[2025 Six Nations] Ireland vs France - 8/3/25

[Leonormous Boozer]

Yep, that Ireland are just a bunch of cheats. I can't blame them though, I'd be so scared of Italy too that I need to cheat to get Ringrose back in time.

I was joking initially, clearly, but it's hilarious that your anger is directed at Ireland. Very misplaced.

 

[Reiser99]

I was joking initially, clearly, but it's hilarious that your anger is directed at Ireland. Very misplaced.

What can I say, I don't like cheats.

I don't care if the citing committee or whoever let them get away with it or if it's just Ireland 'playing the system'. They knew what they were doing and got away with it, doesn't change the fact they chose to do it especially when it was completely unnecessary.

Just to be clear, if England did the same thing or when they did in the past, I'll be just as critical.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

What can I say, I don't like cheats.

I don't care if the citing committee or whoever let them get away with it or if it's just Ireland 'playing the system'. They knew what they were doing and got away with it, doesn't change the fact they chose to do it especially when it was completely unnecessary.

Just to be clear, if England did the same thing or when they did in the past, I'll be just as critical.

I'd be livid if I was involved in any organisation that didn't use tools and arguments available (that are available to any equivalent organisation in the same position) to gain an advantage. Every union in the game would have tried to do what Ireland did, it's not cheating at all.

Unironically this time, the decision to play Osborne and have centre cover from the wing shows the plausibility of the argument too. Ringrose has started five games on the wing in his career, one since 2016. Likely, no, but enough for World Rugby's burden of proof which is where the problem lies.

 

[Reiser99]

I'd be livid if I was involved in any organisation that didn't use tools and arguments available (that are available to any equivalent organisation in the same position) to gain an advantage. Every union in the game would have tried to do what Ireland did, it's not cheating at all.

Unironically this time, the decision to play Osborne and have centre cover from the wing shows the plausibility of the argument too. Ringrose has started five games on the wing in his career, one since 2016. Likely, no, but enough for World Rugby's burden of proof which is where the problem lies.

We'll just agree to disagree. I personally see organisations trying to find loop holes in the rules for their advantage as cheating.

 

[Toulousain ex French fan]

This is a fully loaded French team, except for Ollivon missing. Fickou is back training but has played only one game with his club. Bit early for him. Could return vs Sco.
The starting XV is close to the best available. No unforced changes. The bench could work or backfire. I'm not sure about Jegou and Auradou. The 7-1 split is a gamble that rests entirely on Galthie. What happens if players get injured?

Still waiting on that big performance vs proper opposition...

 

[Smurfy]

What can I say, I don't like cheats.

I don't care if the citing committee or whoever let them get away with it or if it's just Ireland 'playing the system'. They knew what they were doing and got away with it, doesn't change the fact they chose to do it especially when it was completely unnecessary.

Just to be clear, if England did the same thing or when they did in the past, I'll be just as critical.

Ffs you’re a Leicester fan. You invented cheating.

 

[Saintjay]

We'll just agree to disagree. I personally see organisations trying to find loop holes in the rules for their advantage as cheating.

In rugby it's not cheating it's improvised winning.

 

[big ginger 8]

A loophole = following the law in a way some people don't like.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Possibly a bit of quack psychology in this post but I'm feeling more confident as we get closer to this.

France are in a weird position where Galthié needs this more than his players and I think there's an air of desperation about him (7/1 and bringing up the James Lowe try from two years ago). The French players are mostly going back to Toulouse and Bordeaux and have the Top 14 and European trophies in their sights, both arguably as big or bigger than a championship sans Grand Slam.

For Ireland it's the end of a chapter for this team in many ways. There's been soft developments in terms of personell and playstyle on both sodes of the ball since the world cup but it's still a team who's core and philosophy remains largely the same. That will change after POM, Healy and Murray, three of the most influential players to ever pull on a green shirt, retire. This is their last home game and Easterbuy's last home game as the main man for the time being, there'll be no shortage of emotional energy.

France are a team that can show up and beat anyone when passes and offloads are sticking but Ireland, along with South Africa, are the best at minimising the influence gamebreakers, that France have in abundance, have on the game.

