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  1. #1
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    MMA/UFC thread

    Not sure how many MMA fans we have here, I've really been getting into it. When I first watched it I thought it was too brutal but now I gotta admit I think it's awesome and the more I watch the more I see how technical it is.

    IMO Boxing is dead, it's a fricken joke. The tippity top of 1vs1 competition in world sports is Mixed Martial Arts and the title of "Baddest Man on the Planet" doesn't go to some boxing fake with some random title it goes to the UFC Heavyweight Champion.

    The rugby nations have a pretty good representation in the UFC last weekend Samoan Kiwi legend Mark Hunt at 39 years old won a huge match by TKO against maybe one of the biggest up and coming young MMA fighters in the world - a 7ft tall Stefan Struve. This won him knockout of the night and put him in the top 10 heavyweight rankings.

    Another kiwi is Light heavyweight James TeHuna who is 5 - 1 in the UFC and has won 4 in a row and considered one of the most dangerous strikers in the division. In a recent fight he broke the UFC record for significant strikes landed in a round and I think the fight broke the record for total significant strikes landed total.

    MMA seems to be pretty big in the UK and I get the feeling it's sky rocketing in Australia. With TeHuna and Hunt doing well in the UFC it should be growing in NZ as well. Any of you lot follow it?
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  3. #2
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    I am a big MMA fan but we don't have coverage to watch UFC. We are stuck with the local EFC africa fights which are pretty amateurish.

    I'm a big Anderson Silva and Chuck Liddel fan. I got into it by playing it on the PS3 and then watching movies like Never Back Down and Warrior. My friends are part of a local club and I watch their fights.

    The only way for me to watch UFC is via youtube and then it's not the whole fight.

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    I used to watch the UFC religiously but haven't seen any since Henderson made Bisping his personal bitch (UFC 95 or something like that?)

    Agree with the first comment though, it's a much more interesting and exciting sport then boxing. I watched "Warrior" the other day also which got me thinking about getting back into watching it again. Who are the big fighters these days?

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    The divisions are pretty interesting right now even though a few of them have one dominant fighter

    Light heavyweight has John Jones who seems unbeatable
    Middleweight has Anderson Silva who is basically a freak and best pound for pound fighter in the world and dominates his division
    Welterwright has GSP who also dominates his division
    Lightweight has Benson Henderson who looks like he may similarly be a long time champion.

    You would think this would make it boring but what this will do is create a round of "super fights" where log time champions cross divisions which we should see this year.

    A John Jones vs. Anderson Silva fight will happen at some point within the next year and it will be the biggest single MMA match up in history. Anderson recently faught at light heavyweight and and dominated.

    heavyweight division I think is great, as far as I know no champion has managed to defend more than a couple of times. Current Champion Cane Velasques is a beast, very complete kickboxing wrestler. #1 contender and former champ Jnr Dos Santos is the only one who has ever beaten Cane is arguably the best boxer in the UFC and would beat most pro heavyweight boxers with boxing rules. Cane has the title but it's basically even between these two, they are 1 - 1 head to head. In May at the same event Cane fights Big Foot Silva and Jnr fights Alister Overeem who comes off a shock loss to Big Foot Silva. The Division has kinda been waiting for Overeem to fight either JDS or Cane to establish a pecking order. Overeem destroyed and retired Brock Lesnar and then had to take a year off because of elevated testosterone levels. He already had a rep as a juicer after fighting for a long time in lighter divisions then suddenly becoming a Massive muscled heavyweight that has to cut to get under 260lbs.

    Mark Hunts win last weekend puts him in line for a potential title shot later this year after 4 wins in a row, though he will likely have to fight Roy Nelson or Another top 10 fighter before then to qualify.

    However big talking point right now is the introduction of a womans division. Despite some bad press from a small group of vocal ******s with internet access its set to be easily on par with interest levels and quality as the men. Ronda Rousey will set the bar for some time. Former Olympic medalist in Judo she's rushed right to the top with 7 first round wins all by arm bar. It may sound boring and one dimensional but winning every time by arm bar just shows how good she is at it. her last few fights everyone knows how good she is at arm bar but she still finds it and finishes it every time and sets it up with some ridiculous Judo Throws.
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    For me personally - I prefer boxing. I agree that the matches in boxing that get the most press have recently all been terrible, but there are still some great boxers out there that don't get the headlines for the wrong reasons.

    Several things turn me off MMA. As a specticle I think it can very easily turn boring. More importantly I dislike the culture surrounding MMA, and the ethos of the sport itself. The one advantage MMA has at the moment, is a leading promotor in the UFC - which means the matchups usually do end up happening as opposed to boxing in which you have people like Mayweather ducking Pacquiao, and the Klitschko's (as amazingly dominant as they are) not fighting the best opponents and fighting them always in Germany.

