PDivvy book

   
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  1. #1
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    PDivvy book

    Former Springbok coach Peter de Villiers on Earl Rose, extract from book.

    "Earl Rose was one of the players who did well in the midweek games [on the 2009 year-end tour], and in retrospect, I should have sent Ruan Pienaar home, as he did not play at his best on that trip, and put Earl on the bench instead. But it turned out to be Earl's last tour of my tenure. He seemed to fade away quickly afterwards, which was tragic, as he had amazing talent. He was a sad example of a black player who had been failed by the system. Part of the problem is that few coaches understand the psychology of black players.

    "I had a lot of time for Earl as a player. Along with Thabang Molefe, he's helped us win the Under-21 title in 2005. But he could be a very emotional guy at times. At one Under-21 tournament, Bismarck du Plessis had to go home early after breaking his ankle, and Earl came to my room in tears. 'You know what coach? I realised today that every day is potentially your last day, and every tour is potentially your last tour,' he said.

    "Critics often accused Earl of not caring enough about his rugby, and that he was too happy-go-lucky in his approach. But I knew him to be very passionate about his committed to the sport, and his emotional reaction to Bismarck's misfortune during that Under-21 tournament was just one instance where he disproved the general perception.

    "On another occasion while I was coaching the Under-21s, I gave everyone in the squad a piece of paper on which they could write down their problems as the first step in trying to overcome them. Earl was the only player who actually signed the piece of paper, which was supposed to be anonymous. A lot of the other players had problems with the captain as well as other issues, but Earl just wrote: 'I have no problems. Whatever the team decides, I'm in.'

    "As a player Earl never let me down. At the end of my first year with the Springboks, I thought that he might be the transformational force our game needed. Not necessarily in the starting team, but certainly coming off the bench.

    "Over the years the provincial unions coached many black players with plenty of talent, but not always successfully, Mzwandile Stick, Adi Jacobs, Thabang Molefe, Thando Manana and the late Solly Tyibilika among them. But when I worked with those guys, I quickly realised what the real problem was. The system was the problem, not them. The white coaches who coached them at the unions didn't understand that they had creative minds and just saw things differently.

    "If you told Solly Tyibilika that you wanted him to set up a ball, he would want to know why. He would say: 'Agh no man, why must I do that when I can just go around the defender?' I had similar conversations with Earl Rose, but I soon figured out how to handle him. With Earl, you had to make him believe that he was the one making the decision. Let's say he is playing at fullback and running from the back more than you want him to - you sit him down and tell him how brilliant he is, but also ask why he ran the ball with so many defenders lined up in front of him. Chances are that he will then say that he shouldn't have done it. And he will make a note not to do it again.

    "Earl may be 10 years ahead of his time. He will run through you when he could have run around you, and while that may be criticised now, as it doesn't conform to the norm, perhaps in time it will be seen as a good thing. Schalk Burger is an example of a white player who is very creative. But if he wasn't white, selectors might have dismissed him as a stereotype and he may have found it more difficult to become a regular in the starting line-up. I am not denigrating Schalk or knocking his status as one of South Africa's truly great players - far from it. But Schalk likes to do his own thing on the field, and that has often been exactly what black players are criticised for. In our 2011 World Cup game against Samoa, we needed Schalk to drive us forward. Instead, he ended up being the guy who made the most passes. If someone like Solly Tyibilika had done something similar, he might have been dropped because he wasn't following instructions. He would have been considered a problem player.

    "Race remains a factor in rugby, whether people want to believe it or not. Often, too much notice is taken of a player's background and origin, which can cloud our judgement. At the 2011 World Cup, we turned a blind eye when John Smit and some of his fellow senior players stole a sign while on a road trip in New Zealand. The incident made all the local newspapers, but we just laughed it off. After all, the guys were just letting off steam. But what would the reaction have been had Ricky Januarie stole that sign? As Ricky was regarded as a 'problem' player, the public might not have been as accepting.

    "I had plans in mind for Earl after the 2009 end-of-year tour, so I wanted Dick Muir, who was coaching the Lions in the following year's Super 14, to give him an extended run. Dick agreed with me about Earl's potential, but then he left Earl out of the Lions team. I couldn't understand why. That was one of the reasons I wasn't happy with Dick coaching the Lions, despite the fact that I had initially supported the idea. I'd thought that Dick was aware of how I wanted to operate; he knew how frustrated I was that I had no support from the Super Rugby coaches apart from Frans Ludeke at the Bulls. But Dick followed his own head - so I guess I can't blame him, as I am much the same. It irritated me that by not selecting Earl, as we agreed, he sent out the wrong message about the player."

