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Appreciation for Richie McCaw
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<blockquote data-quote="Big Ewis" data-source="post: 667073" data-attributes="member: 57076"><p>Basketball is played with 5 players on the court at one time for one team. Rugby is played with 15 on the field for one team. MJ did literally pick up his team on his shoulders and brought them places and single-handedly put Chicago on the map. He only started winning ***les when others came in and matured and they got the right coach though, but Mccaw and Jordan are for this instance incomparable as to their greatness and impact on a team. Mccaw takes care of one department and a Rugby field is 100m long, basketball court is under 30m. The impact of one single player in Rugby will never by definition be as important as one single bball player for bball.</p><p></p><p>The argument that Mccaw benefited from being an AB is undeniable. Most of those records in the OP are due to him playing for the best team ever. </p><p>For example, <strong>winning 114 int'l tests</strong>. That's obviously got very little to do with a personal record, and has lots more to do with the topic of All-Blacks dominance, he just happened to have played in those 114 games, and sure enough, played well under the 7 jersey, but a global team effort allowed this stat to occur.</p><p>Another: <strong>81 wins as captain</strong>. That stat isn't that he "won 81 games <u>because he was such a great captain</u>", although some credit goes to him because he must've been a good skipper necessarily for that to happen.</p><p></p><p>Those numbers do look really great though, and that's one heck of a CV.</p><p></p><p>And about the 'total tries scored' vs 'tries scored in short period' thing, I refer back to basketball and say it comes down to proportional figures (in bball total points vs points per game). 'Tries per game' is the only stat I look at.</p><p></p><p>Lastly, about *objectively* setting one player as the best ever (for one position at least), stats can be enough to assess that in the NBA. Here in Rugby though, I can only call on mathematical basic rules: McCaw is a better OS flanker than, say, Alexandre Lapandry (10 caps for France, Clermont player). Fundamentally, if one player can be better than one other, then he is necessarily better or worse than any other player that exists. With the ultra-rare exception of two players being so close in impact/level they are humanly virtually indistinguishable. It gets much harder to judge when we're talking greatest ever because so many other names pop up, and very good cases could be made for each one of those other ones. But a fair, patient and pure assessment surely could allow someone with enough intelligence, integrity and knowledge of the history of the game to actually come up with a fairly objective ("objective enough !") conclusion.</p><p>It's hard to measure the impact of a player in Rugby, but that impact exists, it is a reality, so therefor simply through footage and then knowledge of the game, it can be assessed surely. Not by me !! I just like to watch Rugby !...</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Big Ewis, post: 667073, member: 57076"] Basketball is played with 5 players on the court at one time for one team. Rugby is played with 15 on the field for one team. MJ did literally pick up his team on his shoulders and brought them places and single-handedly put Chicago on the map. He only started winning ***les when others came in and matured and they got the right coach though, but Mccaw and Jordan are for this instance incomparable as to their greatness and impact on a team. Mccaw takes care of one department and a Rugby field is 100m long, basketball court is under 30m. The impact of one single player in Rugby will never by definition be as important as one single bball player for bball. The argument that Mccaw benefited from being an AB is undeniable. Most of those records in the OP are due to him playing for the best team ever. For example, [B]winning 114 int'l tests[/B]. That's obviously got very little to do with a personal record, and has lots more to do with the topic of All-Blacks dominance, he just happened to have played in those 114 games, and sure enough, played well under the 7 jersey, but a global team effort allowed this stat to occur. Another: [B]81 wins as captain[/B]. That stat isn't that he "won 81 games [U]because he was such a great captain[/U]", although some credit goes to him because he must've been a good skipper necessarily for that to happen. Those numbers do look really great though, and that's one heck of a CV. And about the 'total tries scored' vs 'tries scored in short period' thing, I refer back to basketball and say it comes down to proportional figures (in bball total points vs points per game). 'Tries per game' is the only stat I look at. Lastly, about *objectively* setting one player as the best ever (for one position at least), stats can be enough to assess that in the NBA. Here in Rugby though, I can only call on mathematical basic rules: McCaw is a better OS flanker than, say, Alexandre Lapandry (10 caps for France, Clermont player). Fundamentally, if one player can be better than one other, then he is necessarily better or worse than any other player that exists. With the ultra-rare exception of two players being so close in impact/level they are humanly virtually indistinguishable. It gets much harder to judge when we're talking greatest ever because so many other names pop up, and very good cases could be made for each one of those other ones. But a fair, patient and pure assessment surely could allow someone with enough intelligence, integrity and knowledge of the history of the game to actually come up with a fairly objective ("objective enough !") conclusion. It's hard to measure the impact of a player in Rugby, but that impact exists, it is a reality, so therefor simply through footage and then knowledge of the game, it can be assessed surely. Not by me !! I just like to watch Rugby !... [/QUOTE]
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