RWC 2015 Qualifiying

[usausa]

Well based on the RWC the Russian lineout is weak as well, I remember the US stealing almost half of their throws...if you can't win your set pieces you don't get possession and your backs/loosies can't show what they have if they don't have the ball. I think set pieces are so important. I criticize the USA Eagles for being sooo bad in the scrum because even on their own put-ins the Eagles get pushed back 4-5 meters and force #8 to pick it up before the scumhalf even gets back there. Getting clean ball off your set pieces is imperative in order to maximize your set plays success.

[welshglory]

I know but we are talking about a hypothetical situation where Russia are playing Uruguay. Will they be dominated so much that they won't even have possession? Will it affect the score line that much? Based on the tier two matches i've seen i doubt it (Georgia v Romania is an exception). The scrum is seen as more of a mode of restarting play rather than a contest at that level imo.

When the US played against Italy their weak scrum was exposed and even against Ireland and Australia in the WC. But against other tier 2 countries i don't think it is such a major factor.

[norcalbuff]

That view is incorrect, particularly when it comes to a country like Uruguay whose strength is in the scrum.

[TRF_Ezequiel]

I hope Uruguay make it. 1 South American country is just not enough. And I am a big fan of Uruguay

[usausa]

I know but we are talking about a hypothetical situation where Russia are playing Uruguay. Will they be dominated so much that they won't even have possession? Will it affect the score line that much? Based on the tier two matches i've seen i doubt it (Georgia v Romania is an exception). The scrum is seen as more of a mode of restarting play rather than a contest at that level imo.

When the US played against Italy their weak scrum was exposed and even against Ireland and Australia in the WC. But against other tier 2 countries i don't think it is such a major factor.

If Russia plays an expansive style like they should then hopefully the scrum issues will be minimal. The new-look USA have been implementing this style, a complete 180 from the Eddie O'Sullivan days. As for the US scrum, it looks weak against every, and I mean everyone. Saxons embarrassed them last year as did Tonga and even Japan. We have no front row depth and our tight head is awful. Our best prop is in his later days and our hooker is better but still inconsistent.

As for your point, I do see where you are coming from. I agree with you that these two teams are even enough where neither will be able to control the possession by a lot. Russia just needs to avoid knock-ons on their side and on defense not let Uruguay count up the phases. As mentioned before Russia have a very talented back 3 and if they can play a territory game and force Uruguay to kick surely they will put themselves in a great position to win.

[norcalbuff]

If the tighthead you are talking about being awful is Fry, you're a year in the past. He's not a world-class scrummager but he has improved immensely since last year to the point that he earned an Air New Zealand Cup contract with Manawatu because he impressed them so much in a warmup match against them. And while the Georgians and Italians got the best of him in the scrum, those are among the best scrums in the world.

Help is on the way long term, too. If you haven't watched the video of the first HSAA match against Chile, Titi Lamositele is a BEAST. He'll probably be too young for 2015 but I fully expect him to be a starting Eagle prop in the future.

[psychic duck]

I think you are overrating the importance of the scrum at that level of rugby duck, but i get your point. I know of one famous Uruguayan prop, i think he's retired now though. What makes you think they would dominate the Russian's so much in that department?

You don't seem to be understanding that the Russian scrum is woeful. Perhaps some video evidence would help you understand this. Seriously the Russian scrum is the laughing stock of the ENC.

I know but we are talking about a hypothetical situation where Russia are playing Uruguay. Will they be dominated so much that they won't even have possession? Will it affect the score line that much? Based on the tier two matches i've seen i doubt it (Georgia v Romania is an exception). The scrum is seen as more of a mode of restarting play rather than a contest at that level imo.

Utter rubbish. The scrum effects Tier 2 and Tier 3 matches even more than Tier 1 matches. The scrum was the main reason that Georgia beat Canada in 2010, Romania won the IRB Nations Cup this year thanks to them getting on top of the Italy A scrum.

If Russia plays an expansive style like they should then hopefully the scrum issues will be minimal. The new-look USA have been implementing this style, a complete 180 from the Eddie O'Sullivan days. As for the US scrum, it looks weak against every, and I mean everyone. Saxons embarrassed them last year as did Tonga and even Japan. We have no front row depth and our tight head is awful. Our best prop is in his later days and our hooker is better but still inconsistent.

