#39;ll be supporting England against NZ anyway.
Get f**ked.
Your friendly neighbourhood Welshman,
Speedy.

[/b][/quote]

I know I&#39;m being a ****. Suprising though it may seem, I wanted Wales to win. But it&#39;s funny they got stuffed considering the pathetic optimism I heard coming out of Wales after the 6N. Wales were the only organised team in the 6Nations, it wasn&#39;t that hard a tournament to win this year. But after winning it, all I heard was &#39;we&#39;ll win the next world cup&#39; and &#39;we can beat south africa&#39; and all this kind of crap when everyone knows that NH touring teams never win unless they&#39;re REALLY good. Apart from the fact that all of the home nations send depleted teams out every year, i said that the true test of a good rugby team was beating SH teams, and Wales as usual were counting their chickens before they hatched, and overrating themselves.

I&#39;ll be proved wrong if Wales beat any tri nations in the Autumn.

dullonien
07-06-08, 04:40 PM
I don&#39;t usually do this, as anyone who&#39;s read my posts knows, but......

Dave Pearson go f**k yourself. I can&#39;t believe how one sided his reffing was. Now, it didn&#39;t do any difference to the result, SA were better and would have won anyway but, it made the final result look way worse than it was. How many knock on&#39;s or foreward passes did he miss, two directly led to SA try&#39;s, yet he picks up on every welsh mistake. Rediculous, f***ing rediculous.

I lost count of how many times the scrum was taken down / springboks popping up, yet nothing. What&#39;s the point of having a dominant scrum when nothing get&#39;s done if they take it down etc.

My other gripe was SA being allowed to enter rucks from everywhere whilst in posetion, the same rule applies to attacking players as definsive ones.

Right, sorry for that, was sooo ****** off by it all, as was everyone else in the pub! I&#39;m also not trying to take anything away from SA who produced a performance showing why they are the World Champions.

Wales need to improve in alot of areas to comete in the next test. Not too optimistic though!

Prestwick
07-06-08, 04:54 PM
I was amazed.
Percy actually went into contact and didn&#39;t kick the ball away...and then scored a try.
I wonder what colour the moon will be tonight...blue I reckon. [/b]

Sorry, photos or it didn&#39;t happen...

Steve-o
07-06-08, 04:59 PM
<div class='quotemain'> I was amazed.
Percy actually went into contact and didn&#39;t kick the ball away...and then scored a try.
I wonder what colour the moon will be tonight...blue I reckon. [/b]

Sorry, photos or it didn&#39;t happen...
[/b][/quote]
It gets better... He was playing at outside center!

mike-o-l
07-06-08, 05:04 PM
Die Bokke played well. Really impressed with Adi Jacobs, got a few good line breaks, should his attacking talent. PDV did well for his first game, with both Bekker and Janties playing superbly while taking the role of Matfield and Monty. James kicked well, used his head. Bolle played well especially after side stepping Stoddart. Wales did well did limit Chavanga and Habana&#39;s chances. Wales lacked a bit of discipline and had far to many unforced errors. Considering that there was a serious lack in expiranced partnerships, The Boks played Well.

Steve-o
07-06-08, 05:27 PM
It was nice to see Luke Watson play his natural game in a Bok jersey, I&#39;d even say relatively quiet by his standards, he proved Jake White wrong today.

shtove
07-06-08, 06:31 PM
Very impressed by SA - don&#39;t know about the selection policy and all that hoopla - but they simply have good strong players who understand the game and play it well.

Very disappointed by Wales. You wouldn&#39;t know that was a Gatland team. Sure, you can lose big game players, but the teamwork had no stamp of authority about it. Thank God for little Shane - the only bright spark. And what the f was Ryan Jones doing with the penalty just before half time? Stupid - not a good leader.

Taking the bits of the Ireland match that I saw as well, it&#39;s back to business as usual: SH > NH.

Cymro
07-06-08, 06:58 PM
Played South Africa and deserved the win!

I aint seen much of the game due to cricketing commitments today but ive seen clips etc and have to say that the Welsh were young school children who were bullied by the Big Boks!

I dont care how poor the ref was, Pearson is poor end of story but we cannot blame it on him!

Wales lost the game at the breakdown to many turnovers which killed the Welsh team. The pack looks utter ****e, Dafydd Jones a major culprit! Cooper looks a waste of space and Roberts looked a shade of his form this season for the Blues!

I wont watch the game highlights because I could not stand to see Wales play so poorly! But saying that I will watch it to see how good South Africa played, because I know they played immense!

I would have hated to be in that changing room after the game with Edwards! I could imagine the hair dryer treatment would have been used!

Wales need to change and change fast! Take out the ****e Dafydd Jones - replace with Delve, Fury should start over Cooper! Wales have alot to do for next weeks game!

danny
07-06-08, 07:22 PM
That was always going to happen IMO.Wales were outclassed upfront and at the breakdown all day. The Boks just looked bigger and stronger. With the Grand sham, sorry Grand Slam a distant memory hopefully we can get some perspective back as to the true merits of not only Welsh rugby but northern hemispere rugby. Looking forward to hearing Loratines comments on the game. I trust his nerves have now subsided and he will sleep well tonight.

wlshby09
07-06-08, 11:23 PM
Next week I would go with Shane Williams at 9. Cooper is poor, dont really know much about Fury. Stick Jamie Roberts on the wing, Stoddart in at 15 (although he got stood up twice which lead to tries). The whole SA team craps themselves whenever Shane touches the ball, (much like we do whenever Habana see&#39;s it), so get him closer to the ball and it should give us better go-forward. Just a thought anyway

Macsen
07-06-08, 11:27 PM
Sob. Wales disappointed me, and South Africa did more than they did in the World Cup to convince me that they are World Champions.

