New Zealand v Australia

[Jethro]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bristol-iain @ Sep 21 2009, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wjd23104 @ Sep 21 2009, 06:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 20 2009, 07:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We have missed out that he was the highest try scorer in the Pacific Cup, scoring INTERNATIONAL tries in every Pacific match and I believe he scored 7 tries all together, and if people actually watched those game, they would realise his work rate was very high, and he also helped set up other tries.[/b]

You have got to be kidding me! International thats a laugh. what do you think would happen if the allblacks played these International level teams, i don't think i'm being aggrogant when i say Tonga Samoa Fiji and Japan Would struggle to stay within 60points of the ABs. Thats not international.
[/b][/quote]

Unfortunatley thats exactly what it is, pure arrogance. By the way you have defamed Samoa, Fiji etc and the way yo say they wouldn't get within 60 points is unfair.

Samoa, Fiji, Tonga are good teams in their own right, dont forget that a lot of the AB's players are Tongan Samaon etc by birth so think how mch better these teams would be if the Pacific Islander born Kiwi's played for the country of their birth.
[/b][/quote]

Rather than listening to the bollock on line name the current AB players born outside of New Zealand. From memory the Roc would be about the only one.

 

[Jethro]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (smartcooky @ Sep 21 2009, 10:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Woldog @ Sep 22 2009, 12:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Still says they finished at number 1.[/b]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Woldog @ Sep 22 2009, 12:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Just gonna put it out there but could it be the two with "Table position #1"...... or don't you have your glasses on gramps....[/b]

"Table position 1" means that they finished at the top of the table. That doesn't make them champions

"Semi Finalist" means they, ahem made the semi finals, and thats as far as they got

Your cane toad mate said they won TWO more than the Reds have made.



<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (C A Iversen @ Sep 22 2009, 12:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Disagreement is fine, but basic attitude problems are not what we want around here. He's distracted the topic from the issue, which isn't what we're looking for in new members.[/b]

Yeah, I managed to get sucked in to the tangent as well.

Never mind, it happens to us all

I like robust discussion, but I get mildly annoyed by people who post "FACTS" that aren't.

Posters that are too lazy to research before they make BS statements get no traction with me.
[/b][/quote]


Slight tangent, the trophey isn't being shared around much really :huh:

 

[Nickdnz]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jethro @ Sep 22 2009, 11:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bristol-iain @ Sep 21 2009, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wjd23104 @ Sep 21 2009, 06:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 20 2009, 07:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We have missed out that he was the highest try scorer in the Pacific Cup, scoring INTERNATIONAL tries in every Pacific match and I believe he scored 7 tries all together, and if people actually watched those game, they would realise his work rate was very high, and he also helped set up other tries.[/b]

You have got to be kidding me! International thats a laugh. what do you think would happen if the allblacks played these International level teams, i don't think i'm being aggrogant when i say Tonga Samoa Fiji and Japan Would struggle to stay within 60points of the ABs. Thats not international.
[/b][/quote]

Unfortunatley thats exactly what it is, pure arrogance. By the way you have defamed Samoa, Fiji etc and the way yo say they wouldn't get within 60 points is unfair.

Samoa, Fiji, Tonga are good teams in their own right, dont forget that a lot of the AB's players are Tongan Samaon etc by birth so think how mch better these teams would be if the Pacific Islander born Kiwi's played for the country of their birth.
[/b][/quote]

Rather than listening to the bollock on line name the current AB players born outside of New Zealand. From memory the Roc would be about the only one.
[/b][/quote]
You serious, I just posted a list, that took about an hour, on All Blacks born in the Pacific Islands, not to say they arn't New Zealanders, but their place of birth isn't New Zealand.

