Did Benitez make changes at Craven Cottage to help win the Fulham game or the Milan game

Discussion in 'All Other Sports' started by RoyalBlueStuey, May 15, 2007.

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Which game were the changes intended to benefit most

  1. Fulham

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  2. Milan

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  1. After fielding an unfamilar lineup against Portsmouth on the Saturday Benitez played what was commonly regarded as his best line-up against Chelsea on Tuesday. On the follow weekend at Craven Cottage he wrang the changes once more.

    Simple question were these changes down in London aimed more at winning the Fulham game or the Milan game.

    From this :

    liverpool: Dudek, Arbeloa, Hyypia, Paletta, Insua, Sissoko (El Zhar 83), Alonso, Zenden, Gonzalez (Pennant 67), Fowler, Bellamy.

    to this :

    liverpool: Reina, Finnan, Carragher, Agger, Riise, Pennant (Alonso 78), Gerrard, Mascherano (Fowler 118), Zenden, Kuyt, Crouch (Bellamy 106).

    and then to this :

    liverpool: Reina, Arbeloa, Paletta, Hyypia, Insua (Finnan 75), Pennant (El Zhar 65), Alonso, Sissoko, Gonzalez (Kewell 77), Fowler, Bellamy.
     
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  3. getofmeland

    getofmeland Guest

    Ummm simple answer is we haven't played the Milan game... he made changes at Fulham to allow his players to rest after an exhausting game against Chelsea...
     
  4. loratadine

    loratadine Guest

    this is just silly!! if everton had had a real long tough season, and had one of the most important games in the clubs history around the corner im sure the fans wouldnt grumble on some of the bigger names players have a much needed rest!!

    :mad:

    its f***ing stupid this is

    pure bitterness
     
  5. getofmeland

    getofmeland Guest

    Totally Agreed...
     
  6. Eh....this whole debate came about through Warnock getting slagged off for telling the truth.

    My cousin works at Sheffield Utd...he might well be getting made redeundant now. This is affected directly by teams treating the league with contempt & fielding weakened sides and gifting points to other teams. Warnock highlighted this and the likes of you and Charlie started calling him a gobshite etc etc

    That was my point...as it happens Everton have not been affected and I've stated that when Everton have done this sort of thing in the past it was out of order.

    So feel free to explain your 'bitterness' comment.

    *waits eagerly*
     
  7. getofmeland

    getofmeland Guest

    Did I miss the law where a manager must field the side that best benefits the whole league? When did that get introduced into the league...

    The simple fact is that Sheffield United did not win enough games... if they wanted to stay up they should of beaten Wigan at the weekend... Simple

    I am sorry to hear about your cousin but it is so easy to blame other teams, the simple truth is that they didn't get the results that were required of them...

    Rafa fielded the strongest squad that was available to him...

    I think what you don't seem to understand is that Rafa had to rest players after they had just played a Grueling 120 Minutes of football and then Penalties in midweek... its not about resting players for the Milan game there was/is 18 days between the Fulham and Milan Game... 22 Days between the Chelsea and Milan Game... between the Chelsea and Fulham game there was 4 days difference...

    And if Rafa was resting his players for the Milan game he would of rested them against Charlton...

    Daniele Padelli, Alvaro Arbeloa, Daniel Agger, Jamie Carragher, Steve Finnan, John Arne Riise, Javier Mascherano, Boudewijn Zenden, Steven Gerrard, Robbie Fowler, Dirk Kuyt

    Apart from probably Fowler and Padelli that would of be Rafa's First Team Squad...

    So Basically your theory on him allowing Fulham to win, is a joke, because at the end of the day a manager is allowed to rest players especially under the intensity of the game which was played on the Tuesday Night before the game on Sunday...
     
  8. You are just being deliberately obtuse so you don't have to disagree with anything St Rafa does.

    Answer me this...if the CL final was on the weekend following the Chelsea game would he have played the team he did against Fulham....'cause it seems to be what you are saying when you say "the best team available to him".

