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[2021 Rugby Championship] Round 6 South Africa v New Zealand (02/10/2021)

TRF_stormer2010

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The more I see of our team under Nienaber the more I'm thinking Stormers ~2010 (not sure about my timing) was Nienaber and not as much Alasdair Coetzee especially if I think back on the Bokke under AC. I'm not sure I like it.
 

saulan

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The more I see of our team under Nienaber the more I'm thinking Stormers ~2010 (not sure about my timing) was Nienaber and not as much Alasdair Coetzee especially if I think back on the Bokke under AC. I'm not sure I like it.
To be fair, he was the defense coach and this is exactly the same thing in terms of defense that you see of that Stormers side I.e. great defense and super tight games but unable to chase a game or score a lot of points against strong teams if required.

Wasn’t it Fleck as the attacking or backline coach back then? Feel like it more falls onto him and AC at the Stormers than Nienaber. There is a potential point of interest in that Nienaber has never been a head coach prior to the Springboks and maybe doesn’t have as much focus/experience on the attacking front.
 

rN_X

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When something does not work for you ... you just continue to do it XD
 

TRF_stormer2010

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To be fair, he was the defense coach and this is exactly the same thing in terms of defense that you see of that Stormers side I.e. great defense and super tight games but unable to chase a game or score a lot of points against strong teams if required.

Wasn’t it Fleck as the attacking or backline coach back then? Feel like it more falls onto him and AC at the Stormers than Nienaber. There is a potential point of interest in that Nienaber has never been a head coach prior to the Springboks and maybe doesn’t have as much focus/experience on the attacking front.
Yes, it was Fleck. Now with the Bokke its Stick. Does not seem like either have much pull.

It does seem that the game plan has indeed become so focused its blind to any opportunities that might arise ball in hand. Its a pity. Vs the Lions I thought it was pragmatic as we lacked any time to get anything else going but its as if it is only getting more focused (in a limiting way I's suggest) as opposed to more nuanced.
 

Umaga's Witness

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When something does not work for you ... you just continue to do it XD
Well they’ve won 50 per cent of the games using their 50 50 kicking

they seem to have lost a lot of fitness over the last couple of years so are limited in what else they can do .

In saying that, they still should be taking the opportunities on offer, they shouldn’t just blindly follow the game plan.

“We made a big step up in terms of our performance last week and having reviewed the match, there is no doubt we delivered a performance worthy of a victory,” Nienaber said
I can imagine this coming from a weaker side, who were proud of nearly beating the all blacks, but the springboks coach? While he’s not wrong, he should be expecting the all blacks to improve.
They were less dangerous with ball in hand in that match than any match so far this year. Actually they’ve seemingly got worse with every game.

“Last week we stuck to our DNA and style of play and with a little more luck we could have come away with the result, so we need to ensure that we are better at it this week."
I Don’t think it will be enough. With a good amount of luck they might win, but they shouldn’t rely on it.
 

Umaga's Witness

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Sounds like mounga, lienert brown, papalii, jacobson might all be available this week. I think that means jacobson starts and the others make the bench. I don’t think they will change the team too much.

possibly
Moody
Taylor
Laulala
Retallick
Scott
Akira
Savea
Jacobson
Weber
Beauden
Reece
Havili
Rieko
Jordan
Jordie
Karl
Taukeiaho
Ofa
Tuipolotu
Papalii
Tj
Mounga
Alb
 

NZbloke

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When something does not work for you ... you just continue to do it XD
Yeah, if someone continues to do something that doesn't work that well for them consistently it's pretty senseless stuff - feel really sorry for the Boks wingers, the only time they tend to get the ball on attack is if they're lucky enough to win it in the air through a 50/50 up & under... people pay good money whether going to Tests or watching the games on tv, so could you imagine if all teams only used that same pedantic tactic on attack, basically just hoping the other side drops the ball ? if that was the case I wouldn't bother watching the game anymore.
 

Kiwiwomble

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Yeah, if someone continues to do something that doesn't work that well for them consistently it's pretty senseless stuff - feel really sorry for the Boks wingers, the only time they tend to get the ball on attack is if they're lucky enough to win it in the air through a 50/50 up & under... people pay good money whether going to Tests or watching the games on tv, so could you imagine if all teams only used that same pedantic tactic on attack, basically just hoping the other side drops the ball ? if that was the case I wouldn't bother watching the game anymore.
i guess that the thing, the Bokke believe in the idea what this game plan got them within two point of the AB's....and ignore the idea that that game plan literally lost them the game, were in front and had the ball...and bombed it...2 or 3 times, didn;t even ban it into a corner or something, it mad
 

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The whole thread lacks any context. The Boks were forced to play extremely narrow due to not playing rugby last year.

