Ireland's Backrow

**big ginger 8** · 05-02-12, 07:05 PM

We have three worldclass backrowers but obviously we're lacking a world-class openside. One of the reasons for this I think is our youth system I think we don't bring natural 7's through because coaches think they're too small and wouldn't make it professionally. Anyway I hoping to get peoples views on the matter on one thread instead of being spread over many. The main question of this is if everyone was fit who would you play at 7? (maybe show your entire backrow as if someone new is picked people will want to see who you dropped).

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**lucky number 7** · 05-02-12, 07:16 PM

I'd have SOB at 8 to be honest. Let him put back on all the weight he lost by going to 7 and get him ****ing shit up again

Heaslip could make a great 7

**killer08** · 05-02-12, 07:40 PM

really want to see SOB smashing through players again so guess its worth mixing things up

**munstermuffin** · 05-02-12, 09:54 PM

I agree all 3 are Worldclass players but each position is specialized and well simply put worldclass is a waste unless we have balance.

**Tadginator** · 05-02-12, 10:37 PM

I think they should stick o'brien at 8 just to try it

**Peat** · 05-02-12, 10:44 PM

I believe that right now Chris Henry is Ireland's best 7 but am unsure as to whether he's international standard in that position.

O'Mahony should be playing 7 for Munster week in week out in the hope of creating one but I'm not sure he's there yet. I think Heaslip is a fantastic 8 partially because he'd make half-decent 7 as well, but I'm not sure he'd be more than half-decent there if he concentrated on it.

**King_D'Arcy** · 06-02-12, 02:56 AM

This whole thing about Dominic Ryan being a natural 7 is just a myth. He's a 6.

**RedCard** · 06-02-12, 08:19 AM

Ireland desperately need to find an out and out openside with pace. One of the current 3 will have to be an impact bencher.

**Holycow** · 06-02-12, 06:28 PM

Is the sole reason To have an out and out 7 to win turn overs? To get into rucks early and poach ball.

I dont think we lost yesterday because we don't have an out and out seven.

Too many handling errors,can't retain the ball for long periods and put opposition under pressure.

How is a seven going to help there?

**cmac95** · 06-02-12, 06:30 PM

Originally Posted by Holycow

Is the sole reason To have an out and out 7 to win turn overs? To get into rucks early and poach ball.

I dont think we lost yesterday because we don't have an out and out seven.

Too many handling errors,can't retain the ball for long periods and put opposition under pressure.

How is a seven going to help there?

Right there.

**big ginger 8** · 06-02-12, 07:30 PM

A friend of mine who's not exactly a rugby guy's brilliant suggestion was Move SO'B to 12 in his words allowing us to have a 7 and fixing our lack of a big center. Genius

.

**HenryChinaski** · 06-02-12, 08:01 PM

Originally Posted by Holycow

Is the sole reason To have an out and out 7 to win turn overs? To get into rucks early and poach ball.

I dont think we lost yesterday because we don't have an out and out seven.

Too many handling errors,can't retain the ball for long periods and put opposition under pressure.

How is a seven going to help there?

yeap. In an ideal world Ireland would have a 7 who is standing out but right now I wouldn't seek to change things too quickly. The current three are worldclass and if the workload can be balanced between them and share roles I think it could yet work. I think Ferris SOB and Heaslip is the way forward, just with more flexible approaches to the 7 and 8 positions.

I don't think this was THE reason why Ireland lost.

**big ginger 8** · 06-02-12, 08:05 PM

Originally Posted by HenryChinaski

yeap. In an ideal world Ireland would have a 7 who is standing out but right now I wouldn't seek to change things too quickly. The current three are worldclass and if the workload can be balanced between them and share roles I think it could yet work. I think Ferris SOB and Heaslip is the way forward, just with more flexible approaches to the 7 and 8 positions.

I don't think this was THE reason why Ireland lost.

Don't think it's the reason we lost yesterday but it is hindering us somewhat.

**Peat** · 07-02-12, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by big ginger 8

Don't think it's the reason we lost yesterday but it is hindering us somewhat.

Yes, but it doesn't need to hinder you so much. Still, with Fez cited they can try O'Mahony and Henry - if it doesn't work, I'd tell Ferris on his return to forget carrying and simply smash into attacking ruck he can see.

Right now Ireland are trying to use Ferris and Heaslip as dedicated carriers with SOB both clearing and carrying. Doesn't work. One man needs to charge in, the other two need to be more involved - and my obsession with bigger backs would be useful here too :P

**Feicarsinn** · 07-02-12, 03:07 PM

Originally Posted by Peat

Yes, but it doesn't need to hinder you so much. Still, with Fez cited they can try O'Mahony and Henry - if it doesn't work, I'd tell Ferris on his return to forget carrying and simply smash into attacking ruck he can see.

Right now Ireland are trying to use Ferris and Heaslip as dedicated carriers with SOB both clearing and carrying. Doesn't work. One man needs to charge in, the other two need to be more involved - and my obsession with bigger backs would be useful here too :P

The funny thing is that Heaslip is actually pretty handy round the break down as far as 8's go. I'd agree that both he and Ferris do need to get themselves more involved, especially considering that O'Brien is by no means a specialised 7.

**Olliekooga** · 07-02-12, 03:25 PM

What happened to Neil Best he was an absolute Psycho (if your reading this Neil I dont mean it)

**Peat** · 07-02-12, 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by Feicarsinn

The funny thing is that Heaslip is actually pretty handy round the break down as far as 8's go. I'd agree that both he and Ferris do need to get themselves more involved, especially considering that O'Brien is by no means a specialised 7.