 

[Jethro]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 22 2009, 10:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jethro @ Sep 22 2009, 11:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bristol-iain @ Sep 21 2009, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wjd23104 @ Sep 21 2009, 06:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 20 2009, 07:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We have missed out that he was the highest try scorer in the Pacific Cup, scoring INTERNATIONAL tries in every Pacific match and I believe he scored 7 tries all together, and if people actually watched those game, they would realise his work rate was very high, and he also helped set up other tries.[/b]

You have got to be kidding me! International thats a laugh. what do you think would happen if the allblacks played these International level teams, i don't think i'm being aggrogant when i say Tonga Samoa Fiji and Japan Would struggle to stay within 60points of the ABs. Thats not international.
[/b][/quote]

Unfortunatley thats exactly what it is, pure arrogance. By the way you have defamed Samoa, Fiji etc and the way yo say they wouldn't get within 60 points is unfair.

Samoa, Fiji, Tonga are good teams in their own right, dont forget that a lot of the AB's players are Tongan Samaon etc by birth so think how mch better these teams would be if the Pacific Islander born Kiwi's played for the country of their birth.
[/b][/quote]

Rather than listening to the bollock on line name the current AB players born outside of New Zealand. From memory the Roc would be about the only one.
[/b][/quote]
You serious, I just posted a list, that took about an hour, on All Blacks born in the Pacific Islands, not to say they arn't New Zealanders, but their place of birth isn't New Zealand.
[/b][/quote]

If you could point me to the list it would be appreciated. You might also, just for the sack of argument compile lists of kiwi born players currently representing the three major Pac Island nations.

 

[smartcooky]

bristol-iain

Foreign born players in the current All Black squad

Muliaina (Manu Samoa)
So'oialo (Manu Samoa)
Jerome Kaino (American Samoa)
Joe Rokocoko (Fiji)
Sitiveni Sivivatu (Fiji)
Isaia Toeava (Manu Samoa)

Of these six (out of 33 in the current AB squad) only the two Fijians came to New Zealand as teenagers (Rokocoko at 13, and his cousin Sivivatu at 16). All the rest came here with their parents at pre-school or early primary school age. All the rugby they played during their formative years was in NZ. They grew up here, were educated here, and they came through the clubs and grades on the New Zealand rugby system.

To suggest that the Pacific Islands have somehow been ripped off because they play for NZ instead of their native country is just plain ridiculous.

For those who see a brown face in an AB team and immediately cry "poached"

More birthplaces
Hosea Gear - Gisborne
Ma'a Nonu - Lower Hutt
John Afoa - Auckland
Keven Mealamu - Tokoroa
Tanerau Latimer - Te Puke
Neemia Tialata - Lower Hutt
Piri Weepu - Lower Hutt

But if you want to hear a good joke
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

During an interview with the England Cricket team management when asked where the team will be staying when they come to South Africa for the ICC Cricket Champions Trophy â€" their answer was "the players will be staying with their parents"[/b]

:whistle3:

 

[C A Iversen]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (smartcooky @ Sep 22 2009, 02:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

bristol-iain

Foreign born players in the current All Black squad

Muliaina (Manu Samoa)
So'oialo (Manu Samoa)
Jerome Kaino (American Samoa)
Joe Rokocoko (Fiji)
Sitiveni Sivivatu (Fiji)
Isaia Toeava (Manu Samoa)

Of these six (out of 33 in the current AB squad) only the two Fijians came to New Zealand as teenagers (Rokocoko at 13, and his cousin Sivivatu at 16). All the rest came here with their parents at pre-school or early primary school age. All the rugby they played during their formative years was in NZ. They grew up here, were educated here, and they came through the clubs and grades on the New Zealand rugby system.

To suggest that the Pacific Islands have somehow been ripped off because they play for NZ instead of their native country is just plain ridiculous.

For those who see a brown face in an AB team and immediately cry "poached"

More birthplaces
Hosea Gear - Gisborne
Ma'a Nonu - Lower Hutt
John Afoa - Auckland
Keven Mealamu - Tokoroa
Tanerau Latimer - Te Puke
Neemia Tialata - Lower Hutt
Piri Weepu - Lower Hutt

But if you want to hear a good joke
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE

During an interview with the England Cricket team management when asked where the team will be staying when they come to South Africa for the ICC Cricket Champions Trophy – their answer was "the players will be staying with their parents"[/b]

:whistle3:
[/b][/quote]


Lol, England only need another 3 South Africans to make their cricket team a really top-knotch one. On top of that the English Rugby team don't have the island nations on their back door-step yet somehow got New Zealand born and trained Riki Flutey playing for them and had Tongan Lesley Vainakolo! Both of those boys learned their game in New Zealand. Yet we're the poaching villains, lol.