    Strange, I thought of Earl Rose as a bit of a poor player myself, never too impressed by him, I don't think PDivvy gets it that when people say they want Earl Rose or Ricky Januarie dropped it isn't about race.

    Nobody is saying drop JP Pietersen or Beast are they? as they are much better players than Earl Rose, simples


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  3. #2
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    I felt bad for Rose when I read comments online about him.
    I hardly saw him play, and he was poor a few times, but some just seemed to have it in for him.
    Certainly had talent, just not the confidence.
    In Shaun we trust

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  4. #3
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    I saw Pdivvy's book in the shops on the weekend...

    Must have been the first time in history that the book being advertised and the closest to the entrance has so many copies left.

    of course he's going to use the race-card, he was an instrument of it.

    He's missing the point once again totally! That part about the guys asking him why they should do as he said, I understand completely, but that is not because of creativity or the way they think, it's because the guys he mentioned, Earl Rose, Solly Tyibilika and Thabang Molefe had a history of defiance. they didn't respect the team and their traditions, always backchatted the ref and didn't respect the captain or coach. Now in his book, he's trying to sugar coat it. Only problem is, not many people are going to buy his book as we're sick and tired of him and his BS.
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  5. #4
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    Although it will be a farce and incredibly annoying to read, I want a copy. I just want to try and understand his way of thinking. Any idea where I can buy it online (to have it shipped to Holland)?

  6. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel View Post
    Although it will be a farce and incredibly annoying to read, I want a copy. I just want to try and understand his way of thinking. Any idea where I can buy it online (to have it shipped to Holland)?

    Don't you have a Kindle??
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  7. #6
    Lambie Lunatic!

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    Quote Originally Posted by heineken View Post
    Don't you have a Kindle??
    You mean those low-budget tablets that can do litterally nothing but show black text on a white background? Neh...

  8. #7
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    I think that book would be painful to read. He's always been a narcissist and a fool and several hundred pages of him explaining his dumb coaching decisions would be too much, especially as all of his failures will be passed onto racism. I'm sure that there are still levels of inequality when it comes to oppertunities for black players particularly at grass roots levels, however his blatant favouritism of less talented black players over more capable ones was pretty unacceptable. He was a very poor coach and I think he did more harm for equality in rugby than good.

  9. #8
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    I'm getting this book next month for my birthday. Divvy's opinions and philosophies may be BS but he does tell the truth. So I'll be 'filtering' while I read
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    I think it'd be an incredibly interesting read, to be honest...


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    I actually want the book just for laughs though.
    Soon we shall rejoice

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  12. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draggs View Post
    I felt bad for Rose when I read comments online about him.
    I hardly saw him play, and he was poor a few times, but some just seemed to have it in for him.
    Certainly had talent, just not the confidence.
    I agree he got some had it in for him, but I also feel that it was Snor's fault for overhyping him, calling him the Tiger Woods of rugby, and that brought him onto him

    if you constantly push a player as so great when he so clearly isn't, then people are going to watch and notice his errors more

    Rose could do well now and again, but he was far too error prone for Super Rugby never mind international rugby

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF_nickdnz View Post
    I think that book would be painful to read. He's always been a narcissist and a fool and several hundred pages of him explaining his dumb coaching decisions would be too much, especially as all of his failures will be passed onto racism. I'm sure that there are still levels of inequality when it comes to oppertunities for black players particularly at grass roots levels, however his blatant favouritism of less talented black players over more capable ones was pretty unacceptable. He was a very poor coach and I think he did more harm for equality in rugby than good.
    he says in the book that he flew to France to ask John Smit specifically to captain South Africa until the 2011, and he defends keeping him there in the team despite Bismarck clearly overtaking him, by saying how honest he was and how he was "keeping his word" and turned the poor decision into saying how honest and great he was and how others were dishonest

  13. #12
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    Read the little preview thing on Amazon UK: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Politically-...1396253&sr=8-1
    The previous week, Welsh referee Nigel Owens had done world rugby a huge disservice by letting Samoa get away with murder in a decisive pool match.
    Ain't that the truth.
    Seriously though, this book sounds like a great read for all the wrong reasons.

