Is Gatland Risking his Credibility by Keeping Warburton?

[Feicarsinn]

Simple question. Warburton has now been unavailable for the first two games of the tour, something which Gatland said would rule a player out from participating in the rest of said tour. In my mind shouldn't the captain be the one who must be available the whole way through too? How can you lead if you haven't either earned your place in the 23 yet or even put a tackle in?

Is this risking Gatland's credibility as Lions coach and could it act as a source of potential discontent within the squad?

 

[McTallshort]

Not really Martin Johnson was unavailable for the first 3 games in 2001 and I think the first 2 games in 97

 

[Rhondda Rudie]

No.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

This is implying that Gatland had credibility in picking Warburton as captain originally though!

 

[Feicarsinn]

Not really Martin Johnson was unavailable for the first 3 games in 2001 and I think the first 2 games in 97

That's not really the argument though. Gatland said any player who was unavailable for the first two games (ie. The Barbarians and The Force) wouldn't be considered. Yet Warburton stays on seemingly only as he's his captain. This sends out strong indications that certain players may be picked not based on tour form but rather as they're the coach's favourites. that can't be good for camp moral.

 

[McTallshort]

^who should it have been....

 

[TRF_Olyy]

^who should it have been....

BOD, POC or Wyn Jones all good shouts.



I'm not sure how I feel about the Warburton (and Jenkins) situation - I kind of feel like if it were any other nations players they'd be gone.
I imagine the situation with these two, though, is that the medical staff have said "they'll probably be ready for this weekend" and then the day comes and they say "actually, a few more days" repeat ad nauseam. This is better than the staff turning around, the day the landed in HK, and saying "Yeah, these two aren't going to be available for the next 3-4 weeks."
That's how I'd be spinning it if I was Gats anyway

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

BOD, POC or Wyn Jones all good shouts.



I'm not sure how I feel about the Warburton (and Jenkins) situation - I kind of feel like if it were any other nations players they'd be gone.
I imagine the situation with these two, though, is that the medical staff have said "they'll probably be ready for this weekend" and then the day comes and they say "actually, a few more days" repeat ad nauseam. This is better than the staff turning around, the day the landed in HK, and saying "Yeah, these two aren't going to be available for the next 3-4 weeks."
That's how I'd be spinning it if I was Gats anyway

It worked out well for Kearney though, granted he can get back fit within the same time they do he's grand!

 

[BRSTLDRGN]

The underlying theme about this Lions tour has been "cultural nepotism" so in most people's eyes, especially the ones who don't grasp what the Lions is all about, Gatland has damaged his credibility by taking a majority of Welsh players. We know thats a load of bull.

I get where you are coming from Feic, and theres a part of me that agrees but in the grand scheme of things the Lions captain hasn't played the first couple of games anyway injured or not and from what I've heard he'll be back for the Reds game. Also a captain does more than play, if he's being a leader off the pitch then I have no issues with him being kept around the team.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

Warburton isn't actually unavailable for this match, if what I've read is correct, he's just got a minor ****le. Why play him against the Force when it may just get worse? It's not like there aren't a bunch of other warm up games he can play in. This is a bit different player who has been 'ruled out'. In one situation you can play him, but don't want to risk his recovery, in the other you don't have a choice.

 

[Groundhog]

While I think Gatland is a bit of a hypocrite by not doing so, and I also don't think Warburton should have been captain in the first place, I hope he isn't sent home. I think Gatland's call on sending players home that quick is harsh to begin with.

 

[Amiga500]

Is Gatland Risking his Credibility by Keeping Warburton?

No. Not yet anyway. It'd be silly to send him home now if he is just a week or so off fitness.


But, his credibility is already low (with me) by picking him as Lions captain when he would not have been playing in a properly picked team from a fully-fit Welsh squad. The backrow would have been Lydiate-Tipuric-Faleteau.

Although, in fairness to him, this year there was no nailed on starter (i.e. Adam Jones, Cian Healy or Johnny Sexton) that is also proven captain material. POC was injured most of the year, albeit showing great stuff on his return, BOD is nursing a battered body constantly, Warburton was hopelessly out of form for much of the year, Robshaw never fully convinced as a world-class 7, Brown wasn't even selected in the squad (somewhat harshly I feel).

Personally, I would have picked POC or BOD ahead of Warburton. Given that Warburton is both injured and in iffy-form. The other two have form, but are questionable on injuries. [admittedly, there may be some bias in that]

 

[dullonien]

I think Gatland's comments regarding not being available for the first two games has been taken slightly out of context here. He didn't want to include players in the squad that certainly wouldn't have been available for these two games, such as those involved in the TOP 14 final. They wouldn't even be involved in the squad yet, a very different situation to a player picking up a small injury and missing these games, at least they are still taking some part in training, mingling with the squad etc.

Gatland never said that he'd send players home if they picked up an injury on tour that ruled them out of 2+ games.

It's not just Warburton either, Jenkins and I believe Kearney have also been carrying slight ****les that have prevented them from playing.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Jenkins travelled injured, though - which is weird.
ASFAIK Warburton and Kearney picked up their injuries with the Lions.

 

[dullonien]

Jenkins travelled injured, though - which is weird.

But he did pick up his injury after the squad announcement.

SOB also travelled injured, but he's returned to fitness a little quicker.

I feel that some are looking for double standards, where there are none.

 

[lynam1104]

I feel that Gats statements could be interpreted to achieve a double standard which I would expect from the Aussies. I think everyone needs to forget about nationality and become Lions at this point Sams out captain now Gats is out coach now and I'm behind them 100% as I am with the rest of the squad.

Except Farrel, double standards.

 

[dullonien]

Except Farrel, double standards.

That's allowed.

 

[Amiga500]

ASFAIK Warburton and Kearney picked up their injuries with the Lions.

Kearney tore his hammy warming up for the Pro12 final.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Kearney tore his hammy warming up for the Pro12 final.

Really?
Shouldn't have gone at all then =/

One rule for the English I guess

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2

 

[lynam1104]

He felt it tighten in the warm up they didn't know it was a tear til he got to HK and had a scan.