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Drop Goal

dc24

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Is anyone else concerned the RWC will be filled with drop goals rather than tries?
Will teams such as SA or England put forth a worthy effort to come away with tries rather than just taking shots at goal?

As great as rugby is, I've always been bothered by the drop goal and the fact that it is worth 3 points at the highest level.
It is far too automatic, especially compared to amateur or club level rugby.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drop_goal#Points_value_of_a_drop_goal
Points value of a drop goal
From time to time suggestions have been made in some quarters of the international rugby community that the number of points for a drop goal should be reduced, or drop goals should be limited or discouraged in other ways. These suggestions have often come from New Zealand and Australia where the use of the drop goal is not so common.

Would the possibility of change increase dramatically if there were an excessive amount of drop goals this year?
 

JW.

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The WC is about winning games, how you win them doesn't matter, boring or with flare.
 

sigesige00

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From 3 to 2

Is anyone else concerned the RWC will be filled with drop goals rather than tries?
Will teams such as SA or England put forth a worthy effort to come away with tries rather than just taking shots at goal?

As great as rugby is, I've always been bothered by the drop goal and the fact that it is worth 3 points at the highest level.
It is far too automatic, especially compared to amateur or club level rugby.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drop_goal#Points_value_of_a_drop_goal
Points value of a drop goal
From time to time suggestions have been made in some quarters of the international rugby community that the number of points for a drop goal should be reduced, or drop goals should be limited or discouraged in other ways. These suggestions have often come from New Zealand and Australia where the use of the drop goal is not so common.

Would the possibility of change increase dramatically if there were an excessive amount of drop goals this year?

Reducing the points of DG from 3 to 2 would be considered.
 

LittleGuy

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This issue always arises come the world cup time. I have no problem whatsoever with the drop goal usage or value, I always find it strange that people complain about the drop goal over the penalty kick at goal, the drop goal which occurs in open play and is much more difficult then a penalty and is often a dramatic conclusion to a match. I wouldn't change any of the point values in rugby union. In league the drop goal(or field goal if you prefer) is almost never used since it is only worth one point. How often have we really seen them used to excess anyway, even the five in a match in 1999 at the RWC only resulted in 15 points for South Africa, barely over two converted tries.
 
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TRF_Ezequiel

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The 5 dropgoals were in 1999 if I'm correct... Jannie de Beer was responsible. I think that the number of points given for a successful penalty should be reduced, not the dropgoal
 

LittleGuy

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The 5 dropgoals were in 1999 if I'm correct... Jannie de Beer was responsible. I think that the number of points given for a successful penalty should be reduced, not the dropgoal

Yeah I quickly remebered it was 1999, because Jannie De Beer tried the same thing in the next game and it backfired, so the strategy may or may not work anyway. What about changing the try to 6 points and the conversion to one ala Gridiron football(I don't endorse this just throwing it out there)
 

Sam Owen

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The 5 dropgoals were in 1999 if I'm correct... Jannie de Beer was responsible. I think that the number of points given for a successful penalty should be reduced, not the dropgoal

Not a bad idea Eze on the reduction of the penalty shot at goal. I remember that game too, de Beer was on fire. Just imagine if de Beer always did that, it'll be hard to stop.

On the subject, I dont think they should take away the drop goal, reduce its worth or do anything to it. Rugby came from Soccer so its a way of the sport keeping in touch with its roots I guess.

The way I see it is on the day, if two teams are fairly equal in the Rugby and this is reflected in the score, both teams still need to play the Rugby to give their drop kicker a fair range to take that shot.
 
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TRF_Olyy

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I think everything should be left as it is, if teams take a dropgoal then fairplay, they've gotten in to the position to do it, why not do it?
 

ranger

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I think everything should be left as it is, if teams take a dropgoal then fairplay, they've gotten in to the position to do it, why not do it?

I think there may be a problem later on with more and more of these South African freaks being able to nail drop goals from their own half. If a fullback catches a clearing kick on the halfway and then slots a dropgoal, he hasn't really gotten himself into a position to do it..
On one hand its a bit harsh on these athletes who have developed the ability to pull it off, but really collecting points through kicks shouldn't be the aim of the game. When you play rugby, the goal is to get into the other teams tryline. Winning a game without doing that is just off imo. Its like winning a quidditch game without catching the snitch..
I just think that dropgoals should be difference makers. Used to push a deficit just out of reach or breaking a tie game in the dying minute, not as a major point accumulator.

The best proposition i have heard is not changing the value of the dg, but just the result of a miss. Currently, if you miss a drop goal, the other side just has to kick it back to you anyway. Theres no risk whatsoever. If the rules were changed to an opposition scrum where you kicked it on a miss, then people would only attempt it when the really needed it, and they wouldnt be firing ridiculous half field shots. It would also make a landed dropgoal all the more special.
 

