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Massive blow for Australia, with Kurtley Beale ruled of all four tests with a groin injury (http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/un...528-1ze27.html). This means either Barnes or Cooper will start at 10 for Australia.
As I suspected, Ben Lucas's omission is due to injury (groin).
Bloody hell. Looks like Barnes and Cooper will be in the mix. Maybe Harris or Foley as backup. Forwards are going to need to win us these tests for once.
No clue about the pack, but this is what I am thinking will be Aus' first choice backline (how they choose the handle the two quick matches, I do not know).
9 Genia
10 Barnes
11 Tomane
12 McCabe
13 Horne
14 Ioane
15 Ashley-Cooper
My reasoning for shifting AAC to fullback is due to the other options. Foley, Morahan, and Mogg are all good prospects, but fullback demands experience. I'd rather put a debutant on the wing than at fullback. I understand that Barnes/McCabe as the five eighths isn't the popular choice, but with O'Connor and Beale out, and Cooper returning from injury, what else can be done. Mike Harris is also an option, but I would put him on the bench with Phipps and perhaps Fainga'a.
I think that is pretty much spot on.
Same backline that I was thinking of, though I'm not sure who I would put on the wing (whether it be Morahan/Shipperly/Tomane/AN other)Originally Posted by Draggs
Yeah, that last position in the back three was tricky. Browsing GaGR, they seem to want to see Tomane in. My biggest issue with that is that he an Ioane, while undoubtedly powerful players, are quite similar. Ashley-Cooper, every time I see him, seems to have a good skillset. He would be a good pick either at wing or fullback. I prefer him at outside centre, but Rob Horne is in good form and AAC is more versatile. I thought Tom Kingston could be in the training squad, but they have other good options. Some have mentioned Foley on the wing, but it would be a poor choice. Good fullbacks don't necessarily make good wings.
If James O'Connor and Beale are uninjured AAC will be the winger, he is a very solid test winger. But because he is so consistent we seem to just throw him wherever we are weakest at the moment.
If QC will be fit, I think Dingo should go with both Barnes and Cooper on the field, it was working well in 2010 and in the only RWC game they played this way.
Others midfield combos (McCabe & Horne and McCabe & AAC, even McCabe & Fainga'a) don't work well, because the 2 players are too similar, would be both straightners, with McCabe barely delivers 2 passes per game!
IMO centre pairing AAC@12 and Horne 13 is not working badly at the 'Tahs, which have problems elsewhere (decision makers and leadership?)...
For Scotland test I'd go with:
1 Robinson
2 Moore
3 Palmer
4 Neville
5 Sharpe
6 Dennis
7 Pocock
8 Higginbotham
9 Genia
10 Cooper
11 Ioane
12 Harris
13 Horne
14 Morahan
15 Ashley-Cooper
16. Fainga'a 17. Kepu 18. Simmons 19. McCalman 20. White 21. Barnes 22. Foley/Mogg
I think McCalman can be there against Scotland, Sharpe can be there for lineout duties, with White and Foley/Mogg in if things goes good.
But this is my idea, probably Fainga'a is going to start (to rest more Brumbies players as possible), and we can see Slipper and Kepu as well.
For Wales it's gonna be a team much closer to the RWC ones, bar injuries and off-form players.
Beale and O'Connor are out of the series.
I wonder if Deans will put out his first choice backline for the Scotland match, and then rest a few for the first test against us, and then bring some back for the final two.
It depends on how well he thinks his players can cope. I don't disagree with you team, madflyhalf, but they must certainly rest a few for the first Welsh test, making that 22 much weaker.
Aussie player are dropping like flies - I reckon Wales might be in with a chance of getting a win (or two).
What I would do out of the training squad. I use all four Force players for the first test. I would have used Cowan at LH if he was in the squad, but I'm forced to use Ma'afu.