    Basically I see why people like MMA, the structure of it means it's certainly easier to follow than boxer - and the best go against the best. But I'd still say in terms of reputation, boxing is far more prestigious. You only have to look at Floyd Mayweather Jr. getting 80 million off of one fight to see that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TRF_nickdnz View Post
    For me personally - I prefer boxing. I agree that the matches in boxing that get the most press have recently all been terrible, but there are still some great boxers out there that don't get the headlines for the wrong reasons.

    Several things turn me off MMA. As a specticle I think it can very easily turn boring. More importantly I dislike the culture surrounding MMA, and the ethos of the sport itself. The one advantage MMA has at the moment, is a leading promotor in the UFC - which means the matchups usually do end up happening as opposed to boxing in which you have people like Mayweather ducking Pacquiao, and the Klitschko's (as amazingly dominant as they are) not fighting the best opponents and fighting them always in Germany.
    At least the fights happen agreed, however it also means Dana White has a monopoly and can "create" the best fighters rather then their destiny being in their own hands - E.g. Brock Lesner was signed for ridiculous money, given a title shot as a rookie then made himself a laughing stock once being found out for being a 1-trick pony whom and decent ju-jitsu fighter can incapacitate. It's swings and roundabouts.

    Basically I see why people like MMA, the structure of it means it's certainly easier to follow than boxer - and the best go against the best. But I'd still say in terms of reputation, boxing is far more prestigious. You only have to look at Floyd Mayweather Jr. getting 80 million off of one fight to see that.
    Fair point, but that is the mainstream promotion that the sport receives is a good reason for that - It could be argued however is the level of skill between Ronaldo and Carter (aka the best 2 players in their respective codes of football) shouldn't have such a gulf in salary.

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    I can't stand boxing, I find it incredibly dull. Can understand why people like it, just not for me.

    I love MMA though. I'm terrible at keeping up with it though - I tend to go on a UFC binge and watch tons of fights, and then forget about it for ages.

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    Mark Hunt's KO was jsut awesome. He was knackered and just took him out. Though when they were on the ground, I thought Struve would get that kimura on, or at least that triangle.

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF_nickdnz View Post
    For me personally - I prefer boxing. I agree that the matches in boxing that get the most press have recently all been terrible, but there are still some great boxers out there that don't get the headlines for the wrong reasons.

    Several things turn me off MMA. As a specticle I think it can very easily turn boring. More importantly I dislike the culture surrounding MMA, and the ethos of the sport itself. The one advantage MMA has at the moment, is a leading promotor in the UFC - which means the matchups usually do end up happening as opposed to boxing in which you have people like Mayweather ducking Pacquiao, and the Klitschko's (as amazingly dominant as they are) not fighting the best opponents and fighting them always in Germany.

    Basically I see why people like MMA, the structure of it means it's certainly easier to follow than boxer - and the best go against the best. But I'd still say in terms of reputation, boxing is far more prestigious. You only have to look at Floyd Mayweather Jr. getting 80 million off of one fight to see that.
    What culture is that? Granted there are good and bad for each fanbase. But I'm not what you're referring to, or how it could be anymore different than to boxing's 'culture'.

    Personally, in terms of talent; Mayweather being the highest paid fighter in the world rather interesting (best boxer? sure enough) but not the best FIGHTER (i.e. can do it all). When I haven't seen him defend a takedown, pass guard, hip throw - all against an equal athlete. Though he is a great marketer; and that is probably the (very close) second reason why he's paid so highly.

    And imo, boxing RIGHT NOW (and the past 5 years or so) is riding off the coat-tails of its own history (Ali, Tyson, Lennox, etc etc).

    Plus there's more than just the typical Tapout-wearing juicehead. They're probably the minority. People also have to remember that since MMA is all-encompassing; there are Judo, wrestling BJJ, Muay Thai etc etc fans because their sport is represented. Most of which, at least the grappling arts; are very well knowledgeable and respectful So I don't get that it's construed as an ugly culture or crowd.

    That's like Dan Carter getting paid less than a rugby player that can just boot the ball through the uprights 60m, but nothing else.

    It's only boring because most people aren't attuned to the non-striking aspects. Much like 99% of people that watch a new sport for the first time. Cricket to me was boring as ****, so was soccer, gridiron, basketball, baseball, rugby/league to an extent and pretty much all other sports

    But that's just me.
    Last edited by admartian; 06-03-13 at 06:47 PM.
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    Boxing has a few guys making big money and the rest make peanuts in comparison, the way MMA is setup and the way the UFC works plus because there is so much talent and so many stars the money is getting spread around a lot more.

    Boxing is living off its history but are their really any truly great fighters these days? You got man and floyd I guess.

