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View Full Version : Welsh rugby club protest march 31st



samponty
10-01-12, 07:39 PM
As many people know Welsh rugby went regional in 2004. Sadly the regions are nothing more than glorified super clubs. The hundreds of Welsh rugby clubs were merged into LLANELLI scarlets, Ospreys, CARDIFF blues and NEWPORT gwent dragons. This meant many famous rugby clubs such as (Neath, Bridgend, Pontypridd, Caerphilly, Ebbw Vale and Pontypool) were simply made feeder clubs to the big 4 of Llanelli, Swansea, Cardiff and Newport despite for years being their equals domestically and in Europe.
I ask all fans of the English Championship and BIC who have enjoyed visiting these rugby clubs down the years to sign a petition led by Pontypridd RFC. The petition is to form one true Valleys Region to embrace all the discarded rugby clubs, and therefore for clubs like Pontypridd to brake away from the Cardiff Blues.
The petition - http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/reform-regional-rugby/signatures/page/17

Thanks for your time

Feicarsinn
10-01-12, 07:47 PM
I seem to remember there being a franchise in place for the like of Pontypridd and Brigend that was riddled with petty squabbling amongst the fans before going balls-up under financial pressure. Also, why did you put the like of Newport and Llanelli in capitols while leaving Neath, Swansea and Gwent in smaller letters. Didn't fit your point eh?

dullonien
10-01-12, 08:21 PM
There's a very big argument to say that the Valleys need their own region, but for the time being I think the WRU are doing the corect thing in developing a North Wales region.

I think most people can accesp that the regional structure was ballsed up at it's inception in 2004, mainly because Llanelli and Cardiff wanted to stand alone. The original regional split made perfect sense, and would have resulted in stronger regions if the WRU had just stuck to their guns instead of bowing under pressure.

The demise of the Celtic Warriors was unfortunate, especially because they probably had the best team on paper and were getting some excellent results at the time. Still, the support from the valleys wasn't up to scratch, and along with Layton Samuel that spelled the end for the region. Maybe the WRU could have done more to support the Warriors in their time of need, as they did with the Scarlets recently, but at that point the WRU decided that Wales could make do with 4 regions (which was probably about right, considering the players available at the time). I still don't think there's enough players for 5 regions in Wales, although it's getting there slowly with the academies working exceptionally well.

1580

I think the above map showes that North Wales deserve a region more.

I know this does nothing to help matters in the Valleys, with alot of people unwilling to support Cardiff Blues (understandably), but there's not much that can be done about it unfortunately. North Wales has had to make do with the Scarlets being their region despite being more than 200miles and 4-5hours away. The Valleys might have to make do aswell by either awallowing their pride and supporting the Blues, or travelling a little further to one of the other regions. Hopefully in time, something can be done about it, when the player pool is big enough and the money is there to bring back the Celtic Warriors.

psychic duck
10-01-12, 08:44 PM
There's a very big argument to say that the Valleys need their own region, but for the time being I think the WRU are doing the corect thing in developing a North Wales region.

I think most people can accesp that the regional structure was ballsed up at it's inception in 2004, mainly because Llanelli and Cardiff wanted to stand alone. The original regional split made perfect sense, and would have resulted in stronger regions if the WRU had just stuck to their guns instead of bowing under pressure.

The demise of the Celtic Warriors was unfortunate, especially because they probably had the best team on paper and were getting some excellent results at the time. Still, the support from the valleys wasn't up to scratch, and along with Layton Samuel that spelled the end for the region. Maybe the WRU could have done more to support the Warriors in their time of need, as they did with the Scarlets recently, but at that point the WRU decided that Wales could make do with 4 regions (which was probably about right, considering the players available at the time). I still don't think there's enough players for 5 regions in Wales, although it's getting there slowly with the academies working exceptionally well.

1580

I think the above map showes that North Wales deserve a region more.

I know this does nothing to help matters in the Valleys, with alot of people unwilling to support Cardiff Blues (understandably), but there's not much that can be done about it unfortunately. North Wales has had to make do with the Scarlets being their region despite being more than 200miles and 4-5hours away. The Valleys might have to make do aswell by either awallowing their pride and supporting the Blues, or travelling a little further to one of the other regions. Hopefully in time, something can be done about it, when the player pool is big enough and the money is there to bring back the Celtic Warriors.

I'm not sure there is the player pool for too many more sides especially with a batch of players leaving to France and more expected in the future, otherwise the sides would really struggle in the Heineken Cup adnd Welsh sides haven't been that successful with just 4 teams, I know people are nostalgic about the clubs but they were doing very poor financially before the regions and were getting progressively worse results in the Heineken Cup

I think the regions should relocate games more often, the Ospreys got the right idea with LV Cup matches, but I think they should give average humdrum Rabo12 matches to Bridgend, the Scarlets also could play a couple of matches in North Wales, Cardiff in Pontypridd and so on




I seem to remember there being a franchise in place for the like of Pontypridd and Brigend that was riddled with petty squabbling amongst the fans before going balls-up under financial pressure.

correct

TRF_Olyy
10-01-12, 09:09 PM
Am I right in thinking the only ground in North Wales for a franchise to use would be the racecourse in Wrexham?