Thank goodness that there are some English fans who can actually commend the All Blacks for being a good team, they aren't the hypocrites. As for the rest, well.......laughable is one word.

 

[Nickdnz]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 21 2009, 09:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Some players include:

Lome Fa'atau: Born Wellington, New Zealand (Played for Samoa)
Earl Va'a: Born Wellington, New Zealand (Played for Samoa)
Trevor Leota: Born Aukland, New Zealand (Played for Samoa)
Junior Poluleuligaga: Born Otahuhu, New Zealand (Plays for Samoa)
Seilala Mapusua: Aukland, Newzealand (Plays for Samoa)
Gavin Williams: Aukland, New Zealand (Plays for Samoa)
Sailosi Tagicakibau: Aukland, New Zealand (Plays for Samoa)
Cencus Johnstone: Aukland, New Zealand (Plays for Samoa)
Justin Va'a: Wainuiomata, New Zealand (Plays for Samoa)
Joe Tekori: Aukland, New Zealand (Plays for Samoa)
Jonny Faamatuainu: Aukland, New Zealand (Plays for Samoa)
Sateki Tuipulotu: Aukland, New Zealand (Played for Tonga)
Sililo Martens: Aukland, New Zealand (Plays for Tonga)
Nicky Little: Tokoroa, New Zealand (Played for Fiji) All I can think of born in NZ.

Players born in Pacific Islands that have played for NZ (reminder this is all of them, where as the names I listed were only those I could name/find out about.

Jerome Kaino: Tutuila, American Samoa (Played for New Zealand 2004-Present)
Frank Soloman: Pago Pago, American Samoa (Played for New Zealand 1931-1932)

Bernie Fraser: Lautoka, Fiji (Played for New Zealand 1979-1984)
Arthur Jennings: Lautoka, Fiji (Played for New Zealand 1967)
Tabai Matson: Nausori Highlands, Fiji (Played for New Zealand 1995-1996)
Josevata Rokocoko: Born Nadi, Fiji (Played for New Zealand 2003-Present)
Sitiveni Sivivatu: Born Suva, Fiji (Played for New Zealand 2005-Present)
Dave Soloman: Born Levuka, Fiji (Played for New Zealand 1935-1936)
Joeli Vidiri: Born Nausori Highlands, Fiji (Played for New Zealand 1998)
Ronald Williams: Born Suva, Fiji (Played for New Zealand 1988-1989)

Sosene Anesi: Born Apia, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 2005)
Olo Brown: Born Apia, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 1990-1998)
Eroni Clarke: Born Apia, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 1992-1998)
Jerry Collins: Born Apia, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 2001-2007)
Alama Ieremia: Born Apia, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 1994-2000)
Casey Laulala: Born Moto'otua, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 2004-2006)
Christopher Masoe: Born Savai’i, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 2005-2007)
Mils Muliaina: Born Salelesi, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 2003-Present)
John Schuster: Born Apia, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 1987-1989)
John Schwalger Born Apia, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 2007-2008)
Rodney So'oialo: Born Moto'otua, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 2002-Present)
Isaia Toeava: Born Moto'otua, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 2005-Present)
Inga Tuigamala: Born Falesiu, Samoa (Played for New Zealand 1989-1993)

