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South Africa coach Heyneke Meyer announced five uncapped players in the 30-man Springbok squad for the two Rugby Championship tests against Argentina. http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/i...ringboks-squad Zane Kirchner, Pat Lambie, JP Pietersen, Bryan Habana, Lwazi Mvovo, Francois Hougaard, JJ Engelbrecht, Jean de Villiers (c), Francois Steyn, Morne Steyn, Elton Jantjies, Ruan Pienaar, Jano Vermaak, Keegan Daniel, Pierre Spies, Marcell Coetzee, Willem Alberts, Jacques Potgieter, Siya Kolisi, Andries Bekker, Juandre Kruger, Eben Etzebeth, Flip van der Merwe, Jannie du Plessis, Bismarck du Plessis, Adriaan Strauss, Chiliboy Ralepelle, Tendai Mtawarira, Dean Greyling, Pat Cilliers. A few interesting selections IMO. Great to see Kolisi picked, but I still think they need Brussow. Kirchner is still very lucky to be there - on recent form I would find it hard to look past Ludik at fullback.
Spies,M.Steyn and Kirchner... Well well well...
Vermaak, who hasn't even managed to get a starting spot for the Bulls, is picked over van Zyl Kirchner, who is awful, is picked over the form full-backs Ludik and Pietersen Spies is picked over Kanko (who might not be eligible but if he is, he should be there) Flip van der Merwe is there but no Bresler... What does Anton Bresler have to do to be picked? And why in the world are we without Aplon???
Spies over kankowski is just crazyness. You guys have got atleast two or three 8's with more potential than spies......
This SA side "could" and I emphasize could lose to Argentina in Mendoza.
Originally Posted by Little Guy This SA side "could" and I emphasize could lose to Argentina in Mendoza. In your opinion... I completely disagree though
You really want to see the Saffas lose don't you. No surprise since you're a Kiwi.
It's a sad reality, because you are right in saying this could be one of our worst teams in a while, but only if Meyer is stubborn and picks the same old guys. If he decides to pick on form and quality, on paper I think we may have the best team.
Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel Vermaak, who hasn't even managed to get a starting spot for the Bulls, is picked over van Zyl Kirchner, who is awful, is picked over the form full-backs Ludik and Pietersen Spies is picked over Kanko (who might not be eligible but if he is, he should be there) Flip van der Merwe is there but no Bresler... What does Anton Bresler have to do to be picked? And why in the world are we without Aplon??? What do you mean Kanko might not be eligible?? Isn't there a rule that if he has played for one onation he can't play for another nation anymore at senior level? You guys can all disagree with the squad, and nobody will ever be satisfied. Heyneke is building slowly but surely. he has now again added 5 rookies to the squad who didn't play against England. He has now brought in more players than any other coach in their first season coaching the Boks. How about some praising?? I see the Stormers-clan are quiet now, is it because Kolisi finally got included?? Happy now?? Kanko has on time and time again showed he's not good at test level especially vs Australia and NZ. Maybe his history has done him in. Stop bitching about Spies, there's no-one better at the moment who is fit, apart from Kanko. As for Morne Steyn, I agree with all of you, he shouldn't be there, he's out of form, and needs some rest.
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Originally Posted by heineken What do you mean Kanko might not be eligible?? Isn't there a rule that if he has played for one onation he can't play for another nation anymore at senior level? Isn't Kanko off to Japan? Could mean that he's unavailable through that.
Dunno what Jantjies has done to deserve being picked...
That didn't stop them selecting Frans Steyn, Ruan Pienaar and Johann Muller. Granted those are experienced proven internationals while Kankowski has been a constant disappointment at that level. So yea i agree with Heineken, people should stop bitching for their favourite players to be involved
Kanko might not be eligible because I read somewhere his contract with Toyota includes a paragraph saying he cannot be called up for international duty. The issue is the same shit now. Yes, we are going to bitch about Kirchner, Spies and Morne Steyn because they are just poor. This is the chance for Heyneke Meyer to try something new. Why not have some balls and pick form-guys in stead of the same old shit? The front-row is easy to pick, although I hope Cilliers gets the starting spot in stead of Jannie (who is past his prime) The second row has a lot of potential but van der Merwe is just not good enough. Why not call up Anton Bresler who is in perfect form? We have Kruger, Etzebeth and Bekker to fight for the 3 spots and Bresler can learn from being in the squad. Think about the future here. Backrow can be very easy. I don't say this because I am a Sharks fan but what if we just bench Spies and have Coetzee blindside, Kolisi openside and Alberts at 8? Daniel off the bench. Scrum-half... Man, how is Vermaak in the squad? Why don't we just call up Cobus Reinach? He didn't play any significant rugby either. Hougaard and Pienaar are good options. Pienaar has the experience we can use against the big teams while Hougaard is flashy, but has his on and off moments Fly-half.... I just hope Lambie plays. Just give the guy a chance... I even prefer Elton Jantjies over Steyn at the moment but it is not going to happen so we will play BB rugby (Boring Bulls). You can say what you want but changing the pack doesn't make a freaking difference if you stick to the same one-trick pony in the number 10 shirt. Habana on the wing is another player who seems to have a guaranteed spot in the starting line-up. When will we ever see Aplon and Pietersen start on the wings together? I guess when Habana is either injured or retired. Centers I am happy with, but the full-back is a joke. Krusty is the worst full-back in Springbok history and is picked for no other reason than familiarity with the coach. Joe Pietersen and Louis Ludik are the form full-backs but both are not even in the squad? The desired change of scenery with Heyneke Meyer is still far away... It's a sad day in Springbok history once again.