  14. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel View Post
    Although it will be a farce and incredibly annoying to read, I want a copy. I just want to try and understand his way of thinking. Any idea where I can buy it online (to have it shipped to Holland)?

    Amazon, Ebay or maybe second hand sites
    Apple is the hair of my motor

    Yeah, pimped and ready to roll






  15. #14
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    Is this the book cover?

  16. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by psychic duck View Post
    I agree he got some had it in for him, but I also feel that it was Snor's fault for overhyping him, calling him the Tiger Woods of rugby, and that brought him onto him

    if you constantly push a player as so great when he so clearly isn't, then people are going to watch and notice his errors more

    Rose could do well now and again, but he was far too error prone for Super Rugby never mind international rugby
    It was Ruan Pienaar he called the 'Tiger Woods of rugby', he just said Rose was in the same class. I think he was wrong about Rose, but he isn't the first nor last coach to have a blind spot about a player and Dick Muir should have kept his word if he said he was going to play him - after all he led the Lions to a whitewash defeat in the S14 that year.

  17. #16
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    The amount of references made towards race was interesting here, possibly showing the kind of issues that still exist in SA towards the subject. The fact that de Villers believes that black players need to be handled differently from white players is the kind of comment which is considered extremely outdated here. It appears that he also feels that black players are more likely to have creative minds. I personally fins it all a little baffling, and unfortunately things like the quota in place for the springboks just highlight the problem instead of really doing anything to fix the problem.

  18. #17
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    I think it possibly true.

    Most white South Africans probably grow up trying to be a great kicker or powerful ball carrier. While black South African's probably grow up trying to run with the ball in every situation and to do tricks like their allblack heroes!
    A bit of a generalisation i know but i think it's true, in a lot of other countries as well.

    Most of the coaches in SA are white as well and they like to play a powerful bish bosh game so i think it could have some element of truth to it.

    I think it's strange why SA doesn't embrace the black players more, i've heard that black SA'a aren't as physically gifted as the West african's though...

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    I wonder if they really get into touch rugby in South Africa. Im sure they have their comps but do they really take to it with a passion instead of just a training warm up. My point is regular touch rugby can really help with non contact attacking skills.
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  20. #19
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    Springboks 'too white' says de Villiers

    Mike Kilpatrick, Yahoo! New Zealand Sport September 18, 2012, 12:34 pm







    Getty Images © Enlarge photo








    Former Springboks coach Peter de Villiers was well known for his outrageous comments during his tenure in charge of the team.
    But since his axing as coach following the World Cup last year, de Villiers has been largely absent from the headlines.
    His latest outburst however - this time at replacement Heyneke Meyer's squad - is sure to put the divisive figure back in the spotlight.
    The 'Boks, who have beaten Argentina twice but lost to both Australia and the All Blacks, have been criticised for their performances in the inaugural Rugby Championship.
    And de Villiers, the first non-white coach of the 'Boks, has put this down to Meyer's squad being 'too white'.
    In an interview with South African radio the controversial coach said the "black support" was being turned against the Springboks and people were tackling negatively about the team.
    "It's just the little things that bother me. We need to know in what country we do live," he said.
    "And at this moment we are turning a lot of black people against ourselves by making the team white and nobody will talk about these things but I just have to.
    "Actually we're breaking up our country again."
    "We do have a lot of great players who can make a difference. You have Gio Aplon - here in Cape Town - who can make a hell of a difference."
    "You've got Juan de Jongh, an exciting player who can make a difference. We never played Kolisi - who's now injured, he was never given a chance," de Villiers continued.
    De Villiers' comments are sure to reignite the race row that has plagued South African rugby for years - he himself was criticised in the past as it was widely believed he only got the job because he was non-white.

