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Northampton Borough Council & Saints have an Arguement

Teh Mite

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11:00


David Summers:
Good morning everyone and welcome to the webchat debate on the future development plans of Franklin's Gardens, the home of Northampton Saints.


On the panel today are the leader of Northampton Borough Council, Councillor Brian Hoare, chief executive of Northampton Saints, Allan Robson and Chron columnist and former Saints player, Jon Sleightholme.


The three panellists will debate the issues and answer each other's questions. To make the debate run smoothly, the panellists have been asked to keep their contributions concise and to the point.


Readers can also ask questions and make comments using the box below. All reader comments will be moderated prior to publication on the site and not all comments will necessarily be made live. Panellists will be specifically asked to answer certain questions rather than trying to answer every question.


First of all, can I check that all the panellists are in place and able to contribute to the debate.


Friday January 28, 2011 11:00 David Summers




11:00


Allan Robson:
Allan here!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:00 Allan Robson




11:00


Jon Sleightholme:
Jon here!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:00 Jon Sleightholme




11:01


[Comment From Cllr Brian HoareCllr Brian Hoare: ]
Good morning
Friday January 28, 2011 11:01 Cllr Brian Hoare




11:01


Jon Sleightholme:
Good morning all
Friday January 28, 2011 11:01 Jon Sleightholme




11:01


Allan Robson:
Morning to Brian and everyone reading wherever they are
Friday January 28, 2011 11:01 Allan Robson




11:02


David Summers:
Just to explain, we are having a few technical difficulties with Cllr Hoare's log in which is why it appears sligthly differently.


To begin, we will have a few opening statements. Jon, can you open with your comments, followed by Brian and then Allan.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:02 David Summers




11:02


Jon Sleightholme:
As a man on the street, I cannot understand why you would oppose the building of a small ASDA food store on Edgar Mobbs Way when your fellow Lib Dem councillors have vocally supported the Sainsbury’s extension on Weedon Road.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:02 Jon Sleightholme




11:02


ChronandEcho:
Debate on development of @SaintsRugby has now kicked off, pop over to our website to have your say or use #saintsdebate to chat via twitter [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:02 ChronandEcho




11:03


[Comment From Cllr Brian HoareCllr Brian Hoare: ]
Good morning everybody, I welcome the opportunity to take part in this Web Chat this morning as I hope that it will help a wider audience to understand the current situation with the Saints stand development and I hope this will help to make progress for the Saints. I have been a Saints supporter since the 1970's when I moved to Northampton, years before I became a councillor. The Saints help put Northampton on the map and as Allan Robson has said bring thousands of pounds into the Northampton economy. Therefore as the Borough Council we should do everything that we can to help the club to expand and be more successful. The Saints unveiled their proposal for the new Sturtridge Stand back in Nov 2009 and it is great shame that there has not been any progress as yet and that the Heinekin quarterfinal will be played at MK in April. What I want to do is make sure that the next time they reach the Heineken quarterfinals it is played at Franklin Gardens.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:03 Cllr Brian Hoare




11:05


David Summers:
Allan, would you like to respond to the opening comment by Cllr Hoare?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:05 David Summers




11:06


Allan Robson:
This is a sentiment that I think would be shared by the town as a whole, including businesses and residents. Our conservative estimate is that the H Cup quarter final in Milton Keynes will cost Northampton town centre businesses upwards of £1.5million.


Interestingly enough, we're playing at stadium:mk, which was built using enabling financing from ASDA and IKEA. No doubt we're going to come back to that later on, but in the meantime suffice that it is a complicated issue and we will cover lots of ground this morning.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:06 Allan Robson




11:06


David Summers:
Ok, thank you for the opening statements. Jon, would like to put your first question to Cllr Hoare please
Friday January 28, 2011 11:06 David Summers




11:07


Jon Sleightholme:
Reiterating my initial question to Cllr Hoare, as a man on the street, I cannot understand why you would oppose the building of a small ASDA food store on Edgar Mobbs Way when your fellow Lib Dem councillors have vocally supported the Sainsbury’s extension on Weedon Road.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:07 Jon Sleightholme




11:08


[Comment From Cllr Brian HoareCllr Brian Hoare: ]
I am happy to talk about the Sainbury's store which is yet to be approved by WNDC, their application was submitted 16 months ago and has been subject to long negotiation. there has been no application for an Asda store, so we do not know what size it is. I also would agree with Allan that the Saints bring a lot of benefit to the towns economy and we would want to continue to support the Saints to expand their stadium and play sell-out games at home.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:08 Cllr Brian Hoare