    The big thing for me is that Boxing is Boxing

    MMA is Boxing, Jujitsu, Wrestling, tae kwon-do, Judo, muay thai and there are even fighters who successfully integrate backgrounds from traditional martial arts like Kung fu and karate.

    Seeing all the exotic techniques working and getting a commentary explaining them is fantastic, I actually feel like I'm learning something watching it. Watching boxing and the commentator is like jab jab straight right left hook uppercut jab jab I really don't think I get anything from it.
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    Huge fan of MMA and have been watching it since the PRIDE FC days. Also wrestled in school and have practiced BJJ for awhile now so I do have an appreciation of the grappling arts.

    I like boxing but the popularity is nowhere near that of MMA now. Sure you have a couple of guys like Pretty Boy Floyd and Manny plus the Klitschko brothers that fight for big money but most of the guys make peanuts in comparison.

    The top tier guys in the UFC i.e. anyone in the top 10 of their weight division are all making atleast $500,000 a year. Top stars like GSP/Anderson Silva/Bones Jones/JDS etc all make millions a year. Reason being is because the UFC is a private organization they do not need to reveal bonuses and other incentives they give fighters. So a guy like GSP for instance shows up and receives $400,000 to fight Carlos Condit, this represents only a small portion of what he receives and is the only piece that has to be revealed to the athletic commission. Top fighters also get a cut of the PPV and bonuses for winning etc so you can be rest assured that a guy like GSP makes a few million every year.

    The whole idea that top boxers get more money as well is not really that realistic. Fedor Emelianenko was offered an apparent $30 million to fight Brock Lesnar a couple of years ago when both were still relevant but the deal fell through so you can see that certain MMA fighters do make really big money and the smaller names in the business still make reasonable salaries.

    I would say most UFC fighters make atleast a $100,000 a year (even the bottom guys) and the big names and top fighters make between $500,000 to a few million.

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    I lost faith with the UFC a while back when they lost Roger Huerta who in my eyes was one of the best fighters back then (Nowadays he's a joke) but I watch it a lot more again, I still love boxing but it's becoming a farce however UFC in my eyes is still a sport where whoever is the biggest thug wins and then you have ******s like Koscheck who play possum all the time. I love MMA, but with Dana White running the UFC like a dictatorship threatening to ban people for the slightest thing I think it still has a while to go before it is at its best.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woldog View Post
    I lost faith with the UFC a while back when they lost Roger Huerta who in my eyes was one of the best fighters back then (Nowadays he's a joke) but I watch it a lot more again, I still love boxing but it's becoming a farce however UFC in my eyes is still a sport where whoever is the biggest thug wins and then you have ******s like Koscheck who play possum all the time. I love MMA, but with Dana White running the UFC like a dictatorship threatening to ban people for the slightest thing I think it still has a while to go before it is at its best.
    LOL WUT? In Heavyweight maybe.

    Rashad Evans was champ and is one of the smallest 205ers, and is an average sized 185er only. Frankie Edgar should be fighting at 135 (and arguably can make weight at 125) and has beaten up on guys like Gray Maybnard for years (guys who walk around at 200 pounds). You have Demian Maia, who's not typically your big guy, but is submitting people left and right. If not that, then he's controlling them. Same with Fitch. Anderson Silva, a lean 185 pounder, beating up guys like Forrest Griffin who are around 230 pounds come fight day.

    Lesson here; the big guys are probably on the worse end of the deal. Closer to even.

    Even if you mean "thug" stylistically, IO would still say that's wrong. It's the most technically sound guys that study tape that are the most successful. Jon Jones is a student of the game, and Anderson and GSP have been doing just that for years now. Same goes for up and comers like Rory Macdonald.

    If you're talking guys like Jeremy Stephens, Josh Koscheck (specifically sin't a thug but more of a ********) who just want blood, yeah sure they win and have a good record, sure they're part of the stable of fighters in MMA; but they are not even close to being a majority.

    As someone who's been practising BJJ for nearly 3 years now; I think MMA has a long way to go in terms of perception. But the reality is, that they're on the right track, and are only trending upwards.
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    I don't think you really understood what I meant by biggest thug.... I didn't mean size wise I was speaking in terms of whoever has the more animal instinct and wants to inflict more pain. You have people like Rampage Jackson who if he wasn't in the UFC would have probably been out fighting people in pubs and the like, UFC is a sport that takes the most violent people and puts them in a ring.
    Anderson Silva yes, he can beat guys like Forrest, but Anderson Silva has had his fairshare of dirty shots and cheap shots (even starting fights at weigh ins) Forrest rarely does cheap shots and to me doesn't have the animal instinct to be the best (See his fights with Tito Ortiz)

