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ChiefsFan
13-05-08, 11:03 AM
WHo do you guys think Graham Henry will pick for his first squad of the year?



If it's a 30 Man Squad i think it will look something like this:



Backs

Leon Macdonald, Mils Muliaina, Sitiveni Sivivatu, Lelia Masaga, Ma'a Nonu, Conrad Smith, Isaia Toeava, Stephen Brett, Stephen Donald, Nick Evans, Daniel Carter, Brendon Leonard, Andrew Ellis



Forwards

Rodney So'oalo, Chris Masoe, Jerry Collins, Richie McCaw, Liam Messam, Sione Lauaki, Brad Thorn, Ali Williams, Jason Eaton, Tony Woodcock, Greg Sommerville, Neemia Tialata, Kevin Mealamu, Andrew Hore, John Afoa, Ross Filipo



If it's 26 then I think Filipo, Toeava, Brett/Donald and Messam/Afoa will be cut.



What do you guys think?

nam97
13-05-08, 11:38 AM
Backs

Leon Macdonald, Mils Muliaina, Sitiveni Sivivatu, Lelia Masaga, Ma'a Nonu, Conrad Smith, Casey Laulala, Stephen Brett, Stephen Donald, Nick Evans, Daniel Carter, Brendon Leonard, Andrew Ellis



Forwards

Rodney So'oalo, Mose Tuiali'i, Jerry Collins, Richie McCaw, Liam Messam, Sione Lauaki, Brad Thorn, Ali Williams, Jason Eaton, Tony Woodcock, Greg Somerville, Neemia Tialata, Kevin Mealamu, Andrew Hore, John Afoa, Ross Filipo

If Tuiali'i and Laulala don't make it then f*** NZ rugby. If BOTH Masoe and So'oialo make it then f*** NZ rugby.

Dmx#1
13-05-08, 12:48 PM
If Tuiali'i and Laulala don't make it then f*** NZ rugby. If BOTH Masoe and So'oialo make it then f*** NZ rugby. [/quote]

Are you kidding me? So'oialo is easily the one of the most consistent players in New Zealand. I dont know what your basing your decision on why not to pick him. Imo I think hes had a consistent season this year.

So'oialo beats Mose in:
- Phenomanal Workrate
- Rucks and Mauls
- Lineouts
-consistent in both Super 14/Internationally
-Experience

What Mose has over
-Good runner
-Faster (Debatable)
-Better Season (maybe)

Its really a no brainer imo we shouldnt determine who makes the squad on whos had a great season alone. If we were to do that Jerry wouldnt make the squad and that would be stupid since he actually plays better Internationally than when he plays for the Super 14. It should be a combination of players reputation and season.

Screw 30 im doing a 15 that I think would do well

Fullback: Mills
Wingers: Sivi and Masga
Centres: Smith & Tuitivake (Great runner although his lack of experience might be his downfall for AB selections)
First Five: Carter
Scrum Half: Cowan (Although Im biased towards Piri)
Loose Fowards: RODNEY, Jerry, Sione Luaki (With Jerry at No.8 haha)
Locks: Williams & Thorn (Although I'd usually pick Eaton hes had a average season)
Hooker: Hore (Hes had a cracker of a season although I would usually pick Mealamu over him to be safe)
Props: Afoa and Woodcock (Tialata discipline hasnt been good lately)

I think some of the choices I made are a bit risky and I wouldnt be surprised if Henry decides to have a 'Safe' starting lineup. I cant blame him though he cant really screw at this point of his career.

nam97
13-05-08, 01:16 PM
If Tuiali'i and Laulala don't make it then f*** NZ rugby. If BOTH Masoe and So'oialo make it then f*** NZ rugby.

Are you kidding me? So'oialo is easily the one of the most consistent players in New Zealand. I dont know what your basing your decision on why not to pick him. Imo I think hes had a consistent season this year.

[/quote]

My beef is more with Masoe. He isn't anything special. Rodney is great and all the pros you listed are true, but he still isn't physically imposing and isn't destructive enough for a no. 8 IMO.