11:09


[Comment From stonysaintstonysaint: ]
wouldnt the logical solution be to sell FG and move lock stock to MK??
Friday January 28, 2011 11:09 stonysaint




11:09


[Comment From Sally WilkesSally Wilkes: ]
Last night on Anglia new Keith Barwell advised that to submit a planning application would cost £1,000,000.00, it is not therefore unreasonable that before the application is prepared and submitted that they seek approval in principle from NBC to the propsed dvelopment including ASDA before submitting the application?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:09 Sally Wilkes




11:09


[Comment From Grant GoodladGrant Goodlad: ]
If town centre shopping is such a priority why is the council not doing more to improve the town centre. the reality seems to be that the demand is not there, eg the empty woolworths shop
Friday January 28, 2011 11:09 Grant Goodlad




11:09


[Comment From JimJim: ]
As the man on the street I, cannot understand why one of the biggest and most widely supported clubs in the country cannot afford to fund the expansion itself without help from ASDA.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:09 Jim




11:11


[Comment From BarryBarry: ]
Cllr Hoare you and your fellow Lib Dem Councellors are aamnet in the local press about protecting town centre first why are you therefore so behind sainsburys extending there out of town store but not supporting the saints and asda in there bids to build new store and stand?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:11 Barry




11:11


[Comment From stonysaintstonysaint: ]
£1mil for a planning application? are they writing it in liquid gold on a piece of diamond encrusted moonrock?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:11 stonysaint




11:11


David Summers:
Allan, following Brian's comments, can you explain why the Saints have not yet put in a planning application
Friday January 28, 2011 11:11 David Summers




11:11


[Comment From JHJH: ]
Do the panel agree that funding the expansion through the sale is a more reponsible solution then assuming debt to pay for it. Especially in current economic times
Friday January 28, 2011 11:11 JH




11:11


[Comment From BrianBrian: ]
If Asda have NOT submitted a planning application, how can the council have rejected it?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:11 Brian




11:12


[Comment From Cllr Brian HoareCllr Brian Hoare: ]
In response stonysaint: I do not believe that Keith Barwell wants the Saints to move out of Northampton, we therefore all want to see a solution at Franklin Gardens
Friday January 28, 2011 11:12 Cllr Brian Hoare




11:12


Allan Robson:
Sally Wilkes has hit the nail on the head. In all the discussions that have been had with NBC leaders there has been nothing but stonewalling towards the idea of an ASDA on the site.
The cost of preparing and submitting a planning application is in the order of £1million. When faced with such a stonewalling attitude why would this money be spent when the Lib Dems have made it clear that they are upholding the Town Centre First policy and that the Saints/ASDA proposal falls outside this.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:12 Allan Robson




11:13


[Comment From Grant GoodladGrant Goodlad: ]
Surely the answer to Jim's comment is that the club want to fund the development themselves - by using their resources in the deal with ASDA. It is the planning issue that isa problem
Friday January 28, 2011 11:13 Grant Goodlad




11:13


[Comment From stonysaintstonysaint: ]
look i love FG, ive been going their since the days of packman but it looks naff with that bingo hall there. a move to mk would mean we could really compete with tigers & the top french teams
Friday January 28, 2011 11:13 stonysaint




11:14


[Comment From UnicobblerUnicobbler: ]
At the risk of high jacking this debate we also need to remember that the council have contiuned to reject every bid made by the Cobblers wether it be housing or shopping. It appears the council are happy for both our sporting teams to suffer and risk both moving out of the town
Friday January 28, 2011 11:14 Unicobbler




11:15


[Comment From Cllr Brian HoareCllr Brian Hoare: ]
Sainbury's and Asda are used to making planning applications and understand the costs involved. There have been significant new investments in the town centre recently, further progress has been made, and I understand the Woolworths store will be opening shortly as a new Tesco.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:15 Cllr Brian Hoare




11:16


Allan Robson:
In reply to Jim: Let's remind ourselves that we are a rugby club and our prime purpose is to be successful on the pitch. Rugby union at this level is also a business, and funding playing success is dependent on commercial success.
Saints have made a profit, albeit sometimes small, for the last 10 years. But like all of us we have a choice of how we spend that money.
Put simply, if we spend money on interest payments from the loan taken on for a new stand, we shall not be able to spend that money on improving our squad, the performance department, our community work and so on.
In short, loan payments will take money away from the playing effort.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:16 Allan Robson






11:16


[Comment From craige craige: ]
Mr. Hoare are you going to stake your political career on the idea that saints will not moove that being that you have any career left after May 2011!!!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:16 craige






11:16
Jon Sleightholme:
Cllr Hoare as a Season Ticket Holder and shareholder of the Saints, do you think it would be wise in the current economic climate for the club to saddle themselves with such debt?


