Ireland Squad 2017/18

[Leonormous Boozer]

After the first round of interpros and heading into Europe now is as good a time as ever to start talking about the squad that's evolving into the team that will lift the William Webb Ellis in 25 months.

I don't think the starting 23 for SA is a bad place to start considering it'll be a new look side from this years 6 nations, what I'd like to see;

15. Carbery
14. Stockdale
13. Ringrose
12. Henshaw
11. Earls
10. Sexton (c)
9. Murray
8. Stander
7. SOB
6. POM
5. Henderson
4. Toner
3. Furlong
2. Scannell
1. McGrath

16. Cronin
17. Healy
18. Ryan
19. Treadwell
20. Van der Flier
21. McGrath
22. Aki (Is he available? Marshall if not)
23. Conway

I'd also want to see lads like Kilcoyne, Treacy, Bealham, Ruddock, Conan, Murphy, Marmion and RO'L get a bit of time, I don't see anyone really putting their hands up for a first cap, Wooton would be the most likely.
I wouldn't be surprised to not see Kearney, Best, Heaslip and possibly Payne ever line out in green again with better, younger and/or not injured players coming through and taking their place.
I've written this up with very little thought so tell me where I'm wrong and who I forgot and get some discussion flowing.

 

[munstermuffin]

Isn't Ringrose out until December? So maybe Scannell or Farrell wil play as Schmidt loves both. Ali will be option too. On backrow. I'm a fan of VDF but I think Ruddock and Conan will be more useful options or Leahy. Again just shows options. On back 3 Munster options. Conway has continued his fine form this year and will be deserving of his spot. Earls yesterday proved his class as he was the best winger on display by a bit despite lack of game timè and in the poorer side.
2nd row still looks our big big weakness. Like front row replacements are good enough for alot of International starting teams. 10 will be the other issue now. Obviously not Sexton but behind him

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Isn't Ringrose out until December? So maybe Scannell or Farrell wil play as Schmidt loves both. Ali will be option too. On backrow. I'm a fan of VDF but I think Ruddock and Conan will be more useful options or Leahy. Again just shows options.

Is it that long? Thought I read he'd be back for the EOYTs. I'd reunite Henshaw and Aki then. Leavy won't be available until Argentina which is why I excluded him, VdF has been easily Leinster's best performing backrow and with POM's and SOB's abilities to play 6 or 8 I think you're safe enough with his lack of versatility.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

I think this'll be the team for SA barring more injuries:

Carbery, Stockdale, Henshaw, Aki, Earls, Sexton, Murray; McGrath, Best, Furlong, Toner, Henderson, O'Mahony, O'Brien, Stander

I'd prefer to see this though:
Carbery, Stockdale, Henshaw, McCloskey, Earls, Sexton, Murray; McGrath, Scannell, Furlong, Toner, Henderson, Stander, O'Brien, Conan

Joey Carbery could start the three November tests, two at fullback and one at flyhalf. Depth at 10 is non existent with Paddy Jackson's "issues". If JJ Hanrahan takes the Munster 10 shirt, he could get a cap next month. It's Ian Keatley or Ross Byrne otherwise.

Would like to see Niall Scannell tested against tier 1 nations as a starter. We all know what Rory Best can do and if he's to make it to the World Cup, his game time needs to be managed.

This may seem like sacrilege to Munster supporters but Peter O'Mahony doesn't do it consistently enough for my liking. That's why I'd like to see Jack Conan get a shot in the backrow. O'Mahony is a superb player on his day though.

Don't like the residency rule at all but since it's there, Ireland would be crazy not to cap Bundee Aki.

Andrew Conway could easily force his way into the team. He's on a great run of form.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I think this'll be the team for SA barring more injuries:

Carbery, Stockdale, Henshaw, Aki, Earls, Sexton, Murray; McGrath, Best, Furlong, Toner, Henderson, O'Mahony, O'Brien, Stander

I'd prefer to see this though:
Carbery, Stockdale, Henshaw, McCloskey, Earls, Sexton, Murray; McGrath, Scannell, Furlong, Toner, Henderson, Stander, O'Brien, Conan

Joey Carbery could start the three November tests, two at fullback and one at flyhalf. Depth at 10 is non existent with Paddy Jackson's "issues". If JJ Hanrahan takes the Munster 10 shirt, he could get a cap next month. It's Ian Keatley or Ross Byrne otherwise.