Round 4 caught us out last year but I think Ireland can raise the levels of focus and intensity seen so far in the championship. I think the first half will be tight and manic but we'll head into the last 10 minutes with an 8+ point cussion amd close it out.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

This is real cliche which France will turn up.

I think if France have the courage of their convictions and go for it, they’ll win. They walloped Ita and Wal (and could easily have put more on the latter). Poor opponents, admittedly. The ball was made of soap against England, but they frequently cut us to pieces and should have had a fairly convincing win there too.

7-1 though suggests they might be looking at more of a power game. But aside from their front row (which could turn the game by itself) I don’t actually think their bench adds very much. And Ire are probably savvy enough to deal with that.

Not vintage Ire though. Not wholly convincing v Eng or Wal and benefited from some early Scottish blue on blue. A few aging legs and there was a piece in the paper this morning about Prendegast’s dodgy defence which will no doubt be tested to the full.

Head says Ire, just. But if Fra get their **** together I don’t think anyone can live with them and that includes Ire. There’s just something in the water that says it will be France’s day.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Don't really agree with it not being a vintage Ireland team. Have got this far without really getting out of third gear with the only worrying periods being the first half v England, and the tide was turning towards the end of that, and the red card period v Wales.

It's not 22/23 standard (that was the third longest winning streak of all time and included every tier 1 international team so fairly lofty) but still comfortably a leading international team.

I think the age profile is also being overstated. With how long players careers are lasting this year, I reckon everyone who hasn't announced their retirement has eyes on the world cup. I'm surprised Murray hasn't tried to stick around and get the third choice spot to be honest, not loads of competition to oust him around.

 

[General Melchett]

I'll be watching this one while sipping an ice cold Castle free at Mojo market, Seapoint in Cape town. Curious to see the ratio of fans out watching although I suspect there will be more green than blue.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

It's not 22/23 standard (that was the third longest winning streak of all time and included every tier 1 international team so fairly lofty) but still comfortably a leading international team.

Oh agreed. I just don't think you're quite where you were - measuring you by your own v high standards.

On the age profile there's the likes of POM, Murray and Healy you mentioned. Aki not far behind.

We’ve probably seen the best of Furlong who’s 32 and struggling with injury. JGP’s the one you might be really concerned about - he’s so critical to you and is now 33. Ringer’s 30, Bealham 33, Lowe 32, Beirne 33, van der Flier 31, Conan 32, Henshaw 31.

Legs go at different rates but go they all do and sometimes quite quickly. Experience can compensate to an extent, but there’s a reason why Father Time is world ranked no1.

 

[big ginger 8]

Don't really agree with it not being a vintage Ireland team. Have got this far without really getting out of third gear with the only worrying periods being the first half v England, and the tide was turning towards the end of that, and the red card period v Wales.

It's not 22/23 standard (that was the third longest winning streak of all time and included every tier 1 international team so fairly lofty) but still comfortably a leading international team.

I think the age profile is also being overstated. With how long players careers are lasting this year, I reckon everyone who hasn't announced their retirement has eyes on the world cup. I'm surprised Murray hasn't tried to stick around and get the third choice spot to be honest, not loads of competition to oust him around.

With regard to our age profile it's also worth noting that this year is the first time in a long time that our 20s lost a 6N match. Because of only having 4 teams a lot of our youth don't get gametime in games that international fans would see, unless they're in the freak category, but our stocks are a lot better than many think. Except maybe tighthead.

 

[Jimbo]

I think @Leonormous Boozer has a point Ireland haven’t played brilliantly by their own lofty standards of the last couple of years, however they have rarely looked anything but in complete control probably having a gear or two if needed but hasn’t been, wonder if there has been a bit of a mindset change in light of WCs, tournaments are a marathon not a sprint, no point in putting crazy points on weaker opponents and not conserving the intensity and complete performance for those you really need it against, I could also be talking complete ******** but when you have under achieved on the biggest of stage you’d like to think things would be put in place long before the next oppertunity.

 

[munstermuffin]

What can I say, I don't like cheats.

I don't care if the citing committee or whoever let them get away with it or if it's just Ireland 'playing the system'. They knew what they were doing and got away with it, doesn't change the fact they chose to do it especially when it was completely unnecessary.