The Wales that won the Grand Slam were a great team. Today just showed how much we&#39;re lacking strength in depth, a problem a nation of 2.5m people is always bound to face. I&#39;m one of those 2.5m, which puts us at an extra disadvantage.

But mark my words South Africa, when the Home Nations combine, Voltron-style, next year we&#39;ll rip you a new one. :P

Sir Speedy
07-06-08, 11:30 PM
Next week I would go with Shane Williams at 9. Cooper is poor, dont really know much about Fury. Stick Jamie Roberts on the wing, Stoddart in at 15 (although he got stood up twice which lead to tries). The whole SA team craps themselves whenever Shane touches the ball, (much like we do whenever Habana see&#39;s it), so get him closer to the ball and it should give us better go-forward. Just a thought anyway
[/b]
Oh Jesus Christ no, Stoddart can&#39;t defend to save his life! He got nowhere near Montgomery for his try or the scrum half in the try before that. Woeful, as he is a superb attacking threat.

loratadine
07-06-08, 11:30 PM
south africa out played us, much deserved victory. dissapointed obviously but if you play as sloppily as that against the world champs then you deserve your ass handed to you, only positve was richie hibbard rumbling with a few saffas :) lol and of course shane williams... this guy is not only one of the best wingers in europe... hes one of the best in the world... full stop.

but congrats south africa (Y)

errlloyd
08-06-08, 01:11 AM
Somebody Requested this, quality isn&#39;t great. I know its not avatar sized, I can fix it on request. Its also 2 mb, amazingly nearly the same size as the program that made it.

http://s227.photobucket.com/albums/dd190/errlloyd/th_WilliamsTry.gif

Gay-Guy
08-06-08, 01:15 AM
Wow South Africa really showed why they are the world champions!



The tri-nations this year will be one of the best in ages!!!!

South Africa = World Cup Champions and Number 1 ranked side.

NZ = SANZAR dominance with most Super Rugby and Tri-Nations titles.

Australia = Robbie Deans the Super Coach training a team with more talent than any Crusaders squad ever.



Ireland won&#39;t win against the Aussies next week. England will unfortunately see a much stronger AB performance next week. Scotland will be dreaming if they think they can beat Argentina in Buenos Aires next week....hey should have taken their chances in rosario. Finally to cap it off Wales will improve with less mistakes but S.A is now on a winning roll of victorious tests starting from last year and have gotten into the victory expectation mode type of confidence that comes with triumphs.

KZNSharksFan
08-06-08, 03:24 AM
I like shane williams, but really, stop shooting your load over that try. I&#39;m a slow lock, and even i could beat Habana coming across field at full pace with a simple change of direction. That wasnt much compared to what the tiny ******* williams has done in the past :P

Prestwick
08-06-08, 04:39 AM
Josh Lewsey of +10 de Villiers bane would have made it...

Steve-o
08-06-08, 07:53 AM
Indeed GG, the Tri-Nations is gonna be a thriller this year. Could be the best in years.
Some reports were right, PdV used this Test match to experiment for Tri-nations preparation, I haven&#39;t seen Percy play outside center since the 90&#39;s and he was there for a good 30+ minutes. This team only had 5 of the 15 players who played in the WC final last year (including 2 player&#39;s debuts), so there&#39;s more to come from the Boks, especially in the Tri-nations.
Mujati didn&#39;t do well,. yes it&#39;s his debut but a certain Heinke vd Merwe who has one cap more would of done better, even out of his position at tighthead.
But Bekker! He played well, look very comfortable. He showed up a much more experienced lock.

I&#39;m looking forward to see what team PdV picks for next weekend. No doubt he&#39;ll experiment again, hopefully give BEAST!!!, Kankowski and Steyn a start. The atmosphere and intensity will be higher in Pretoria, they don&#39;t call it Fortress Loftus for nothing.

Gay-Guy
08-06-08, 08:03 AM
Yep....I mean honestly....what the hell are Wales gonna think when KANKOWSKI is unleashed on them! NZ does not have a player who can contain Kankowski...they have to have the entire pack focussing on giving him no room...Thorne stopping him close and Kaino stopping him wide. Wales will think Collins and Soioalo were easy to tackle after they get to play against Kankowski. Hopefully someone like Shane Williams :P will break an arm or leg of Kankowski because I am not looking forward to him playing against NZ at all this year and bringing back memories of that Stormers loosie from the 90&#39;s who used to terrorise us.

Prestwick
08-06-08, 08:40 AM
I have absolutely idea if you&#39;re being serious or not, but its hilarious as hell.

Gay-Guy
08-06-08, 08:45 AM
Yes...its true....NZ has at times been terrorized by players from other countries.....we just pretend we never are...