Would like to see Niall Scannell tested against tier 1 nations as a starter. We all know what Rory Best can do and if he's to make it to the World Cup, his game time needs to be managed.

This may seem like sacrilege to Munster supporters but Peter O'Mahony doesn't do it consistently enough for my liking. That's why I'd like to see Jack Conan get a shot in the backrow. O'Mahony is a superb player on his day though.

Don't like the residency rule at all but since it's there, Ireland would be crazy not to cap Bundee Aki.

Andrew Conway could easily force his way into the team. He's on a great run of form.

Is Best not injured? And I don't like the idea of bringing a 37 year old to the world cup when at this moment we have four capped hookers who could be good enough.

I see Sexton as captain ahead of POM because I do see POM in a battle with Leavy and Conan for the starting spot sooner rather than later but Conan needs to get back to last season's form to earn it in my opinion!

 

[munstermuffin]

On Captaincy. O'Mahony is best leadership but I agree isn't 100% guaranteed so I'd keep captaincy away from any backrower. But equally no for Sexton. I think a 10 has too much on their plate never mind being captain too. It always effected ROG and even Wilkinson said similar. A 10 will lead anyways. I'd disagree with you on POM snoop but again all our opinions would have reasonable debate. On Conan. He hasn't hit form of last year and that may count against him in such a competitive area. Also should we read on to SOB playing 8 recently?
I'm still not convinced of Hen do as a lock yet either so hopefully he cements that position down.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Is Best not injured? And I don't like the idea of bringing a 37 year old to the world cup when at this moment we have four capped hookers who could be good enough.

Best is injured but due back shortly.

This summer seemed like the natural time for Rory Best to retire. Captained Ireland to first wins over the AIG Blacks and away to South Africa. Also toured with the Lions. That he hasn't retired at this point indicates to me that he's going to give it two more years to get to a World Cup. By and large, he's playing as well as ever so if he's managed correctly (like Keith Wood in the lead up to 2003), he can easily keep going.

Having said all that, I prefer Niall Scannell as a starting option and Sean Cronin as an impact sub. Scannell is fast becoming a terrific hooker and Cronin offers carrying ability unlike every other hooker available to Ireland. I don't see James Tracy as much more than a good Leinster player, Richardt Strauss and Rob Herring aren't more than provincial players at this point and nobody else is stepping up. Best, Cronin and Scannell will go to Japan barring injury.

On Conan. He hasn't hit form of last year and that may count against him in such a competitive area. Also should we read on to SOB playing 8 recently?

Jack Conan started the season exceptionally well but has been a little quiet the last couple of games in terms of ball carrying. He's worth persevering with.

Not sure if Sean O'Brien was picked as 8 with a view to playing there for Ireland or because it was the best way to get him back into the Leinster team. I'd assume it's a bit of both. Should CJ Stander be selected as Ireland's Number 8, O'Brien could be the backup option at 8 if Stander has to leave the field as I doubt Conan will be a bench option.

 

[dunney77]

We really are developing a strong team!

Just need a few positions to gain backup players (10, 4/5) over the next few years.

Think we will comfortably beat SA but i think they will be a completely different beast by the next RWC

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

We really are developing a strong team!

Just need a few positions to gain backup players (10, 4/5) over the next few years.

