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mark_shaw
09-01-06, 10:13 PM
in the nz herald today there was an article about how marshall could switch over if leeds get relagated but then there was a quote from the leeds guy sayng he wont let marhsall go anywhere for at lease another year :S

Bullitt
10-01-06, 09:10 AM
It's a joke when players jump ship if there's a risk of relegation. He knew the risk by joining Leeds so he should face the conciquences.

Besides, if he wen't to Quins he wouldn't play as they already have Mhertens.

harrison2468
10-01-06, 06:50 PM
Originally posted by Teh Mite@Jan 10 2006, 09:10 AM
Besides, if he wen't to Quins he wouldn't play as they already have Mhertens.
He is applying for South African nationality, meaning he won't be a foreign player.

SaintsFan_Webby
10-01-06, 06:50 PM
Originally posted by Teh Mite@Jan 10 2006, 10:10 AM
Besides, if he wen't to Quins he wouldn't play as they already have Mhertens.
Merthts is getting an SA passport. Problem solved.

Hopefully Leeds go down, Quins come up, they try scrapping relegation for a couple of seasons, and we have a Prem full of proper teams.

Bullitt
10-01-06, 06:53 PM
I thought the rule said they have to be a capped South African otherwise they have to naff off after 18 months?

SaintsFan_Webby
10-01-06, 06:55 PM
Originally posted by Teh Mite@Jan 10 2006, 07:53 PM
I thought the rule said they have to be a capped South African otherwise they have to naff off after 18 months?
Don't think so. For some reason unknown to most normal people SA players don't count as overseas.

harrison2468
10-01-06, 06:58 PM
Originally posted by SaintsFan_Webby@Jan 10 2006, 06:50 PM
they try scrapping relegation for a couple of seasons, and we have a Prem full of proper teams.
No way is that fair. Either expand the Premiership or keep it as it is. The season would be boring if there was nothing to play for. Relegation is exciting, and brings the crowds in. Plus, if Leeds go down, they will fall apart, and take a few years to come back up.

Bullitt
10-01-06, 06:59 PM
What about the reason Wyle Human had to go home - He wasn't capped and only got an 18 month visa.

SaintsFan_Webby
10-01-06, 07:43 PM
Originally posted by harrison2468+Jan 10 2006, 07:58 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (harrison2468 @ Jan 10 2006, 07:58 PM)</div>
<!--QuoteBegin-SaintsFan_Webby@Jan 10 2006, 06:50 PM
they try scrapping relegation for a couple of seasons, and we have a Prem full of proper teams.
No way is that fair. Either expand the Premiership or keep it as it is. The season would be boring if there was nothing to play for. Relegation is exciting, and brings the crowds in. Plus, if Leeds go down, they will fall apart, and take a few years to come back up. [/b]
Fine expand it to 14 team, bring up a couple of worthy clubs, leave Leeds where they are and see how it goes.

Their stadium is rubbish, their fans are rubbish, and their team are crap. The Prem would look much better with Quins in their place.

Bullitt
10-01-06, 07:59 PM
14 clubs are far too many. It&#39;ll get to the point where players are playing twice a week, which is far too much for a game as physical as rugby. Players are getting burned out as it is.

Canadian_Rugger
11-01-06, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by Teh Mite@Jan 11 2006, 07:59 AM
14 clubs are far too many. It&#39;ll get to the point where players are playing twice a week, which is far too much for a game as physical as rugby. Players are getting burned out as it is.
who said you have to play a team twice f***. The NFL plays 16 games a season and their are 32 teams in the league. Offcourse they do draw 70,000 fans a game :-P

Bullitt
11-01-06, 09:45 PM
Originally posted by Canadian_Rugger+Jan 11 2006, 09:26 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Canadian_Rugger @ Jan 11 2006, 09:26 PM)</div>
<!--QuoteBegin-Teh Mite@Jan 11 2006, 07:59 AM
14 clubs are far too many. It&#39;ll get to the point where players are playing twice a week, which is far too much for a game as physical as rugby. Players are getting burned out as it is.
who said you have to play a team twice f***. The NFL plays 16 games a season and their are 32 teams in the league. Offcourse they do draw 70,000 fans a game :-P [/b]
Whoop-de-f***in-do-dah for them.

