International teams tiers

Discussion in 'Rugby World Cup 2015' started by Petrichor, Nov 2, 2015.

  1. Petrichor

    Petrichor Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2015
    Messages:
    1
    Country Flag:

    Australia

    Club or Nation:

    Waratahs

    Hi guys! Been reading this forum since the start of the RWC, really interesting discussions and such so decided to join! Congrats to NZ for winning the final.

    One thing I've seen so much of this world cup is talk about the different 'tiers' in rugby. Obviously, they're just a guideline, but the line between the tiers is becoming increasingly blurred. I was curious as to how you guys rank the different teams. Obviously there is the world rankings, and these are generally accurate, but I thought this might be fun. Basically, you job is to rank all the teams at the RWC from 1 to 20. After a lot of people have ranked, I'll rank the teams by giving 20 pts to the no.1 pick, 19 to no.2 etc down to no.20. We can then divide the teams into different tiers depending on the differences in the points.
    So without further ado!

    1. New Zealand
    2. Australia
    3. South Africa
    4. Argentina
    5. Wales
    6. Ireland
    7. England
    8. France
    9. Scotland
    10. Japan
    11. Fiji
    12. Italy
    13. Georgia
    14. Samoa
    15. Tonga
    16. Romania
    17. USA
    18. Canada
    19. Namibia
    20. Uruguay
     
  2. Forum Ad Advertisement

  3. PacDuran

    PacDuran Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2015
    Messages:
    335
    Country Flag:

    Ireland

    Club or Nation:

    Leinster

    Looks about right. Ireland have the potential to be higher but we are chokers. On top of that we have average skills and no depth so we get blown away when we get a few injuries to key players.
     
  4. Tigs Man

    Tigs Man Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2013
    Messages:
    16,405
    Location:
    LimerDick
    Country Flag:

    Puerto Rico

    Club or Nation:

    Wigan

    For me based on the RWC:

    1) New Zealand
    2) Aus
    3) SA
    4) Arg
    5) Ireland
    6) Wales
    7) Scotland
    8) England
    9) France
    10) Japan
    11) Fiji
    12) Georgia
    13) Samoa
    14) Italy
    15) Tonga
    16) Canada
    17) Romania
    18) USA
    19) Nambia
    20) Uruguay

    Eng, France and Japan could all be rotated.
     
  5. Josht36

    Josht36 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2014
    Messages:
    49
    Country Flag:

    England

    Club or Nation:

    Bath

    I always think it is crazy how much public perception changes on the back of one or two close results.
    England were only a score or so from winning the six nations. They were the better team against Wales for a significant period but then threw it away on the back of a couple of poor decisions.
    Scotland got the wooden spoon in the six nations. They crept through a relatively easy group by just beating Samoa and then should have beaten Australia on the back of two intercept tries. They have always been capable of a good one off result and definitely have the squad to improve over the next few years. However the swing in optimism for these two countries has been vast between six nations and now.
    Similarly, Ireland had an awful start against Argentina without possibly their 3 best players. They pulled it back to stage where I thought they might well win the game but then didn't quite have the composure and let it slip at the end. Suddenly Argentina are on another level to all the six nations teams.
    I find it a little amusing just how much we all jump on the bandwagon. In reality I think Wales, England, Ireland, Argentina are very close and can all beat each other on their day. Scotland have the squad to be in that group but need to show a bit more consistency over the next few six nations/years. I would go:

    1) New Zealand
    2) Aus
    3) SA
    4) =Arg, Ireland, Wales, England
    8) France
    9) Scotland
    10) Fiji
    11) Japan
    12) Georgia
    13) Samoa
    14) Italy
    15) Tonga
    16) Romania
    17) Canada
    18) Namibia
    19) USA
    20) Uruguay
     
  6. FNS

    FNS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2015
    Messages:
    550
    Country Flag:

    Argentina

    Agree Arg is not a level up but at the same levels of WA,ENG,IRE.
     
  7. chippieolamus

    chippieolamus Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    621
    Country Flag:

    England

    Club or Nation:

    Saracens

    Spot on, although I'd probably say England and Wales are slightly below Ireland and Argentina.
     
  8. Kiwi_

    Kiwi_ BANNED!!!