Especially when there is a perfectly logical solution available to the club which will also, I believe, put approximately £6million back into the pockets of taxpayers through the sale of land to ASDA
Friday January 28, 2011 11:16 Jon Sleightholme






11:18
Allan Robson:
Response to Brian Hoare: Yes, ASDA and Sainsbury's would be only too aware of those costs, and given the continuing objections in principle by NBC Lib Dem leaders it is not unreasonable for them to be thinking twice about spending that type of money at the moment.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:18 Allan Robson






11:18


[Comment From SA SA: ]
A move to Mk will mean that an awful lot of staff in Northampton area will lose their jobs on match days. I work at FG on match days and earn good money for what i do, but a move to MK will put me and others out of a job and the local economy will suffer without that extra money that will go to MK area economy instead.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:18 SA






11:18
David Summers:
Cllr Hoare will pick up the points from Allan first then the point from Jon
Friday January 28, 2011 11:18 David Summers






11:18


[Comment From billingsaint billingsaint: ]
I am assuming stonysaint is from Stoney Stratford-near MK. remember we are Northampton Saints not MK Saints
Friday January 28, 2011 11:18 billingsaint






11:18


[Comment From John John: ]
What is the situation regarding L&G's future plans for the grosvenor centre development, particularly in the current economic climate? This seems to be a major stumbling block, but we've heard that Tesco are already thinking of opening up the former PO sorting office in Barrack Road which can hardly be classed as "Town Centre"
Friday January 28, 2011 11:18 John






11:20
David Summers:
Should be getting a response from Cllr Hoare shortly
Friday January 28, 2011 11:20 David Summers






11:20


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Allan has refereed to the Town Centre Policy. Residents across Northampton have been demanding a strong and vibrant town centre. This national policy reinforces the local approach that each application for out of centre retailing will be judged on the merits of the proposal and its potential impact on the town centre. Asda should make an application so it can be fully considered.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:20 Cllr Brian Hoare






11:20
Friday January 28, 2011 11:20






11:21


[Comment From JH JH: ]
Cllr Hoare. Can you explain how the Town First policy is benifiiting the average man on the street. Especially when L&G have procrastinated for 10+ years. We lost Ikea to MK do you want to loose Saints to MK as well?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:21 JH






11:21


[Comment From Brian Brian: ]
Saints make regular profits, unlike most rugby clubs. Saints is a business and should be prepared to invest in it's self rather than crying that they can't bully their way to a freebee.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:21 Brian






11:21


[Comment From Grant Goodlad Grant Goodlad: ]
In reply to Cllr Hoare, putting a Tesco in Abington Street is hardly likely to attract shoppers to the town centre, is it? The argument that the town centre shopping should be given priority lacks credibility
Friday January 28, 2011 11:21 Grant Goodlad






11:21


[Comment From billingsaint billingsaint: ]
New significant in the town centre recently? Is it the stunning fountain on the market square your'e talking about
Friday January 28, 2011 11:21 billingsaint






11:22
David Summers:
Just to remind readers that not all questions will be answered by the panel as there are so many coming in but your comments are appreciated
Friday January 28, 2011 11:22 David Summers






11:22


[Comment From Barry Barry: ]
Mr Hoare how can you say that you are in support of a strong town centre when you are allowing sainsburys to extend there ouof town store and tescos to build on e former PO site on Barrack Road both out of town. Its makes no sense to me
Friday January 28, 2011 11:22 Barry






11:22


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
who these days go into the town centre to carry out their food shopping
Friday January 28, 2011 11:22 mike d






11:22


[Comment From Ben Miller Ben Miller: ]
I honestly dont see what the problem is with the developement of Franklins Gardens, as much as i can gather is that saints will have a bigger stadium bringing in more money to the northampton economy and local residents have a greater choice in supermarkets and asda would support any further local developments. Bring 15+ thousand saints fans into northampton on saturday im sure a majority would go into the town centre to browse or celebrate etc
Friday January 28, 2011 11:22 Ben Miller