We already have 2 of the best flankers in the world who put in HUGE work rates. I think Rodders can be sacrificed for a unit like Tuiali'i or Lauaki. (Preferably Tuiali'i, his time is NOW).

My 15 (not on current S14 form):

15. Evans
14. Rokocoko (Masaga until Roks get's fit)
13. Muliaina
12. Nonu
11. Sivivatu
10. Carter

9. Ellis (don't laugh, he's the best in NZ)

8. Tuiali'i
7. McCaw
6. Collins
5. Thorn
4. Williams
3. Somerville
2. Mealamu
1. Woodcock

I've tried to be a bit more experimental. I'm probably the only one who would back Nonu. Evans is too good to be on the bench so he's at 15 and Mils at center. No. 8 is a toss up between Tuiali'i and Lauaki, I just think Rodney isn't as effective as either plus he would be good to have on the bench.

Dmx#1
13-05-08, 01:40 PM
I'd actually like Nonu to have a shot as well. If theres one player I strongly disagree on that is on your list cullen its Greg Somerville. Lately hes been getting owned and he collapses scrums. Not trying to be a nitpicky anal prick by the way lol.

nam97
13-05-08, 01:49 PM
I'd actually like Nonu to have a shot as well. If theres one player I strongly disagree on that is on your list cullen its Greg Somerville. Lately hes been getting owned and he collapses scrums. Not trying to be a nitpicky anal prick by the way lol.
[/b]

Yeah fair enough. The Crusaders have been dominated a bit as of late. However Flynn is a ****e scrummager and so is Franks/Crockett compared to some others going around the S14. I don't think Somerville is entirely to blame but I could be wrong as I am no front row expert. Tialata would be my next choice with Afoa strongly pushing him.

Dmx#1
13-05-08, 01:57 PM
True I guess it would be wrong to blame it entirely on him. I'm no front row expert either. I think the only time it was really obvious that he was getting wasted was when he was facing Woodcock. Then again it is woodcock after all he is one of the best scrummaging props.

ChiefsFan
14-05-08, 05:36 AM
9. Ellis (don't laugh, he's the best in NZ)
[/b]



**Laughs**

Incredible Schalk
14-05-08, 02:03 PM
Ellis is pretty useful but he is behind one of the best scrums in the competition, forgetting they got owned by the Blues scrum. I would pick Leonard at scrum half, pace,eye for the gap and consistently performs to a high level.

I might have Reid in at blindside instead of Collins who has been average this season, Lauaki looks overweight and slow so i would keep him out of the squad. So'oailo every time at no.8. On the wing i would give Masaga ago, he's grease lightning and very strong.

nam97
14-05-08, 02:24 PM
Ellis is pretty useful but he is behind one of the best scrums in the competition, forgetting they got owned by the Blues scrum. I would pick Leonard at scrum half, pace,eye for the gap and consistently performs to a high level.

I might have Reid in at blindside instead of Collins who has been average this season, Lauaki looks overweight and slow so i would keep him out of the squad. So'oailo every time at no.8. On the wing i would give Masaga ago, he's grease lightning and very strong.
[/b]

Collins always plays average in the S14, but when he puts on an All Black shirt he's unstoppable. No way is Read better, despite S14. Maybe he deserves a place in the squad, but not the no. 6 jersey.

I'd choose both Cowan and Ellis over Leonard. Ellis has the best pass in NZ and Cowan is just as dangerous on attack as Leonard is, plus he is feral around the rucks with a huge work rate.

Incredible Schalk
14-05-08, 02:30 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
Ellis is pretty useful but he is behind one of the best scrums in the competition, forgetting they got owned by the Blues scrum. I would pick Leonard at scrum half, pace,eye for the gap and consistently performs to a high level.

