Martin Johnson's Successor

[samhall]

Martin Johnson leaving the England post. Personally i am quite thankful as i see it is the (hopefull) end of the Woodward era. As England or rugby fans we have seen the glorious Woodward followed by his less glorious Assistant and Attack managers followed by his former captain. Therefore I cannot lie that I am excited for what the future holds for English rugby.

So for me the fundamental flaw within the election of the most recent coaches is that they just havent got the best players in quick enough. I want to see us take a Robbie Deans approach of blood 'em young and let the proove their talent. Players such as the Marlers, Gaskells, Farrells etc. need to come in soon.

Who knows about the talent within English rugby?

Presumably the coaches withing England. Therefore in my mind that rules out Mallet and Henry. Briliant coaches both of them, but the strength in English rugby at this time relies on a coach who can get a young good team together now, who knows the players and can look forward to the next world cup and bring some elements of success.

Therefore this leaves a number of coaches who have a good knoweledge of English club rugby and the strength to run the squad and deal with the players in it. So who are the candidates? well personally i have 3 coaches who would be right for the job

1) Connor O'Shea - Current Quins coach undeniably doing wonders with the squad and particularly youthful setup. Although Irish he has helped Quins into to good running rugby and the ability to grind out solid wins. However, whether he would want the job is another matter. Quins are high flying, O'Shea looks comfortable and the talent is only going to improve down at the Stoop. So as much as he would be good, seeing his face as the head of English rugby is in my mind unlikely.

2) Richard Cockerill - Pragmatist, hard nosed Leicester at core. He could do the job and knows English rugby. Naturally a good candidate. But is he right? Do we the public want him? My answer is that i personally dont. (I will generalise horribly for a second, and apologise to Leicester fans) I dont want to be watching England for another 4 years playing head downs smash it up the middle of the park rugby. We have ashton foden tuilagi flood youngs simpson cueto, i could go on. The talent in the backs division is not lacking and the talent in the forwards division can lead towards a mobile set of forwards with Marler Corbisiero Gaskell and Lawes etc. Therefore with Cockerills upbringing as a Lecister coach i dont see him as the man for the job at this pioint in time with the squad England possess. Not to say that i dont think that one day he will be and England manager. However he has already said he wants to stay at Leicster so unlikely for him to be part of the set up.

3) Jim Mallinder - For me this man has to get the job. Look at the way Saints play, running rugby with a mobile set of forwards and a hard scrum. He knows some of the youngest and most talented in the squad and would add something different to the way of the old Johnson era. With the fly halves we have seen him pick at Northampton e.g Lamb Geraghty etc. clearly its attacking rugby he favours. And for England i think perfect. He is a new man for a new era of English rugby in my eyes

In terms of backroom staff, a few suggestions. Scrum Coach- Dorian West, Northampton and works with Jim Mallinder. Attacking Coach- Lets have a punt at someone like Austin Healy. The man has support and adds something. Who says he cant do a good job. Defence- Darren Lockyer? audacious yes but a God of League and can transfer his knowledge in a Edwards esque way. Kicking Coach/General- Paul Grayson The man is again a Saint and can help steer the fly halfs to play in a good attacking but well thought out game.


Whilst there are many other names to be thrown into the ring for a number of positions i would love to see the following.

Head Coach - Jim Mallinder
Attacking Coach- Austin Healy
Defence Coach - Darren Lockyer (or can you intice Shaun Edwards from the depths of the rugby world)
Kicking/Fly Half - Paul Grayson
General Motivation - Will Greenwood, Richard Hill, Neil Back ('03 cohort)
Forwards Coach- ? audacious shot at MArtin Johnson but would have to much awkwardness... not a knower of forwards so place names in the ring.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Mike Tindall at 1000 to 1 on Ladbrokes - worth a tenner, surely?

 

[Daylightfire]

Interesting that Eddie O'Sullivan has just resigned from the Eagles..

 

[Jockstap]

I would've thought Mallet would be the perfect coach for England. I'd say he could really do a job there, have England ever had non-national as coach?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Nope - all been English so far


Anyone know when a new coach is likely to be named?
In theory it could be as January, as there's no Autumn Internationals, but I imagine they'd want to get it sorted sooner rather than later

 

[Saintjay]

I think they will go for Mallet, he was looked at when Johnson got the job and the RFU seem to have a thing for him.

I hope Mallinder stay's at Saints and they have the clout and finances to keep him. I love England doing well but not at the cost of the Saints taking a massive hit. Plus looking at the suggestions of Grayson and West going we would be raped of all are coaching talent. Unless they do the part time set up like Edwards and Wales.

 

[j'nuh]

Has to be Mallinder. Glad to see he's the favourite as well. I mean, he's coached the Saxons, and then went away and had an excellent 4 years at Northampton, and has already made it clear he'd like to coach England. I'll be frustrated if it doesn't happen. Fingers crossed, he'll be allowed to choose his coaching team as well. (Set piece coaches can stay.)

Unless they do the part time set up like Edwards and Wales.

I want this to happen more than anything. I think it would do the assistant coaches good stead to be coaching even when internationals aren't on. If so, could Cockerill have a role in the coaching set-up?

 

[Teh Mite]

The Arr Eff You can Arr Eff Off.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Jim Mallinder seems to be the outstanding candidate. He's brought Northampton from England's second tier and turned them into one of Europe's top 4 or 5 teams. Players like Ben Foden, Courtney Lawes, Sione Tonga'uiha and Chris Ashton have blossomed under his guldance. He's proven himself at club level by getting the most out of ordinary players which will serve him well with England [/trolling].