As for your point, I do see where you are coming from. I agree with you that these two teams are even enough where neither will be able to control the possession by a lot. Russia just needs to avoid knock-ons on their side and on defense not let Uruguay count up the phases. As mentioned before Russia have a very talented back 3 and if they can play a territory game and force Uruguay to kick surely they will put themselves in a great position to win.

Not quite everyone, they can still win scrum penalties against Russia.

[usausa]

If the tighthead you are talking about being awful is Fry, you're a year in the past. He's not a world-class scrummager but he has improved immensely since last year to the point that he earned an Air New Zealand Cup contract with Manawatu because he impressed them so much in a warmup match against them. And while the Georgians and Italians got the best of him in the scrum, those are among the best scrums in the world.

Help is on the way long term, too. If you haven't watched the video of the first HSAA match against Chile, Titi Lamositele is a BEAST. He'll probably be too young for 2015 but I fully expect him to be a starting Eagle prop in the future.

Fry is definitely better than he was in the RWC but I don't think he's still the weakest link in my opinion in the scrum. But 8 have to scrum as 1, and it's on all the forwards that they scrum better. Teams definitely seemed to attack the tighthead side a lot against the USA. Even against Canada our scrum struggled. I haven't watched any of the HSAA highlights although I hear they are playing quite well! The College AA's did great too! It seems as the senior players are loving this quick expansive style, and it takes advantage of the USA's great backline and it minimizes their weakness at the breakdown/contact.

[usausa]

Utter rubbish. The scrum effects Tier 2 and Tier 3 matches even more than Tier 1 matches. The scrum was the main reason that Georgia beat Canada in 2010, Romania won the IRB Nations Cup this year thanks to them getting on top of the Italy A scrum.



Not quite everyone, they can still win scrum penalties against Russia.

I reply back to you with a solid Russian push at 5:25, nice clean and drove the US back about 4 meters.

Now in that game, the Russian lineout was embarrassed! If I remember correctly I think they went 6 for 10 on their own throws, and losing 40% of your throws is unacceptable.

[psychic duck]

I reply back to you with a solid Russian push at 5:25, nice clean and drove the US back about 4 meters.

Now in that game, the Russian lineout was embarrassed! If I remember correctly I think they went 6 for 10 on their own throws, and losing 40% of your throws is unacceptable.

Both the sides are crap scrummagers.

[usausa]

Both the sides are crap scrummagers.

Agreed!

[norcalbuff]

There is no doubting our scrum was awful last year and wasn't much better in the years leading up to that. But there are a couple things to remember:

Pittman and Fry are both young for props. For whatever reason, most props don't really develop until their late 20s. And for Fry, his improvements will be faster than normal since he has only been playing the position for a couple years now and didn't have a dedicated scrum coach until his time in NZ.

EOS really neglected the scrum and it shows. The scrum coach Tolkin brought in is supposed to be pretty good so hoping to see further improvement.

[Black_Magic]

First matches of CAR Africa Cup Division 1C in Botswana were played today. The results:
Mauritius - Nigeria 26 - 22
Botswana - Zambia 23 - 15

As only the winner of the tournament advances to Division 1B and thus will keep a chance to qualify for RWC2015, the two teams beaten today face a difficult task if the are to stay in the hunt for qualification.

[usausa]

Mauritius-Nigeria Match Report
Botswana-Zambia Match Report

[usausa]

Must add that through 10 Africa Cup matches (including Division 1A, which is not part of qualifying this year and not Division 2 because it was played as a 7s tournament), that ONLY 1 game has been decided by greater than 9 points. And, 6 games have been decided by 4 points or less!!! The average margin per game so far has been 5.4 points!

Africa Cup this year is producing extremely competitive results which is awesome for the game!

[norcalbuff]

It does seem like there is quite a bit of parity in African rugby right now. In particular, it seems like any of the top 8 could beat each other on a given day. Good for the game for sure but hopefully the parity drives each of the countries to improve since the African qualifier has been the least competitive of any in the RWC.

[BZHopenside]

I don't know. Japan has won every match in World Cup qualifying against Asian teams by a huge margin, at that doesn't look like it's going to change.

[usausa]

I don't know. Japan has won every match in World Cup qualifying against Asian teams by a huge margin, at that doesn't look like it's going to change.

I think he means the African team that qualifies has been the weakest in the final tournament, which would make sense. Perennial African qualifier Namibia have been beaten by pretty large margins never threatening to win a match while Asian qualifier Japan has a few wins/draws to their record.