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Messages:
    1,569
    Location:
    Queenstown, Otago, NZ
    Country Flag:

    New Zealand

    Club or Nation:

    Highlanders

    Scotland and France are above England.
     
  9. ncurd

    ncurd Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2015
    Messages:
    6,319
    Location:
    Gloucestershire
    Country Flag:

    England

    Club or Nation:

    Bath

    Fair enough we've not played Argentina in 2 years but considering the last time they beat us was 6 years ago during a lions tour and at home 2006 against a weakened side. It's going to take a lot more than a decent world cup run where they beat a severely depleted Ireland side (who almost clawed their way back in after a dismal 20 mins) and lost against all three SH sides to tell me they definitely in a better place than England.

    Think Josht36 has got it right at the top end but maybe mid-table wrong a little harsh on Italy who didn't come bottom in the 6 nations and only proved they were worse than France/Ireland but better than Romainia/Canada. Fiji also extraordinarily high considering they never really challenged any of the top teams in their group.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Based on what? Beat both teams this year comfortably Scotland ran Aus closer but had nothing to lose and Aus already had three tough games.
     
  10. chippieolamus

    chippieolamus Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    621
    Country Flag:

    England

    Club or Nation:

    Saracens

  11. smartcooky

    smartcooky Referee Coach and Advisor

    Joined:
    May 25, 2007
    Messages:
    5,688
    Country Flag:

    New Zealand

    Club or Nation:

    Tasman

    And the world ranking POINTS certainly reflect that...

    [TABLE="class: fullRankings"]
    <tbody>[TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]4[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (5)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Wales
    [/TD]
    [TD]83.49[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]5[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (4)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Argentina
    [/TD]
    [TD]82.59[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]6[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (6)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Ireland
    [/TD]
    [TD]81.17[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]7[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (7)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • France
    [/TD]
    [TD]79.77[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]8[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (8)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • England
    [/TD]
    [TD]79.77[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    </tbody>[/TABLE]

    ... less than four ranking points across all five teams.

    Its not the ranking position that indicates the prospective result of a match between two teams, it the ranking points difference. The bigger the difference, the more likely the higher ranked team will win. If you look at the top 12 ranked teams...

    [TABLE="class: fullRankings"]
    <tbody>[TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]1[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (1)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • New Zealand
    [/TD]
    [TD]96.10[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]2[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (2)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Australia
    [/TD]
    [TD]89.33[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]3[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (3)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • South Africa
    [/TD]
    [TD]87.66[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]4[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (5)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Wales
    [/TD]
    [TD]83.49[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]5[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (4)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Argentina
    [/TD]
    [TD]82.59[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]6[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (6)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Ireland
    [/TD]
    [TD]81.17[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]7[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (7)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • France
    [/TD]
    [TD]79.77[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]8[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (8)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • England
    [/TD]
    [TD]79.77[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]9[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (9)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Scotland
    [/TD]
    [TD]77.94[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]10[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (10)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Japan
    [/TD]
    [TD]77.05[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]11[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (11)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Fiji
    [/TD]
    [TD]76.96[/TD]
    [TD="class: detailsCol"][/TD]
    [TD="class: addToFavourite"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: firstColumn"]12[/TD]
    [TD]
    • (12)
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    • Italy
    [/TD]
    [TD]72.74[/TD]
    [/TR]
    </tbody>[/TABLE]

    ...of all the matches between the teams in this list (I'm guessing about 15 - 20), only one match I can think of bucked the trend of higher ranked teams beating lower ranked teams - Japan's win over South Africa.
     
  12. valley commando

    valley commando BANNED!!!

