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European Champions & Challenge Cup
Heineken Cup 1/4F - Toulon v Leinster
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<blockquote data-quote="Big Ewis" data-source="post: 635308" data-attributes="member: 57076"><p>that much does seem very true...</p><p></p><p>However I disagree with what you're saying as a whole, although most of the separate things you say are true.</p><p>The FFR is accusing the clubs of things, and the clubs are accusing the FFR of things. In reality for a neutral, they're BOTH doing wrong to each other. But neither side will look at it this way and wants the entire cake, who ever wanted to share in this world of men, just look at Israel and the Palestinians as the most intense example.</p><p></p><p>They're both playing the ostrich game, it's an absolute cacophony from a logical perspective, and you can't work with someone if he doesn't want to work with you. You can force him though, but we're sitting back and watching what that's accomplishing - clubs are just ignoring the deals...</p><p></p><p>Of of the aspects of clubs - the main one in fact back in the day - is to train guys, make them into elite national products so they can go compete for their nation on the highest stage there is.</p><p>But now that the Top 14 has turned into an industry, and every league in the world (all sports included) either has been that way for long or is following suit - it's all about winning. And to win, injecting talent sure helps. And you said it yourself, even the ProD2 has a bunch of internationals now, because that reality has steamrolled all over the nation.</p><p></p><p>There are no two ways about it. What do you want, French Rugby ? Because you can't have both. Do you want success at the top at national test level, or do you want the Top 14 ? Because the truth is the Top 14 has become too big, too much. Just look at Toulouse, Clermont, Toulon, Montpellier, SF, Racing etc...they've become ***ans.</p><p></p><p> The Top 14 is so huge it's attracting more and more internationals (from Top Tier 1 circles) to drop their own league, abandon their country or hopes to play internationally themselves ever again for England, NZ, Australia, SA...etc...and come to France and compete there. The Bouclier de Brennus and H Cup have become a very relic in world Rugby right now. Wilkinson and Andrew Sheridan have said many times they didn't want to go back to play for England or the Lions Tour or wtvr because they wanted to focus full time on Toulon Rugby. On that Top 14 ***le.</p><p></p><p>It's become so big it's leaving no room for French national rugby. Just the natural laws of space management. It's eating up the XV de France.</p><p></p><p><strong>Now I repeat the question:</strong> </p><p>what do you want, French Rugby: the current Top 14 or the XV de France and 6N Grand Slams and World Cup finals etc...? Coz you can't have both.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Big Ewis, post: 635308, member: 57076"] that much does seem very true... However I disagree with what you're saying as a whole, although most of the separate things you say are true. The FFR is accusing the clubs of things, and the clubs are accusing the FFR of things. In reality for a neutral, they're BOTH doing wrong to each other. But neither side will look at it this way and wants the entire cake, who ever wanted to share in this world of men, just look at Israel and the Palestinians as the most intense example. They're both playing the ostrich game, it's an absolute cacophony from a logical perspective, and you can't work with someone if he doesn't want to work with you. You can force him though, but we're sitting back and watching what that's accomplishing - clubs are just ignoring the deals... Of of the aspects of clubs - the main one in fact back in the day - is to train guys, make them into elite national products so they can go compete for their nation on the highest stage there is. But now that the Top 14 has turned into an industry, and every league in the world (all sports included) either has been that way for long or is following suit - it's all about winning. And to win, injecting talent sure helps. And you said it yourself, even the ProD2 has a bunch of internationals now, because that reality has steamrolled all over the nation. There are no two ways about it. What do you want, French Rugby ? Because you can't have both. Do you want success at the top at national test level, or do you want the Top 14 ? Because the truth is the Top 14 has become too big, too much. Just look at Toulouse, Clermont, Toulon, Montpellier, SF, Racing etc...they've become ***ans. The Top 14 is so huge it's attracting more and more internationals (from Top Tier 1 circles) to drop their own league, abandon their country or hopes to play internationally themselves ever again for England, NZ, Australia, SA...etc...and come to France and compete there. The Bouclier de Brennus and H Cup have become a very relic in world Rugby right now. Wilkinson and Andrew Sheridan have said many times they didn't want to go back to play for England or the Lions Tour or wtvr because they wanted to focus full time on Toulon Rugby. On that Top 14 ***le. It's become so big it's leaving no room for French national rugby. Just the natural laws of space management. It's eating up the XV de France. [B]Now I repeat the question:[/B] what do you want, French Rugby: the current Top 14 or the XV de France and 6N Grand Slams and World Cup finals etc...? Coz you can't have both. [/QUOTE]
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