[2020 Six Nations] England vs Ireland (23/02/20)

[Which Tyler]

I don't want to keep quoting Eddie's book, that would be silly, but he explicitly states that one of the biggest problems he encountered when he became England coach is that English players don't go off piste, that they want to be told what to do. This is the opposite of Ozzie rugby players apparently. So in order to get the England players to take the initiative, improvise, play off-the-cuff and problem-solve, he repeatedly puts them in situations that make them uncomfortable so that they have to work things out for themselves. So playing players out of position is part of that drive to make them better at going off-piste. He wants to make them uncomfortable because he thinks it will make them better players.

He should have had a chat with Brian Ashton at some stage. He tried his hardest to get the players to think for themselves and take responsibility for their plays - which oussed off the players so much they stayed a revolt so that they could take responsibility for their plays and do the thinking themselves

 

[bushytop]

Unless Farrell has had his arm surgically moved to his stomach/hip, then he wasn't getting hit in the arm

Red would be harsh, I agree with that on second viewing (live I thought it was to the head), but saying that's play on and only penalising the holding on is mental

I personally don't feel that particular angle is categorical in regards to arm or ribs. I saw a different angle during the match coverage which looked like it was the arm he was going at.

Either way Farrell's sudden fetish for male legs is... weird

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Andy Farrell's interview shows promise. Doesn't make any attempt to make excuses, admits the scoreline flattered us, praises the bench but doesn't try to turn this into something it's not.

Looked like a man who recognised the problems and was planning to fix them, instead of the denial we saw from the camp last season.

It's promising if he backs up his comments.

Before the tournament started, most people were saying the backrow needed to be addressed. He did so for the Scotland game yet reverted to type against England because of a win over a Wales team who were desperately poor on the day.

Before the tournament started, most people were saying John Cooney is in far better form than Conor Murray. Murray's poor form has continued through 2 out of 3 games in the 6 Nations.

The jury is out on Andy Farrell. I'll feel a lot more comfortable about having him as head coach if he makes the necessary changes. Bringing Ronan Kelleher, Iain Henderson, Caelan Doris and John Cooney into the starting XV against Italy is as good a start as any. It would be harsh on Rob Herring because he hasn't done anything wrong but Kelleher has much higher upside.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I personally don't feel that particular angle is categorical in regards to arm or ribs. I saw a different angle during the match coverage which looked like it was the arm he was going at.

Either way Farrell's sudden fetish for male legs is... weird

He definitely was not hitting his arm. There is an angle I saw live from behind Stander and you can see he is hitting Farrell in the stomach. From the angle provided you can also see his arm is going behind and well beyond where Farrell's arm is. No doubt the footage will surface somewhere, along with the **** he was doing with Itoje.

 

[bushytop]

He definitely was not hitting his arm. There is an angle I saw live from behind Stander and you can see he is hitting Farrell in the stomach. From the angle provided you can also see his arm is going behind and well beyond where Farrell's arm is. No doubt the footage will surface somewhere, along with the **** he was doing with Itoje.

The angle I saw was facing Stander rather than behind him. From behind you can only see the top part of Farrell's one arm, from the front you can see the rest of Farrell's one arm as well as his other arm. I have no doubt that a strike or two may have missed the arms and connected with Farrell's midriff but imho I genuinely think he was trying to dislodge Farrell by hitting his arms.

Haven't seen anything of the Itoje incident, what is it that apparently happened?

edit. & I'm no particular Stander fan btw...

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

The angle I saw was facing Stander rather than behind him. From behind you can only see the top part of Farrell's one arm, from the front you can see the rest of Farrell's one arm as well as his other arm. I have no doubt that a strike or two may have missed the arms and connected with Farrell's midriff but imho I genuinely think he was trying to dislodge Farrell by hitting his arms.

Haven't seen anything of the Itoje incident, what is it that apparently happened?

edit. & I'm no particular Stander fan btw...

Was about a minute before Stander ended up without a shirt, but they seemed to be yingyanging eachother with Itoje on the bottom and it looked like a punch into Itoje's stomach

 

[Which Tyler]

Stupid by farrell to hold on but must be close yo reversal due to stander punching faz. Faz was not in the right obv but not clear

Faz was looking to hurt Stander's knee IMO, holding above the knee, putting all his weight medially onto it. Once the punching started, I don't blame him for holding on, letting go would have exposed him to more damage if Stander kept going.
You still can't punch people though, and I'd have carded both, with penalty to England as the retaliation always gets the last word on sanction.

 

[LIONSxv]

Tbh stander will likely get cited. I'm not all that bothered about what he did. If he was striking the face then different storey.