Just to be clear, if England did the same thing or when they did in the past, I'll be just as critical.

But does this not say more on citing team as opposed to IRFU?

Like if they got away with it and played system that means they actually played within the rules.

 

[Welsh Exile]

With regard to our age profile it's also worth noting that this year is the first time in a long time that our 20s lost a 6N match. Because of only having 4 teams a lot of our youth don't get gametime in games that international fans would see, unless they're in the freak category, but our stocks are a lot better than many think. Except maybe tighthead.

Your under 20 pack has some very big boys in there as well. Absolute monsters. Good ball players too. Whilst I was extremely proud of our performance and result it was clear Ireland were a better side than us.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Oh agreed. I just don't think you're quite where you were - measuring you by your own v high standards.

On the age profile there's the likes of POM, Murray and Healy you mentioned. Aki not far behind.

We've probably seen the best of Furlong who's 32 and struggling with injury. JGP's the one you might be really concerned about - he's so critical to you and is now 33. Ringer's 30, Bealham 33, Lowe 32, Beirne 33, van der Flier 31, Conan 32, Henshaw 31.

Legs go at different rates but go they all do and sometimes quite quickly. Experience can compensate to an extent, but there's a reason why Father Time is world ranked no1.

I think Aki, Lowe, Conan and Bealham are my biggest worries there, they're all at an age that power and explosiveness can fall off fast as you say, backrow, wing and centre fortunately aren't problem areas for us with ready replacements and a lot of depth in the provinces. Furlong too obviously but I expect him to eventually get back fit and be Johnny Sextoned to the next world cup, wouldn't be surprised if he makes it to 2027 and play less than 10 more times for Leinster. TH is Ireland's biggest weakness currently.

JGP will be the same age as Aaron Smith was in 23 at the next world cup and he's turned himself into a bit of a Smith dupe the last few years. His high aerobic threshold shouldn't leave him before 2027.

A 35 year old lock at a world cup isn't out of the ordinary.

A lot of players are still in their primes at 32-33 these days so the rest will all definitely be there I imagine.

With regard to our age profile it's also worth noting that this year is the first time in a long time that our 20s lost a 6N match. Because of only having 4 teams a lot of our youth don't get gametime in games that international fans would see, unless they're in the freak category, but our stocks are a lot better than many think. Except maybe tighthead.

Add to that that most of the real prospects from this 20s crop are injured. 2031 will look vastly different than now but I think the starting XV and most, if not all, the 23 for 2027 is currently in the squad.

I think @Leonormous Boozer has a point Ireland haven't played brilliantly by their own lofty standards of the last couple of years, however they have rarely looked anything but in complete control probably having a gear or two if needed but hasn't been, wonder if there has been a bit of a mindset change in light of WCs, tournaments are a marathon not a sprint, no point in putting crazy points on weaker opponents and not conserving the intensity and complete performance for those you really need it against, I could also be talking complete ******** but when you have under achieved on the biggest of stage you'd like to think things would be put in place long before the next oppertunity.

I've been thinking this too. NZ got the hop on us in 2023 and started both halves better which was something Ireland had mastered before it. I hope the realisation is that that can't be guaranteed and the approach is to minimise the variabkes in the last 20. Two decisive moments in that QF were Kelleher getting held up (incredible Barrett play but truly awful from Kelleher) and Henderson getting isolated and turned over at the end. Two subs making game losong contributions is criminal, the bench has been a weapon so far this year.

 

[OllyM97]

As a neutral I think the game needs France to fly out of the blocks and get an early lead. If Ireland get in front then I fear that they may suffocate France out of it and it might not be the game that it could be. It would make it a more interesting spectacle if Ireland had to chase the game.

 

[Jimbo]

I was thinking France might squeak it until this morning, now I am thinking it will be more of the same Ireland quietly going about their business, their defense standing strong for the most part, France to have purple patches but Ireland with overall control across the 80 mins with enough to get it done and not really look like losing. Also thinking France may have put too much into the Italy game, it probably demonstrated some defensive vulnerability in the French defense Ireland will look to expose, Ireland by 5.