Pita Alatini: Born Nuku'alofa, Tonga (Played for New Zealand 1999-2001)
Walter Batty: Born (can't find out), Tonga (Played for New Zealand 1928-1931)
Sione Lauaki: Born Ha'apai, Tonga (Played for New Zealand 2005-2008)
Isitolo Maka: Born Longoteme, Tonga (Played for New Zealand 1998)
Charles Riechelmann: Born Nuku'alofa, Tonga (Played for New Zealand 1997)
Saimone Taumoepeau Born Ha'apai, Tonga (Played for New Zealand 2004-2005)
Kupu Vanisi: Born Nuku'alofa, Tonga (Played for New Zealand 1999)

That is the list of every Pacific born New Zealander. Why did I do that...I just spent over an hour researching those people. Oh my god. Please, I am a sick person, with obviously too much spear time. Oh god help me. Who in there right mind will read this list...well, that was a waste of time, and very much off topic...[/b]

Here is the list. There are many Kiwi born Samoans playing for Samoa, however the only player I know of Fiji, that was born in NZ was Nicky Little, and he dosn't play for Fiji any more. I'd say it is pretty even between number of Kiwi players playing for Samoa and visa versa.

 

[wjd23104]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 21 2009, 09:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wjd23104 @ Sep 21 2009, 08:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 21 2009, 08:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Fiji made it to the quater finals of the Rugby World Cup, beating Wales in the process, so I assume you believe beating Wales is an easy task, which is acheivable without an International standard squad? And is dosn't seem to be clear to a number of people myself included that the above mentioned are all faster then Hosea Gear. I would rate Hosea in the top 5 fastest wingers in NZ and within the top five for the amount of skill from a winger. I would consider not digging yourself into a deeper hole, as your opinions are appreciated, however your way of going about it seem to offend every which way. Again telling people to go do some research makes you come off as an idiot, and I have yet to see any really valid points from you so far. Yes NZ can beat Samoa, Fiji and Tonga on a regular basis, but to claim beating those teams is easy, and they arn't to international standards, especially with Fiji rated the 9th best team in the world, makes you sound like a fool.[/b]

What is invalid about saying there are more NZ born players playing for Tonga and Samoa than there are Samoan or Tongan born players playing for NZ. How is that Stupid? I believe the only starting ABs not born in NZ Are Toeava Mils and Rockoko. I can't find any info on the Tonga or Samoa Websites, Hell even Australia only lists when not where. I can't find any NZ born players listed on Fiji's Website (though Takicabau who played for taranaki didn't have his place of birth listed). But anyway some of Samoa's best players (not necessarily their best but famous anyway) were born in NZ Michael Jones (played for ABs as well obviously) Simo Sititi (former Captain and No.8) I think Brian Lima Was Born in NZ (don't quote me on that) i know last year there were quiet a few but admittedly i can't name any.

that better?
[/b][/quote]
My lists list several All Blacks to prove you wrong, which include Jerome Kaino, Joe Rokocoko, Sitivini Sivivatu, Mils Muliena, Rodney So'oialo, Isaia Toeava and Sione Lauaki. There are also many players in the Super 14 born in Samoa, but elligable for selection in New Zealand. I must say Fiji is pretty Kiwi free, and so is Tonga to a lesser extent, but Samoa is all most half people born in New Zealand. You said Simo Sititi was born in New Zealand where he was actually born in Moto’otua, Samoa. Please get your facts right.
[/b][/quote]
Wow thats impressive work. I was meaning to compare the last allblacks starting line-up (thats why i only listed the three in the post above) to the most recent Samoan Tongan and Fijian line ups because i figured those comparisons would favour me. But from your work and what i saw on the fiji website i'm willing to concede fiji and probably tonga. As you say Samoa has a strong kiwi contingent. I do feel however the claims that the ABs poach pacific island talent overlooks our contribution to the area and the fact that most PI's in the AB's have lived in NZ for most of there lives (think Jerry Collins) i wouldn't claim Jeremy Paul as a kiwi even though he was born here (i think). Did Simo Sititi Live in Wlg then? i always thought he was a Welly boy.

 

[Nickdnz]

Yeah, he lived here when he captained Wellington, I'm not sure what age he made the move. I agree that it isn't right to claim we poach other countries talent, especially considering that most of the players have lived here well before they began playing Rugby on a competitive level.