This is my biggest issue with HM selections and it isn't really about specific players. South Africa's tactical game plan has in recent years revolved around a few "elements" we now lack, I say elements and not players because when we lost Fourie du Preez and big Vic weren't just losing a couple talented players we were losing actual game-play elements that were previously part of our strategical game plan. The "territorial" rugby which SA has favoured since Jake White's time needs a game controlling scrum half with a masterful kicking game and an unassailable line-out. I'm not saying their replacements aren't good but in a way HM is trying to enforce the same strategy without actually considering the loss of key parts. We need to try something different and play to the specific strengths of our players. It's like the old spring-bok squad was a nice reliable Jeep, but then the engine blew, and the fan belt broke and we replaced the missing parts with the parts of a Lamborghini. The Jeep just doesn't work like it used to.
Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel Fly-half.... I just hope Lambie plays. Just give the guy a chance... I even prefer Elton Jantjies over Steyn at the moment but it is not going to happen so we will play BB rugby (Boring Bulls). You can say what you want but changing the pack doesn't make a freaking difference if you stick to the same one-trick pony in the number 10 shirt. :O u sounding like the icemn now beter late than never pienaar on 9 with lambie on 10 and it's game on!!!
This can't be Naas Botha.........This man is running with the ball...
Originally Posted by SomeOke It's like the old spring-bok squad was a nice reliable Jeep, but then the engine blew, and the fan belt broke and we replaced the missing parts with the parts of a Lamborghini. The Jeep just doesn't work like it used to. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Originally Posted by Icemn :O u sounding like the icemn now beter late than never pienaar on 9 with lambie on 10 and it's game on!!! Yeah, but I don't support NZ sides because of SA's gameplan I don't like. Guess I am more patriotic about the Springboks than you are. I don't really care what type of rugby they play, as long as they win. With Morne Steyn, we won't win.
It's a talented squad and probably the best forward pack in the world. But they seem to lack a bit of depth in the backline. Interesting choice to stick with Kirchner.
No, we have a shitload of depth in the backline, but if you just ignore Juan de Jongh, Gio Aplon, Louis Ludik, Robert Ebersohn, Joe Pietersen and Willie le Roux.... Yeah, you will lack depth, but only by choice. Maybe not all of them need to be called up, but they are better than Wynand Olivier and Zane Kirchner who played against England.
Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel but if you just ignore Juan de Jongh, Gio Aplon, Louis Ludik, Robert Ebersohn, Joe Pietersen and Willie le Roux.... Yeah, you will lack depth, but only by choice. Maybe not all of them need to be called up, but they are better than Wynand Olivier and Zane Kirchner who played against England. That is what I meant (the squad has a lack of depth). Why isn't Ludik and Ebersohn in the squad?
In my opinion Ludik and Bresler aren't good enough for South Africa. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter about how good their form is, if they aren't good enough they won't be included
Well, I think they are better than their counterparts (van der Merwe and Kirchner) so why ignore them? I think you should select the best players. Form is very important with that. Kirchner and van der Merwe have never had a good game for the Boks so they should not be called up. Ludik and Bresler are good enough for the Boks because they are better than the current players.
Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel Yeah, but I don't support NZ sides because of SA's gameplan I don't like. Guess I am more patriotic about the Springboks than you are. I don't really care what type of rugby they play, as long as they win. With Morne Steyn, we won't win. My friend, if you don't like "chicken" of a spesific franchise, support another... Nothing to do patriotism, race, colour... So let's move on...