Canadian_Rugger
11-01-06, 10:15 PM
Originally posted by Teh Mite+Jan 12 2006, 09:45 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Jan 12 2006, 09:45 AM)</div>

Originally posted by Canadian_Rugger@Jan 11 2006, 09:26 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-Teh Mite@Jan 11 2006, 07:59 AM
14 clubs are far too many. It&#39;ll get to the point where players are playing twice a week, which is far too much for a game as physical as rugby. Players are getting burned out as it is.
who said you have to play a team twice f***. The NFL plays 16 games a season and their are 32 teams in the league. Offcourse they do draw 70,000 fans a game :-P
Whoop-de-f***in-do-dah for them. [/b]
whoopdee f***ing do is right as the National Football League is the most successfully run league in the world and is one of only five leagues that draw over 30,000 fans a game on avg

Guinness Premiership Rugby union England 2004-05 132 1,282,743 9,718 guinnesspremiership.com


NFL American football United States 2005 256 17,270,486 67,463 kenn.com

The problem with relegation is it has the potential of hurting big clubs which are what really makes the game what it is Imagine a club like Leicester or Gloucester going down in this era the drop would be devastating sure the Quins are going to bounce right back up but thats not the case for every club and relegation will only hurt clubs.

My idea would be scrap the Powergen Cup crap, cut league games down to 18 + Heineken Cup and increase league size when a team in division one earns the right for promotion.

Oh and make a new playoff system. This whole Wildcard crap sucks a lot of cock. Top 6 teams qualify for playoffs with the top 2 getting a bye to the semis other four play each other then move onto round 2.

Cutting the Powergen cup would give so much more leeway to the season tis not even funny

mark_shaw
11-01-06, 11:12 PM
samoans dont count has forein players lol wat the funk

An Tarbh
11-01-06, 11:26 PM
Originally posted by SaintsFan_Webby+Jan 10 2006, 07:55 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SaintsFan_Webby @ Jan 10 2006, 07:55 PM)</div>
<!--QuoteBegin-Teh Mite@Jan 10 2006, 07:53 PM
I thought the rule said they have to be a capped South African otherwise they have to naff off after 18 months?
Don&#39;t think so. For some reason unknown to most normal people SA players don&#39;t count as overseas. [/b]
It&#39;s because of the Kolpak ruling stating that workers from around 100 countries who have trade agreements with the EU are now protected by European employment laws.

The court decision was based upon the idea that no resident of the European Union should be prevented from working in another part of the EU. Specifically the case meant that, in professional sports, if a sporting club chose a player who resided in the EU, then there could be no law preventing this.

Kolpak was a Solvakian handball player who wanted to play in Germany but not be classed as a foreigner (this was prior to Slovakia joining the EU)

This has allowed English cricket Counties to have more than one overseas player.

sambãd5
12-01-06, 07:41 AM
Originally posted by mark_shaw@Jan 12 2006, 12:12 PM
samoans dont count has forein players lol wat the funk
yeah, havent you ever seen the all blacks? http://www.therugbyforum.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif

mark_shaw
12-01-06, 09:44 AM
is there a law in nz with the forein player thing..

harrison2468
12-01-06, 05:36 PM
My suggestion would be to increase the size to 15 teams, and have a Super12 style format, except with 14 games. Keep the Powergen, but change the format to a FA Cup style. Make the &#39;big&#39; teams come into the cup at a certain point, having the games played in the early rounds with Divison 3 teams. Getting rid of this group crap and make it knock-out would cut a few pointless games. Also, we could keep the Welsh teams in the comp if revenue is an issue. http://www.therugbyforum.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif

I reckon this would cut off about 8-9 weeks, perfect for FREE weekends during the 6N. Also, keep the play-off but only top 4, Wildcard is pointless.