    PDivvy is back!!
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  21. #20
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    Wow, what a clown.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Owen View Post
    Springboks 'too white' says de Villiers

    Mike Kilpatrick, Yahoo! New Zealand Sport September 18, 2012, 12:34 pm







    Getty Images © Enlarge photo






    Former Springboks coach Peter de Villiers was well known for his outrageous comments during his tenure in charge of the team.
    But since his axing as coach following the World Cup last year, de Villiers has been largely absent from the headlines.
    His latest outburst however - this time at replacement Heyneke Meyer's squad - is sure to put the divisive figure back in the spotlight.
    The 'Boks, who have beaten Argentina twice but lost to both Australia and the All Blacks, have been criticised for their performances in the inaugural Rugby Championship.
    And de Villiers, the first non-white coach of the 'Boks, has put this down to Meyer's squad being 'too white'.
    In an interview with South African radio the controversial coach said the "black support" was being turned against the Springboks and people were tackling negatively about the team.
    "It's just the little things that bother me. We need to know in what country we do live," he said.
    "And at this moment we are turning a lot of black people against ourselves by making the team white and nobody will talk about these things but I just have to.
    "Actually we're breaking up our country again."
    "We do have a lot of great players who can make a difference. You have Gio Aplon - here in Cape Town - who can make a hell of a difference."
    "You've got Juan de Jongh, an exciting player who can make a difference. We never played Kolisi - who's now injured, he was never given a chance," de Villiers continued.
    De Villiers' comments are sure to reignite the race row that has plagued South African rugby for years - he himself was criticised in the past as it was widely believed he only got the job because he was non-white.

    PDivvy is back!!
    I also think the Bokke are too white but we've just gotten past winter so give the boys a few days off and the African sun will do the rest.

    Quote Originally Posted by welshglory View Post
    I think it possibly true.

    Most white South Africans probably grow up trying to be a great kicker or powerful ball carrier. While black South African's probably grow up trying to run with the ball in every situation and to do tricks like their allblack heroes!
    A bit of a generalisation i know but i think it's true, in a lot of other countries as well.

    Most of the coaches in SA are white as well and they like to play a powerful bish bosh game so i think it could have some element of truth to it.

    I think it's strange why SA doesn't embrace the black players more, i've heard that black SA'a aren't as physically gifted as the West african's though...
    It's very difficult to say as I don't know the conditions at mainly black clubs but the generalisation is that the 'black' clubs in traditionally black homelands tend to mismanage players and funds while the more settled clubs prefer a more traditional power based approach.

    The other generalisation is that your average black kids generally struggle to compete physically with the average white kid. I tend to agree if I look at my own experiences and just standing in queues in shopping centers etc.

  23. #22
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    [sarcasm]It's not a coincidence all wingers are black!!![/sarcasm]

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    Quote Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel View Post
    [sarcasm]It's not a coincidence all wingers are black!!![/sarcasm]


    You remind me of the joke that we should change the emblem from a springbok to a seagull; all white with black on the wings.
    Last edited by stormer2010; 18-09-12 at 02:29 PM.

  25. #24
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    Hahaha, that is actually quite hilarious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stormer2010 View Post
    you remind me of the joke that we should change the emblem from a springbok to a seagull; all white with black on the wings.
    aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

    it has nothing do to with colour, its about merit/form... we have to stop looking at colour...

    However... (and i'm probably going to be in sh!t for saying this)

    but, the current gameplan probably suit "the white SA player" MORE as the "non-white"...

    non-white players tend to play more of an expensive game then white players, you do however get white expansive players too, eg. lambie/goosen

    but the percentage of white expansive players in SA are minimum... and i think this is what Pdivvy is actaully trying to say, indirectly... i would not mind having a full white expansive SA team though... why? I am actually supporting one in the AB...

    so i think it comes down to game plan... but we have to move away from "colour"...
    Last edited by Icemn; 18-09-12 at 02:53 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icemn View Post
    aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

    it has nothing do to with colour, its about merit/form... we have to stop looking at colour...

    However... (and i'm probably going to be in sh!t for saying this)

    but, the current gameplan probably suit "the white SA player" MORE as the "non-white"...

    non-white players tend to play more of an expensive game then white players, you do however get white expansive players too, eg. lambie/goosen

    but the percentage of white expansive players in SA are minimum... and i think this is what Pdivvy is actaully trying to say, indirectly... i would not mind having a full white expansive SA team though... why? I am actually supporting one in the AB...

    so i think it comes down to game plan... but we have to move away from "colour"...
    Do you have any examples to back up this statement?

    I bet you just say that because most black players are wingers.
    Last edited by psychic duck; 18-09-12 at 03:00 PM.

  28. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by psychic duck View Post
    Do you have any examples to back up this statement?