To like and pick sides, we have club rugby. National teams are different. But lets not get into that too much. Heyneke Meyer is afraid of change because every time he has another excuse. First, the England test was his first test, now the Rugby Championship is too important since it's a prize to be won. In November he won't make changes because he wants the Boks to play familiar style rugby to win overseas. Before you know it, it's 2015 and we will still be stuck with Spies, Steyn and Kirchner
Originally Posted by Icemn My friend, if you don't like "chicken" of a spesific franchise, support another... Nothing to do patriotism, race, colour... So let's move on... Double post 45 minutes apart?
Heyneke Meyer is not the type of guy to make the bok-jersey cheap. Bresler IMO is crap, he does exactly the same work as Flip, except Flip gains meters when running with the ball... Bresler is a poor Albert van den Bergh, and sorry to say this Eze, but this is where your Sharks biaseness is getting the better of you... With Kolisi now also in the mould, for all we know Willem Alberts could become an extra Lock/Flanker/8th Man, like Danie Rossouw.
Alberts to his most useful position, bench. Is Duane injured or just not selected? No Ludik is a crime. Say what you want, he has been miles better than Kirchner all season.
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Originally Posted by welshglory You really want to see the Saffas lose don't you. No surprise since you're a Kiwi. He made some valid points, some of which I agree with and although I'm leaning to supporting Argentina in this comp I don't exactly have my horse in the race. I still think the Boks should be favoured but the Pumas can't be totally written off, I'm surprised many are doing it so early before we've seen them hit their stride. Hernandez is looking good, and the Argentine back line actually has some flair for once.
Originally Posted by Little Guy He made some valid points, some of which I agree with and although I'm leaning to supporting Argentina in this comp I don't exactly have my horse in the race. I still think the Boks should be favoured but the Pumas can't be totally written off, I'm surprised many are doing it so early before we've seen them hit their stride. Hernandez is looking good, and the Argentine back line actually has some flair for once. By Argentine standards, you mean all players able to place kick and slot drop goals? Originally Posted by TRF_Ezequiel Kanko might not be eligible because I read somewhere his contract with Toyota includes a paragraph saying he cannot be called up for international duty. The issue is the same shit now. Yes, we are going to bitch about Kirchner, Spies and Morne Steyn because they are just poor. This is the chance for Heyneke Meyer to try something new. Why not have some balls and pick form-guys in stead of the same old shit? The front-row is easy to pick, although I hope Cilliers gets the starting spot in stead of Jannie (who is past his prime) The second row has a lot of potential but van der Merwe is just not good enough. Why not call up Anton Bresler who is in perfect form? We have Kruger, Etzebeth and Bekker to fight for the 3 spots and Bresler can learn from being in the squad. Think about the future here. Backrow can be very easy. I don't say this because I am a Sharks fan but what if we just bench Spies and have Coetzee blindside, Kolisi openside and Alberts at 8? Daniel off the bench. Scrum-half... Man, how is Vermaak in the squad? Why don't we just call up Cobus Reinach? He didn't play any significant rugby either. Hougaard and Pienaar are good options. Pienaar has the experience we can use against the big teams while Hougaard is flashy, but has his on and off moments Fly-half.... I just hope Lambie plays. Just give the guy a chance... I even prefer Elton Jantjies over Steyn at the moment but it is not going to happen so we will play BB rugby (Boring Bulls). You can say what you want but changing the pack doesn't make a freaking difference if you stick to the same one-trick pony in the number 10 shirt. Habana on the wing is another player who seems to have a guaranteed spot in the starting line-up. When will we ever see Aplon and Pietersen start on the wings together? I guess when Habana is either injured or retired. Centers I am happy with, but the full-back is a joke. Krusty is the worst full-back in Springbok history and is picked for no other reason than familiarity with the coach. Joe Pietersen and Louis Ludik are the form full-backs but both are not even in the squad? The desired change of scenery with Heyneke Meyer is still far away... It's a sad day in Springbok history once again. Disagree with regards to Jannie. 6 months ago I would agree, but Jannie has had a great season, rightfully the starting tighthead. Why Dean Greyling is there I'll never know. It could be worse (CJ) but still, Greyling is nowhere near international standard. What we will see: 01 Mtawarira 02 du Plessis BW 03 du Plessis JN 04 Bekker 05 Etzebeth 06 Kolisi 07 Coetzee 08 Spies (Not too sure about this backrow, I'll have to think about it) 09 Hougaard (don't really think he is as good as some say)\ 10 Steyn M 11 Habana 12 Steyn FPL 13 de Villiers 14 Pietersen 15 Lambie 16 Strauss 17 Cilliers 18 Kruger 19 Alberts (18 Alberts, 19 Daniel could be possible) 20 Pienaar 21 Engelbrecht 22 Kirchner
