Jumbled up, lots of questions, my personal account of stuff, what do you think?

[JWS]

Hello I am a prop in a under 17s section. I've had a fairly long spell from playing 3 months (potentially my longest 'break') I'm hoping to get back into it this coming Sunday (literally playing a game) I have a few grievances, the first being boots.. I have absurdly wide feet, I play prop by the way, (love it) I was thinking these http://www.lovell-rugby.co.uk/Rugby...Elite-8-Stud-SG-Rugby-Boots-Black-or-True-Red . I'd class this Sunday as a test run, it's against a team we've never played before which makes things.. Interesting to say the least. Oh and I'm flat flooted and slow (but I do a good job in most cases, I hope?)

I also seem to be lacking confidence as a player, I really need to get over this, I look at my negative qualities and think it's not worth trying, my brother also plays in the team despite being a year younger (we are a mixed age team, plenty of under 16s, they are good enough, they aren't our problem.) you could say we are polar opposites, I being the slightly overweight prop (I need to work on this, it's obviously weighing the confidence down, get it?), him being something like 9/7% body fat weighing barely anything but putting in so much in games, he has better core skills (passing etc. I can only pass a certain distance to be honest) his tackling is.. immense to say the least. He can tackle anyone (yet he doesn't know much about rucking, which is my specialty, along with most contact stuff), at our presentation he was described 'pound for pound our best player' unfortunately he didn't take away any silverware.

He lacks commitment though, so I win on that ground, well I did until around feb this year, I had an argument with a coach who said I had a 'poor attitude', this really hit hard, despite being one of the best, if not the best behaved player on the team (discipline is **** poor, another reason I stopped), this was said to me, to be honest to this day it still gets me. Apparently he apologized but he doesn't seem the type who would. I also don't get along with some players during training (this seems to happen a lot with some league players, I live in a very league orientated city, this can be an issue due to the core lessons in both games and local culture with them both) I am often described as a 'gentle giant', which to be honest means, if I do hurt someone, 99% of the time it's by accident and I apologize and feel guilty straight away. (I'd love to get aggressive during games, I vent most of my stuff at my family unfortunately, which isn't nice) Some league players however, don't take this well, and try 'start ****' so to speak.

I love the game and my local club so much, I feel so passionate about it, yet sometimes during trainings I feel so unwelcome. When we trained with the first team it felt great, they really made everyone feel welcome and gave us in depth pointers. I knew that was where I wanted to end up, this club has earned my love and effort to say the least.

We are in an organized league this year, and unfortunately we are in a low division, which was disappointing, but I think we can bring something back, and learn. Unfortunately I feel a lot of other player's don't want to improve, and during games it's like improvise acting, no organization, no idea what we're doing. 90% of the tries are scored by individuals who just take the **** and run round the other team disrespecting them. I feel the values of the game mean nothing to the team.

I regularly attend first team games, it was one of the few ways I got out to be honest.. I feel so enthusiastic before training and then during the actual thing I'm just brought down.

This Saturday when the first team are playing I'm going to talk to the coach and see if I see how I am by playing again on Sunday (though its a gamble as new team etc. we've had additions since I've been gone), more than likely they will agree and I'll take it from there. The main thing I'm lacking is speed (I need to get to the players to support them in time) fitness is pretty bad too, (I'm thinking of messing about with intervals in the gym for this, rowing and cross trainer, I'm bad with treadmills as I'm flat footed) my strength is good still can improve though (should I have my brother doing weights still? He's been doing a little bit, he's 15 atm.) At the actual gym I've been using machines as quite frankly the free weight room is crowded as heck.

I'll probably play at the local field with my brothers to work on general skills, any other suggestions? Also I'd like to support the club a bit more while getting a bit high up in standing there, as I want to stick with them on a long term basis to say the least.

 

[Rich Taff]

My personal opinion is that if you're a young prop, you're far better in a lower division than playing against those in a higher division with more experience.
Not because their ball skills etc will be better, but you're far less likely to get injured by someone who knows how to 'bore in' or collapse a scrum, and not get hurt.
If you worry about your younger brother having better ball skills, may I point you towards Adam Jones. I think it was Michael Lynagh who said 'If you've got Adam Jones in your side, you bring him out for the scrums, then tell him to go sit on the sideline covered in cotton wool until the next scrum' (paraphrasing of course).
The coaches comment about 'poor attitude' may have been in reference to your apparent lack of confidence, and just their way of trying to 'gee you up'.
I've never played in the 'boiler house', as I kept moving further and further away from the pack as I got older. (I moved to the centres, then the wing and now I've now attained 'top tier of the millenium stadium' and decided it's my best position)

 

[TobesHodges]

What's the team you play for?
What's your height and weight?

You sound very passionate for the sport which is great, I'm a 1st XV centre for my club Cranbrook RFC and we have a few guys that sound like yourself.