I might have Reid in at blindside instead of Collins who has been average this season, Lauaki looks overweight and slow so i would keep him out of the squad. So&#39;oailo every time at no.8. On the wing i would give Masaga ago, he&#39;s grease lightning and very strong.
[/b]

Collins always plays average in the S14, but when he puts on an All Black shirt he&#39;s unstoppable. No way is Read better, despite S14. Maybe he deserves a place in the squad, but not the no. 6 jersey.

I&#39;d choose both Cowan and Ellis over Leonard. Ellis has the best pass in NZ and Cowan is just as dangerous on attack as Leonard is, plus he is feral around the rucks with a huge work rate.
[/b][/quote]


Fair enough. Yea i forgot about Cowan, he obviously wont get the rave reviews during the S14 because of the side he plays for but he certainly gets stuck in. I would like to see him run a bit more but there&#39;s no doubting his commitment. If its Leanard,Ellis or Cowan they would all do an effective job, Weepu&#39;s coming back to form as well.

danny
14-05-08, 02:35 PM
Collins has to start as his track record with the AB`s is superb. Also from what I`ve seen Leonard is the pick of the New Zealand scrum halves. But having three quality 9`s to choose from is a nice problem to have.

joe013
14-05-08, 03:12 PM
Nonu has to get a shot! He is dominating!

Incredible Schalk
14-05-08, 03:25 PM
Yea he&#39;s awesome, i mean if someone like Conrad Smith can play at Centre for the AB&#39;s surely Nonu can get a chance. By the way has Smith retired?

Dmx#1
14-05-08, 03:30 PM
I think Cowan has had a great season this year. He&#39;s been lethal on attack,has a good pass, his d is pretty solid and has put a hit in a few hits too. I think he should be number 1 scrum half for now. Sorry but Leonard just doesn&#39;t do it for me.

Incredible Schalk
14-05-08, 05:38 PM
Yea he&#39;s awesome, i mean if someone like Conrad Smith can play at Centre for the AB&#39;s surely Nonu can get a chance. By the way has Smith retired?
[/b]


BRAINFADE :lol: he&#39;s playing for the Canes of course.

shtove
14-05-08, 09:03 PM
Be interesting to see a lot of players I&#39;m not familiar with.

But what emphasis is Henry going to use with his team? Stick with counter attack? More kicking and set piece? Wot u fink?

paretrooper
14-05-08, 10:57 PM
<div class='quotemain'>
I&#39;d actually like Nonu to have a shot as well. If theres one player I strongly disagree on that is on your list cullen its Greg Somerville. Lately hes been getting owned and he collapses scrums. Not trying to be a nitpicky anal prick by the way lol.
[/b]

Yeah fair enough. The Crusaders have been dominated a bit as of late. However Flynn is a ****e scrummager and so is Franks/Crockett compared to some others going around the S14. I don&#39;t think Somerville is entirely to blame but I could be wrong as I am no front row expert. Tialata would be my next choice with Afoa strongly pushing him.
[/b][/quote]


Sorry there has only been 2 or 3 games where the crusaders have been dominated. and out of that
2 or 3 times they have lost someone to the bin. (ie scott hamilton comeing in as a flanker) and the
times things have not gone to plan it has been Crockett to sure it up. as for Greg Somerville getting
"owend" it hard for a tighthead prop to pull down a scrum 90% of the time it is the loosehead prop
rolling his outside shoulder down and in and thus pulling the tighthead down.a good loosehead
like woodcock try to get there head under the tightheads ribs pushing up thus trying to pop the
tighthead out of the scrum. that is why when you see a scrum going backwards the opposeing
front row seem to be higher than the domonant front row the loosehead has lifted his man witch
in turn allows the hooker and the tighthead to get under there man and lift or "push through"
so as far as Somerville being a bad prop f*** all times do you see him getting popped.