TrueSlawter
10-01-12, 09:12 PM
A north wales region is needed way more than a Valleys one to be fair.. As its been said before having the closest regional team 4-5 hours away doesnt help potential future wales players up north as to put it simply they can't travel that just for training and have to take the risk moving down south when it could come to nothing.. To be fair I'd rather see the Blues being re-formed if that makes sense give them a new image etc. to hopefully get the valleys on board but tbh its unpractical to play in 2/3 stadiums just to keep supporters happy, it could be done on the odd occasion to keep support away from their main base but I just see it as a bit unpractical and then you've got to consider money.. The cost of say scarlets going up north wont really be covered by playing somewhere like Erias park (RGCs or WRUNWASXV or whatever it is called now) play their home games, likewise for going to the racecourse ground in wrexham

As for NW stadiums Erias Park is more central (Colwyn Bay) But will need development in terms of stands.. currently it has 2 stands and a terracey kinda area. It has the development center for NW (RGC) there though

http://www.sportvenueconstruction.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/180909-eirias.gif

Feicarsinn
10-01-12, 09:23 PM
A north wales region is needed way more than a Valleys one to be fair.. As its been said before having the closest regional team 4-5 hours away doesnt help potential future wales players up north as to put it simply they can't travel that just for training and have to take the risk moving down south when it could come to nothing.. To be fair I'd rather see the Blues being re-formed if that makes sense give them a new image etc. to hopefully get the valleys on board but tbh its unpractical to play in 2/3 stadiums just to keep supporters happy, it could be done on the odd occasion to keep support away from their main base but I just see it as a bit unpractical and then you've got to consider money.. The cost of say scarlets going up north wont really be covered by playing somewhere like Erias park (RGCs or WRUNWASXV or whatever it is called now) play their home games, likewise for going to the racecourse ground in wrexham

As for NW stadiums Erias Park is more central (Colwyn Bay) But will need development in terms of stands.. currently it has 2 stands and a terracey kinda area. It has the development center for NW (RGC) there though

http://www.sportvenueconstruction.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/180909-eirias.gif

Munster are playing four games this season at Musgrave Park and eleven at Thomond while the A team pretty much play all over the province. While it's not a particularly even split it is at least a decent effort to spread some fixtures round the place. A decent nod to the fans. It wouldn't be inconceivable for the likes of Cardiff or Ospreys to play 3 games or so outside of the cities.

racingmetrofan
10-01-12, 09:29 PM
I'm not sure there is the player pool for too many more sides especially with a batch of players leaving to France and more expected in the future, otherwise the sides would really struggle in the Heineken Cup adnd Welsh sides haven't been that successful with just 4 teams, I know people are nostalgic about the clubs but they were doing very poor financially before the regions and were getting progressively worse results in the Heineken Cup

I think the regions should relocate games more often, the Ospreys got the right idea with LV Cup matches, but I think they should give average humdrum Rabo12 matches to Bridgend, the Scarlets also could play a couple of matches in North Wales, Cardiff in Pontypridd and so on





correct

More teams means players can be payed more especially under a salary cap... so maybe there would be less of an exodus. England has 12 teams in which to spread it's internationals around, France has 14, Wales has 4. If there are 4 teams, the total money available to keep Welsh players in Wales is 14 mil, if there are 5 there is 17.5.

TrueSlawter
10-01-12, 09:33 PM
Munster are playing four games this season at Musgrave Park and eleven at Thomond while the A team pretty much play all over the province. While it's not a particularly even split it is at least a decent effort to spread some fixtures round the place. A decent nod to the fans. It wouldn't be inconceivable for the likes of Cardiff or Ospreys to play 3 games or so outside of the cities.

But munster has support outside of Thomand.. If the blues played a game or two in Ponty I dont really see any diehard ponty fans going to watch it..

Feicarsinn
10-01-12, 09:42 PM
But munster has support outside of Thomand.. If the blues played a game or two in Ponty I dont really see any diehard ponty fans going to watch it..

Well I suppose the arguement is that you're not going to grow the brand outside of the city without taking the team on the road. Short term hit for a long term gain and all that jazz. It also means that Pontypridd fans can't go complaining to the WRU about not being included.

TrueSlawter
10-01-12, 09:43 PM
Well I suppose the arguement is that you're not going to grow the brand outside of the city without taking the team on the road. Short term hit for a long term gain and all that jazz. It also means that Pontypridd fans can't go complaining to the WRU about not being included.

Yeah I know that, I just cant see Pontypridd being happy with anything other than a region for the valleys :/

TRF_Hulkster
10-01-12, 09:51 PM
But munster has support outside of Thomand.. If the blues played a game or two in Ponty I dont really see any diehard ponty fans going to watch it..