Prestwick
08-06-08, 08:49 AM
Yup, even terrorised by a living god back in 2003!

silent_shadow
08-06-08, 10:15 AM
Indeed GG, the Tri-Nations is gonna be a thriller this year. Could be the best in years.
Some reports were right, PdV used this Test match to experiment for Tri-nations preparation, I haven&#39;t seen Percy play outside center since the 90&#39;s and he was there for a good 30+ minutes. This team only had 5 of the 15 players who played in the WC final last year (including 2 player&#39;s debuts), so there&#39;s more to come from the Boks, especially in the Tri-nations.
Mujati didn&#39;t do well,. yes it&#39;s his debut but a certain Heinke vd Merwe who has one cap more would of done better, even out of his position at tighthead.
But Bekker! He played well, look very comfortable. He showed up a much more experienced lock.

I&#39;m looking forward to see what team PdV picks for next weekend. No doubt he&#39;ll experiment again, hopefully give BEAST!!!, Kankowski and Steyn a start. The atmosphere and intensity will be higher in Pretoria, they don&#39;t call it Fortress Loftus for nothing. [/b]

Where must Steyn start? I&#39;m still not totally sure of Jacobs, but he had a good game yesterday.
The biggest concern for me is if Januarie&#39;s playing. Bolla played well yesterday so he at least deserve a spot on the bench. But Pienaar also played well when he came on. So will he be dropped for Januarie or will PdV keep the scrummies as is?
Mujati had a shaky start in the scrums. But what more do you expect from a young tighthead on debut. He got settles quickly and he&#39;ll only improve the more games he plays. I still think he should&#39;ve been brought off the bench. Bekker was brilliant in the line outs and at defense. He had a few handling errors, otherwise a solid game. It&#39;s good to know we have a replacement for when Matfield retires.
Danie Rossouw didn&#39;t really do much and I&#39;d still like to see Kankowski in his place.

The best thing about this game was Percy&#39;s try. That blonde streak of lightning gave me the biggest fright! Who knew he still had that much pace left? The pass wasn&#39;t even meant for him but he timed it perfectly. I think Grant was actually meant to go instead of Percy, but he played well nonetheless.
Oh and I expect both teams to play better next week. Wales will be trying to prove a point after playing badly yesterday and the boks will be getting used to the new combinations and getting into their rhythm.

Prestwick
08-06-08, 10:44 AM
If Steyn would stop acting like a hyperactive nutter I would pick him as well. In the World Cup there were multiple cases of him trying way too hard and biting off way more than he could chew. Admirable stuff but he needs to remember that theres fourteen other green shirts out on the field there.

He&#39;ll stick in my mind for two things: one, the superb DGs against Australia and two, him completely going mad against Fiji and trying to take a long line out in his own 22 to a poor fellow Bok standing in try area. Thankfully, common sense prevailed and the ref brought it back but its moments of madness like them which cost games.

Thankfully, Smit told him to calm the hell down and he was back to his usual self afterwards.

dullonien
08-06-08, 11:20 AM
Just watched the game again so I could look at it with more perspective.

South Africa won that game at the breakdown, turnovers gallore, which SA turned into tries at will. If we can&#39;t get good ball in the right positions in the second test, it&#39;ll be another drumming. It wouldn&#39;t of made much difference if Phillips, Peel, Henson, Burne etc. were fit, because the forewards didn&#39;t give the backs the platform they need.

But from that game, it&#39;s blindingly obvious Parker cannot play 12 (how many times have we said that). When Parker plays, Shanklin also looks poor, cos he&#39;s forced to try and create his own space as Parker just creates nothing! Stoddard is nowhere neer international class, his tackling is appalling, wheras Roberts showed he&#39;s got a bright future ahead of him, one of the stars of the Welsh team yesterday.

Shane Williams showed again, if we can get him into the game, give him a bit of space, he&#39;ll do the rest. He really is the best winger in the world at present, one of the only bright lights from that performance. Pitty he only touched the ball a handfull of times!

I thought allmost every SA player had a very good game, with de Villers the standout man. What a player he is, I lost count of the amount of big hits he put in and the amount of offloads he managed out of tackles etc. The only facet of the SA game that struggled was their scrum, but Gethin Jenkins showed that he&#39;s world class, tough job for the rookie SA prop.

Incredible Schalk
08-06-08, 11:40 AM
Shane Williams showed again, if we can get him into the game, give him a bit of space, he&#39;ll do the rest. He really is the best winger in the world at present, one of the only bright lights from that performance. Pitty he only touched the ball a handfull of times!

The only facet of the SA game that struggled was their scrum, but Gethin Jenkins showed that he&#39;s world class, tough job for the rookie SA prop.
[/b]


Yes im not a fan of Mujati&#39;s he got pasted quite a few times in the super 14 so wasnt to happy with him playing yesterday. When the beast arrives the pack should be much stronger i feel.

I have to say i would agree with Williams being a world class winger, imo he is better than Clerc, but until he comes up against Rocokoko and Sivivatu i wouldnt say he&#39;s the best but in europe for sure.