Crockett is a good up and commer not ready for AB&#39;s yet NZ A for sure as for flynn he will
all ways be a second brides made behind mealamu and hore.

darwin_23
15-05-08, 02:42 AM
By all accounts a 26-man squad will be named initially - I&#39;d say Henry and co to pick a squad something along the lines of:

Sommerville, Afoa, Tialata, Woodcock, Mealamu, Hore, Thorn, Williams, Eaton, Kaino, Collins, Masoe, McCaw, So&#39;oialo, Ellis, Leonard, Evans, Carter, Brett, Toeava, Nonu, Smith, Masaga, Sivivatu, MacDonald, Muliana.

As much as I&#39;d love to somehow squeeze a Highlanders player in there I just can&#39;t manage to do it...I haven&#39;t been impressed at all with Cowan this year - sure he&#39;s made a few big hits but he&#39;s missed a LOT of tackles - his secure tackling used to be the best part of his game for me...

Wouldn&#39;t be surprised if Tuiali&#39;i, Lauaki or Read gets into the squad (instead of Kaino). The big problem I have with Tuiali&#39;i and Lauaki is consistency (or lack of it) - Tuiali&#39;i started off the season great, but has faded recently, while you never know what Lauaki is going to do from week to week. If either of these players could somehow get the consistency in there game the way So&#39;oialo has they would be really pushing for starting spots....

Never thought I&#39;s say it but I think Nonu should be in the squad.... :unsure: I think the selectors will stick with Toeava, but there are a number of other mid-fielders who will be close (Tuitavake, Laulala, Stanley). They may select another specialist winger (someone like Rudi Wulf), but I think they are more likely to go with just the two specialists (Sivivatu and Masaga) and have others in the squad who can cover (Nonu, Muliana, Toeava, Tuitavake et al.)

Dmx#1
15-05-08, 07:16 AM
Yea he&#39;s awesome, i mean if someone like Conrad Smith can play at Centre for the AB&#39;s surely Nonu can get a chance. By the way has Smith retired? [/b]
Conrad smith is a solid player. If he isnt the best defensive centre in NZ rugby hes close. I&#39;d put smith at 12 and Nonu at 13.

bobilycious
15-05-08, 08:14 AM
<div class='quotemain'> Yea he&#39;s awesome, i mean if someone like Conrad Smith can play at Centre for the AB&#39;s surely Nonu can get a chance. By the way has Smith retired? [/b]
Conrad smith is a solid player. If he isnt the best defensive centre in NZ rugby hes close. I&#39;d put smith at 12 and Nonu at 13.
[/b][/quote]



I reckon Richard Kahui is a better defensive centre... but its probably quite close.

Dmx#1
15-05-08, 08:22 AM
<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'> Yea he&#39;s awesome, i mean if someone like Conrad Smith can play at Centre for the AB&#39;s surely Nonu can get a chance. By the way has Smith retired? [/b]
Conrad smith is a solid player. If he isnt the best defensive centre in NZ rugby hes close. I&#39;d put smith at 12 and Nonu at 13.
[/b][/quote]



I reckon Richard Kahui is a better defensive centre... but its probably quite close.

[/b][/quote]

Yeah but I&#39;d still rate Smith higher than him based on reputation.

Ripper
16-05-08, 11:44 PM
And the fact he can stay on the field for up to 3 straight weeks compared to Richard The Foodbill&#39;s 43 minute spells.

Oh and Kaino surely has to be in with a major sniff, definatly ahead of Messam and probably Lauaki. Once again showed he along with Read is the form 6 of the competition. Great in the line out, devastating in the loose, can cover 6,7,8 and lock at a desperate pinch and has finally consitiently putting together a mammoth workrate. His old problem used to be play great, than disappear, but now he&#39;s putting 80 minutes in week in, week out.

Number10
17-05-08, 12:50 AM
Here is who I would pick

Backs:

Muliaina, MacDonald, Sivivatu, Masaga, Tuitavake, Toeava, Nonu, Smith, Carter, Brett, Leonard, Moa

Forwards:

Lauaki, So&#39;oialo, Kaino, McCaw, Braid, Williams , Eaton, Reid, Afoa, Woodcock, Tialata, MacIntosh, Mealamu, Hore

I havent taken anyone who is leaving except Carter as he is only going for 6 months and we dont have any quality first-fives with experience.
Jerry would miss out coz he is getting outplayed by both Kieran Reid and Jerome Kaino, and Masoe also plays better for the Canes at number 6 this year.