An Tarbh
12-01-06, 05:39 PM
I like the idea of the super 14 format, however would the club owners go for it considering their loss in revenue? Doubt it.

Would also be worth considering if the top 3 Italian teams are to be invited into the Celtic League.

harrison2468
12-01-06, 06:02 PM
The problem is that I can&#39;t think of a single situation where one party is not negatively affected. However, player burn-out is a big issue, and needs to be dealt with properly and ideally, as soon as possible.

The club owners will not get as much revenue as there will be less home games, but I suppose all their best players will be available, which may add a few fans on. An agreement between the RFU and the clubs should be really a priority, but thtey don&#39;t really like speaking to each other that much... http://www.therugbyforum.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif

Of course, if the stupid RFU relised the advantages of central contracts years ago, then many problems wouldn&#39;t be here today.

Titan
12-01-06, 08:08 PM
Originally posted by SaintsFan_Webby@Jan 11 2006, 07:43 AM
Fine expand it to 14 team, bring up a couple of worthy clubs, leave Leeds where they are and see how it goes.

Their stadium is rubbish, their fans are rubbish, and their team are crap. The Prem would look much better with Quins in their place.
So what makes a team &#39;worthy&#39; in your opinion? What happens on the pitch is all that should matter - if you&#39;re good enough, you go up - that&#39;s what competitive sport is all about. No team has a divine right to play in the top flight, not even Northampton. Quins went down last year because they were the worst team in the division. Likewise, whoever finishes bottom this year will deserve to go down. By all means expand the GP to 14 teams, but scrapping relegation now would be an almighty step backwards.

SaintsFan_Webby
12-01-06, 08:19 PM
Originally posted by Titan+Jan 12 2006, 09:08 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Titan @ Jan 12 2006, 09:08 PM)</div>
<!--QuoteBegin-SaintsFan_Webby@Jan 11 2006, 07:43 AM

Fine expand it to 14 team, bring up a couple of worthy clubs, leave Leeds where they are and see how it goes.

Their stadium is rubbish, their fans are rubbish, and their team are crap. The Prem would look much better with Quins in their place.
So what makes a team &#39;worthy&#39; in your opinion? What happens on the pitch is all that should matter - if you&#39;re good enough, you go up - that&#39;s what competitive sport is all about. No team has a divine right to play in the top flight, not even Northampton. Quins went down last year because they were the worst team in the division. Likewise, whoever finishes bottom this year will deserve to go down. By all means expand the GP to 14 teams, but scrapping relegation now would be an almighty step backwards. [/b]
By worthy, I mean clubs who add something to the league.

Leeds have an awful ground, a small and irritating fan base, and as a club really don&#39;t merit top flight rugby at the moment. If they decide to ring-fence the Premiership as they have been talking of doing, then it has to be full of teams with the facilities and support base to warrant top class rugby.

Yes it&#39;s elitist, and I&#39;d much rather have relegation. However, if they decide to close off the top league then it has to contain a full complement of competitive teams.

No offense, but last time Rotherham were in the Premiership it was just embarassing. I would love more teams to come through and prove themselves, but at the moment there are only about 14 who could realistically hope to compete at the top level.

Titan
12-01-06, 08:36 PM
But surely if you want a competitive league, you need promotion and relegation? Remember last season when it went down to the wire? That&#39;s how you sell a product. Without relegation, half the games after December would be devoid of interest for spectators and sponsors alike. It&#39;s the same in National 1 - there are a number of clubs who aspire to play in the Premiership one day (Cornish Pirates, Plymouth, Bedford, and yes, the Titans) - who knows, one of these could be the next Sale. Rugby as a sport simply cannot afford to ringfence.

SaintsFan_Webby
12-01-06, 08:41 PM
I would much rather keep relegation and promotion, and I agree with what you&#39;re saying.

