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wjd23104
Guest
I mean its the only NZRU award that only an individual of one race can win. Why do these things seem to be generally accepted?
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Nickdnz
Guest
Because reverse racism is a complex issue, that to talk about it is deemed racist. There are many racist things in New Zealand, such as a New Zealand Maori team, a political party that focus on the need of one people, the Maori party, and yes, the Maori player of the year award. That being said, this issue I'd rather stay out of, because the things are little hipocracies in New Zealand society that are probably best to be ignored.
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shazbooger
Guest
Young player of the year is discriminating against age too.
Do they have a Young Maori player award? Thats double bad. Someone should be lynched for that.
Do they have a Young Maori player award? Thats double bad. Someone should be lynched for that.
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shazbooger
Guest
Oh and I presume female players over or under a certain age wont be considered for the award!
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C A Iversen
Guest
It is clearly racist. As for comparing the fact that women aren't expected to play against men and are treated seperately in rugby, well I'm sure the sane amongst us know that it's fair they have their own competitions and prizes. It's not fair they get paid less, but women and men would never fairly compete with each other in this particular sport. I do love it when women athletes are recognised of course.
As for young player of the year? Everyone is that age or area of age at some point, so that is actually open to all.
Racism is racism. Maori and all other ethnic groups share a level playing field when it comes to sports opportunities in New Zealand and pretty much always have.Theres no need to reward someone for being the best player of any individual race.
Zac Guildford is an amazing talent and deserves to be recognised as the up and coming player in New Zealand without a racial reference. This is just a tradition that would have been removed some time ago if it was best european or caucasian player of the year.
Still, all New Zealanders are powerless in the face of this kind of racism, so we must just either celebrate or ignore these situations.
As for young player of the year? Everyone is that age or area of age at some point, so that is actually open to all.
Racism is racism. Maori and all other ethnic groups share a level playing field when it comes to sports opportunities in New Zealand and pretty much always have.Theres no need to reward someone for being the best player of any individual race.
Zac Guildford is an amazing talent and deserves to be recognised as the up and coming player in New Zealand without a racial reference. This is just a tradition that would have been removed some time ago if it was best european or caucasian player of the year.
Still, all New Zealanders are powerless in the face of this kind of racism, so we must just either celebrate or ignore these situations.
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feicarsinn
Guest
It's an interesting debate this one. On one hand you have the question whether it is racist or not and on the other whether we want to do away some quite old traditions, something that rugby union holds very dear.
Personally I'm against the award. If the best Maori is the best rugby player then he'll get the player of the year award. If not, he doesn't deserve an award. I doubt that these days a Maori player is going to be denied the main award due to race so a Maori award is kind of redundant. Then again I'm just a Paddy so what do I know.
Personally I'm against the award. If the best Maori is the best rugby player then he'll get the player of the year award. If not, he doesn't deserve an award. I doubt that these days a Maori player is going to be denied the main award due to race so a Maori award is kind of redundant. Then again I'm just a Paddy so what do I know.
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Nickdnz
Guest
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (feicarsinn @ Dec 19 2009, 01:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
Yeah, it's the general opinion of New Zealander's too. Most Maori I have talked to also disagree with the award, but it is kind of a touchy subject, so we ignore it and hope it goes away.
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C A Iversen
Guest
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Dec 19 2009, 02:40 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
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Yeah it's hard to bring it up without sounding like you want to take something away from Maori, something I and I'm sure every other New Zealander certainly doesn't want to do.
I suppose if it was an award given out on a marae and voted on by other marae going maori, it'd seem more cultural. It seems racial when brought to the professional awards system.
Yeah, it's the general opinion of New Zealander's too. Most Maori I have talked to also disagree with the award, but it is kind of a touchy subject, so we ignore it and hope it goes away.
[/b][/quote]
Yeah it's hard to bring it up without sounding like you want to take something away from Maori, something I and I'm sure every other New Zealander certainly doesn't want to do.
I suppose if it was an award given out on a marae and voted on by other marae going maori, it'd seem more cultural. It seems racial when brought to the professional awards system.
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wjd23104
Guest
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Dec 18 2009, 08:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
Good point. Phil Goff (however insincerely) questioned wether giving certain iwi groups forestry rights that other forestry groups didn't have was racist and he gets accused of playing the race card. The Ets trading deal was complicated but it didn't seem unreasonable to question what appeared to preferential treatment based on race.
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candybum
Guest
They have Maori sports awards, shouldn't they just include the award there?