When it comes to rugby as you know we're all different shapes and sizes, you can't compare yourself to your brother, he wouldn't have a hope playing prop just like you wouldn't playing in his position, that's the nature of rugby.

Work on what your good at, hands etc.
I cannot recommend enough to WATCH rugby games on TV, you will naturally start to understand the patterns of play in a rugby game and it helps so much with your in game knowledge.
I played for 2 years and still wasn't quite getting it, I started watching every rugby game on TV and my game awareness, positioning and my understanding of where to be on the field improved significantly. I can't recommend this enough at grass roots level.

I asked at the start your height and weight, some of the guys on here will know the average heights and weights of the positions you want to achieve.

This is all just my own personal experience, you sound very keen which is great

 

[JWS]

I play for a club based in Hull in Yorkshire 1, it's a growing club in East Yorkshire I don't know my exact weight, I'm around 6 foot 17/18 stone, I'm definately overweight (I'm working on diet etc for fat loss, as that's an issue with myself, any advice for this? I think the main issue is admitting the problem, which I've just done so that's a step) I've only been at the game 3 years, this is my third. Any particular leagues on television you'd recommend? I now have access to BT Sports, so that's helpful that I can watch premiership along with all the ones on sky (southern hemisphere, top 14, PRO12)

The coach can sometimes come out with things by accident, there was an incident in my first year which resulted them in getting a 5 match touchline ban or something. He's a good guy, just sometimes he says things a bit wrong and offends people. We have another coach too who's good too.

Any other player's you'd recommend me to? If I don't have access to the television is there plenty of ways on the internet to watch?

 

[philU]

I was in a very similar situation to you, but nearly 20 years ago!
I'm 6'1 and 18 (and a bit) stone, but the difference is I'm 36 years old, so I'm coming to the end of my career, but i would just say if its something your truly passionate about then keep going. whether its at your current club or a new one you'll find a club that suits you and vice versa


As a prop don't be worried about not being able to get round the park as much. as long as you are doing your job in the scrums, line outs, and in the tight then nobody can criticise you. its not your job to go making 80 yard breaks, its your job to make 8 yard breaks, bosh off the opposition and then give the ball to someone much quicker.
As far as gym work goes if you want to carry on playing front row then you need to be doing lots of upper body strength work, and leg pushes. the cardio side will come from being 'match fit' rather than gym fit.
Look online at players like Oz du randt, adam jones, jason leonard etc. just watch what they do at scrums and rucks.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I get where you are coming RE League mentality I play League (mainly for fitness now), but used to play it quite competitively when I didn't have Union and there is definitely a different mentality to most union players in the U20 below age bracket. You just got to focus on your job rather than care if your players are trying to start **** really.

Exercising and diet outside of rugby is key not only physically but also mentally. The Internet is full of information it is just sorting out the broscience to the actual info, (I'm sure if you have any questions people here will help out).

In terms of ball skill etc who gives a poo there is a reason props are so desired in pro rugby it's because it is a unique skill set, focus on that and then add on that but most forwards let only props tend to be limited to passing distance.

In terms of gentle giant plenty of top props are like that Cole, Sheridan, etc etc it's another one of those things where you just need to focus on your own game and block thoughts on what someone else might think.

 

[JWS]

Status update, everything that could of gone wrong, went wrong today. Murphy's law I guess.. The game was a thrashing to be honest, since I'd gone they changed the lineout lifting style (which I quickly adapted to and did fine). I got pulled up on multiple occasions regarding scrummage, something about my shoulder not being out (sorted this towards the end of the first half). I asked for a few minutes to think things over (on bench) during the second half, they said sure. For this they put the moved the hooker into my position and put another hooker in, I was forgotten. I spent the remainder of the second half watching from the sidelines.

I was disheartened because of this, I feel utterly useless. I have no confidence, I know what another major issue is as well, I wasn't supporting, because I literally wasn't getting there.. I wasn't fast enough or fit enough. :/ Also I have had no idea of where I should be after THREE YEARS of playing, I'm being told I'm doing it wrong, but I'm not being told/shown how to do it right. This causes tension and arguments with teammates getting frustrated as they think backs can't ****ing ruck, this infuriates me.

I'm considering jumping ship altogether, this has shattered whatever confidence I had left to be honest, I have no idea how I'm going to recover..

 

[TobesHodges]

Well mate, sounds like you had bit of a roller coaster, **** happens in sport, by the sounds of what your saying, your not getting the support you need..
DO NOT STOP PLAYING.
Don't take the easy option like so many before you, this is your first step.
Scrummaging is such a difficult thing to learn the main reason is because a lot of coaches will interpret it differently, you'll find a coach or another player that will explain the dynamics and it will click in your mind and you'll start being able understand what your job is.