The point is, they have been threatening to scrap it for years, and if the RFU do decide to, then they need to first ensure the top league is full of sides who are going to be competitive at that level.

English rugby can&#39;t afford to have a massive gap between the top and bottom team. Every team needs to have the ability to beat every other in the league on their day.

wigan_rlfc
13-01-06, 02:10 PM
Originally posted by SaintsFan_Webby@Jan 10 2006, 06:50 PM
Hopefully Leeds go down, Quins come up, they try scrapping relegation for a couple of seasons, and we have a Prem full of proper teams.
Proper Teams like Newcastle?

Plus Headingley is one of the largest grounds in the Guinness prem, also a new stand is being built over one of the open terraces this year.

SaintsFan_Webby
13-01-06, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by wigan_rlfc+Jan 13 2006, 03:10 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wigan_rlfc @ Jan 13 2006, 03:10 PM)</div>
<!--QuoteBegin-SaintsFan_Webby@Jan 10 2006, 06:50 PM
Hopefully Leeds go down, Quins come up, they try scrapping relegation for a couple of seasons, and we have a Prem full of proper teams.
Proper Teams like Newcastle?

Plus Headingley is one of the largest grounds in the Guinness prem, also a new stand is being built over one of the open terraces this year. [/b]
Yes, like Newcastle. Reasonable attendences, decent players, good coach, nice stadium.


Don&#39;t think the Tykes play at the same ground as the Rhinos, because I&#39;ve seen their ground, and it&#39;s an absolute turd of a ground.

harrison2468
13-01-06, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by SaintsFan_Webby@Jan 13 2006, 05:00 PM
Yes, like Newcastle. Reasonable attendences, decent players, good coach, nice stadium.


Don&#39;t think the Tykes play at the same ground as the Rhinos, because I&#39;ve seen their ground, and it&#39;s an absolute turd of a ground.
You should of stopped at decent players! http://www.therugbyforum.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif

I&#39;m quite sure that Leeds play at Headingly, but don&#39;t pull in anywhere near enough big crowds to justify playing in a reasonably large stadium.

Bullitt
13-01-06, 05:46 PM
The Rhinos and the Tykes are the same club, so yes, they do both play at Headingley

http://www.leedsrugby.com/

SaintsFan_Webby
13-01-06, 06:13 PM
My mistake. It still isn&#39;t a good stadium though, obviously not at all helped by the rubbish attendances.

Symclaw
13-01-06, 06:54 PM
I dont think u could get rid of leeds, because the argument, that would always be brought up, for leeds is that they&#39;re the only Northern representative. I think im right in saying that, however i dropped Geog in 3rd year.

Bullitt
13-01-06, 07:04 PM
So where is Sale?

Or Newcastle?

SaintsFan_Webby
13-01-06, 08:24 PM
Originally posted by Symclaw@Jan 13 2006, 07:54 PM
I dont think u could get rid of leeds, because the argument, that would always be brought up, for leeds is that they&#39;re the only Northern representative. I think im right in saying that, however i dropped Geog in 3rd year.
Hmmm......might be time to open up that map again. http://www.therugbyforum.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif

wigan_rlfc
14-01-06, 03:14 PM
Originally posted by Teh Mite@Jan 13 2006, 07:04 PM
So where is Sale?

Or Newcastle?
Well Sale is Cheshire, not the true North.

Bullitt
14-01-06, 05:16 PM
Originally posted by wigan_rlfc+Jan 14 2006, 03:14 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wigan_rlfc @ Jan 14 2006, 03:14 PM)</div>
<!--QuoteBegin-Teh Mite@Jan 13 2006, 07:04 PM
So where is Sale?

Or Newcastle?
Well Sale is Cheshire, not the true North. [/b]
North of the Watford Gap isn&#39;t it?

It&#39;s bloody Nothern, now finish yer chips &#39;n&#39; gravy &#39;n&#39; get down t&#39; coal mine...