 

[InsaneAsylum]

do you guys want Quade Cooper back?

 

[wjd23104]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (smartcooky @ Sep 21 2009, 11:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 21 2009, 11:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It is impossible to make a statment that smartcooky wont eventually disprove with "facts" or "evidence",[/b]

Only if the statement is WRONG!!

Also, anyone who thinks Hosea Gear is not fast has rocks in his head

NZ Players 40 metre sprint times

Name - average (best)

1. Viliame Waqaseduadua - 4.60(4.49)
2. David Fa'alili - 4.74
3. Lelia Masaga 4.76
4. David Smith 4.76 (4.72)
5. Sosene Anesi 4.79 (4.53)
6. Rudi Wulf 4.88 (4.72)
7. Hosea gear 4.91 (4.85)
8. Anthony Tuituvake 4.93 (4.70)
9. Joe Rokocoko 4.93 (4.66)

Can't find a time for Sivivatu or Jane, but I imagine they will be up there with this lot.

I got these off AllBlacks.com about six months ago, but I can't find the original page now. Must have been wiped.
[/b][/quote] Well whose david Fa'alili? i recognise everyone else on the list. I wasn't completely wrong Masaga and David Smith were on my List no mention of Guilford and some of the others how do we know who was recorded and who wasn't? I don't think i said he was slow, just not one of the fastest,which appears to be wrong( my bad). Still surely Jane and Sivi are quicker.

In response to this thread not being about ABs wingers, surely you don't plan to bag the Aussies from now till Oct 31 and surely commenting on the make up of the team and performance of NZ players is related to this game and the upcoming rematch.

 

[smartcooky]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 22 2009, 05:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Smartcooky, out of interest I was wondering exactly where you got your results from in the speed 40m sprints. It's not that I doubt you or anything, it is just I am all ways interested in finding place I can compare wingers stats, and the ones you put up are very interesting.[/b]

Originally I got them off AllBlacks.com. They used to have a chatroom in the Fanzone, where one of the current squad would come on and answer questions. Luckily I copy and pasted that info at the time (I knew I would find it handy someday!!) They don't seem to have that chatroom now, or at least, I have been unable to find it.

However I recently found someone else had posted similar information in a yahoo forum, and a lot of the times matched, so I figure he must have been one of the people in the chatroom at the same time as me.

Here is a link to the yahoo forum

http://au.messages.yahoo.com/sports/rugby-...ussion/1739?p=2

 

[smartcooky]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wjd23104 @ Sep 22 2009, 05:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Well whose david Fa'alili?[/b]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/sport/2707...o-trophy-dreams

 

[danger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (InsaneAsylum @ Sep 22 2009, 05:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

do you guys want Quade Cooper back? [/b]

I wouldnt mind actually haha, i rate the guy. I think he made a terrible decision going to Australia. His game is Maori-Carlos Spencer style, he just makes **** up as he goes along. Thats not how the australians roll. They are all about the crisp moves and a smooth, polished style of play.

I think Quade Cooper would really cause some mischief in the Blues or 'Canes, playing amongst a whole lot of other guys playing a similar game.

 

[Nickdnz]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (smartcooky @ Sep 22 2009, 05:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Sep 22 2009, 05:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Smartcooky, out of interest I was wondering exactly where you got your results from in the speed 40m sprints. It's not that I doubt you or anything, it is just I am all ways interested in finding place I can compare wingers stats, and the ones you put up are very interesting.[/b]

Originally I got them off AllBlacks.com. They used to have a chatroom in the Fanzone, where one of the current squad would come on and answer questions. Luckily I copy and pasted that info at the time (I knew I would find it handy someday!!) They don't seem to have that chatroom now, or at least, I have been unable to find it.

However I recently found someone else had posted similar information in a yahoo forum, and a lot of the times matched, so I figure he must have been one of the people in the chatroom at the same time as me.