In regards to not knowing where to be on the pitch, I stand by what I said in my earlier post watch rugby games! On TV on YouTube.
With your position at the grass roots level your playing, a lot of people will just run to ruck to ruck and within about 30mins I imagine your very knackered, this is what I call forwards honey potting rucks (like bees to hive).
You have to think on the pitch, where you think the ball is going to be not just the next phase(each ruck) but the phase after that also, there's no point in you running from one side of the pitch to the other, when the ball is going to end up where you were originally. Again this knowledge I found came far more easily watching copious amounts of rugby.
Also a technique I found if your hands aren't amazing, get a ball and just pass it up in the air whilst watching TV or walking round the house, you don't have to throw it high, but just pass it up, make sure you do it off both hands!

Good luck this week at training, don't give up, rugby is a lovely sport and you shouldn't feel the way you do about it right now..

 

[big ginger 8]

Small thing about the supporting the play don't know if you've been told it before but you shouldn't be trying to get to every ruck. Every second one is ideal. I presume your team also at least has the basic calls of whether the ball is going to the backs or the forwards? If they do listen to them, if it's forwards ball the next ruck will be near the last one and if it's backs ball it'll likely be a lot further away. If you can start anticipating the play your lack of fitness won't be as noticeable.

Most importantly try and keep a positive mindset. Don't think crap I made another mistake, think ok I could have done better there and I will next time.

As a 17st prop myself I know what it's like to not have the fitness of essentially every other player but if your smart it can have minimal impact for most of the game.

EDIT: Regards scrummaging what side are you playing? I'm going to guess tighthead based on what you were penalised for. Essentially you just need to at least have the appearance of keeping your shoulders level and only come down when actually engaged.

 

[JWS]

Status update again,
Unfortunately I didn't attend training on Tuesday as I was really worn out by all the new college crap. (Seriously it's 10x harder than I thought it'd be).

However, I attended my youngest brother's training tonight (U12s), just to go in the bar, coach popped in, asked where I was on Tues and I informed them I'd be turning up tomorrow (Thursday). Now this is the bad part, I'll be honest.. In our games there is zero communication, this leads to a lot of arguments. I'm a pretty tolerant chap, but when I have backs yelling at me regarding my positioning and not saying where to go, I get kinda ****** off, make the odd comment back.

My fellow prop (who unfortunately plays the tighthead, which is where I'd rather be as I'm MUCH LESS MOBILE) was designated 'pack leader' he did not utter a single word during the last game.

We need some organisation, I'm sure that if I make a suggestion to the coach he'll try and implement it, our captain lacks integrity unfortunately, he's a nice chap and all, but can't really follow through on all the being in charge stuff.

Something that really doesn't help with my training is the fact that when we go into a game towards the end, the pitch we 'create' is SO SMALL (in terms of width) I can do a good job, in terms of getting to the rucks etc. I assume the area covered by each player in terms of width is around 2.5 meters if not less, compared to the 5 which is theoretically covered in a full pitch (I got this figure by dividing 70 by 14 players as the fullback hides away from everything, please correct me if this is bad thinking).

I'm getting dehydrated stupidly easy, how do I prevent this? We usually are only giving water when we score occasionally if the opponents score.

My positioning as I said, I'll usually move somewhere awkward if I don't see anyone covering it, (this results in conflict with backs due to me being for example, left of the right winger) I really need something that simply shows me where I should be, like the 'get to every 2nd ruck ginge above suggested. Just a little maxim to follow.

Boots, my god this is bad, I'm getting ache (not that painful, just REALLY distracting) in the mid outer area of my feet, I'm flat footed and my feet are.. stupidly wide. Any suggestions for boots? Will I need to get special ones? I've been ok with canterbury but it's still not preventing the distraction, I've been considering trying asics. Oh and stupid heel blisters.

I agree 100% I've been too negative, when something bad happens I let it get too me too much, I worry too much. I'm going to work on this, hopefully I will feel happier soon.

I hate the fact we're reliant on certain people do get the tries, this really frustrates me, for example with slower teams when they kick it to our fullback, (he's very fast) he will try and literally take the **** run loads of directions and try get through and score. This makes him impossible to support due to him changing lateral directions every second, this is one of the reasons we lost our past game.. he got caught, even before we could get back, they'd ship it out to their winger and then they'd score. Basically he doesn't kick, he's more winger material to be honest (he was in his old team)

I'm working on my diet, I'm focusing on losing fat as I'm quite bad at the moment, I can tell it's affecting my health badly.

I'm planning to keep going to the gym to do a bit of fitness and weight lifting (I really need to get access to the free weights room, but it's crowded as hell), I was thinking to do the fitness on the rowing machine, I can't remember what the term is like, 30 seconds of sprint level effort and 30 seconds jog level effort. I do it on the highest resistance they have on it (isn't noticeable anyway lol) so not much I can do in terms of that. It's full body though so that's good. I'll probably start this for 10 mins then do some weights. I hope to get this to a good 40 mins (though I'll probably get chucked off it for hogging lol).

Hope to hear off you all, thanks for the previous advice!