Thingimubob
08-06-08, 11:43 AM
I like shane williams, but really, stop shooting your load over that try. I&#39;m a slow lock, and even i could beat Habana coming across field at full pace with a simple change of direction. That wasnt much compared to what the tiny ******* williams has done in the past :P [/b]

At least give us something, you demolished us! it was a very good try and all the better that it was Habana that Shane stepped. It obviously had an effect on Habana, because he seemed desperate to get a try from then on, and didn&#39;t look too happy that he didn&#39;t get one. And I&#39;d honestly like to see you step Habana mate :P I&#39;m a quick Winger and probably would get caught. And Shane isn&#39;t a ******* myn.

Yeah I watched the highlights on S4C, we got smashed in the breakdown, and the only Welsh player who really tried to be physical and show the Boks that he wasn&#39;t going to lie down and take it was Richard Hibbard. He ended up getting into a fight because of it as well :P

Steve-o
08-06-08, 11:58 AM
<div class='quotemain'> Indeed GG, the Tri-Nations is gonna be a thriller this year. Could be the best in years.
Some reports were right, PdV used this Test match to experiment for Tri-nations preparation, I haven&#39;t seen Percy play outside center since the 90&#39;s and he was there for a good 30+ minutes. This team only had 5 of the 15 players who played in the WC final last year (including 2 player&#39;s debuts), so there&#39;s more to come from the Boks, especially in the Tri-nations.
Mujati didn&#39;t do well,. yes it&#39;s his debut but a certain Heinke vd Merwe who has one cap more would of done better, even out of his position at tighthead.
But Bekker! He played well, look very comfortable. He showed up a much more experienced lock.

I&#39;m looking forward to see what team PdV picks for next weekend. No doubt he&#39;ll experiment again, hopefully give BEAST!!!, Kankowski and Steyn a start. The atmosphere and intensity will be higher in Pretoria, they don&#39;t call it Fortress Loftus for nothing. [/b]

Where must Steyn start? I&#39;m still not totally sure of Jacobs, but he had a good game yesterday.
The biggest concern for me is if Januarie&#39;s playing. Bolla played well yesterday so he at least deserve a spot on the bench. But Pienaar also played well when he came on. So will he be dropped for Januarie or will PdV keep the scrummies as is?
Mujati had a shaky start in the scrums. But what more do you expect from a young tighthead on debut. He got settles quickly and he&#39;ll only improve the more games he plays. I still think he should&#39;ve been brought off the bench. Bekker was brilliant in the line outs and at defense. He had a few handling errors, otherwise a solid game. It&#39;s good to know we have a replacement for when Matfield retires.
Danie Rossouw didn&#39;t really do much and I&#39;d still like to see Kankowski in his place.

The best thing about this game was Percy&#39;s try. That blonde streak of lightning gave me the biggest fright! Who knew he still had that much pace left? The pass wasn&#39;t even meant for him but he timed it perfectly. I think Grant was actually meant to go instead of Percy, but he played well nonetheless.
Oh and I expect both teams to play better next week. Wales will be trying to prove a point after playing badly yesterday and the boks will be getting used to the new combinations and getting into their rhythm. [/b][/quote]

"Why should Steyn play?" = the question that has every Sharks and/or Bok supporter stumped.



IMO, Steyn should either play 13 or 15. Because firstly, he&#39;s a big boy and his physicality will be most effective there, plus his tackling is sound. Secondly, he&#39;s unpredictable (I&#39;m talking about the good unpredictable here), has a good step, knows good running lines and comes onto the ball well. His distribution skills and decision making have failed him sometimes but he only turned 21 a month ago, that kind of stuff can be developed.

He should however stay far away from 10 or 12, the Sharks tried him there and he got showed up, especially at 10. He says he wants to play 10, but meh, he would say that.

Onto Jacobs, I don&#39;t think Jacobs will be a regular starter for the Tri-Nations either. I used to hate him back in 2002 but I&#39;m sure any Sharks supporter will agree with me that he&#39;s been playing good rugby for a couple of years now. I really started liking him when he started running straighter lines and attacking the line with confidence, something he severly lacked back in his early Bok career.

Conradie played well against Wales, no doubt about that, alot of people are eating their words. I&#39;ve been on his case all week, and I certainly didn&#39;t expect him to be so solid. Well played Bolla. But as we all know the Tri-Nations make or break players chances of a Bok spot, and last time around Conradie got showed up by the Aussies and Kiwis. I still think there are atleast 4 other scrum-halves above him.

In order: du Preez, Januarie, Kockett, Vermaak are above him on a consistent basis in the S14 IMO.

I also hope Rossouw gets &#39;rest&#39; :P next week, but he can cover 5 positions which makes it so hard to not include him, just-in-case. Know what I mean? For instance he replaced Botha, a lock, which I assume Kankowski couldn&#39;t slot right into it like him.

Mujati... Hmmm... I&#39;m sure the Stormer fans on here already know I don&#39;t rate this guy as a Springbok. Gonna go out there and say that the Cape doesn&#39;t produce good international props. Visagie and Rautenbach were the last Bok quality props produced in the Cape. However it was quite clear that PdV wanted to play the expansive game by having Steenkamp and Mujati on at the same time, both aren&#39;t reknown for their scrummaging but they get around the park well. Dynamic props indeed. Perhaps that&#39;s why PdV didn&#39;t choose J.du Plessis and H. vd Merwe, both are extremely good scrummager but don&#39;t offer much in loose play. As soon as CJ van der Linde came on the scrums settled down a bit, but then got sin binned for that little scuffle he had :lol: I love that dude, so glad the Boks have him.