Scotland Wales I Wales II/III 1 Slipper Robinson Robinson 2 Fainga'a TPN Moore 3 Ma'afu Kepu Kepu 4 Sharpe Simmons Sharpe 5 Simmons Timani Pyle 6 Higginbotham Dennis Higginbotham 7 Pocock Pocock Pocock 8 McCalman Palu Palu 9 Genia Genia Genia 10 Cooper Barnes Cooper 11 Morahan Ioane Ioane 12 McCabe Harris (?) McCabe 13 Fainga'a Horne Horne 14 Tomane Shipperley Tomane 15 AAC AAC AAC 16 Moore Moore TPN 17 Alexander Palmer Alexander 18 Pyle Sharpe Simmons 19 Hooper Higginbotham Dennis 20 White White White 21 Harris Cooper Barnes 22 Shipperley Tomane/Morahan/Mogg Morahan
And select for the other two tests out of performances. For the first test, if they get a healthy lead, take off Sharpe, Pocock, Genia, AAC and McCabe asap. Try to keep Moore fresh (depending on how he is after the weekend's game). I put him on the bench, but it could be TPN depending on who's on better condition.
It also depends on the Brumbies and Rebels resting players against each other... something borderline unethical imo, but that has been in the air. Taking that, probably Waratahs players won't be used against Scotland.
The Scotland test was a BAD idea. It may turn into Samoa II, or into a lot of injuries. Or both.
This is going to be a real big test of depth in Australian Rugby, especially with the games so close after another.
From what I've seen from Robbie Deans, he will look at the positives and might get more answers than questions.
Can anyone explain to me why Speight was overlooked?
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He is not eligible for Australia (not for another 2 years anyway).
Ah okay, thanx... Australasia and their Islanders...
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I wonder whether Australia's weakened team they will play Scotland with could leave them with red faces like they had against Samoa last year
Just like South Africa and their Zimbabweans
Speight moved to New Zealand as a teenager, and I think is eligible for New Zealand now. He failed to get a Super Rugby contract last season with a NZ franchise so moved to Australia. He has played well for the Brumbies this season, and could certainly be an option for them in the future if he keeps improving.
I agree, I'm picking it will be a very tight series. I think it is 50/50 at the moment, but another key injury (to either team) could tip it either way....
I think if Cooper is playing at 10 then you'd have to have Barnes at 12. They worked well together when together before for the Wallabies, and it presents a solid kicking option if Cooper is having a mare.
These are pretty similar to the coaches thoughts, also we'd lose a ****load of ranking points if Scotland beat us.
http://www.news.com.au/news/robbie-d...-1226359377351
Deans had planned to name a Queensland/Western Force-based squad against Scotland, because those two teams have the bye before the Scotland Test.
But poor form and injuries have scuppered both that and plans to announce a Test squad on Monday week - and positions will be up for grabs right up to the local derby between Melbourne and the Brumbies on June 1, and the Waratahs' match against the Hurricanes on June 2.
"My preference is that we don't want to be providing caps that haven't been earned," Deans said. "It is very unlikely to be a totally Reds and Force-based side. It is a Test match. I guess if we learned something out of Samoa it is that no one can play three games in a week."It's a moving target. It's not dissimilar to Samoa, and we don't want to go through that again."
Australia has just as many Zimbabweans as we do atm :P.Just like South Africa and their Zimbabweans
Speight moved to New Zealand as a teenager, and I think is eligible for New Zealand now. He failed to get a Super Rugby contract last season with a NZ franchise so moved to Australia. He has played well for the Brumbies this season, and could certainly be an option for them in the future if he keeps improving.
I agree, I'm picking it will be a very tight series. I think it is 50/50 at the moment, but another key injury (to either team) could tip it either way....
Haha, true.
While a Cooper/Barnes combination has worked well at times in the past (France 2010 springs to mind), they have struggled as a combination at times too - indeed Cooper only started to flourish at the Reds once Barnes left. They are very different players - Cooper wants to attack from everywhere, while Barnes is incredibly conservative - while in theory it is good to have both options, there can be issues with this too. Whether this combination works really depends on how Cooper plays - if he is happy to share the responsibility for running the team this could be a great combination, however if he adopts a 'me first' approach (as he did for much of last season) I don't think it will work.
Personally I'd go for a Barnes/McCabe combination against Wales. Both are strong defenders (McCabe is exceptional in this area), which will be needed to contain Wales backline of giants (even without Roberts). Not sure what I'd do against Scotland, but my team for the 1st test vs Wales would be:
Robinson
Moore
Kepu
Simmons
Sharpe (not sure about either locks - I'd seriously consider Douglas, Timani, and Pyle too)
Higginbotham
Pocock
Palu
Genia
Barnes
Ioane
McCabe
Horne
Morahan (though I'd also consider Shipperly and Tomane)
Ashley-Cooper
Polota-Nau
Alexander
Pyle/Douglas/Timani
Dennis/Hooper
White
Cooper
Shipperly/Tomane
We'll probably see a "first choice" team only on the second test against Wales. They'll have to rotate a bit for Sco and Wal 1, even if "a test is a test" and all that.