    I bet you just say that because most black players are wingers.
    not only wingers, more backline players.... very little black forwards...

    they don't feature that much for SA though as the gameplan is not for expansive play...

    why do you think J de Jongh and Aplon looked average for the Stormers in this years S15? cuz the Stormers did not play their usual running game, they played "safe" rugby this year, trying to squeeze a win out of very game...

    The stampkar gameplan does not suite non-white players, its not what we do, we want to play flair rugby, want to outsmart an opponent, might be a genetic thing aswell as non-player players in SA are usually smaller than the white players, so stampkar is not really an option... hence the saying "as jy nie sterk is nie, moet jy slim wees"...

    That is why i feel SA can really dominate world rugby IF they just start thinking on the field, instead of doing what they have been told... take initiative, play your natural game

    So Aplon was left out, cuz he doesn't suite the safe/stampkar gameplan, Aplon is too creative and the coach might be afraid he will take chances so he makes the excuse Aplon is too small for test Rugby... the coach however forgets, Aplon took on SBW in the S15... but the coach feels SBW gained 50kgs for test rugby... please tell HM to go look at how Cruden tackled Fran Steyn in Saturdays game plz... but i'm going off topic here...

    Lets say De Jongh and JP made the team... would they have started? JP would have played 14 and JDJ on the bench... JDV and Fran Steyn to start... the coach would have his reasons...

    JDV is captain and will need to start, although he is crap, his captaincy and as a player...

    The coach will say fran steyn will start becasue of his huge boot (might be why morne started and not goosen, with goosen there his excuse for fran steyn huge boot wont count cuz goosen can kick far aswell) morne and frans back-up etc other for an excuse to include both...

    10 goosen
    12 JDJ
    13 JP
    14 JDV (captain needs to play)

    a setup like that can work, but as i say - i don't mind if the entire bok team being white, for me its not about colour... its about gameplan, if the boks can play an exciting running game with 15 purple players so be it...

    i would love to see a team like this!!!

    9. fck know :? pienaar really really let me down.. but i blame the coach for this... its as if he listening to what the coach told him and not going according to his instinct :?
    10 Lambie/Goosen/Jantjies/Katrakilis
    11 banana/Hougaard/aplon
    12 lambie/JDJ/Whitehead
    13 JP/Jordaan/JJ (I would love to see JJ on 13)
    14 JJ/Banana/Aplon/
    15 taute/ludic/Aplon maybe fran steyn :?
    This can't be Naas Botha.........This man is running with the ball...

  29. #28
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    Very few black forwards???

    Ralepelle, Hadebe, Mtawarira, Mujati, Maku, Ntubeni, Floors, Johnson, Raubenheimer, Mtembu, Mabeta, Hess, Kolisi, Nyakane... Yeah, not enough...

    People should stop judging based on skin-color. Why don't we see a lot of white players in Bafana Bafana? No, that doesn't need to be equal, only rugby. F*ck off.

  30. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel View Post
    Very few black forwards???

    Ralepelle, Hadebe, Mtawarira, Mujati, Maku, Ntubeni, Floors, Johnson, Raubenheimer, Mtembu, Mabeta, Hess, Kolisi, Nyakane... Yeah, not enough...

    People should stop judging based on skin-color. Why don't we see a lot of white players in Bafana Bafana? No, that doesn't need to be equal, only rugby. F*ck off.
    Exactly!

    and the other problem is that the good black players, all play in the same position, so they will be just substituting themselves. If you swap Kirchner for Aplon, it's 15 swapping 15. Mvovo for Habana, winger for winger.

    Kolisi is maybe the only backrower who is up to par to play for the boks of colour. It's a no-win situation.

    PDV is just blowing fire out of his ass... there would have been more black players in the team if it wasn't for injuries, Ralepelle and JP Pietersen comes to mind.
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    • Joined: Apr 2011
    • From: Cape Town, South Africa
    Hurricanes
    Quote Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel View Post
    Very few black forwards???

    Ralepelle, Hadebe, Mtawarira, Mujati, Maku, Ntubeni, Floors, Johnson, Raubenheimer, Mtembu, Mabeta, Hess, Kolisi, Nyakane... Yeah, not enough...

    People should stop judging based on skin-color. Why don't we see a lot of white players in Bafana Bafana? No, that doesn't need to be equal, only rugby. F*ck off.
    but are they good enough for the boks team? we are talking about the boks right? no use you name all the non-white forwards in SA...
    This can't be Naas Botha.........This man is running with the ball...

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