2017 RBS Six Nations] Round 4: Italy v France (11/02/2017)

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

2017 RBS Six Nations] Round 4: Italy vs France (11/03/2017)

Venue: Stadio Olympico
Time: 13:30 GMT​

ITALY
15 Edoardo Padovani, 14 Angelo Esposito, 13 Michele Campagnaro, 12 Luke McLean, 11 Giovanbattista Venditti, 10 Carla Canna, 9 Edoardo Gori, 8 Sergio Parisse (Capt.), 7 Simone Favaro, 6 Abraham Steyn, 5 Dries van Schalkwyk, 4 Marco Fuser, 3 Lorenzo Cittadini, 2 Leonardo Ghiraldini, 1 Andrea Lovotti

Replacements: 16 Tommaso D'Apice, 17 Sami Panico, 18 Dario Chistolini, 19 George Biagi, 20 Maxime Mbanda, 21 Giorgio Bronzini, 22 Tommaso Benvenuti, 23 Luca Sperandio

FRANCE
15 Brice Dulin, 14 Noa Nakaitaci, 13 Rémi Lamerat, 12 Gaël Fickou, 11 Virimi Vakatawa, 10 Camille Lopez, 9 Baptiste Serin, 8 Louis Picamoles, 7 Kévin Gourdon, 6 Fabien Sanconnie, 5 Yoann Maestri, 4 Julien Le Devedec, 3 Rabah Slimani, 2 Guilhem Guirado (c), 1 Cyril Baille
Replacements: 16 Christopher Tolofua, 17 Uini Atonio, 18 Eddy Ben Arous, 19 Paul Jedrasiak, 20 Bernard Le Roux, 21 Antoine Dupont, 22 Francois Trinh-Duc, 23 Yoann Huget

 

[ThebigARena]

France by 30 points

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

If Italy tried the no ruck tactics against France they would have been annihilated, France love just smashing it through the middle and around the fringes. The days of French flair are gone, they are going full blown bulldozer tactics.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

If Italy tried the no ruck tactics against France they would have been annihilated, France love just smashing it through the middle and around the fringes. The days of French flair are gone, they are going full blown bulldozer tactics.

They wasted it on England, one of the eggchasers was saying they should have tried to stay in the game until HT and then used it, I'd agree. They could have caught the Scots on the hop with it though considering they score most of their tries out wide.

 

[DozeyPillock]

(I'll try and spruce up the first post tomorrow).

You might want to fix the month portion of the date too

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

You might want to fix the month portion of the date too

Ta. I think you'll find I am the rightful custodier of that username!

 

[DozeyPillock]

Ta. I think you'll find I am the rightful custodier of that username!

I'm just building strength in depth at the position, got to have a finisher these days, don't you know?

 

[TW27BA]

France by 30 points

France by at least 30pts.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

I'm just building strength in depth at the position, got to have a finisher these days, don't you know?

Heh. Commendable. The day you can mess up the date on two game day threads in a row you will become the first name on the team sheet dozeypillock-San. Until then, observe the master at work

- - - Updated - - -

Italy incredibly unpredictable. They looked genuinely good at times against England, but would they have if England weren't all confused? France may lack less cutting edge than Ireland, and maybe even Wales, so it might keep the score respectable - particularly with France out of tournament contention. Think the gap could be less than 20 points depending on the French team selection.

 

[DozeyPillock]

Italy have played some good rugby in small fits and starts - look at the Campagnaro try against England, that was good stuff to see. I think the biggest problem is still the drop off after 60 minutes, particularly when the pack is going to have to work very hard against a big French pack. I'm not convinced that the French are full 80 minute players, but they only need to last longer than their Italian counterparts to run up a few points at the end.

 

[RedruthRFC]

Agreed DP, even with some good subs to come off the bench, you have to question the French staying power, but as the same question has always hung over the Italians, it's hard to see it being a problem for the French. I agree with all the French to beat the handicap shouts, I just can't see the Italians coping with the French power game and believe that the bookies have read too much into the match against England.

