It's going bust, It's going it bust, It's going! Rugby's Going bust!

[Teh Mite]

Copy pasted:
http://www.rugbynetwork.net/boards/read/s99.htm?101,12364740

Brian Kennedy stated in a recent interview that rugby was going broke. Looking at the numbers below he seems to have a point. Only ourselves and Leicester made a profit last season (I'm assuming Wasps didn't as they lost over £2m the previous year). If the money men pull out of the loss making clubs, then we won't have a premiership. Over £16m in losses (plus £2m? for Wasps) = £18m+. The recession hasn't helped but that's still going to be a big number at the end of this season. Time for the RFU to step in with more funding?

2009-2010
Club Turnover Profit/Loss
Leicester £18,489,000 £284,000
Saracens £6,929,102 -£6,401,086
Gloucester £9,360,891 -£562,540
Saints £12,032,507 £566,401
Irish £7,547,574 -£2,088,841
Quins £11,300,113 -£1,315,051
Barf £8,832,271 -£1,256,560
Wasps not filed yet
Exeter £4,622,608 -£76,967
Sale £7,948,703 -£1,581,148
Leeds £3,725,671 -£1,631,783
Newcastle £6,199,908 -£1,473,091

Sarries lost nearly equal to their own turnover is the most shocking figure. That bubble has to burst and there has to be more emphasis from the union to increase the club gate.

Nearly £20m lost between 10 clubs (bare in mind Wasps lost a good few million the season before and only the East Midlands giants making any profit) is appalling.

Granted that Saracens have lost 42.8% of all the competitions downturn of the figures we know (luckily for Nigel Wray, the population likes Dominoes Pizza!), but while these sort of figures are small beer compared to soccer the market is a fraction the size.

Either emphasis is put on and allowing the clubs to grow - Removal of stangulation via the salary cap, ending the mid season test series which detracts from the vital "bums-on-Seats" statistic, sensible allocation of TV rights and kick-off times, stronger promotion of the junior echelons, less constant emphasis on England, the rapid and final destruction of the BBC etc. otherwise the lifeblood level of the sport will collapse in on itself and everything goes to **** once Sarries, Irish, Sale, Newcastle, Worcester and Quins have gone belly up.

The only teams likely to still be strong in a few years time if that continues are Tigers and Saints (who made money), Gloucester (who normally turn a small profit) and Bath (who can absorb an costs thanks to the new sugar daddy). Everyone else is fooked.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Brian Kennedy reckons he's lost £15m of his own money keeping Sale Sharks alive since whenever he took over

That's just ridiculous - especially when you consider some footballers will make that in a year...



Don't agree with removing the salary cap - it would benefit Saints and Tigers and noone else
The rest of the clubs are f**ked as it is, imagine if they then had to splash out more money to try and stay competitive with the richer clubs

 

[Peat]

Removing the salary cap to decrease deficits seems fairly counter-intuitive. I can see where you're coming from Bullitt, but don't think it'd work.

Also, how would destroying the BBC help club rugby? Plus, England's status and importance generally allows for this to continue.

What are Leicester spending that 6m extra on they have over every other rugby club?

 

[Teh Mite]

Short term thinking.

The ability to get in bigger name draw and extended squads means there's more chance for the clubs to be competitive . Yes there will be have and have-nots, but that's already enforced in the reverse direction - ironically because of Dave Thompson -due to Newcastle buying the league ***les in the late 90s. The wage cap was put in place and has remained there ever since. The world has moved on since the have first turned pro 20 years ago.

Dave Thompson, now he's broke, is one of the chief main stayers of wanting the cap because his business plan of Friday night games a million miles from anyone else in the league means he always has a poor gate and nobody comes to watch his team - Not as though that matters much longer I guess as Newcastle are on their way down and can't likely be seen bouncing straight back.

Also think that the amount available to spend wouldn't be greatly affected: Tigers had a poor return on what they usually get and Northampton look rich due to the LV= cup win which pays a greater return then the HEC on winning it apparently.

Something has to give. If a few clubs can increase the profile of the sport (which thanks to the stale test arena and various other factors is on the wane), every side will benefit. Look at Ireland (where they're nowhere near as restricted) and France (no restrictions at all) as the examples.

Ireland: 66% of the qualified regions through to the HEC 1/4ers.
France: 66% of the Qualified regions through to the 1/4ers also.
England: Only 2 profit making clubs through, 25%. One is barely a shadow of their former selves and the other has a tiny squad of 30 players and are visibly a slower side then 6 months ago for it.

Something has to give.

The socialist mantra behind the league (pin those who could kick on to 'help' the smaller clubs) is crippling the games development.

Removing the salary cap to decrease deficits seems fairly counter-intuitive. I can see where you're coming from Bullitt, but don't think it'd work. - See above

Also, how would destroying the BBC help club rugby? Plus, England's status and importance generally allows for this to continue. - The tabloid nature of reporting which ignores (or reports to the detriment of) the club game.

What are Leicester spending that 6m extra on they have over every other rugby club? - Chuffing great loan to pay for the Welford road revelopment

-

 

[Peat]

I get the logic, I just don't agree. You won't grow clubs by asking people to turn up and watch their teams play in a Premiership you can't win - there are only a handful of clubs who can really exploit a rise in the salary cap. Do so, and you give them the Premiership. They've pretty much got it already tbh, but I don't see any mileage in increasing that.

England rugby needs to grow together. It needs a better standard of homegrown player, it needs better coaches, it needs sustained international success again to capture the public's attention.

Yes, it is a worry how English clubs are going in the Heineken, but I'm not sure its all salary cap. A lot of clubs are currently developing teams, that takes time. Part of its luck, Saracens would have gone through if they'd swapped groups with Ulster. And, personally, I see places where both Leicester and Northampton could do themselves favours.

Mallinder needs to learn to embrace squad rotation. I know his back-ups aren't of the quality of the firsts, but thats a gamble you've got to take sometimes. And playing Tiny/Clarke/Mujati/Dowson in the Anglo-Welsh? Lunacy. Leicester's squad is very lopsided to my mind. I don't think either club is currently taking good enough advantage of their academies, Leicester have a number of young stars from it but its not really giving them any great depth to their squad because Cockerill won't use them, not sure what's going on with Northampton's - but compared to, say, Quins/Glos/Saffacens, they seem to have very low numbers of academy players. Both Irish clubs relied heavily on kids from the academy to get them through rotation and were even throwing a few into the HC battle. We've got a better youth system than them as a whole, but we're spreading it through 14 odd clubs and they through 4 provinces.

I would like to see the salary cap raised. But I don't think its practical right now. Although it is getting a small raise, for clubs who have academy produced players on the books. And there is a RFU handout on the way - for clubs who are getting a certain number of EQPs.

 

[Prestwick]

Saracens £6,929,102 -£6,401,086

:bana: WOOOOOOO! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! :bana:

Guarantee you that thanks to the agreement with Watford has meant that Saracens have been losing a good £6 million every season. Absolutely no share of food & drink and pay through the nose for rent means that its impossible to turn a profit.

Whats more shocking is that Quins have their own ground yet are still losing over a million a year!