Think we will comfortably beat SA but i think they will be a completely different beast by the next RWC

A little depth chart because it trumps studying French Grammar;

LH Prop: McGrath, Healy, Kilcoyne, Cronin, Dooley

Hooker: Best*, Scannell, Cronin, Tracey

TH Prop: Furlong, Ryan, Bealham, Porter

Locks: Toner, Henderson, Treadwell, Dillane, Ryan, Kleyn

Blindside Flanker/Number 8 (Due to Stander probably being the best in both positions these are linked): Stander, Heaslip*, O'Mahoney, Conan, Leavy, Ruddock, O'Donoghue, Deegan

Openside Flanker: O'Brien, Van der Flier, Murphy, O'Donnell, Henry

Scrum Half: Murray, McGrath, Marmion, Cooney

Out Half: Sexton, Jackson*, Madigan*, Carbery*, Bleyendaal, Keatley, Hanrahan, Byrne

Centres: Henshaw, Ringrose, Aki, Marshall, McCloskey, Olding*, Scannell, Farrell

Wings: Earls, Stockdale, Zebo*, O'Loughlin, Ludik, Byrne, Kelleher, Wooton, Sweetnam

Fullback: Carbery*, O'Halloran, Conway, Olding*, Kearney*, Zebo*

Bold indicates I player that I believe to be in the top three in their position in the world, bold and in italics is a player I believe to be the best!

Italic denotes an uncapped player

A * Denotes a player whom I believe has at best a 50% chance of being available for the next world cup. (In Carbery's case its there because I don't know what position he'll be used)

A quick look at that would have me believing that Schmidt's medium term goals should be to develop his hookers behind Best, his locks, 10's behind Sexton (Or get Mad Dog back/Pray for PJ) and his back three into international class players because there lies our obvious weaknesses with Toner being the only guy in those positions who has really earned that status through consistent performance at that level. Another goal, and one which is very achievable, should be to go into the next World Cup with the best front row, back row and halfbacks and one of the best centre partnerships. For this Autumn the focus should be on the back three, locks and hooker with a few guys ready to step up in those positions against tier 1 international opposition.

 

[munstermuffin]

Isn't Madigan out as he will still be in Bristol? Can't see him return as there will be no need for him in Blue or Red and Ulster will I think have 10 sorted. He won't go to Connacht and he still hasn't the game to be a regular 10 at International level and there will be youngsters coming through too. Guys like Lamour and that too wil be realistic possibilities

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Isn't Madigan out as he will still be in Bristol? Can't see him return as there will be no need for him in Blue or Red and Ulster will I think have 10 sorted. He won't go to Connacht and he still hasn't the game to be a regular 10 at International level and there will be youngsters coming through too. Guys like Lamour and that too wil be realistic possibilities

It would be the exceptional circumstances clause (If he doesn't have a go home clause in his third year), If its the case that Jackson is behind bars and Carbery is starting 15, Madigan is quite easily the next best 10 at the time of writing. A contract at Leinster for the 2020/21 where he replaces Johnny Sexton while Ross Byrne, Conor Dean or this year's star of Leinster school's rugby gain the experience to take over from him would be ideal for both parties, I'd also be skeptical of Ulster sorting a 10 out, you have to go back to Contepomi to find a NIQ 10 who was better than Mads playing for a province. Jackson's issues could leave the IRFU with egg on their face regarding Mads if Byrne, Bleyendaal or Hanrahan don't step up which is far from unforeseeable. This stems from my faith in Byrne not being what it was as I don't think he has the physical attributes to make it, Bleyendaal has yet to impress me enough to consider him an international, Keatley isn't as good and I doubt Hanrahan will be a 10 which is why I think there's enough of a chance of Madigan playing in 2019 to include him.

Forgot Larmour, will lump him in.

 

[munstermuffin]

It would be the exceptional circumstances clause (If he doesn't have a go home clause in his third year), If its the case that Jackson is behind bars and Carbery is starting 15, Madigan is quite easily the next best 10 at the time of writing. A contract at Leinster for the 2020/21 where he replaces Johnny Sexton while Ross Byrne, Conor Dean or this year's star of Leinster school's rugby gain the experience to take over from him would be ideal for both parties, I'd also be skeptical of Ulster sorting a 10 out, you have to go back to Contepomi to find a NIQ 10 who was better than Mads playing for a province. Jackson's issues could leave the IRFU with egg on their face regarding Mads if Byrne, Bleyendaal or Hanrahan don't step up which is far from unforeseeable. This stems from my faith in Byrne not being what it was as I don't think he has the physical attributes to make it, Bleyendaal has yet to impress me enough to consider him an international, Keatley isn't as good and I doubt Hanrahan will be a 10 which is why I think there's enough of a chance of Madigan playing in 2019 to include him.