If Steyn would stop acting like a hyperactive nutter I would pick him as well. In the World Cup there were multiple cases of him trying way too hard and biting off way more than he could chew. Admirable stuff but he needs to remember that theres fourteen other green shirts out on the field there.

He&#39;ll stick in my mind for two things: one, the superb DGs against Australia and two, him completely going mad against Fiji and trying to take a long line out in his own 22 to a poor fellow Bok standing in try area. Thankfully, common sense prevailed and the ref brought it back but its moments of madness like them which cost games.

Thankfully, Smit told him to calm the hell down and he was back to his usual self afterwards. [/b]

You think he was a loose cannon in the WC, you should of seen him in the S14! My god, I was ripping my hair out.

Steve-o
08-06-08, 12:17 PM
Shane Williams showed again, if we can get him into the game, give him a bit of space, he&#39;ll do the rest. He really is the best winger in the world at present, one of the only bright lights from that performance. Pitty he only touched the ball a handfull of times![/b]


He&#39;s quick and has one hell of step but he was playing against a player with 2 international caps, who subsquently went out of position to tackle the already covered Welsh no.13, and Percy (playing at 13) had to try make up for the mistake (fat chance there), then Habana had to come across field to try and cover but **** that Williams can change direction so well. He even admitted after the game it was textbook stuff. Good try but all this hype of it is quite silly. Saying he&#39;s the best at present is a bit premature.

Prestwick
08-06-08, 12:19 PM
He&#39;s great when he&#39;s calm, Steyn can be forgiven because he&#39;s barely 19, right? And also, he has the raw talent to counter-balance some of the silly things he does from time to time. For example, fair enough he did try some silly things in the WC but at the same time he played really well when he had calmed down.

It kind of points to the leadership of guys like Smit and the other heavies in the squad who can quickly calm a situation before it gets out of control, like it almost did against Fiji.

Incredible Schalk
08-06-08, 12:22 PM
Yea CJ is always good for a laugh, he&#39;s a pretty good scrummager but always seems to get into daft scuffles and occassionally acts as a scrum half :lol:




Shane Williams showed again, if we can get him into the game, give him a bit of space, he&#39;ll do the rest. He really is the best winger in the world at present, one of the only bright lights from that performance. Pitty he only touched the ball a handfull of times![/b]


He&#39;s quick and has one hell of step but he was playing against a player with 2 international caps, who subsquently went out of position to tackle the already covered Welsh no.13, and Percy (playing at 13) had to try make up for the mistake (fat chance there), then Habana had to come across field to try and cover but **** that Williams can change direction so well. He even admitted after the game it was textbook stuff. Good try but all this hype of it is quite silly. Saying he&#39;s the best at present is a bit premature.
[/b]


I dunno, he is the most prolific at the moment, Habana never got any space and was obviously furious when he was held up over the line, on the day Williams certainly had the edge on the Bok wingers partly due to the fact he was the only one to get a chance to run. Williams just has so much confidence, i never used to rate him because he was so small and was always targetted now any time he gets the ball it looks like he can score.

Steve-o
08-06-08, 12:34 PM
Yea CJ is always good for a laugh, he&#39;s a pretty good scrummager but always seems to get into daft scuffles and occassionally acts as a scrum half :lol:

<div class='quotemain'>

Shane Williams showed again, if we can get him into the game, give him a bit of space, he&#39;ll do the rest. He really is the best winger in the world at present, one of the only bright lights from that performance. Pitty he only touched the ball a handfull of times![/b]


He&#39;s quick and has one hell of step but he was playing against a player with 2 international caps, who subsquently went out of position to tackle the already covered Welsh no.13, and Percy (playing at 13) had to try make up for the mistake (fat chance there), then Habana had to come across field to try and cover but **** that Williams can change direction so well. He even admitted after the game it was textbook stuff. Good try but all this hype of it is quite silly. Saying he&#39;s the best at present is a bit premature.
[/b]


I dunno, he is the most prolific at the moment, Habana never got any space and was obviously furious when he was held up over the line, on the day Williams certainly had the edge on the Bok wingers partly due to the fact he was the only one to get a chance to run. Williams just has so much confidence, i never used to rate him because he was so small and was always targetted now any time he gets the ball it looks like he can score. [/b][/quote]

By "at the moment" I assume you&#39;re talking about recent international form? The SH teams have just started their international season, so by saying "at the moment" people are talking about other NH players and teams. Alot of other wingers have a better strike rates him, we should atleast wait till after the Tri-Nations to judge fairly.