You’re not going to see any meaningful change till next summer. The entire cycle of incorporating new players and tactics is an entire year behind every other nation.
 

Kiwiwomble

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good team, i wouldn't have Dmac and Richie on the bench, would rather someone bigger but thats splitting hairs


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Kiwiwomble

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The whole thread lacks any context. The Boks were forced to play extremely narrow due to not playing rugby last year.

You’re not going to see any meaningful change till next summer. The entire cycle of incorporating new players and tactics is an entire year behind every other nation.
dont buy that, the Argentinians didn't pay for a year but turned up, played some great rugby and rolled over the AB's last year, SA has used similar tactics on and off for years
 

ChicagoKid

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dont buy that, the Argentinians didn't pay for a year but turned up, played some great rugby and rolled over the AB's last year, SA has used similar tactics on and off for years
You don’t buy it? It’s not an opinion it’s a fact. Argentina had an inspired one-off versus the ABs and then fell off immediately the next week. Then they played zero domestic rugby and look where they are at.

You have to play to develop good attacking rugby. That’s been proven for years.
 

Kiwiwomble

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You don’t buy it? It’s not an opinion it’s a fact. Argentina had an inspired one-off versus the ABs and then fell off immediately the next week. Then they played zero domestic rugby and look where they are at.

You have to play to develop good attacking rugby. That’s been proven for years.
rubbish, SA played the currie cup this year and a lions tour before the RC so had plenty of time to build a different style, its a choice to play like this, they're not forced to do anything
 

ChicagoKid

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rubbish, SA played the currie cup this year and a lions tour before the RC so had plenty of time to build a different style, its a choice to play like this, they're not forced to do anything
So they should have unveiled a new style when playing an opponent that they face every 12 years? Logically, wouldn’t you take more risks when the downside is lower rather than higher? I don’t follow your reasoning. And how does the Currie cup help the Boks when only one backline player is involved. How does Faf, Pollard, Cheslin, Mapimpi, DDA and Willie benefit from the Currie Cup?
 

Kiwiwomble

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So they should have unveiled a new style when playing an opponent that they face every 12 years? Logically, wouldn’t you take more risks when the downside is lower rather than higher? I don’t follow your reasoning. And how does the Currie cup help the Boks when only one backline player is involved. How does Faf, Pollard, Cheslin, Mapimpi, DDA and Willie benefit from the Currie Cup?
but did they NH rugby? i believe so...so you have lots of players that have payed some for of domestic rugby...like a normal season...then they have gone into camps for the RC....like a normal season....so how exactly have they been stopped from developing their game and forced into playing this current style

The fact you said they would be debuting a "new style" shows it was the old style, the one they played before covid...so im not sure why you think theyre being forced to play a certain way now, the bokkes themselves are unashamed about the style they play, they say themselves they play a style they think will win...i might find other styles more enjoyable to watch but i can respect them for owning how they play
 

ChicagoKid

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but did they NH rugby? i believe so...so you have lots of players that have payed some for of domestic rugby...like a normal season...then they have gone into camps for the RC....like a normal season....so how exactly have they been stopped from developing their game and forced into playing this current style

The fact you said they would be debuting a "new style" shows it was the old style, the one they played before covid...so im not sure why you think theyre being forced to play a certain way now, the bokkes themselves are unashamed about the style they play, they say themselves they play a style they think will win...i might find other styles more enjoyable to watch but i can respect them for owning how they play
Just read Jac’s answer from his recent press conference. If you think COVID had no impact on development, then ok. He says differently. And if you don’t believe him, ask American coaches. They can give you a first-hand account.
 

NZbloke

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The whole thread lacks any context. The Boks were forced to play extremely narrow due to not playing rugby last year.

You’re not going to see any meaningful change till next summer. The entire cycle of incorporating new players and tactics is an entire year behind every other nation.
Disagree... it's the mindset of this current coaching staff wanting them to play such a restricted type of attacking game.
 

Kiwiwomble

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Just read Jac’s answer from his recent press conference. If you think COVID had no impact on development, then ok. He says differently. And if you don’t believe him, ask American coaches. They can give you a first-hand account.
of course COVID effect lots of stuff...but saying the bokkes are only playing this style, a style that has been played by lots of bokke teams for decades, because of COVID....when they have actually have a pretty normal season...just seems ill thought out
 

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