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Johnson stands up for Wilkinson

Discussion in '2017 RBS Six Nations' started by Gavin, Feb 17, 2010.

  1. Gavin

    Gavin Guest

    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>
    [/b]http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3820_5956037,00.html

    Martin Johnson is a complete fool. I enjoyed his statement <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>
    Does that include Borthwick?
     
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  3. Why doesn't Johnson just address the problems of his team rather than giving them full support. They act as if its all happy and the team is together and they're building but its just complete bullshit. I'm sure Wilkinson has taken criticism in the past and can take it again. Why is there this silence where everyone is forced to say the same things. Players are paid enough to be able to take criticism and there doesn't need to be this 'don't be mean to my little dumplings' approach from Johnno and Borthwick.

    These players have problems with their games, which have never been addresed publicly and most probably in training either.

    Payne
    Borthwick
    Care
    Wilkinson
    Monye

    Grow some f***ing balls, Johnno
     
  4. Olyy

    Olyy Guest

    Bleargh, he should just play Flood already.
    Wilkinsons been unimpressive in all the games he's started recently, he's been a good tackler, and a consistent penalty/conversion kicker, but then that was suspect in the Italy game.
    I'm not saying drop him completely, but at least give someone else a chance
     
  5. Bullitt

    Bullitt Guest

    Danny Care is actually the best man for the job - Look at how he works for Quins alongside Evans. However he is hindered for England by a pathetic gameplan (including this belt-and-braces approach to securing the ball, thus slow presentation) and a fly-half that stands 20m directly behind the fullback.

    Sadly we cannot blame the rest of the backs for these faults. However we can note that Monye is blowing hot and cold like menopausal heroin addict while Armitage has developed/regressed the common sense (and temperament) of Joey Barton.
     
  6. I'm not saying these players shouldn't be in the squad (except for Payne) but they have aspects which have shown no sign of improvement.

    i.e.
    Care - too long to pass, as he always steps towards his man
    Wilkinson - doesn't stand on the gainline, cant kick for ****
    Monye - carries the ball under his arm (Lions tour), no thoughts for support runners (Italy, New Zealand)
     
  7. iWin

    iWin Guest

    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ali12 @ Feb 17 2010, 06:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
    With my Quins blinkers on, I'd say that Care definitely, and possibly Monye are fine for the job.
    Care's been great in this 6 nations so far, and I'd like to see him stay if he keeps playing well.
    Monye is learning to carry the ball in the right hand. While I'd still like to see Ashton instead, I don't think his last two performances warrant dropping him.

    However, the others are perfectly valid targets. Also, I'd like to add Armitage to that list. He's done nothing since coming back to deserve his spot ahead of Foden.

    I don't understand where Johnson has been these last 7 years, but Wilko has been nowhere near his best since that world cup.
    He doesn't kick well out of hand any more, and he never passes, as well as standing too deep. While the place kicking was just an off day, Flood's place kicking isn't so bad that we'll miss Wilko for it.
    I'd rather score 3 tries and miss a couple of penalties than the other way round...
     
  8. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (iWin @ Feb 17 2010, 07:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
    With my Quins blinkers on, I'd say that Care definitely, and possibly Monye are fine for the job.
    Care's been great in this 6 nations so far, and I'd like to see him stay if he keeps playing well.
    Monye is learning to carry the ball in the right hand. While I'd still like to see Ashton instead, I don't think his last two performances warrant dropping him.

    However, the others are perfectly valid targets. Also, I'd like to add Armitage to that list. He's done nothing since coming back to deserve his spot ahead of Foden.

    I don't understand where Johnson has been these last 7 years, but Wilko has been nowhere near his best since that world cup.
    He doesn't kick well out of hand any more, and he never passes, as well as standing too deep. While the place kicking was just an off day, Flood's place kicking isn't so bad that we'll miss Wilko for it.
    I'd rather score 3 tries and miss a couple of penalties than the other way round...
    [/b][/quote]

    so would i, but i'd just like to see some signs of improvement. I'm not saying drop them.
     
  9. gingergenius

    gingergenius Guest

    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>
    You get the impression that they're deluding themselves. No one who criticises Wilkinson is criticising him for the fact that we had 3 or 4 breaks that we failed to score from. This isn't a big problem. Neither is the fact that he missed some kicks, because we know that he is a world class goal kicker usually.

    What people are criticising him for, and criticising Johnson and anyone involved in England, is the gameplan.

    Making 3 or 4 breaks against Italy is not impressive; the Irish never got out of 2nd gear and still killed the game off early. With players like Flutey, Tait and Armitage coming into the line, this should be normal. But breaks are usually converted into points when they happen in opposition territory, closer to the 22 than halfway, and you need territory for this to happen. Wilkinson is not the type of fly half who will ever think about creating something in his own half - he is the sort who needs to control the game with his boot and therefore with him in the team, we should expect a lot of territory.

    So when every one of Wilkinson's kicks goes straight down the throat of an Italian, of course he's going to be criticised. He is a key cog in the gameplan, and if he's not working, it falls to pieces.

    After his kicks go astray, we had the back 3, Wilkinson and Tait waiting back to field the returning kick. Now, from here, all of them besides Tait kicked very poorly from hand. Here is the 2nd flaw in the plan.

    The 3rd flaw is the team as a whole having a complete inability to adjust. All it required was 10 mins of massive 100% effort from the forwards - and Castro being binned was the perfect oppurtunity. Almost every time I saw the back 3 catch the ball, there were a number of chasing Italians, and no English near them. If they took it into contact, they'd get turned over or pinged for holding on - and in the meantime, the forwards were literally walking around in midfield, as if they new for certain it was going to be kicked back. If they bust a gut to get back and support, then maybe the back 3 would be more inclined to run it back.

    What I suspect, however, is that they were told to kick everything and keep playing the territory game.

    England's big failure on Sunday was Johnson's determination to bully victory out of the Italians, which was never possible when half the pack and the fly half were playing so poorly.

    Their subsequent failure to adapt, and then admit their errors following the game, is very worrying.


    It's time for Flood. His kicking from hand is certainly not worse, his goalkicking and defence decent, and his attacking game infinitely better. Johnson will never see this.
     
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