Incredible Schalk
08-06-08, 01:23 PM
<div class='quotemain'> Yea CJ is always good for a laugh, he&#39;s a pretty good scrummager but always seems to get into daft scuffles and occassionally acts as a scrum half :lol:

<div class='quotemain'>

Shane Williams showed again, if we can get him into the game, give him a bit of space, he&#39;ll do the rest. He really is the best winger in the world at present, one of the only bright lights from that performance. Pitty he only touched the ball a handfull of times![/b]


He&#39;s quick and has one hell of step but he was playing against a player with 2 international caps, who subsquently went out of position to tackle the already covered Welsh no.13, and Percy (playing at 13) had to try make up for the mistake (fat chance there), then Habana had to come across field to try and cover but **** that Williams can change direction so well. He even admitted after the game it was textbook stuff. Good try but all this hype of it is quite silly. Saying he&#39;s the best at present is a bit premature.
[/b]


I dunno, he is the most prolific at the moment, Habana never got any space and was obviously furious when he was held up over the line, on the day Williams certainly had the edge on the Bok wingers partly due to the fact he was the only one to get a chance to run. Williams just has so much confidence, i never used to rate him because he was so small and was always targetted now any time he gets the ball it looks like he can score. [/b][/quote]

By "at the moment" I assume you&#39;re talking about recent international form? The SH teams have just started their international season, so by saying "at the moment" people are talking about other NH players and teams. Alot of other wingers have a better strike rates him, we should atleast wait till after the Tri-Nations to judge fairly.
[/b][/quote]


whatevvvaaa ..:P

Gay-Guy
08-06-08, 01:31 PM
I have to say i would agree with Williams being a world class winger, imo he is better than Clerc, but until he comes up against Rocokoko and Sivivatu i wouldnt say he&#39;s the best but in europe for sure. [/b]



How quickly people forget who was crossing the line when Sivivatu and Williams met.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41257000/jpg/_41257995_siviv_pa300.jpg

silent_shadow
08-06-08, 02:11 PM
Mujati... Hmmm... I&#39;m sure the Stormer fans on here already know I don&#39;t rate this guy as a Springbok. Gonna go out there and say that the Cape doesn&#39;t produce good international props. Visagie and Rautenbach were the last Bok quality props produced in the Cape. However it was quite clear that PdV wanted to play the expansive game by having Steenkamp and Mujati on at the same time, both aren&#39;t reknown for their scrummaging but they get around the park well. Dynamic props indeed. Perhaps that&#39;s why PdV didn&#39;t choose J.du Plessis and H. vd Merwe, both are extremely good scrummager but don&#39;t offer much in loose play. As soon as CJ van der Linde came on the scrums settled down a bit, but then got sin binned for that little scuffle he had :lol: I love that dude, so glad the Boks have him.
[/b]

How can you not rate Mujati? Seriously awesome scrummager. Yet you want Beast who only stands out in the loose? I do agree that Heinke should&#39;ve been in the team, amazingly strong for someone so young.
Just look at how with the help of a decent workhouse in JD Moller, Mujati was able to push the Sharks scrum around in Durban a few months ago. A scrum with Jannie du Plessis, Beast and BJ Botha (obviosuly not all together).

I think Steyn should play fullback. Easily the best position for him. It means his selfish tendencies to kick the ball away and never pass to anyone else won&#39;t hurt us much. But he&#39;s not deserving of a starting spot yet with Jantjes and Percy still in the mix.

Bull
08-06-08, 02:44 PM
I don&#39;t rate Mujati at all neither the Beast. Mujati doesn&#39;t scrum well at all, while Beast gets around the field well and does other things good he also can&#39;t scrum. Heinke should have been in the team.

Incredible Schalk
08-06-08, 03:04 PM
I don&#39;t rate Mujati at all neither the Beast. Mujati doesn&#39;t scrum well at all, while Beast gets around the field well and does other things good he also can&#39;t scrum. Heinke should have been in the team.
[/b]


Every time i watch the beast he pastes his opposite number <_<

But yea Mujati is a pretty average scrummager and utter crap in the loose

Steve-o
08-06-08, 03:07 PM
<div class='quotemain'>

Mujati... Hmmm... I&#39;m sure the Stormer fans on here already know I don&#39;t rate this guy as a Springbok. Gonna go out there and say that the Cape doesn&#39;t produce good international props. Visagie and Rautenbach were the last Bok quality props produced in the Cape. However it was quite clear that PdV wanted to play the expansive game by having Steenkamp and Mujati on at the same time, both aren&#39;t reknown for their scrummaging but they get around the park well. Dynamic props indeed. Perhaps that&#39;s why PdV didn&#39;t choose J.du Plessis and H. vd Merwe, both are extremely good scrummager but don&#39;t offer much in loose play. As soon as CJ van der Linde came on the scrums settled down a bit, but then got sin binned for that little scuffle he had :lol: I love that dude, so glad the Boks have him.
[/b]

How can you not rate Mujati? Seriously awesome scrummager. Yet you want Beast who only stands out in the loose? I do agree that Heinke should&#39;ve been in the team, amazingly strong for someone so young.
Just look at how with the help of a decent workhouse in JD Moller, Mujati was able to push the Sharks scrum around in Durban a few months ago. A scrum with Jannie du Plessis, Beast and BJ Botha (obviosuly not all together).

I think Steyn should play fullback. Easily the best position for him. It means his selfish tendencies to kick the ball away and never pass to anyone else won&#39;t hurt us much. But he&#39;s not deserving of a starting spot yet with Jantjes and Percy still in the mix.
[/b][/quote]

I know what you mean about Beast, he was a 8th man only 4 years ago but from what I&#39;ve seen of Mujati (granted I didn&#39;t watch all the Stormers games) he seems quite lazy fades away when he meets real opposition (NZ scrums). The Beast does get a good shoulder in, in most scrums but he is nowhere near our best scrummager. Even myself, a staunch Sharks supporter, raised an eye brow when his name got called out for the 30 man squad, however both got raised when Mujati got selected :P . He&#39;s is still young though, and I&#39;m waiting to see the potential he has, as told by Stormer supporters.