But i guess because there is a Maori team there's a Maori player awards, just like age grade team with age grade awards etc
But i guess because there is a Maori team there's a Maori player awards, just like age grade team with age grade awards etc
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jawmalawm24
Guest
Everything seems to be racist these days when it comes to Maori we should all just try get along because I love pakeha girls and for some reason they're genetically predisposed to liking us Maori boys too don't know why but that's just how it is.
Jokes aside it looks racist whenever you put Maori infront of anything Maori Tv, Maori Party, Maori Player Of The Year Award, Maori Rugby etc. Doesn't mean you have to be Maori to do any of these things. Surely no one here thinks that only Maori are involved in all of these activities without any Pakeha at all?
Jokes aside it looks racist whenever you put Maori infront of anything Maori Tv, Maori Party, Maori Player Of The Year Award, Maori Rugby etc. Doesn't mean you have to be Maori to do any of these things. Surely no one here thinks that only Maori are involved in all of these activities without any Pakeha at all?
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C A Iversen
Guest
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jawmalawm24 @ Dec 19 2009, 12:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
It's mostly the radicals really who make some Maori things look racist. A lot of the guys who played in my teams were hardcase boys who'd give you a lift to a game if you needed it, would drink and socialise with me, generally laugh at anything and are just generally good guys. Thats how I think most Maori are.
I don't mind Maori TV, I think it helps keep cultural elements and history alive.
I think the Maori Party would be okay if they actually had a vision for non-maori futures too, they don't, so are generally racist in my opinion.
I think Maori player of the year is a racist award, but I think it has absolutely no intent to be so, so I don't really mind it much. Just pointing out that it really just wouldn't be tolerated if there was such a thing as caucasian player of the year.
As for loving our pakeha girls, thats fine. Just for goodness sake get a higher proportion of your women fit, lol! The fit ones look mostly great. Bernice Mene was a fine example. Sure there's a few hefty pakeha chicks too, but it's really not fair at the moment, you guys have this thing where too high a number of your girls love their BK and KFC a little too much. Sort them out please. :lol: A level playing field and all that.
It's mostly the radicals really who make some Maori things look racist. A lot of the guys who played in my teams were hardcase boys who'd give you a lift to a game if you needed it, would drink and socialise with me, generally laugh at anything and are just generally good guys. Thats how I think most Maori are.
I don't mind Maori TV, I think it helps keep cultural elements and history alive.
I think the Maori Party would be okay if they actually had a vision for non-maori futures too, they don't, so are generally racist in my opinion.
I think Maori player of the year is a racist award, but I think it has absolutely no intent to be so, so I don't really mind it much. Just pointing out that it really just wouldn't be tolerated if there was such a thing as caucasian player of the year.
As for loving our pakeha girls, thats fine. Just for goodness sake get a higher proportion of your women fit, lol! The fit ones look mostly great. Bernice Mene was a fine example. Sure there's a few hefty pakeha chicks too, but it's really not fair at the moment, you guys have this thing where too high a number of your girls love their BK and KFC a little too much. Sort them out please. :lol: A level playing field and all that.
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jawmalawm24
Guest
Most Maori are always down for a laugh and generally cool fullaz to hang with but people like Tame Iti, Hone Harawira do us no favours.
Bernice Mene is Samoan but fine nonetheless and yeah alot of our Maori girls favourite hangouts are takeaways, kfc, bk, last nights boilup and anywhere with a lighter and cigarette. Alot are unhealthy but damn when they're fit they look really stupidly fine but the only thing is most of the time they still talk the damn same like a Hori haha.
My nephew got a Maori student of the year award from school about 5 years ago it was crackup because nobody knew he was even Maori because he's halfcast but than all the Horis started coming up to him talking in Maori. Racist ********.
Bernice Mene is Samoan but fine nonetheless and yeah alot of our Maori girls favourite hangouts are takeaways, kfc, bk, last nights boilup and anywhere with a lighter and cigarette. Alot are unhealthy but damn when they're fit they look really stupidly fine but the only thing is most of the time they still talk the damn same like a Hori haha.
My nephew got a Maori student of the year award from school about 5 years ago it was crackup because nobody knew he was even Maori because he's halfcast but than all the Horis started coming up to him talking in Maori. Racist ********.
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C A Iversen
Guest
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (K-Pac @ Dec 19 2009, 03:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
No they don't have european player of the year based on race, in samoa there'd be no point in calling it "samoan player of the year", as nearly everyone is a samoan person.
It's not just your country, it's everyone who is a citizen's country, unless you yourself are racist.
Don't call people *****.
Discuss the issue, don't insult.
Your post is deleted.
Back to jawmalawm24. Thanks for proving that this can be a civilised discussion.