Symclaw
16-01-06, 04:15 PM
ignorance is bliss

woosaah
16-01-06, 10:51 PM
so....

Marshall wont go to quins because leeds wouldnt let him out of his contract anyway. he has another year and he is stuck with them, or so i read somewhere (sorry for getting back on topic)

Symclaw
17-01-06, 04:03 PM
how dare you

woosaah
17-01-06, 08:26 PM
yeah sorry about that, but it needeed to be said

wigan_rlfc
19-01-06, 03:01 PM
Originally posted by Teh Mite+Jan 14 2006, 05:16 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Jan 14 2006, 05:16 PM)</div>

Originally posted by wigan_rlfc@Jan 14 2006, 03:14 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-Teh Mite@Jan 13 2006, 07:04 PM
So where is Sale?

Or Newcastle?
Well Sale is Cheshire, not the true North.
North of the Watford Gap isn&#39;t it?

It&#39;s bloody Nothern, now finish yer chips &#39;n&#39; gravy &#39;n&#39; get down t&#39; coal mine... [/b]
My local pit closed in 1940.

Bullitt
19-01-06, 03:17 PM
Originally posted by wigan_rlfc+Jan 19 2006, 03:01 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wigan_rlfc @ Jan 19 2006, 03:01 PM)</div>

Originally posted by Teh Mite@Jan 14 2006, 05:16 PM

Originally posted by wigan_rlfc@Jan 14 2006, 03:14 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-Teh Mite@Jan 13 2006, 07:04 PM
So where is Sale?

Or Newcastle?
Well Sale is Cheshire, not the true North.
North of the Watford Gap isn&#39;t it?

It&#39;s bloody Nothern, now finish yer chips &#39;n&#39; gravy &#39;n&#39; get down t&#39; coal mine...
My local pit closed in 1940. [/b]
Well, s&#39;posse you can blam t&#39;Torys for that &#39;un.

lewseys got it covered
26-01-06, 06:58 AM
Marshall will stay at leeds beacuse they won&#39;t get relegated!!!! they&#39;ll do the same as last year and defend like their life depends on it, truth be told this year i don&#39;t want to see anyone go down, it breaks up fantastic teams.

Bullitt
26-01-06, 08:12 AM
Ah, sod that. Get rid of Leeds, no one likes tham anyway, and bring the toffs back up.

Than ringfence it.

lewseys got it covered
26-01-06, 04:20 PM
id like to see northampton go down, bar the kiwis in there team.

Bullitt
26-01-06, 05:42 PM
Well there&#39;s a contradiction in terms.

lewseys got it covered
26-01-06, 06:04 PM
hahaha its just i was born in leeds and although i wouldnt like to see anyone go down if there was someone it would have to be northampton.

SaintsFan_Webby
26-01-06, 07:08 PM
Originally posted by lewseys got it covered@Jan 26 2006, 05:20 PM
id like to see northampton go down, bar the kiwis in there team.
Obviously I&#39;m going to disagree with you there. However, Northampton going down would be a much bigger loss to the Premiership than Leeds.

We have top facilities, big crowds and fan base, are one of the few clubs who make profit year after year, and are starting to play some very attractive rugby.

All of which Leeds are not.

lewseys got it covered
26-01-06, 07:43 PM
but come on i was born there, i&#39;m not avoiding the fact i biasd. but seriously there is some very good youth coming through tykes just take a look at tom biggs so it would be a shame to loose them. also i think marshalls got a clause in his contract which releases him if leeds get relegated (that could be spencer i get so confused!!!)

SaintsFan_Webby
26-01-06, 07:45 PM
Originally posted by lewseys got it covered@Jan 26 2006, 08:43 PM
but seriously there is some very good youth coming through tykes just take a look at tom biggs so it would be a shame to loose them.
Saints Academy is one of the best in the country.

lewseys got it covered
26-01-06, 07:57 PM
your barley playing them in the first team, i play rugby with some of the development squad who are mostly north england. hooper one of the youngest captains in the premiership.