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2015
    Messages:
    1,277
    Location:
    England
    Country Flag:

    Wales

    Club or Nation:

    Pontypridd

    1. New Zealand
    2. Wales
    3. Australia
    4. South Africa
    5 Argentina
    6 Japan
    7 Ireland
    8 France
    9 England.
    10 Fiji
    11 Georgia
    12 Samoa
    13 Scotland
    14 Italy
    15 Romania
    16 Tonga
    17 Canada
    18 USA
    19 Namibia
    20 Uraguay

    Wales are 2nd not because I'm Welsh but with a full compliment of fit players I honestly think only the All Blacks are better. Japan are the unluckiest team at the WC, winning 3 games and not qualifying, it was a travesty that they had only 4 days between their Bok victory and Scotland, I reckon given a couple of 3 days extra they could have turned Scotland over as well.
    Scotland are at 13 for a few reasons, if there was relegation in the 6 Nations they'd have been replaced by Georgia is one reason another is Hogg I can't forget his cheating against the Boks and don't think any team should ever be penalised for late tackling him, in fact as I have said before teams that don't repeatedly late tackle him should receive a points deduction.
     
  13. Tallshort

    Tallshort Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2011
    Messages:
    5,108
    Location:
    Coalville
    Country Flag:

    Poland

    Club or Nation:

    Leicester

    :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
     
    • Like Like x 1
  14. Josht36

    Josht36 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2014
    Messages:
    49
    Country Flag:

    England

    Club or Nation:

    Bath

    You seem quite bias. Wales were full strength in the six nations and a depleted England turned them over quite easily. Wales haven't beaten Australia in years and years and have only managed one home win against south Africa in n recent memory. How you can put them second with a straight face is beyond me.
     
  15. chippieolamus

    chippieolamus Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    621
    Country Flag:

    England

    Club or Nation:

    Saracens

    Oh vc, you never fail to give me a laugh. As if Wales are worse than NZ!
     
  16. The Alpha Bro

    The Alpha Bro Fat Boi

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2010
    Messages:
    10,979
    Location:
    DubWIN
    Country Flag:

    Ireland

    Club or Nation:

    Leinster

    If you delve deeper there are even more reasons to laugh!!!!! :D

    1. Japan are better than Ireland because they could have beat Scotland with three more days rest.
    2. While there's not a hint of bias involving Wales' rank, obviously, Scotland are below both Japan and Samoa who they beat because the poster has taken a disliking towards Stuart Hogg.

    Apart from these three errors of judgement, I think it's a perfectly reasonable and objective post!!! :D
     
  17. valley commando

    valley commando BANNED!!!

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2015
    Messages:
    1,277
    Location:
    England
    Country Flag:

    Wales

    Club or Nation:

    Pontypridd

    Gats was only playing with England in the 6 Nations, he did state that he wasn't bothered about the 6 Nations it was just a stepping stone to the WC, however we got dealt the worst possible hand injury wise.
    Nobody can say for sure but the odds are that without our injury list starting pre WC with JD we would have done a more convincing job on England, fair chance we'd have beaten Oz and the Boks games we lost with small margins and with 2nd, 3rd and 4th choice players in some positions. You may call it bias but if you bother to annalise we wouldn't have been far away

    - - - Updated - - -

    Anybody not taking a dislike to Hogg needs a head test.
     
  18. Tallshort

    Tallshort Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2011
    Messages:
    5,108
    Location:
    Coalville
    Country Flag:

    Poland

    Club or Nation:

    Leicester

    Thats true, horrible little man
     
  19. Josht36

    Josht36 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2014
    Messages:
    49
    Country Flag:

    England

    Club or Nation:

    Bath

    So was he only playing with Australia and South Africa the last 10 or so times as well?

    I agree you had a few injuries. However so did England in the six nations. Injuries are part of international rugby these days and more often than not its the ability of your wider squads that wins you tournaments. Australia still managed to beat Wales without pocock. Similarly I don't think 3 or 4 of south Africa's first team being out would have changed many of their results with Wales the last 10 years.
     
  20. valley commando

    valley commando BANNED!!!

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2015
    Messages:
    1,277
    Location:
    England
    Country Flag:

    Wales

    Club or Nation:

    Pontypridd

    We feel injuries a lot more than England, Oz or the Boks as we have only a fraction of the players to choose than those 3 Nations.
     
  21. ENZED-88

    ENZED-88 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2014
    Messages:
    311
    Location:
    Sydney
    Country Flag:

    New Zealand

    Club or Nation:

    Auckland

    I like this team except I would put Aus and SA as equal third. With daylight 2nd, and Wales would drop down a few spots on this list, their backline is terrible!!
     
Enjoyed this thread? Register to post your reply - click here!

Share This Page