Unless they attempt playing regular games there then you won't know if Sardis Road and the likes will draw crowds.

Jayatron
11-01-12, 06:46 PM
I would probably go but I can almost see Sardis Road from my window. However I agree that I don't believe that Wales currently have enough talent to start another region. Just look at the Dragons, they could do with a little help, not another region to compete with for players. Also Pontypridd done a cracking job recently in the British and Irish Cup. Loosing only by 1 point to the Ulster Ravens. But if they came up against Ulster they wouldn't stand a chance, though I would love to walk down the road and see Ulster play.

I really honestly believe, and apologies for yacking on, that the best win win situation for Welsh rugby and the WP is to move it to the summer. No longer have competing regions and WP clubs. I'm telling you all now for a fact it works. I saw it first hand in New Zealand. I watched the Highlanders Vs Reds with about 12,000 then later in the year watched Southland Vs Canterbury with about 8,000.

Also I was in Cardiff today and walked by the Arms Park and could only think how much of a shame that the Blues didn't play their any more. I even commented to my girlfriend that I use to hate Ulster going their because it was a hard intimidating place to win. Now I just hit Ulster playing there because it is ****.

welshglory
12-01-12, 05:08 AM
A summer rugby premiership wouldn't really work in Wales seeing that the majority of the players are semi pros if not amateurs. They would all be off on holiday by then.

Saintjay
12-01-12, 12:31 PM
Just some info and plans for parc Eirias. I think the capacity will be in the region of 6000 with an all new 2000 seater stand.

It looks like three of Wales U20 six nations games are going to be palyed there. RSC 1404 will be starting in Div one east or similar next season and pushing on from there.

The WRU states.

http://www.pitchero.com/clubs/northwalesrugbyunion/news/parc-eirias-to-be-officially-o-425964.html

dullonien
12-01-12, 02:29 PM
Parc Eirias looks like a decent stadium. Making it multi purpose was sensible, but having a running track in between the pitch and the stands at such a small stadium might really kill any atmosphere, we'll have to wait and see. Good that the WRU are playing three U20 games there this season, hopefully more to follow. When the A-team finally get's going again, maybe they could play a few games in North Wales at Eirias park and at the Stortsground in Wrexam for further involve North Wales.

I still think the Scarlets should move a few games up North, they might be surprised by the size of crowd they get. If they move some of the smaller fixtures, such as Connacht, Treviso or Aeroni, which hasn't been attracting more than a few thousand to Parc Y Scarlets, then I think they'd get similar crowds up North.

It's gonna be interesting to see how long it takes for RGC 1404 (or whatever they're called now), so move up through the system. The academy system is supposedly producing some good players, so when that ramps up a little more, things will get interesting.

It's still disapointing that the original provincial plan drawn up by the WRU wasn't accepted by the clubs. That proposal included a North Wales province fed from all South Wales clubs to begin with (I suppose very similar to Connacht, where young players go there to gain experience before returning to one of the other provinces). The four provinces were going to be:

- Llanelli, Swansea & Neath
- Cardiff, Bridgend & Ponty
- Newport, Caerphilly & Ebbw Vale
- North Wales province.

That seems like a much better split to me. The Gwent province is pretty similar to what it is now, so would poosibly still be struggling somewhat. The other two regions would be much stronger than what we have at the moment, whilst the North Wales region would be great for development. The plan was for the WRU to be control of the provinces (central contracts?). Much better than the botched system we have in place now. Ultimately it's the short sightedness of the bigger clubs in Wales that led to the current system.

TrueSlawter
12-01-12, 03:52 PM
That proposed plan sounds so much better than what we've got.. As for RGC's academy system it is going well ish.. I say ish becuase a team winning 3 NW cups in a row then 2 leagues in a row (not doing well now however) only had 1 player in the squad (max they had was 2 iirc) of which is played at 14 alot when he's a 10/12. :/ Other than that its going strong..

Saintjay
12-01-12, 04:36 PM
I am lucky I am within walking distance of the parc. So I'll be heading down for the U20's once all the details are known.

I don't think the parc has had it's pubilic opening yet and seem to think it is not due till the summer to fit in with the 2012 games.

As an Englishman I am not that up to speed on the WRU structure. It seems to me that the WRU have missed a trick with North Wales. Maybe they are starting to get there act together. The term developement area worries me, jsut seems that all the talent will go down south to the regions once the players have been brought on.

Coming from Northampton and playing most of my club rugby there. I know the local clubs have strong links with the Saints and feed players into the system that way. So you get your the likes of Lawes, Diggin, Thompson, Cohen coming through. Any talent found here is going to the four regions down south to the regions and it seems such a shame.

You have a hugh amount of Welsh rugby support and a number of local clubs. The Ospreys for some reason sem to be the most followed team here, I am sure if a region did set up here it would do well. I do wonder why the WRU are not so keen.