Further S14 expansion

Discussion in 'Super Rugby' started by sanzar, Mar 13, 2008.

  1. sanzar

    sanzar Guest



    Thoughts?
     
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  3. BLR

    BLR Guest

    O'Neill is a tosser...that's my only thought....not going to solve a thing in Australian rugby....plus the other SANZAR nations won't go for it, they have domestic competitions, unlike us...
     
  4. sanzar

    sanzar Guest

    O'Neil is a pretty smart businessman though and he knows what the broadcasters want, and ultimately that's what matters because that's where the money comes from.
     
  5. BLR

    BLR Guest

    Or maybe the Saffas will just go north like they threatened to do last year I think it was...broadcasters mean everything for Super 14, but who is to say the SANZAR union will continue after the end of the current broadcast...O'Neill crusading without consulting the other unions certainly won't help...
     
  6. sanzar

    sanzar Guest

    Or maybe the Saffas will just go north like they threatened to do last year I think it was...broadcasters mean everything for Super 14, but who is to say the SANZAR union will continue after the end of the current broadcast...O'Neill crusading without consulting the other unions certainly won't help... [/b][/quote]

    Don't think it mentioned O'Neil "crusading without consulting the other unions" anywhere... It sounded to me like this was very much a joint thing and I doubt he'd be making the move if he didn't think it had a chance of success. As for the Saffers, well they're like north korea and the bomb - they always threaten, but only to get attention. The SANZAR agreement's involement with NZ rugby and its assured tests against the All Blacks are invaluable to SA rugby, and they'd never give that up for a move north.

    Personally I would like to see a national competition be restarted... but they've seriously got to do something about the team names (I mean seriously, Sydney "Fleet", Melbourne "Rebels"?!? That's almost as bad as Perth "Glory" or Queensland "Roar").
     
  7. Juggernaut

    Juggernaut Guest

    Well I think O'Neill is a c**t. Pushing brilliant ideas forward as long as it benefits Australia. What ever happened to the idea of helping the Islanders out??

    and plus, like what BLR said....extending the season will ruin the domestic comp. Fans will not be able to watch star players play NPC because of burnout from the long super season, midweek tests against NH teams & then the Tri-Nations...after which, most will be rested to prepare for the EOYT.

    Very dumb idea.

    **** off O'Neill.
     
  8. Fushitsusha

    Fushitsusha Guest

    http://news.rugbyheaven.com.au/nz-cool-on-...80313-1z46.html

    NZ cool on Super 14 expansion plans

    The New Zealand Rugby Union (NZRU) has dampened suggestions the Super 14 competition could be expanded to two rounds and include a team based in Japan, according to media reports on Thursday.

    Australian Rugby Union (ARU) Chief Executive John O'Neill had suggested the new competition run from February until August and would be split into two rounds - the first a round robin format before the second split into locally based competitions.

    "We're trying to expand Super rugby to 26 weeks. And the possibility of joint-venturing a team in Japan, with half the team Japanese and the other half foreign players - predominantly Australian - is worth a look," O'Neill told the Sydney Morning Herald.

    However, his NZRU counterpart Steve Tew said the proposals were at the preliminary stage.

    "John has floated one option that would clearly suit the Australian set of circumstances, probably better than ourselves or South Africa," Tew told the New Zealand Press Association.

    "There are any number of things we would need to consider, though, in terms of finding our position."

    Tew agreed that Japan held enormous commercial opportunities to expand the game, but stronger rugby nations in the Pacific Islands and Argentina also needed to be considered.

    "There needs to be a more strategic look at how Super rugby might unfold," he added.

    "We wouldn't dismiss John's thoughts out of hand .... we see the gateway to Asia as being important."



    JON should really be focusing on trying to start up an Australian rugby comp. equivelent to the A-League.
     
  9. BLR

    BLR Guest

    1. Why would it, the media pushed the hardest out of everyone to get O'Neill into the job, I think the fact that he constantly comes out with these grand plans every couple of days itself gives out that image...I mean, O'Neill constantly going on about the ELV's could very well be percieved in the UK as a Australian attempt to take the pressure off the Australian scrum by these new rule changes, and that is what alot of the opposition I have read from NH sources go on about...he needs to stop being this figurehead...I haven't seen him do a thing of worth since he came back besides the Hong Kong test, and even then I am not decided on it....