The African qualifying itself has shaped up to be the most competitive all the way around but the best Asian qualifier is better than the best African qualifier. Although one oculd argue Madagascar's huge home field advantage put them through but we will see next year how talented they truly are when they will be most likely have to play the Division 1A tournament away from the Mahamasina and from Madagascar.

[usausa]

Ivory Coast 29-17 Nigera (16-6 HT). Nigeria is presumably done at 0-2, and eliminated from RWC2015 and from progressing to Division 1B.
Ivory Coast------->1-0 ---29-17 --- +12
Botswana-------->1-0 --- 23-15 ---+8
Mauritius--------->1-0 --- 26-22 ---+4
Zambia----------->0-1 ---15-23 ---(-8)
Nigeria----------->0-2 --- 39-55 ---(-16)

[Keithmurdoch]

Pretty impresssive from Mauritius, considering they're a tiny scattering of islands bringing down Nigeria (pop. 170 million). What is it about Islanders and greatness? Beach rugby perhaps?

[norcalbuff]

I think he means the African team that qualifies has been the weakest in the final tournament, which would make sense. Perennial African qualifier Namibia have been beaten by pretty large margins never threatening to win a match while Asian qualifier Japan has a few wins/draws to their record.

The African qualifying itself has shaped up to be the most competitive all the way around but the best Asian qualifier is better than the best African qualifier. Although one oculd argue Madagascar's huge home field advantage put them through but we will see next year how talented they truly are when they will be most likely have to play the Division 1A tournament away from the Mahamasina and from Madagascar.

Yes, that is what I meant. Other than South Africa, no African team has won a match in the RWC and no African team has come closer than losing by 15 since 1991. Given this, I find it ridiculous that Africa gets an automatic qualifier while South America does not. That said, I obviously want the African teams to become more competitive.

[usausa]

Based on the points (4 for win, 1 for draw and bonus points), here are the standings.

Ivory Coast----->4 pts, +12
Botswana------->4 pts, +8
Mauritius-------->4 pts, +4
Nigeria---------->1 pt, -16
Zambia--------->0 pts, -8

Saturday's matches (final match day)
Ivory Coast-Zambia
Botswana-Mauritius

I am going out on a limb and guessing that table points will decide the 'winner' of the tournament, and then probably points or try difference. But I don't think anybody is really sure what the format is....

[welshglory]

Just out of curiosity. Where would people say rugby is bigger out of Belgium, Germany and the Netherlands?

[Little Guy]

Definately Belgium at the moment, there are a few Belgians in the Pro D2 and Belgium has played the likes of Canada and others in friendlis in recent years.

[welshglory]

Definately Belgium at the moment, there are a few Belgians in the Pro D2 and Belgium has played the likes of Canada and others in friendlis in recent years.

Yea i thought so. Rugby seems to be growing rapidly there, they're even ranked 23rd!

[Nielsch]

Just out of curiosity. Where would people say rugby is bigger out of Belgium, Germany and the Netherlands?

Definitely Belgium. Looking forward to seeing them play in the European Nations Cup Division 1A. They already attracted a decent size crowd in Division 1B and it could only get bigger.

Some impressions from the last Belgium - Netherlands rugby match.

[ZeFrenchy]

Racing-Métro will be hosting their Heineken Cup match against Saracens in Bruxelles (Brussels in english?)

[Nielsch]

Racing-Métro will be hosting their Heineken Cup match against Saracens in Bruxelles (Brussels in english?)

That's cool. I believe it's Saracens hosting the match though. I remember travelling to Brussels a couple of years ago to see Stade Français - Ulster in the Heineken Cup. Game got cancelled on match day due to ice and snow on the pitch. Hopefully this time the organizers will have more luck.

[norcalbuff]

Definitely Belgium at the moment. Unfortunately their administrator who oversaw the large growth of the game there recently stepped down so hopefully someone good fills the void. They recently had a young player Jens Torfs sign with Metro Racing as well.

[yoe91]

Yeah it's funny that the Dutch never picked up on rugby, in light of how huge it is in South Africa...you'd think it's just in that Dutch blood, in the culture....but not at all. And it's not even like Africa has a rugby culture anywhere but where they are...

Anyways: I suppose Belgium. They're very close to France culturally after all...even though our rugby regions are the south and center, not really related to the east but...they've picked up on it through us surely...
It would be cool to have a Belgian team in the RWC, wouldn't it ?!
I mean, Spain has made it, and Namibia give teams record victories every time. I'm sure Belgium could squeeze itself in the top, what, 20.