    Size doesn't mean anything in fights, I've done boxing for 12 years and MMA for 3 it comes down to the fighter, have a look at Roger Huerta dropping that NFL player in a street fight, Roger is like 2 foot tall and nails a 6'5 NFL player like it ain't not thang.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woldog View Post
    I don't think you really understood what I meant by biggest thug.... I didn't mean size wise I was speaking in terms of whoever has the more animal instinct and wants to inflict more pain. You have people like Rampage Jackson who if he wasn't in the UFC would have probably been out fighting people in pubs and the like, UFC is a sport that takes the most violent people and puts them in a ring.
    Anderson Silva yes, he can beat guys like Forrest, but Anderson Silva has had his fairshare of dirty shots and cheap shots (even starting fights at weigh ins) Forrest rarely does cheap shots and to me doesn't have the animal instinct to be the best (See his fights with Tito Ortiz)

    Size doesn't mean anything in fights, I've done boxing for 12 years and MMA for 3 it comes down to the fighter, have a look at Roger Huerta dropping that NFL player in a street fight, Roger is like 2 foot tall and nails a 6'5 NFL player like it ain't not thang.
    I still don't necessarily agree.

    And in saying that, it is a combat sport after all. Where the direct objective is to inflict pain.

    And mind games are very different to actually being a thug. Chael is a BS artist, a master of mind games ,but not a thug. His wrestling will wear you out, but he's not hug.

    Neither is Cain Velasquez. Neither is Junior Dos Santos. Neither was Fedor. I can go on.

    The main thread all these guys posses is the will and dedication to win necessary​ for their respective fields. Not different to someone like Richie McCaw, Dan Carter, Michael Jordan ,Lebron James, Lionel Messi, David Beckham, Novak Djkokovic, and heck even Floyd Mayweather or Manny Pacquiao.

    Like I said earlier, and the same logic applies here - Rampage is all but a small part of that equation in the fight business - NOT limited to MMA - but not the majority.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woldog View Post
    I lost faith with the UFC a while back when they lost Roger Huerta who in my eyes was one of the best fighters back then (Nowadays he's a joke) but I watch it a lot more again, I still love boxing but it's becoming a farce however UFC in my eyes is still a sport where whoever is the biggest thug wins and then you have ******s like Koscheck who play possum all the time. I love MMA, but with Dana White running the UFC like a dictatorship threatening to ban people for the slightest thing I think it still has a while to go before it is at its best.




    Anderson Silva is one of the most gifted fighters and I would go as far and say athletes on the planet. To call these guys simply thugs is moronic.

    Even at Heavyweight their are lots of good dynamic fighters:



    Old and not in MMA anymore but Crocop is one of my all time favorites



    Frank Mir who is a gifted Jiu Jitsu fighter, he dislocated nogueira's should in this btw



    Another all time fav ... Fedor Emelianenko



    Anthony Pettis

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    Anderson's head movement is sick! I know it's been said countless times, but that is Matrix level **** there. Forrest describing it is gold too!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1R50LpFh_M
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yE3oM0MPZ_c

    And that Mir transition to bait Noguiera to roll and finish that Kimura is definition of black belt level BJJ. Not to mention that peek-out to get out of back control.
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    Quote Originally Posted by admartian View Post
    Anderson's head movement is sick! I know it's been said countless times, but that is Matrix level **** there. Forrest describing it is gold too!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1R50LpFh_M
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yE3oM0MPZ_c

    And that Mir transition to bait Noguiera to roll and finish that Kimura is definition of black belt level BJJ. Not to mention that peek-out to get out of back control.
    Mir has the highest level Jits in heavyweight MMA... now if only his wrestling was as good and he could actually drag guys to the mat!

  19. #18
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    I didn't say all of them are thugs, of course Anderson Silva has never done any knees to the head on downed opponantes or face kicks on them (Sarcasm) I'm surprised none of you have mentioned Georges St-Pierre as he's probably one of the most talented fighters.
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    I'm going at the Jitz inter varsities in a few weeks...completely and utterly out of practice and 2 weight classes heavier than last year when I won Silver at 77Kg but I reckon I'll still be in with a shout.

    Don't watch that much UFC or MMA but I like getting a good foundation in various martial arts , trained boxing , a little kickboxing , decent bit of BJJ and heaps of Freestyle wrestling so I like to consider myself a reasonably tasty character.

    If I can get a video of the comp uploaded I'll get to it.

    Here's my first fight in last years contest. I had trained JuJitsu probably 5-6 times before and decided to give it a lash

    ss

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    I recently beat a US national HS champion John Siryj in freestyle wrestling. Huge achievement except he weighed in at 77kg (after competing at 55kgs three years or so ago), and I weighed in at 108kg, haha - so it was just for a bit of run. Still I'm getting a bit of training from the guy which is certainly good, I want to start competing at 100kg.
    Last edited by TRF_nickdnz; 07-03-13 at 07:34 AM.

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