Forgot Larmour, will lump him in.

But thing is alot and I'm included don't rate Madigan as a high 10 either and until he becomes a regular 10 in a top league that won't change. Like I'd rate Blenyendaal higher when on song. Not saying he's international just you're overhauling Madigan a tad. Also on the NOW 10 commènt maybe the man who's playing in a top league and who kept him out of provinces 10 jersey would argue that.

Also for lock Tadgh will be in there

 

[Groundhog]

Ireland are set to announce a three test series against Australia for next year.
This raises further questions of whether I'll care until three days in advance and also what does Brexit mean for the Irish beekeeping community. The answers may shock you.

 

[AM_Bokke]

Ireland are set to announce a three test series against Australia for next year.
This raises further questions of whether I'll care until three days in advance and also what does Brexit mean for the Irish beekeeping community. The answers may shock you.

Dates and locations are already on the Wallabies website.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Ireland are set to announce a three test series against Australia for next year.
This raises further questions of whether I'll care until three days in advance and also what does Brexit mean for the Irish beekeeping community. The answers may shock you.

3/3 in Autumn
4/5 in Spring
2/3 in Summer

That's the minimum Ireland need to achieve to separate themselves from SA and Aus in the next year which should be the goal because doing so bridges the gap between us and 1 and 2.

 

[Groundhog]

3/3 in Autumn
4/5 in Spring
2/3 in Summer

That's the minimum Ireland need to achieve to separate themselves from SA and Aus in the next year which should be the goal because doing so bridges the gap between us and 1 and 2.

If only things were as hopeful for Irish mushroom exporters in the wake of Brexit

 

[munstermuffin]

3/3 in Autumn
4/5 in Spring
2/3 in Summer

That's the minimum Ireland need to achieve to separate themselves from SA and Aus in the next year which should be the goal because doing so bridges the gap between us and 1 and 2.

Very achievable. Can only see us looking to England and 1 Aus game myself unless injuries occur

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I'm wary of France in Paris and not winning the series away but I don't see us dropping a home game at all. If there's no improvement upon the year gone we'll win our home games and nick one in Aus but with the back three options available and tested at European level and new centre options behind Ringshaw I think that the weaknesses of the 6 nations can be cured. The Second row should be getting looked at too.

 

[Jockstap]

But thing is alot and I'm included don't rate Madigan as a high 10 either and until he becomes a regular 10 in a top league that won't change. Like I'd rate Blenyendaal higher when on song. Not saying he's international just you're overhauling Madigan a tad. Also on the NOW 10 commènt maybe the man who's playing in a top league and who kept him out of provinces 10 jersey would argue that.

Also for lock Tadgh will be in there

The jury's still out on Beirne, look what happened with Copeland. Now I'll admit I haven't seen a lot of Beirne but maybe he was just lucky to join a team that suits his game. It's odd that he became an incredible player in a season. Anyway we'll see what happens at Munster.

 

[Groundhog]

The jury's still out on Beirne, look what happened with Copeland. Now I'll admit I haven't seen a lot of Beirne but maybe he was just lucky to join a team that suits his game. It's odd that he became an incredible player in a season. Anyway we'll see what happens at Munster.

Difference between Beirne and Copeland is light and day. Follow what Beirne does in a game and he's hitting pretty much every ruck, making a nuisance of himself at breakdowns, looks supremely fit and has some very nice skills developed now too. He's absolutely no show pony, he's a workhorse who shone in a very good Pro 12 winning team, unlike Copeland who appeared a diamond among rocks in Cardiff and even then he put up some good (carrying) performances on an all weather track, but still had blindingly obvious faults in his game. Before I copped who Beirne was in a game a while back I kept noticing how that sodomite in a blue scrum cap was constantly involved in every facet of play.