    He tinkers with the team far too much and the players he's bought in aren't up to it. He did it against us, we made mugs of you, he did it before the Arsenal league-cup game and they did too....that's just off the top of my head.
     
  9. getofmeland

    getofmeland Guest

    I will simplify things for you

    Liverpool 3rd Place in the league and a European Cup Final for squad rotation...

    Manchester United top of the league, FA Cup Final and European Cup Semi Final using Squad Rotation

    Chelsea Second in the League, League Cup, FA Cup Final and European Cup Semi Final using squad rotation

    Everton 6th in the League no chance of silverware not using squad rotation

    ???

    To your Question, I believe he would of played his best available squad.. Your trying to compare an irrelevant League Fixture to a Champions League Final, there is no Comparison from a Liverpool Perspective...

    This whole Arguement is based on your hate for Liverpool, it is so clear and obvious...
     
  10. loratadine

    loratadine Guest

    im sorry but charlie is right!!

    managers have to do whats best for the club and thats it!! they dont have any obligation or duty to other sides

    im sorry but the sides they feilded were hardly **** were they... so f***ing what a few of the big guns were rested!! its been along season, and unlike everton players from united in liverpool have been playing in europe, and in uniteds case advanced to the final of the fa cup.

    as i said, if everton had milan in little over a week, im sure you would be estatic if moyes named his full side and arteta or cahill or johnson got injured!!
     
  11. So basically you have just conceded that liverpool are treating these game as an irrelevance...that was my point in the beginning of this whole debate. If you think it's right that's another matter but Warnock has every right to criticise the policy because to the clubs down there it's not irrelevant.

    My whole argument is based around defending a decent manager working for a decent honest club. Manager who you lot are arrogantly besmirching for being vocal but not managing a top four club.

    SB
     
  12. shiznit

    shiznit Guest

    i agree with stuey to a degree. ideally it really should be the best team available. but with the tightness of the schedule you really have to prioritise. its sad for the blades because both the fulham V liverpool game and Utd V hammers game had a big effect on there drop.

    maybe they could look at having a couple of weeks break between the last league game and then have a finals week. with the FA Cup Final & UEFA Cup final midweek and then as the finale of 'cup week' you have the CL final on the weekend.
     
  13. getofmeland

    getofmeland Guest

    I respect a lot of managers but Warnock is not one of those, for the main reason he sticks his nose into other clubs business, if he was to concentrate on his own club then maybe they wouldn't of been relegated...

    And I actually said the game in the premiership was irrelevant to Liverpool in the other thread, because it was for position more than anything, we needed to rest players, so Benitez picked the side HE considered the best to do the job and get a win... and for a third string side as you refered to it, they didn't do too bad to lose only 1 nil and also had a lot of decisions go against our side, but we didn't complain over it...

    You have a serious problem with top 4 clubs...

    As Sir Alex Said at the start of the game against West Ham "I have picked the side which I believe will win the game" and that is the same with every manager...

    Manchester United never put a bad side out against West Ham, and Liverpool Put out the best side available under the circumstances...
     
  14. shiznit

    shiznit Guest

    sure it wasnt as bad as the side they put out against chelsea but it wasnt there best. the player of the season on the bench??
     
  15. But you've already agreed that if it was the crunch game that weekend (Ie the CL final) he'd have played his first choice.

    We've established that...he was writing off those games. The lads I know who troop up and down the country to away games and the lads who trooped up from London (twice) to see the Carling Cup debacle against Arsenal aren't happy with it. It's just a matter of establishing whether you are comfortable with it or not.

    What's that grinding, rumbling noise? Oh, it's Shankly and Paisley turning in their graves.

    Basically you've got to play the game straight......when you don't you can't get all pouty if people aim a few brickbats your way (which is basically the reason this whole debate started.
     