What did bother me and what will most likely get picked up was Ryan's first half attempts to clear the ruck. 2 or 3 occasionas he lead with the shoulder with no attempt to wrap hitting stationary players. Far more dangerous than a punch to the stomach/chest

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Is that saints fan that posts on here about Eddie about?

Yes, Lawes played well as a lock today but not as a back row. MOTM doesn't change the fact he's not a back row.

Oh and we won today despite the strange selection, not because of it, so I still hate Eddie. I'm sure we'd have had the bonus try if we'd had a proper 23 (I might be wrong but I'm sticking to it).

 

[die_mole]

Farrell and stander sorted itself out. I'd be fine with a card to Farrell and pk to Ireland but if stander landed a punch on the stomach then it needs to be a pal to England. Punching arms and hands is fine but gut punches cross our games unwritten rules.

standers attack on itoje and Ryan's "clear puts" were much worse.

Ryan hit a guy on his knees who had his hands up in the air, i don't know how it wasn't picked up.

 

[Yoshimitsu]

I don't really care anymore but Jaco Peyper is the embodiment of all the things I'd take out of a ref. He penalised Kruis for a 1:1 wrestle over the ball whilst missing the fact that Ryan was consistently throwing himself at the ruck with no regard for his or the opposition's safety. He's got a way of reffing a game that just looks like he's a massive incompetent.

 

[bushytop]

 

[corny]

We've gone from being a team full of uncompromising ball carriers to..... 'give it CJ' in no time haven't we.

Farrell needs to address this. Healy and POM should be dropped. Healy has been an irrelevance for some time now and POM adds next to nothing to the team.

Playing off 9 to a stationary carrier has to be stopped. The English lads must be laughing to themselves how stupidly predictable we are. They lined up our carriers time and again with double and sometimes treble hits. All with tremendous linespeed. In the pre match you hear the usual platitudes 'Ireland are a good team, well coached'. Actually we're not well coached. A well coached team would not play the game in such redundant fashion. We're stuck playing a game that the rest of the world have moved on from.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Yes, Lawes played well as a lock today but not as a back row. MOTM doesn't change the fact he's not a back row.

Oh and we won today despite the strange selection, not because of it, so I still hate Eddie. I'm sure we'd have had the bonus try if we'd had a proper 23 (I might be wrong but I'm sticking to it).

Didn't you lose?
Since you know you supported Ireland....

 

[Amiga500]

What fúcks me off most is looking over at France.

Not afraid to give the in form young guys a chance and they are flying.

Us? Same problems we all knew we had 18 months and not one fúcking inch further forward in fixing them.

 

[bushytop]

What fúcks me off most is looking over at France.

Not afraid to give the in form young guys a chance and they are flying.

Us? Same problems we all knew we had 18 months and not one fúcking inch further forward in fixing them.

Dat accent tho!

 

[TheOvalBall]

Owen Farrell trending on twitter as of this moment. Hilarious!

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Fairly easy win that said far more about Ire than us.

Disappointing not to get the BP and the 6-2 made such an impact that we lost the 2nd half.

V lucky that the back 3 weren't tested and that there were no injuries behind the scrum. Poor shadow of our performance in Dublin last season.

Not much more than competent. Pre match concerns remain.

 

[duncanb]

Yes, Lawes played well as a lock today but not as a back row. MOTM doesn't change the fact he's not a back row.

Oh and we won today despite the strange selection, not because of it, so I still hate Eddie. I'm sure we'd have had the bonus try if we'd had a proper 23 (I might be wrong but I'm sticking to it).

To both maybe me your on about.
Lawes best line player did what was told carried tackled won most line outs of anyone.
No turnovers .
All far more knowledgeable people have him MOM
than us but heyho Lawes haters wont go away and you have your opinions that today is not backed by facts ie match stats or professional opinion.
Jones even said he was personally disappointed in his performance against France.
Once again I say I would have him as bench lock to add from 50 mins onwards.
But he can play International 6 and made POM look shite.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

To both maybe me your on about.
Lawes best line player did what was told carried tackled won most line outs of anyone.
No turnovers .
All far more knowledgeable people have him MOM
than us but heyho Lawes haters wont go away and you have your opinions that today is not backed by facts ie match stats or professional opinion.
Jones even said he was personally disappointed in his performance against France.
Once again I say I would have him as bench lock to add from 50 mins onwards.
But he can play International 6 and made POM look shite.

I'm not a Lawes hater, I really rate him as a player and i'm a saints fan, but every player has their weaknesses and playing 6 plays to his weaknesses. I mean he plays in the second row for us just like he did today, it's not like playing him at 6 changed his game, he still tackles and carry's like that at lock weak in weak out in the premiership.