Yeah I agree that Steyn hasn&#39;t done enough to secure a spot this season, especially at 15. Jantjies has been awesome this whole season, and has way more composure under the high ball. And Percy... well he&#39;s so damn dependable these days, the veteran is a great asset to the squad. Still a class player. Do you reckon he has another season in his legs? The Lions tour next year is a biggy, and we&#39;ll have to have all our bases covered.

We&#39;re not exactly spoilt for choice when it come to full-backs, so developing Steyn into a 15 could be a good idea. The Sharks wingers didn&#39;t see much ball when he played 13, his just to dominant with the ball at the moment.

Prestwick
08-06-08, 03:51 PM
Yeah I agree that Steyn hasn&#39;t done enough to secure a spot this season, especially at 15. Jantjies has been awesome this whole season, and has way more composure under the high ball. And Percy... well he&#39;s so damn dependable these days, the veteran is a great asset to the squad. Still a class player. Do you reckon he has another season in his legs? The Lions tour next year is a biggy, and we&#39;ll have to have all our bases covered.

We&#39;re not exactly spoilt for choice when it come to full-backs, so developing Steyn into a 15 could be a good idea. The Sharks wingers didn&#39;t see much ball when he played 13, his just to dominant with the ball at the moment.
[/b]

You have to nip the problem of developing players who are either too selfish or simply not self aware enough to work the ball in the bud. Post 2003, you had a problem where the &#39;new&#39; generation of England centers either didn&#39;t know that Jason Robinson/Mark Cueto was standing on an overlap or were more interested in trying to crash through the opposition via route one. The result? Not making the gain line and turnover. The Tindall and Noon partnership was possibly one of the biggest disasters of post 2003 English Rugby. The reason why Greenwood and Tindall rocked so much was because Greenwood&#39;s brains balanced Tindall&#39;s tunnel vision brutality. You didn&#39;t have to worry about Tindall because you knew that Greenwood would have an answer for any eventuality. When Greenwood went, Andy Robinson either couldn&#39;t or wouldn&#39;t make up his mind over developing a suitable replacement for 2007 and time after time resorted to Noon & Tindall. Utter, utter fail.

Anyway! The lesson of this is to move Steyn to full back and harness that ultra powerful boot of his! Job done!

TVH11
08-06-08, 03:58 PM
well was a good match for neutrals i guess. Wales were just outclassed, no excusses (humidity, end of season, injuries etc hahah). Only good thing was I&#39;d say Shane Williams 1- Bryan Habana 0 hahahaha. Although Habana looked lively at times! should be interesting next week.

Steve-o
08-06-08, 05:19 PM
You have to nip the problem of developing players who are either too selfish or simply not self aware enough to work the ball in the bud. Post 2003, you had a problem where the &#39;new&#39; generation of England centers either didn&#39;t know that Jason Robinson/Mark Cueto was standing on an overlap or were more interested in trying to crash through the opposition via route one. The result? Not making the gain line and turnover. The Tindall and Noon partnership was possibly one of the biggest disasters of post 2003 English Rugby. The reason why Greenwood and Tindall rocked so much was because Greenwood&#39;s brains balanced Tindall&#39;s tunnel vision brutality. You didn&#39;t have to worry about Tindall because you knew that Greenwood would have an answer for any eventuality. When Greenwood went, Andy Robinson either couldn&#39;t or wouldn&#39;t make up his mind over developing a suitable replacement for 2007 and time after time resorted to Noon & Tindall. Utter, utter fail.

Anyway! The lesson of this is to move Steyn to full back and harness that ultra powerful boot of his! Job done! [/b]

Luckily for the Boks and the younger players like Steyn we have some great leaders, in the backs and forwards. Smit, Watson, Smith, Matfiled, De Villiers and Fourie have been or are captains of their S14 and provincial teams. PdV is also one no non-sense type of guy and has coached SA at U/19 and U/21 (x2) level so he knows how to handle young players.

I also think we should put too much pressure on Steyn, as he&#39;s still very young and I feel some of his coaches value his wildcard status. HOWEVER, international rugby doesn&#39;t take any prisoners, so if he wants to play a part for the Boks he needs to stop sulking so much, shut the f*** up and get in line.

But I&#39;m sure under PdV he will thrive, as PdV has worked and helped develop with alot the young players you see on the international scene nowdays. I listed them in another thread, but it fell on deaf ears though as they were empty names, but after the Test match last week maybe some more people will give him more recognition. Spies, Watson, Shalk Britz, Bosman, Barritt, Heinke vd Merwe and many more have all worked with PdV in the past.