Just seen that Beale might return for part of the series, and Ben Lucas has joined the Wallabies training group.
It looks like Mike Harris is a good chance to wear number 10 against Scotland
http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/harris-in-frame-for-wallabies-no10-spot-20120530-1zjkf.html
Makes sense if you consider Deans doesn't want to rush Cooper back and Barnes is playing 2 days before against the Hurricanes. With Harris at 10 I'd expect Deans to keep the tried and tested center pairing of McCabe and Ashley-Cooper, with Ioane and a debutante on the wings (Shipperley/Vuna/Tomane). This could be complicated by Beale's injury. I'd expect Ben Lucas or Luke Morahan will play fullback because Bernard Foley will be playing on Saturday with Barnes, as will Rob Horne so that will decrease the likelihood of shifting Ashley-Cooper back to 15 and playing Horne at Outside Center.
As far as the forwards go I'm looking forward to seeing what the youngsters in the second row can do. The Wallabies are really lacking personnel at lock at the moment so I hope to see Sitaleki Timani and Caydern Neville getting a run and impressing. In the back row Dennis and Higgenbotham have earned a shot after being on the fringe of Wallaby selection for the past few seasons, both have had impressive seasons in Super Rugby. I'm also looking forward to seeing what Hooper can do on the international stage. Lets hope he gets a chance to shine even though Pocock is likely to be captaining the side in Horwil's absence.
Last edited by Tomsey; 31-05-12 at 02:18 PM.
Though I like all three of your teams, I think we must keep in mind the Australian's defensive system when Cooper is on the field: on set pieces he defends at FB or left wing position, with Ioane (left wing btw) in his fly-half spot.
This was due of course to Cooper liability in defence, but it added a lot of flair in counter attacks if the ball would be kick back by attacking team... Cooper, Beale and O'Connor can create anything from nothing!
Maybe this can be an added limit to the possible selection in the back three: Ashley-Cooper is quite familiar with this defence, as he defended both back and in the line (when Ioane was injuried) if I remember well, probably Morahan and Shipperley are because they are Reds players, but this could be intricate with Brumbies and Waratahs backs, even though Tomane played centre, maybe team mechanisms wouldn't be cemented well.
I think Morahan has more chance to play in Welsh series, than Tomane has... and probably we're gonna see a Wallaby side much more similar to the one that played Wales at RWC and December 2011.
Ben Mowen has been called up to join the Wallabies squad for the Scotland test: (http://nz.sports.yahoo.com/rugby/new...llabies-squad/)
McCalman an injury worry then, he an Palu weren't really going to strike fear into anybody in current form.
I am waiting for the Aussies to announce the side for Scotland so I can actually try and make a 22 for the first Welsh test.
It will be interesting to see who they pick vs Scotland. I'd expect it will be a second string squad mainly on Force and Reds players, very similar to the one suggested by ZeFrenchy (though maybe with Harris at 12, Morahan at 15, and Shipperly on the wing). This would leave an (almost) fresh top XV to face Wales, with only the likes of Higginbotham, Sharpe/Simmons, Genia and possibly Morahan required to backup vs Wales.
Who do you think will start at standoff, Darwin?
I can't see beyond Cooper myself. There really are so many potential backline combinations, when you look at AAC and Barnes in the mix.
Against Wales? I'm not sure myself - Cooper has only just got back from serious injury, but Barnes hasn't exactly been in great form (he has been poor to be honsest) - whenever he gets the ball his first instinct seems to be to kick it regardless of where he is on the field! I'd probably pick Cooper simply because the Wallabies best chance to win against Wales is to play an attacking gameplan - I don't think they have the forward pack to match it with Wales in a more structured game. However if O'Coonor, Beale or even Lealiifano had been fit I would have started them at 10 ahead of Cooper (I'd even consider Ben Lucas at 10). There are certainly plenty of options in the backline - with Beale out I'd start Ashley-Cooper at fullback and pair McCabe and Horne in the centres, but really have no idea what Deans is thinking.
The Australian inside backs will benefit from the lack of Jamie Roberts.
Cooper/Barnes is a tough call, for the reasons you have stated. I want to see how Ben Lucas will figure in this backline, that will determine quite a bit I feel.
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