    2. Why would O'Neill do that, the clubs got him in place to scuttle the ARC and that is exactly what he did...and this new Super 14 idea keeps the clubs onside but will basically water the Super 14 down as a whole...I thought O'Neill was supposed to turn Australian Rugby around with vision that actually helped make Australian rugby strong....
     
  10. sanzar

    sanzar Guest

    1. Why would it, the media pushed the hardest out of everyone to get O'Neill into the job, I think the fact that he constantly comes out with these grand plans every couple of days itself gives out that image...I mean, O'Neill constantly going on about the ELV's could very well be percieved in the UK as a Australian attempt to take the pressure off the Australian scrum by these new rule changes, and that is what alot of the opposition I have read from NH sources go on about...he needs to stop being this figurehead...I haven't seen him do a thing of worth since he came back besides the Hong Kong test, and even then I am not decided on it....

    2. Why would O'Neill do that, the clubs got him in place to scuttle the ARC and that is exactly what he did...and this new Super 14 idea keeps the clubs onside but will basically water the Super 14 down as a whole...I thought O'Neill was supposed to turn Australian Rugby around with vision that actually helped make Australian rugby strong.... [/b][/quote]

    It sounds a bit odd that O'Neil would be brought back to "scuttle the ARC" when he was always for the creation of a national competition when he was in charge before...

    We'll wait and see what comes from these talks though, it does sound like a bit of a money making scheme, but maybe he's just trying to see how much he can get away with and hoping for a compromise half way.
     
  11. Fushitsusha

    Fushitsusha Guest

    I have an idea JON - sign more rugby league players :rolleyes:
     
  12. BLR

    BLR Guest

    Before doesn't matter, the simple fact he wishes to extend the Super 14 season without even giving an appropriate second tier competition shows that he is not quite up to defying the club system as yet...I mean, if he was really for a national competition he would have re-worked the shell of the ARC to what he would like instead of ditching the whole thing....whether that be getting rid of teams, re-organising the areas they came from....but no, he scrapped it with no real contigency plan...
     
  13. Juggernaut

    Juggernaut Guest

    If O'Neill is really serious about helping Aussie rugby, then revive the ARC again and stick with it. Of course losses will be incurred but they have to look at the bigger picture here.

    Provincial unions in NZ too are incurring losses, especially last year, but what the NZRU does is find solution....not scrap the whole tournament.
     
  14. sanzar

    sanzar Guest

    Yeah, cause League players just suck so bad at union. That Ryan Cross bloke has been bloody hopeless since he went over :rolleyes: .

    Seriously, O'Neil was instrumental in the whole Sailor thing, and while he didn't live up to expectations the publicity it got union was almost worth it alone... the guy is a business man remember.
     
  15. Fushitsusha

    Fushitsusha Guest

    Yeah, cause League players just suck so bad at union. That Ryan Cross bloke has been bloody hopeless since he went over :rolleyes: .

    Seriously, O'Neil was instrumental in the whole Sailor thing, and while he didn't live up to expectations the publicity it got union was almost worth it alone... the guy is a business man remember.
    [/b][/quote]

    You'd rather throw large amounts of money at failed league converts rather than developing any real genuine rugby talent?

    Sailor, Tuqiri and Rogers are all rugby failures in my opinion.

    Tuqiri played well between 2003 - 2004 and since then has been wasting the position that should be held by another player simply due to his profile.

    JON is as much to blame for the failure of the Wallbies in recent years.

    As for Ryan Cross - he's representative rugby before and obviously was genuinely interested in returning to rugby union. They certainly didn't have to pull out the big bucks to lure him over.
     
  16. sanzar

    sanzar Guest

    Yeah, cause League players just suck so bad at union. That Ryan Cross bloke has been bloody hopeless since he went over :rolleyes: .