Sir Speedy
08-06-08, 05:35 PM
the only Welsh player who really tried to be physical and show the Boks that he wasn&#39;t going to lie down and take it was Richard Hibbard. He ended up getting into a fight because of it as well :P
[/b]
Shame about his throwing in at the lineout. We lost two balls when he came on I think. Then again, all of our hookers suck at throwing in. :angry:

silent_shadow
08-06-08, 06:35 PM
I know what you mean about Beast, he was a 8th man only 4 years ago but from what I&#39;ve seen of Mujati (granted I didn&#39;t watch all the Stormers games) he seems quite lazy fades away when he meets real opposition (NZ scrums). The Beast does get a good shoulder in, in most scrums but he is nowhere near our best scrummager. Even myself, a staunch Sharks supporter, raised an eye brow when his name got called out for the 30 man squad, however both got raised when Mujati got selected tongue.gif . He&#39;s is still young though, and I&#39;m waiting to see the potential he has, as told by Stormer supporters.

Yeah I agree that Steyn hasn&#39;t done enough to secure a spot this season, especially at 15. Jantjies has been awesome this whole season, and has way more composure under the high ball. And Percy... well he&#39;s so damn dependable these days, the veteran is a great asset to the squad. Still a class player. Do you reckon he has another season in his legs? The Lions tour next year is a biggy, and we&#39;ll have to have all our bases covered.

We&#39;re not exactly spoilt for choice when it come to full-backs, so developing Steyn into a 15 could be a good idea. The Sharks wingers didn&#39;t see much ball when he played 13, his just to dominant with the ball at the moment.
[/b]

The only NZ scrum that we didn&#39;t do well against was the Crusaders&#39; (and did any team scrum well against them?) We outscrummed the Blues and Chiefs with Mujati shouldering most of the responsibility. Aginst the Hurricanes we definitely had the upper hand, remember that 40m rolling maul that Mujati was in front of? Only when Moller became injured, that idiot Brok Harris replaced him and Mujati has to move to loosehead did we start struggling. And I can&#39;t remember how our scrum stood up to the Highlanders.
Point is, Mujati was anything but nonexistant against NZ. When he&#39;s plays well, our scrum does well. To be honest that&#39;s the reason I want him to succeed so much, there&#39;s no player who&#39;s important in The Stormers squad than him. So I really hope he can make the step up. I&#39;ll judge him properly at the end of the year though when he should&#39;ve been tested enough.

I can&#39;t imagine that Percy will still be as good a player next year. But then I&#39;ve been thinking that for the past few years and he&#39;s proved me wrong so it&#39;ll probably be the same. He&#39;s a great player to have around to pass his experience on.
I think Percy should be rested against Italy and we can have Steyn start at fullback to see how he does. Steyn&#39;s still young so he can be be developed as a fullback in the meanwhile and when Percy retires he&#39;ll probably be fighting with Jantjes for a starting place. Nothing wrong with playing in another position when you&#39;re needed (like Percy did yesterday), but this swopping him around has really messed him up.

Maybe if we&#39;re lucky Habana and Chavanga will get more of the ball next week. It&#39;s actually amazing have 3 super fast, brilliant wings on a rugby field at one time. Chavanga&#39;s defense was a bit disappointing though, especially since his defense was so good during the Super 14. But it&#39;s his 1st game back from injury so let&#39;s hope heregains his spark next week.

errlloyd
08-06-08, 06:53 PM
our hookers suck
[/b]



Perfect out of context quote.....

Johan
08-06-08, 07:17 PM
I TINK WALES SHOULD RETHINK THEIR TACTICS BECAUSE FOR ME THS WASNT THE BEST SPRINGBOK TEAM AND STIL THEY HAMMERD THE WALES

Mr.cyclopede
08-06-08, 07:19 PM
For people in France, the match is on Canal + sport (as most of the test matches beetween NH and SH)

Go on Walles

Johan
08-06-08, 07:29 PM
THE BOKS ARE GOING TO BEAT THE WALES NEXT SAT

silent_shadow
08-06-08, 08:22 PM
THE BOKS ARE GOING TO BEAT THE WALES NEXT SAT [/b]

http://opera.oslocity.org/caps/capslock.jpg

Cymro
08-06-08, 09:30 PM
Some better news for Wales

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_unio...lsh/7442764.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/7442764.stm)

Matthew Rees is out! Rhys Thomas in at hooker. Now I feel that the wrong Cardiff hooker has been picked! Gareth Williams kept Thomas out of the Blues squad and even during the 6 nations earned the right to sit on the bench out in Ireland infront of Thomas!

Macsen
08-06-08, 09:32 PM
THE BOKS ARE GOING TO BEAT THE WALES NEXT SAT [/b]
NO THEYR NOT LIES

shtove
08-06-08, 10:23 PM
Bok supporters don&#39;t talk about Steyn as if he were the best player in the world - he&#39;s not there yet, but his abilities are way ahead of anyone else. And yet the team does great without him. Amazing.

SA will win RWC 2011 - sorry ABs!

Prestwick
08-06-08, 11:14 PM
<div class='quotemain'> THE BOKS ARE GOING TO BEAT THE WALES NEXT SAT [/b]
NO THEYR NOT LIES
[/b][/quote]

ONOES U FOGUT THE APOSTRAVIE!

loratadine
09-06-08, 12:02 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61MISYZHT_s



yes, watch that welsh fans :)



what a boy!!



i dont give a ****, rugbys bout opinions, and my opinion is that shane williams is the most exciting and dangerous player on the planet :)

errlloyd
09-06-08, 12:08 AM
Curios that he never dives for his run in tries for ophspreys but he does for Wales, players have there own style, personally I was always one for touching it off the post.