No argument there. In fact I'd say O'Brien is the worst of the three. I honestly can't see Ireland having too much trouble dominating their own ball if those three are being told 'Get me the ball free of that ruck'. Particularly if O'Callaghan is dropped for a quicker lock to join the party. Defence is slightly different, but there we go.

**Feicarsinn** · 07-02-12, 03:39 PM

Originally Posted by Olliekooga

What happened to Neil Best he was an absolute Psycho (if your reading this Neil I dont mean it)

Went to Northampton with Roger Wilson, didn't get his game, ended up at Worchester. Not in the same league as the 3 guys we have at the moment.

Originally Posted by Peat

No argument there. In fact I'd say O'Brien is the worst of the three. I honestly can't see Ireland having too much trouble dominating their own ball if those three are being told 'Get me the ball free of that ruck'. Particularly if O'Callaghan is dropped for a quicker lock to join the party. Defence is slightly different, but there we go.

Yup, and if Donnacha Ryan were to come into the side we'd effectively have 4 backrows on the pitch, or at least 4 players who have played there an awful lot.

**Peat** · 07-02-12, 04:15 PM

Best not getting his game at Northampton had a lot to do with getting into his car drunk and driving over to a teammate's house to give him a beating. Or so I have been led to believe. And various other acts of penisry. He's currently injured at Wuss, but I believe he's not reformed his act there.

In the unlikely circumstances of him returning to fitness and outstanding form in the next three hours, I believe the drunken rant he left on Kidney's voicemail in 2010 might mean he's still out the Ireland team anyway.

**TRF_Olyy** · 07-02-12, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by Peat

Best not getting his game at Northampton had a lot to do with getting into his car drunk and driving over to a teammate's house to give him a beating. Or so I have been led to believe. And various other acts of penisry.

!!!
I've never heard that before!

**Peat** · 07-02-12, 05:37 PM

Originally Posted by TRF_Olyy

!!!
I've never heard that before!

I might be getting the story confused, so please don't quote me. I'd have to dig around the various Ulster forums to get the story for sure - but I'm pretty certain that's how it went. Mite might know and all. Also, I think he never arrived there as he crashed and wrote off the car the club gave him.

**Tadginator** · 07-02-12, 05:38 PM

Originally Posted by big ginger 8

A friend of mine who's not exactly a rugby guy's brilliant suggestion was Move SO'B to 12 in his words allowing us to have a 7 and fixing our lack of a big center. Genius

.

I agree with this guy. That would be killing two birds with one stone. A stroke of genius on you friends part.

Has anyone else noticed that mike Ross is a slower, fatter, less skilled version of Kris Burton.

**big ginger 8** · 07-02-12, 06:22 PM

Originally Posted by Tadginator

I agree with this guy. That would be killing two birds with one stone. A stroke of genius on you friends part.

Has anyone else noticed that mike Ross is a slower, fatter, less skilled version of Kris Burton.

Stop trolling.

**ashman_backrow7** · 07-02-12, 09:15 PM

chris henry has to be the solution... move o brien to eight and drop heaslip... heaslip has been drifting through the last few years because nobody is challenging for his position... i think its time heaslip has to made earn his place on a team... and james coughlan should be a thought if fez gets sighted... move SOB to six, chris henry at seven and let james coughlan have a crack at the french... he has proved countless times for munster that he should be starting for ireland... wake up kidney and smell the red flowers!

**Feicarsinn** · 07-02-12, 09:18 PM

Originally Posted by ashman_backrow7

chris henry has to be the solution... move o brien to eight and drop heaslip... heaslip has been drifting through the last few years because nobody is challenging for his position... i think its time heaslip has to made earn his place on a team... and james coughlan should be a thought if fez gets sighted... move SOB to six, chris henry at seven and let james coughlan have a crack at the french... he has proved countless times for munster that he should be starting for ireland... wake up kidney and smell the red flowers!

If there's one thing you can't accuse Kidney of it's ignoring Munster players! Anyway, I think you're being a bit harsh on Heaslip there. He was one of our bester performers on the weekend, certainly the best of our backrows.

**big ginger 8** · 07-02-12, 09:26 PM

As said Heaslip was one of our best this weekend and is really coming back into form recently. He wasn't even playing that badly just not up to his high standards and SO'B was making him look bad.

**coonor** · 07-02-12, 10:00 PM

Originally Posted by Feicarsinn

If there's one thing you can't accuse Kidney of it's ignoring Munster players! Anyway, I think you're being a bit harsh on Heaslip there. He was one of our bester performers on the weekend, certainly the best of our backrows.

Yeah he was really good, thinking about it I probably would say he was the best forward in the game. He made atleast 2 turnover, was our most aggressive tackler and probably our made the greatest yards out of of our pack.

**ashman_backrow7** · 08-02-12, 04:36 PM

ah ya hes still playin well but not like the heaslip of old... two or three years ago he was takin everything up... rucking everything and defendiong lik his life depended on it... i just tink to mix it up and get him back to his own ways... he is personally one of my all time heros, he just needs a bit of competition to bring him back to his best

**Peat** · 08-02-12, 04:53 PM

There's something to be said for competition. Right now Heaslip knows he's not getting dropped from Ireland unless he stirs Kidney's morning coffee with his knob, and that can lead to complacency.

**big ginger 8** · 08-02-12, 06:13 PM

Originally Posted by Peat

There's something to be said for competition. Right now Heaslip knows he's not getting dropped from Ireland unless he stirs Kidney's morning coffee with his knob, and that can lead to complacency.

Don't think this is true for all players some like to have competition but others like to know there place is cemented think this may be the case with Sexton.

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