  16. getofmeland

    getofmeland Guest

    I didn't say it was their best, I said it was the side Sir Alex thought could win the game...

    OMG I am defending Manchester United to fight my arguement...
     
  17. Oh I haven't even started with Sir Alex yet.........


    .....Actually Chris, my mate's brother, is a steward at Goodison and was doing crowd control for the visitors bus after their dramatic 4-2 win the other week. As Sir Alex and Carrick, the last in the group, got on the coach Chris mumbled "Safe journey" in friendly though thoroughly despondent tones (given the result). Sir Alex waved Carrick onto the bus and then walked back to chat to Chris and commiserate. Seemed a really nice bloke he said.
     
  18. getofmeland

    getofmeland Guest

    So what your basically saying stuey, you rather increase the chances of one of your key players gain an injury??

    The simplicity of it, you can't compete in 4 comps over a season with just a squad of 15, to even consider it is ridiculous...

    You are jealous of the Top 4 clubs in country and you won't admit it...
     
  19. Yes you've said the jealousy line several times now....You'll note I didn't start a thread on it when Benitez's rejects lost to Portsmouth. Just when you started dispensing jibes to a decent manager for doing nothing in particular out of the ordinary.

    My point in this whole thing is that for the integrity of the league you should always put your best possible team out to win every game....not just the ones that matter. You conceded that liverpool didn't do this....I can't believe you are wasting time argueing about it.

    SB
     
  20. getofmeland

    getofmeland Guest

    Actually I never started it the jibes on a "decent" manager... I continued them with my opinion... In MY opinion Neil Warnock is a gobshite, he is always concerned what other clubs have done, more so than his own... If he was to concentrate on his club maybe they would of stayed up... he kicked off the whole Tevez thing about legal action should be taken... Now I am not saying it was correct how it was dealt with but at the end of the day an Independent Commision dealt with it and they made the ruling so that should be the end of it... if you have a problem you complain to the Premier League, no need to go to the media and stir scandel, he tried to use the media as an Allies but majority of the time it has backfired on him, he is one of the most hated managers in the league, for his constant outbursts... He may be a decent bloke but he doesn't help himself one bit...
     
  21. Ah so after all that too-ing and fro-ing we reach consensus...now you see my original point is that these Warnock outbursts are no different from the way Ferguson, Mourinho, Bentiez and Wenger do there business....with the possible exception that Warnock has to do most of his in the post match interviews because he doesn't have the the luxury of a packed media room to talk to every Friday. That is a big difference in modern football...perhaps naturally the big clubs get 90% of the coverage, managers hold their Friday press conferences to rooms packed with national newspapers, radio stations and 24 hour news channels. They use this to their advantage and indulge in pontificating about referees and these clever "mind games" that everyone loves so much. The likes of Warnock, Jewell, Redknapp, Coppell, Moyes, Hughes etc have the local newspaper and not a lot else so if they are to be heard they have make a big controversial post match splash.

    Warnock's cheeky & bolshy but I think he did it with grace and humour. I do genuinely think this is a top four issue. It does seem like fans of the clubs that are never out of the news are saying "Who does he think he is" 'cause he joins in the banter.

    As for stirring scandal can you blame them when there's £40,000,000 riding on staying in the Premiership and the board given responsibility for investigating the eligibility of West Ham's key player come out with stuff like :

    "This was not only an obvious and deliberate breach of the rules, but a grave breach of trust as to the Premier League and its constituent members. In our finding the club has been responsible for dishonesty and deceit".

    "a deduction of points would normally follow from such a breach of rules".

    "docking points would "not be proportionate".


    but gave reasons for the fine such as :

    A points deduction so late in the season might have consigned the club to relegation

    The players and fans of West Ham are in no way to blame for the situation and therefore should not suffer


    I'd be apoplectic if I were associated with a club down in that dogfight. Even the way it was done...they announced that the club was basically in the clear two days before a crunch six-pointer against Wigan. How much of a boost must that have been.
     
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