 

[welshoptimist]

The French had a new coach this year and I was surprised they were as cohesive as they have been, think they will start to come on strong now, really exciting back line, have been really entertaining in every game, think they will rack up a huge score here, more than anybody has so far

 

[DozeyPillock]

I just can't see the Italians coping with the French power game

First 20 I expect them to be competitive, but after that it will be downhill as once France start to dominate in the forwards I don't think Italy have the ability to force the game to be played anywhere but their own 22 for any length of time.

The French had a new coach this year and I was surprised they were as cohesive as they have been, think they will start to come on strong now, really exciting back line, have been really entertaining in every game, think they will rack up a huge score here, more than anybody has so far

It is very refreshing to see the French players finally looking like they know who each other are, the last couple of seasons I have wondered whether they had actually all bothered going to the training camps together. As to the score, I think France will get the bonus point, but not until the second half. I don't expect them to slice through Italy with the ease that Ireland did.

 

[FrenchFan]

Bonus win for France or bust. Yet I can see France struggle with a lack of leadership and confidence.

Noves has admitted after the Irish game his side is stagnating. 'I don't get the impression we're improving'. http://www.rugbyrama.fr/rugby/6-nations/2017/6-nations-guy-noves-xv-de-france-je-n-ai-pas-l-impression-qu-on-progresse-mais-on-construit_sto6072548/story.shtml

All the talk of French renaissance is raving BS. Some media talk of 'the old France back' (Guardian). I want the New France not the old one.

Noves doesn't have the players capable of playing the Toulouse offloading game he's trying to implement. Players don't have the skillsets when under pressure and have showed little tactical intelligence. That was obvious in Dublin. At Toulouse he had players like Castaignede, Ellisalde, Cazalbou etc. who instinctively knew what game to play in each area of the pitch.
Many times they're offloading in the wrong areas and trying difficult passes they don't need to. Lopez excellent kicking game with Clermont has barely featured. He has showed better tactical awareness when playing for Clermont.

Also faith in players like Atonio and Spedding is baffling. Atonio is a penalty giving machine, too slow, can't scrum. Dulin should start all day ahead of Spedding. At least the back row is finally rid of Chouly.

If Italy have done their homework and play a pressure game they can get something and more out of this game.

France are looking at 4th or 5th place which will not be seen an improvement. Hard to see Laporte not turning the screws on Noves then.

Laporte to bring in a consultant (Fabien Galthié?) and then a manager when/if Noves walks out.

 

[Groundhog]

Italy


15. Edoardo Padovani
14. Angelo Esposito
13. Michele Campagnaro
12. Luke McLean
11. Gioanbattista Venditti
10. Carlo Canna
9. Edoardo Gori
1. Andrea Lovotti
2. Leonardo Ghiraldini
3. Lorenzo Cittadini
4. Marco Fuser
5. Dries van Schalwyk
6. Braam Steyn
7. Simone Favaro
8. Sergio Parisse (Capt)
Replacements:
16. Toommas d'Apice
17. Sami Panico
18. Dario Chistolini
19. George Biagi
20. Maxime Mbanda
21. Giorgio Bronzini
22. Tommaso Benvenuti
23. Luca Sperando
France
15. Brice Dulin
14. Noa Nakaitaci
13. Remi Lamerat
12. Gael Fickou
11. Virimi Vakatawa
10. Camille Lopez
9. Baptiste Serin
1. Cyril Baille
2. Guilhem Guirado (Capt)
3. Rabah Slimani
4. Julien Le Devedec
5. Yoann Maestri
6. Fabien Sanconnie
7. Kevin Gourdon
8. Louis Picamoles
Replacements
16. Christopher Tolofua
17. Uini Atonio
18. Eddy Ben Arous
19. Paul Jedrasiak
20. Bernard Le Roux
21. Antoine Dupont
22. Francois Trinh-Duc
23. Yoann Huget

 

[TheSaffycen]

Very happy to see Dulin, missed watching him and Guitone as they are both electric. Bonneval was fun to watch as well.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Bugger. Why drop the solid but unspectacular Spedding against Italy? I wasn't anticipating France to do much returning Padovani and Canna's hoofs downfield but this looks like a team that might play more in the French spirit. I've yet to be convinced by Vakatawa. So he'll probably have a blinder.