11:22


[Comment From Martyn Martyn: ]
As 67 year old Northamptonian and a Saints suporter for some 60 years I despair. For decades we have endured 'backward' thinking 'city fathers'' and the lack of fore sight by them spells yet another nail in Northamptons coffin. MK must be laughing all the way to the bank. Come on all of you get this soughted so that the Saints can retain its status as one of the best grounds in Europe.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:22 Martyn






11:22


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
As I understand it, is it not central government policy to oppose out of town development? Not actually the borough councils? The expansion of an excisting store is different from building a whole new store and the impact will be minimal compared to a whole new store. Think of the traffic in that area is already poor. A new store would make it utterly chaotic around there.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:22 Jim






11:23


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Jon, I know that the Saints would prefer for some one else to pay for the Stand i.e. ASDA but that does not mean that they could not find other ways of financing the stand. The Saints are a success club that I have supported since moving to Northampton in the 1970’s. It has created a great stadium at Franklins Gardens in the last 10 years from its own finances. The Saints are a profit making Rugby Club. Their last annual accounts showed a profit. As a share holder myself, I do not expect the club to give that money to share holders but to continue to plough it back into making the club even more successful.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:23 Cllr Brian Hoare






11:23
Allan Robson:
Brian, when considering the Sainsbury's proposed extension, the NBC planning committee report states: "The lack of diversity and food range choice on the western side of Northampton is apparent, and there is an acknowledged need for a qualitative improvement in convenience offer on this side of town."
Would you agree that an ASDA on Edgar Mobbs Way would also fit in with this assessment?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:23 Allan Robson






11:24


ChronandEcho:
#saintsdebate is getting pretty lively now over on the website, if you have an opinion on Asda, Franklin's Gardens, town centre etc join in [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:24 ChronandEcho






11:24
Jon Sleightholme:
Cllr Hoare - also, does the Sainsbury-Tesco monopoly in the town not go against the Competititon Commission’s views. I understand that in this situation, neither supermarket should be granted further planning permissions and that newcomers should be welcomed to offer a better competitive picture to the local consumer.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:24 Jon Sleightholme






11:24


[Comment From mkSaint mkSaint: ]
Brian,Selling land to build a stand is not a "freebee"
Friday January 28, 2011 11:24 mkSaint






11:24


[Comment From craige craige: ]
So Mr. Hoare by saying that saints can invest in themselves are you saying that the Libdems have no intention ever of giving any kind of support th our local sports clubs??? Saints make regular profits, unlike most rugby clubs. Saints is a business and should be prepared to invest in it's self rather than crying that they can't bully their way to a freebee.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:24 craige






11:24


[Comment From Big Bird Big Bird: ]
The Saints is an integral part of the local community and has been for many years. From my perspective both sets of my grandparents lived in the shadows of Franklins Gardens and one grandfather played the odd game at fullback for what would now be the Wanderers. To contemplate relocation of the Saints to an out of town, or even a new town does not bear thinking about.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:24 Big Bird






11:25


[Comment From Unicobbler Unicobbler: ]
How many jobs would be created at the new Asda as well as the contracts for building the Asda that the council are rejecting.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:25 Unicobbler






11:25


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
Out of all of northampton sporting teams the saint are only the top flight team we have. i think we should back them all the way. i strongley beleave if this was a football team playing at the hight of the game they would have no problem in getting all the support they need.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:25 mike d






11:26


[Comment From Annie Annie: ]
I liave in St James next to FG and would love to see Asda here, a lot of people cannot afford to shop in sainsburys. Yes I am also a season ticket holder . As for traffic there are not games every day so don't think it would be a problem
Friday January 28, 2011 11:26 Annie






11:26


TPMarshall15:
wow just realised the #saintsdebate live webchat in on @ChronandEcho website now. this shoud be interesting [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:26 TPMarshall15






11:26


[Comment From JH JH: ]
If Saints weren't profit making would Cllr Hoare still insist that they should pay for it through debt?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:26 JH






11:26


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Allan, It is not for me to make that judgment, once an application has been submitted, planning officers at both WNDC and the Borough Council will provide professional advice to the Planning committee as to whether the application is in line with national and local planning policies.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:26 Cllr Brian Hoare






11:26


[Comment From Hackleton resident Hackleton resident: ]
Cllr Hoare your inconsistancy is frightning for someone in control of Northamptons future (until May!).
Friday January 28, 2011 11:26 Hackleton resident