    Seriously, O'Neil was instrumental in the whole Sailor thing, and while he didn't live up to expectations the publicity it got union was almost worth it alone... the guy is a business man remember.
    [/b][/quote]
    Cross is just a class player. He
    You'd rather throw large amounts of money at failed league converts rather than developing any real genuine rugby talent?

    Sailor, Tuqiri and Rogers are all rugby failures in my opinion.

    Tuqiri played well between 2003 - 2004 and since then has been wasting the position that should be held by another player simply due to his profile.

    JON is as much to blame for the failure of the Wallbies in recent years.

    As for Ryan Cross - he's representative rugby before and obviously was genuinely interested in returning to rugby union. They certainly didn't have to pull out the big bucks to lure him over. [/b][/quote]

    Not quite. Cross came to Union because the Roosters f***ed him over and basically gave him the cold shoulder.

    As for the others, well Rogers, considering he wasn't exactly a superstar in League was massively successful by comparison when he went to union and was a fantastic strike player for the wallabies when brought off the bench (he had far more impact for the wallabies than he ever did for Qld in Origin if you ask me). The problem was that they just tried to overuse someone who was essentially always a utility player.

    Sailor I won't argue with, but Tuqiri wasn't just good between 2003 to 2005 (he had a brilliant season in 05 too) he was fantastic, to the point where people were claiming he was one of the best wingers in the world. His for over the last 2 seasons has been dissapointing, but I don't think he's really been "bad" either.

    As for developing their own talent - well of course they should, but with the ARU currently in somewhat of a financial crisis and the abonment of the ARC, the number of high level professional players isn't about to increase any time soon. The fact remains that the NRL has a much larger body of high level professionals than rugby can currently even imagine, so until they manage to work out a system that gets a proper national competition started Rugby League players will be targeted. Personally I'd love to see how Greg Inglis would go in Union, cause that kid is just a f***ing machine!
     
  17. Steve-o

    Steve-o Guest

    This dude is seriously reaching out. Absolutely crazy idea. NZ and SA will suspend the talks indefinitely.

    Super 14 is great but it's not our life.

    6 months long?! Bah, bahahaha! Players are already suffer from burn out nowdays. And what about the end of year tours to the NH? And NH summer tours down south? Don't think he thought about the Curri Cup either.

    Never gonna happen. The proposed plan will disrupt everything.

    The situation in Oz seems to be getting desperate. Atleast he is actively trying to solve the problem I guess. But not this way.

    I also think however that we should support AUS in their time of need, by going out on limb to help and considering some of these plans (and in this case, tolerate them).
     
  18. sanzar

    sanzar Guest

    Yeah agreed. And in all honesty I don't think he thinks it'll happen, but that's they way negotiations work I guess, you bid for as much as you think you can possibly get, but most of the time you're pretty happy if you get only 10% of what you asked for.
    I also think his suggestion that we make the UK tour games 'mid week' affairs, was a swipe at the home unions for sending under strength teams all the time. Sp therefore he's almost threatening to make them into non-events completely unless they don't start treating them more seriously and send their best teams.
     
  19. Dmx#1

    Dmx#1 Guest

    6 months?!! This is rugby not bloody NBA basketball! O Neill can get f***ed!
     
  20. yeah this seems to be heavly australian point of view - obviously. south africa and new zealand have very strong provintal competetions, and have stronger rivalrys in npc level than super level. yes it is a good idea to play more matches and more teams, but this seems a bit rediculas. bring in japan. bring in some islanders and bring in some pumas and shake them all about - and find a way to have a realistic way of getting a competition that wont burn out players or overlap with provintal and international competitions.

    i can see where hes coming from though - in australia - you have nrl and afl playing each team twice and going through a large chunk of the year. but unlike these sports, union has a larger amount of internatioal games and provintial. good idea - but very hard to make realistic for all partys involved.
     
  21. BLR

    BLR Guest

    It's not an Australian point of view, if anything it is a New South Wales point of view, as they have thier clubs who don't want a second tier competition unlike the rest of the Australian community. (speaking generally)

    I think you will find alot of Australians think it will be an alright idea ONLY if we get the second tier competition first...
     
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