 

[FrenchFan]

Bugger. Why drop the solid but unspectacular Spedding against Italy? I wasn't anticipating France to do much returning Padovani and Canna's hoofs downfield but this looks like a team that might play more in the French spirit. I've yet to be convinced by Vakatawa. So he'll probably have a blinder.

Very happy to see Dulin, missed watching him and Guitone as they are both electric. Bonneval was fun to watch as well.

Glad to see Spedding dropped. He played himself out in Dublin anyway. They found him out with 2 well placed high kicks. Had Sexton start the aerial bombardment earlier Ireland would have won by more.

Vakatawa is a fantastic player. Prob the best 7s player i've seen. The point I made about the lacking skillset in the team re. offloading and passing doesn't apply to him. However he is a defensive liability and doesn't play enough 15s to be an effective defender. Would expect Italy to target him with high kicks.

 

[BPM]

Bonus win for France or bust. Yet I can see France struggle with a lack of leadership and confidence.

Noves has admitted after the Irish game his side is stagnating. 'I don't get the impression we're improving'. http://www.rugbyrama.fr/rugby/6-nat...esse-mais-on-construit_sto6072548/story.shtml

All the talk of French renaissance is raving BS. Some media talk of 'the old France back' (Guardian). I want the New France not the old one.

Noves doesn't have the players capable of playing the Toulouse offloading game he's trying to implement. Players don't have the skillsets when under pressure and have showed little tactical intelligence. That was obvious in Dublin. At Toulouse he had players like Castaignede, Ellisalde, Cazalbou etc. who instinctively knew what game to play in each area of the pitch.
Many times they're offloading in the wrong areas and trying difficult passes they don't need to. Lopez excellent kicking game with Clermont has barely featured. He has showed better tactical awareness when playing for Clermont.

Also faith in players like Atonio and Spedding is baffling. Atonio is a penalty giving machine, too slow, can't scrum. Dulin should start all day ahead of Spedding. At least the back row is finally rid of Chouly.

If Italy have done their homework and play a pressure game they can get something and more out of this game.

France are looking at 4th or 5th place which will not be seen an improvement. Hard to see Laporte not turning the screws on Noves then.

Laporte to bring in a consultant (Fabien Galthié?) and then a manager when/if Noves walks out.

I agree with some of the points you've raised about leadership and confidence, but I think you are being harsh on your team here.

The French team has been in a slump for a few years now, but I do believe there has been improvement, if not a renaissance under Noves. Results aside, there have been genuine positives in some of the performances so far and I fully expect France to get a bonus point on Saturday. I also think they have a good chance of beating Wales - particularly if Wales lose to Ireland.

If that happens, 3 wins from 5 would be a decent return for Noves IMO.

 

[FrenchFan]

I agree with some of the points you've raised about leadership and confidence, but I think you are being harsh on your team here.

The French team has been in a slump for a few years now, but I do believe there has been improvement, if not a renaissance under Noves. Results aside, there have been genuine positives in some of the performances so far and I fully expect France to get a bonus point on Saturday. I also think they have a good chance of beating Wales - particularly if Wales lose to Ireland.

If that happens, 3 wins from 5 would be a decent return for Noves IMO.

so far we've scored less tries than Italy (2 v 4) and Noves is said to have picked 'attacking' sides... To his credit he has brought about a change of attitude and renewed interest in the jersey which is more than his predecessor managed. His W/L ratio is against him though and he has a mountain to climb. He has picked young players who need time but I think he will run out of time. Laporte will shaft him when the time is right.

Wales could still nick it in Paris. If we finish with 2 wins, Noves is on his way out. 3 wins and he's on his way out as well, just the slower exit