Teh Mite

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Not a bad idea (about the scrums).

Reduce the value of penalties and players will cheat more as the punishment isn't a deterrent. Unless yellow cards become more prevalent.

I'm sure John O'Neill will have a ***** and a moan to have the laws changed again once Australia are dumped out in the 1/4s.
 
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TRF_Ezequiel

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Ehm,

The goal of sports is winning. If you win scoring 8 dropgoals and your opponent scores 3 converted tries, you win 24-21. A win is a win, easy as that. We can argue all day about this, but in the end we are talking about the difference between winning and playing attractive rugby. If the 2 culminate, it means we have a fantastic display of the sport we all cherish. I don't mind South Africa winning with only dropgoals and penalties. I don't like the fact we failed to cross the tryline, but in the end we celebrate a win, not the number of tries.

If the All Blacks would win the way the Springboks did yesterday (or Schotland last november against the Boks) I am pretty sure nobody would mind.
 

TRF_Olyy

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I could get behind the scrum thing as well - good idea!
 

Thingimubob

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Personally I've always liked drop-goals, used to annoy my mate and kick a couple every time we played rugby 06/08 :p it's the easiest form of points in the game, but still takes a fair bit of skill and general rugby from the whole team to pull off. If it doesnt look like a try is gonna be scored, I don't really have a problem with them deciding to slot a drop goal, just keeps the points ticking over which is very very useful. Watched the highlights of the Sharks vs someone (Western Province maybe?) from a recent Currie Cup match, Michalak took the right option is horrible conditions to slot 3 drop goals (as well as a few penalties) which eventually got them the win.
Agree about the scrum rule though, if you miss a 50m drop goal should be changed to so it'll be a scrum back from where it was kicked, as it is with regular kicks.
 

TRF_stormer2010

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I think there may be a problem later on with more and more of these South African freaks being able to nail drop goals from their own half. If a fullback catches a clearing kick on the halfway and then slots a dropgoal, he hasn't really gotten himself into a position to do it..
On one hand its a bit harsh on these athletes who have developed the ability to pull it off, but really collecting points through kicks shouldn't be the aim of the game. When you play rugby, the goal is to get into the other teams tryline. Winning a game without doing that is just off imo. Its like winning a quidditch game without catching the snitch..
I just think that dropgoals should be difference makers. Used to push a deficit just out of reach or breaking a tie game in the dying minute, not as a major point accumulator.

The best proposition i have heard is not changing the value of the dg, but just the result of a miss. Currently, if you miss a drop goal, the other side just has to kick it back to you anyway. Theres no risk whatsoever. If the rules were changed to an opposition scrum where you kicked it on a miss, then people would only attempt it when the really needed it, and they wouldnt be firing ridiculous half field shots. It would also make a landed dropgoal all the more special.

LOL, one could just as easily say that it's unfair with these Kiwi freaks who can break tackles (and score tries) and seem to want to run the ball from anywhere more and more.
 

TRF_stormer2010

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Ehm,

The goal of sports is winning. If you win scoring 8 dropgoals and your opponent scores 3 converted tries, you win 24-21. A win is a win, easy as that. We can argue all day about this, but in the end we are talking about the difference between winning and playing attractive rugby. If the 2 culminate, it means we have a fantastic display of the sport we all cherish. I don't mind South Africa winning with only dropgoals and penalties. I don't like the fact we failed to cross the tryline, but in the end we celebrate a win, not the number of tries.

If the All Blacks would win the way the Springboks did yesterday (or Schotland last november against the Boks) I am pretty sure nobody would mind.

True, there would be songs and hymns about how much guts and determination they showed along with heeps of resourcefulness to dig it out the hard way.

I can't see why people can't appreciate the fact that there are more than one way to skin a cat.
 

JW.

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I agree it's a skill to play like that, the AB's couldn't do it. You haven't got to play attractive rugby just for the heck of it you have to play a gamestyle that suits you. And which wins you games.
 

SelimNiai

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Drop Goals are such an important part of the game, Joel Stranksy, Jeremy Guscott, Wilkinson and myself will all say that kicking a drop goal to win a game in the final seconds is a fantastic feeling. As pointed out if you wanted to win by drop goals, so what?
 

TRF C A Iversen

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I'm a kiwi and I love them. They are a real skill. If they weren't why are we here in New Zealand so completely average at them?

I've nailed one in real life and it feels better than a try. In some situations, much harder to do skills-wise.
 

big ginger 8

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I think they're fine can lead to incredibly dramatic situations. E.g. my favourite moment from watching rugby was RO'G's drop goal with a "Grand Slam at stake".
 

TRF_Ezequiel

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Johan Goosen scored a massive dropgoal over the weekend. Will upload it later...
 

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