Totally agree mate, if some of those girls are fit, they look seriously fine. It's just sad that more don't, and yeah heaps of them smoke. Sad, because there's plenty of talent there if they look after themselves, lol.
Didn't realise about Bernice Mene (oops), but I'm sure there are other examples. That one who plays Tania on Shortland streets alright, but her characters a pain in the arse.
As for the sports award, it's not something I'm saying NZ should be ashamed of. Zac has every right to be proud. It's just technically a catagory for one race and theres no changing that really.
No they don't have european player of the year based on race, in samoa there'd be no point in calling it "samoan player of the year", as nearly everyone is a samoan person.
It's not just your country, it's everyone who is a citizen's country, unless you yourself are racist.
Don't call people *****.
Discuss the issue, don't insult.
Your post is deleted.
Back to jawmalawm24. Thanks for proving that this can be a civilised discussion.
Totally agree mate, if some of those girls are fit, they look seriously fine. It's just sad that more don't, and yeah heaps of them smoke. Sad, because there's plenty of talent there if they look after themselves, lol.
Didn't realise about Bernice Mene (oops), but I'm sure there are other examples. That one who plays Tania on Shortland streets alright, but her characters a pain in the arse.
As for the sports award, it's not something I'm saying NZ should be ashamed of. Zac has every right to be proud. It's just technically a catagory for one race and theres no changing that really.
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Nickdnz
Guest
Like, this is an odd issue. It is Maoris' country? Damn, so where am I going to live? I was born here. Guess I'm still not a New Zealander yet...
I personally don't see the value of an award that commemorates the achievements of one race and not others, and to do so seem like a racist idea. Sorry if that means I'm a twat.
I personally don't see the value of an award that commemorates the achievements of one race and not others, and to do so seem like a racist idea. Sorry if that means I'm a twat.
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C A Iversen
Guest
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Dec 19 2009, 04:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
Started the process of dealing with that fellow Nickdnz, so no big dramas. Just answer guys like jawmalawm24, seems that he can have a light hearted debate about things.
Started the process of dealing with that fellow Nickdnz, so no big dramas. Just answer guys like jawmalawm24, seems that he can have a light hearted debate about things.
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shtove
Guest
God knows what racist means.
Is the award funded by the state? If it is, then f*** it: that's not the bargain the taxpayers struck. But there's a lot of things we didn't bargain for, and more to come.
If the RU chooses to spend its private funds this way and it helps rugby then fair enough.
Is the award funded by the state? If it is, then f*** it: that's not the bargain the taxpayers struck. But there's a lot of things we didn't bargain for, and more to come.
If the RU chooses to spend its private funds this way and it helps rugby then fair enough.
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Nickdnz
Guest
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (C A Iversen @ Dec 19 2009, 04:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
Started the process of dealing with that fellow Nickdnz, so no big dramas. Just answer guys like jawmalawm24, seems that he can have a light hearted debate about things.
[/b][/quote]
Roger Roger!
Started the process of dealing with that fellow Nickdnz, so no big dramas. Just answer guys like jawmalawm24, seems that he can have a light hearted debate about things.
[/b][/quote]
Roger Roger!
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C A Iversen
Guest
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (shtove @ Dec 19 2009, 04:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
The NZRFU have no doubt used their own money for this part of their annual awards, so yeah that again lessens some of the negative perceptions.
The problem with defining racism is that anything conveyed from a mostly caucasian person to a darker skinned person is heavily checked and can be fair game. Anything in the opposite scenario is largely acceptable. This is the problem.
Still back to the main point, Zac Guildford is the player I'd prefer to catagorise as NZ's Player Of The Future 2009 rather than anything else.
The NZRFU have no doubt used their own money for this part of their annual awards, so yeah that again lessens some of the negative perceptions.
The problem with defining racism is that anything conveyed from a mostly caucasian person to a darker skinned person is heavily checked and can be fair game. Anything in the opposite scenario is largely acceptable. This is the problem.
Still back to the main point, Zac Guildford is the player I'd prefer to catagorise as NZ's Player Of The Future 2009 rather than anything else.
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William18
Guest
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Dec 19 2009, 04:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
I agree with the first part. My ancestors first came here in 1840, I should be able to call myself a New Zealander by now. I think anyone can call themselves a NZer if they love the country and are willing to conform to our laws and customs. I think that many Maori can use the past as an excuse for them failing when it is just as possible for them to achieve as anyone else. I don't have an issue with the award though. I feel like it is just recognizing the best Maori player and probably had much more significance when the New Zealand Maori team was around.