Here is a link to the yahoo forum

http://au.messages.yahoo.com/sports/rugby-...ussion/1739?p=2
[/b][/quote]
Cheers Smartcooky, however as I asked the question, I read in your original post that the page is gone, so I tried to edit the question out to make me look less stupid. Interesting times, a few I wouldn't have expected.

 

[InsaneAsylum]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (danger @ Sep 22 2009, 03:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (InsaneAsylum @ Sep 22 2009, 05:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

do you guys want Quade Cooper back? [/b]

I wouldnt mind actually haha, i rate the guy. I think he made a terrible decision going to Australia. His game is Maori-Carlos Spencer style, he just makes **** up as he goes along. Thats not how the australians roll. They are all about the crisp moves and a smooth, polished style of play.

I think Quade Cooper would really cause some mischief in the Blues or 'Canes, playing amongst a whole lot of other guys playing a similar game.
[/b][/quote]

i know what you mean, he's a flashy 10 similar to spencer. he did look alright when he came on for barnes against SA and you are right in saying that's not how we roll. all this talk about "playing what's in front of them" but they just seem confused

 

[Maccaweeny]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Prestwick @ Sep 22 2009, 12:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Woldog @ Sep 21 2009, 01:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Still says they finished at number 1.[/b]

(and really, I really want it to be true.... but then I don't because then I'd be showing sympathy to an Australian which is like showing sympathy to someone who has just kicked your dog)
[/b][/quote]

Ah another snipe, my internets would not be the same if it were any other way.

 

[Maccaweeny]

@ insane.

Man I don't think the change of structure is what the problem is. Our backline has shown it can function without relying on structured plays, but it needs a platform up front. I'll freely admit that it was a team effort that achieved a new level of ***** in Wellington, but the main problem DOES revolve around our forwards.

England used the same tactic against us in 2007, we'd be trying to consolidate the ball with two/three blokes and they'd just drive through and force a turnover or slow our ball down, and we were playing a structured game then. Our pack needs an overhaul, if not in players then in tactics. Commit to the rucks and stop putting forwards out in back-play.

I think we also need some size in our mid-field, Stirling Mortlock's absence is obvious.

 

[Jethro]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (smartcooky @ Sep 22 2009, 12:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

bristol-iain

Foreign born players in the current All Black squad

Muliaina (Manu Samoa)
So'oialo (Manu Samoa)
Jerome Kaino (American Samoa)
Joe Rokocoko (Fiji)
Sitiveni Sivivatu (Fiji)
Isaia Toeava (Manu Samoa)

Of these six (out of 33 in the current AB squad) only the two Fijians came to New Zealand as teenagers (Rokocoko at 13, and his cousin Sivivatu at 16). All the rest came here with their parents at pre-school or early primary school age. All the rugby they played during their formative years was in NZ. They grew up here, were educated here, and they came through the clubs and grades on the New Zealand rugby system.

To suggest that the Pacific Islands have somehow been ripped off because they play for NZ instead of their native country is just plain ridiculous.

For those who see a brown face in an AB team and immediately cry "poached"

More birthplaces
Hosea Gear - Gisborne
Ma'a Nonu - Lower Hutt
John Afoa - Auckland
Keven Mealamu - Tokoroa
Tanerau Latimer - Te Puke
Neemia Tialata - Lower Hutt
Piri Weepu - Lower Hutt

But if you want to hear a good joke
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE

During an interview with the England Cricket team management when asked where the team will be staying when they come to South Africa for the ICC Cricket Champions Trophy â€" their answer was "the players will be staying with their parents"[/b]

:whistle3:
[/b][/quote]

Thanks smartycookie was going to hit the rugbymuseum to get the info on current players. Last time this argument raised it's head, on another forum post Lions tour to NZ, did a similar list with similar results. The poaching charge does not hold up under scrutiny, but is brought up every now and again by various muppets *cough*Stephen Jones*cough*.

 

[Jethro]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (InsaneAsylum @ Sep 22 2009, 03:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

do you guys want Quade Cooper back? [/b]

As long as you play Dunning and Baxter in Japan it's a deal, Cooper can go play for Canterbury