Anyways thats my thoughts but I doubt it will happen

Ripper
17-05-08, 12:59 AM
I&#39;d still personally have Collins ahead of Laauaki - Lauaki has just been a fat lump 90% of this year while Collins has spent most the time affected by a rib injury - he looked on the mend last night and showed flashes of his old brillance.

V99
18-05-08, 10:05 PM
Nonu has to get a shot! He is dominating!
[/b]

Absolutely, he&#39;s on fire at the moment.
But I can still see him getting put on the bench.

Dmx#1
19-05-08, 05:49 AM
I&#39;d still personally have Collins ahead of Laauaki - Lauaki has just been a fat lump 90% of this year while Collins has spent most the time affected by a rib injury - he looked on the mend last night and showed flashes of his old brillance. [/b]

True, and as stated before Jerry Collins plays alot better when he plays for the ABs.

all7days
26-05-08, 01:09 AM
After the semi final here are my choices for starting 15



Backs - Evans, S Sivivatu, A Tuitivaki, C Smith, B Stanley, D Carter,

Forwards - R Soialo, R McCaw, K Reid, A Williams, B Thorn, N Tialata, A Hore, T Woodcock.



Tuitivaki deserses a start with his form. He&#39;s better under the high ball and at defense than Masaga. Plus his attacking play has been consistently good.

Reid has been the best blindside this super 14. His workrate and support has been awesome. Though he&#39;ll have to watch out for A Thompson next year.

Thorn and Ali are a good combo. Rodders just beats out Mose. Evans has been a world class fullback for a long time. Muliaina has been quiet all year (not really his fault).

I didn&#39;t include Nonu mainly because he makes stupid decisions and mistakes. He plays super 14 well, but can never make the next step to internationals.

isaac
31-05-08, 01:45 AM
I also believe smith to be an amazing player. He is getting back to being pretty good - I thought he had an average world cup tho. Mine.

15: Mils
14: Tuitavake (Until Rocokoko)
13 Smith
12: Nonu
11: Siti
10: Carter
9: Cowan
8: So&#39;ialo
7: McCaw
6: Read
5: Williams
4: Thorn ( I think he has done enough to edge out everyone else)
3: Somerville
2: Hore
1: Woodcock

Reserves: Kaino, Afoa, Mealamu, Boric, leonard, Brett, MacDonald

dangandan
02-06-08, 12:55 PM
adam thompson... anthony boric....... rudi wulf........ what the hell?

savundra92
14-07-08, 12:05 PM
I think Graham Henry should have picked Isaiah Toeava, Chris Masoe and Lelia Masaga

I am also looking forward in the future to see the likes of Kade Poki, Sean Maitland and David Smith.

I wonder if anyone in New Zealand has got the pace of Bryan Habana. I know Masaga is a dangerous finisher and Rokocoko is quick. Doug Howlett maybe but I think that he has retired. It would be cool to see someone like that step up from the air new zealand cup

Bullitt
14-07-08, 12:10 PM
Doug Howlett maybe but I think that he has retired.[/b]

Nope, plying his trade for Munster these days.

Howlett was never as fast as Habana anyway, probably never in the top 10 sprinters for that matter. His art was (and still is) his brain which kept him 2-3 paces ahead of anyone else.

gurkis12
17-07-08, 07:32 AM
why you most don&#39;t include in team rockocoko i thin he is the best

Dmx#1
17-07-08, 07:37 AM
why you most don&#39;t include in team rockocoko i thin he is the best [/b]

I hope your your not a piece of **** spammer. Only I have the right to unnecesarily bump threads and contribute nothing to the topics in this forum! :angry:

HarryPeters
17-07-08, 07:57 AM
He is probably trying to get 10 posts to get into the games area.