Of the other options, I don't rate Nick Mallett as a serious candidate. Italy would have been far better off keeping Pierre Berbizier rather than going for the ex-Springbok coach. Under Berbizier they were making huge progress whereas under Mallett they took two steps back before taking one step forward.

Graham Henry would be the sexy pick but would he really be suitable? So soon after winning a World Cup, I can't imagine the challenge of coaching England would excite him greatly which would impact negatively upon performances.

Conor O'Shea appears to have a very bright future but it's probably too soon for him. He needs another 2 or 3 years of successful coaching behind him before he's ready for a top international job.

Richard Cockerill is a dick. That's why he won't get the job.

Jake White assisted by Eddie Jones could be an interesting call. White has had time out from coaching but his pedigree is undeniable. Jones has some knowledge of the English game and is a very good attacking mind. They worked really well as a team for South Africa.

 

[j'nuh]

^ White's just joined the Brumbies. He's also said he's not going to coach England after Johnson (although he didn't say he'd never coach England). I'm also unsure about Mallett. I'm not convinced he'll get the most out of our backs. It might be slightly harsh on him, considering he's probably played to Italy's strengths by relying on their pack, but Mallinder has Northampton playing the style of rugby that I want England to play. I wouldn't be rushing to see England play the style that Italy plays.

I'd also like to see Johnson stay somewhere within the coaching setup. He's got some experience now, and he knows how to marshall a pack, so give him the forwards coach role. With a head coach like Mallinder also guiding him, he could yet become a great coach.

 

[Teh Mite]

With Rob Andrew still involved I can hardly see anyone wanting the poison chalice that is the England role.

 

[m0rris]

As long as Andrew is there the blood letting is not over and Andrew will be forced out, he's made more than enough enemies of late. Rocking up to be the England head coach would probably be like rocking up in 1945 to be Hitler's military head.... ******* into the wind.

As for what would happen I'd think they'll go for a care taker soon enough, possibly the guy who runs the Saxons as he has a good record IIRC, and then bring someone in like Mallinder over the summer... I suspect it will have to be Mallinder as all of the big name international coaches are being snaffled by clubs. (I know that Bath are trying to get one in to replace Geech soon as well). Mallinder's a good enough cooach but I think it would be a shame to see him go from Saints as he does have plenty of unfinished business there.

 

[Teh Mite]

As long as Andrew is there the blood letting is not over and Andrew will be forced out, he's made more than enough enemies of late. Rocking up to be the England head coach would probably be like rocking up in 1945 to be Hitler's military head.... ******* into the wind.

Not so sure about that. Baron and Thomas long avoided the gallows while instead John Steel and even His Right Honourable Hanging Judge were sacrificed to the gods of Gin and Tonic. The secret handshake society have a way of pinning blame and brushing their history under the carpet.

Mallender would be the obvious choice, which gives even more reason for the Ar Ef You to pick someone else, a jolly good yes man.

Hasn't Richards ban only got a short while to go?

 

[m0rris]

Don't even mention Richards you'll give them ideas...

I think the difference now is that no matter how funny their handshake they are going to be the lastest target of the press in one of their head hunting seasons. Although I suspect that things at the RFU won't change enough up to the point when the premiership clubs waltz off into the sunset and tell the RFU too put it where the sun doesn't shine.

 

[gingergenius]

O'Shea cannot get the England job on the basis of 2 months of outstanding Quins form. Plus, he's Irish. You might as well suggest Mark McCall, for having a near-perfect 8 months in charge of Sarries, who is also Irish.

My first choice would be Jim Mallinder. He has an outstanding record with the Saxons Sale and Saints, and he's English. And Saints, more than any other team, play the style of rugby England have been trying for - big scrum, good lineout, aggressive pack, mobile back row, and some flair in the back 3. His best credential - he's got nothing to do with Leicester or Bath. Furthermore, he's managed to develop Ashton and Foden into international class players to name but a few. In fact, out of coaches with no Test experience, I think he's got by far the best CV. Were he to take over, there would be a huge hole for Saints - perhaps Mallinder would remain there in a consultancy role until the end of the season while doing the England job. What cannot happen is him delaying a takeover of the England job until the summer - we need to build a team, and we need to start in February.

Of the others, the best options would be White, Mallett and Henry, purely because of their Test experience. However, I'd be uneasy with them since none are English. Also, Henry wasn't great with Wales or the Lions; Mallett has been a little inconsistent, and White has done nothing for 4 years.

 

[Nobblynick]

RT @willcarling I am informed Rob Andrew is not to fall on his sword today due to current review he is conducting into the suitability of sword for the job. 

 

[m0rris]

How about McGeechan? He's like a rugby Doctor Who who will take you back about 10 years... i.e. the run up to the previous RWC. (I might be suggesting this in the vain hope that the rfu take idea and take the sack of rubbish out of Bath).

I don't think Bath will be on the RFUs default choice for this one as we haven't won anything or improved under any of our coaches the only ex Bath person up to the Job ATM is Robbo and that neither ended well last time nor is he availible today. If they go for Leicester then I will formally submit my application to become Irish as Cockerill is not the man I want in the job to say the least.

Mallinder should be the man but if I was him I'd hold tight for a bit and watch the RFU explode first for his own good. I agree about O'Shea he isn't the man for the Job as for the johnny foeigners White is with the Brumbies, Henry sounds like he's going to the Blues and that leaves Mallett who could earn his corn elsewhere with half the hassle.

 

[madflyhalf]

What about Toby Booth?

 

[Aristodemus]

I would be happy with either Henry or Mallinder.

 

[04perryo]

Maby Nick mallet