11:27
Allan Robson:
In response to Brian (not Cllr Hoare - 11:21): Yes, the club continues to invest in supporting the playing effort and our other work in the community. However we also have a responsibility to our supporters, shareholders and the town at large to in maintaining the club for future generations. We have seen elsewhere that clubs have got into massive difficulties servicing debt - Leeds Utd, Cardiff City etc - and we want to avoid this.
WE have found a company willing to invest with us. We would be selling our lease on land, and would be receiving finance in return that would fund the stand. Also it should be remembered that the taxpayer would also benefit from the deal, receiving 50% of the proceeds.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:27 Allan Robson






11:27


[Comment From Unicobbler Unicobbler: ]
to mike d. So becuase Saints are succesful the Cobblers and Steelbacks have to suffer? Why not support all our teams so we can be the most succesful sporting town in the country
Friday January 28, 2011 11:27 Unicobbler






11:28
David Summers:
Councillor Hoare, you've been answering a fair few questions, what points would you like to put to Allan and Jon?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:28 David Summers






11:28
Allan Robson:
Thanks for the comments, Ben Miller, who is showing that people do understand the whole picture.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:28 Allan Robson






11:29


[Comment From Philip Philip: ]
It is clear the Cllr is not going to budge from his stubborn views that unless an application is made then he cannot discuss it further. What a pointless debate.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:29 Philip






11:29


[Comment From james james: ]
i live this side of town - we have sainsbury's - and that's it. If you walk into town by the canal - it's a corridor of industrial depriation and wasteland that has great potential. I'm for the Asda development as we should be developing brownfield sites and improving what we have - not scaring away investors.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:29 james






11:29


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
Brian: You allure to the idea said "finding other ways to fund the stadium expansion". Can I enquire what you suggest is a better way then utilising their current resources while equally providing a service to the local residents of St. James. As a resident of the area - who has spent nearly 18 months out of work through no fault of my own, I am all too aware what benefit a new store would offer the local community in services and employment opportunities.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:29 Chris






11:29
David Summers:
In the meantime, panellists feel free to answer any of the points raised by readers
Friday January 28, 2011 11:29 David Summers






11:29


[Comment From Unicobbler Unicobbler: ]
Cllr Hoare, surely the clubs and the council should discuss this first prior to submitting an expensive application as neither can afford to submit multiple applications once they have been rejected.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:29 Unicobbler






11:30


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
I do support all are teams and many years ago worked at sixfields. i just feel if it was a foot ball team playing at this level they would get the backing.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:30 mike d






11:30


brionyjcolbert:
The #saintsdebate is getting lively now :) @ChronandEcho is doing a good job! [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:30 brionyjcolbert






11:30


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Allan, Will you agree with me that the rugby fans want to know why you have not put in a planning application for your stand to be extended? having publicised the stand in Nov 2009. They would also want to understand why Asda, have made no formal approach to the Borough Council which would give them the opportunity of discussing their proposals.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:30 Cllr Brian Hoare






11:30


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
roll on May , cant wait
Friday January 28, 2011 11:30 Guest






11:31


[Comment From billingsaint billingsaint: ]
Councillor Hoare and your colleagues,-why don't you have a bit of vision for the town for once and stop thinking first and it seems only about what the owners of the Grosvenor Centre want? I hate to say it ,but the people that run MK stand for everything about vision andplanning that you don't
Friday January 28, 2011 11:31 billingsaint






11:31
David Summers:
Allan, can you reply to Cllr Hoare on that point
Friday January 28, 2011 11:31 David Summers






11:31
Allan Robson:
Cllr Hoare: We could find other ways of financing the stand. But they would cost us in terms of interest repayments and capital repayments.
We would rather invest that money into the playing effort and helping to keep the team on its present upward curve. Would you rather, as a supporter, that this money go instead to the banks rather than the team?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:31 Allan Robson






11:31


TRF_Bullitt:
This should be interesting, plenty of hollow excuses I suspect from the soon to be former council #saintsdebate @chronichleandecho [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:31 TRF_Bullitt






11:31


ThomStitt:
@ChronandEcho #saintsdebate, would have loved to but security said no, have emailed ITsupport @Kaspersky, will there be a transcript later? [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:31 ThomStitt






11:31
Jon Sleightholme:
In response to the comment 'So because Saints are succesful the Cobblers and Steelbacks have to suffer?' I would disagree. The Cobblers are suffering with regards to their future development due to backward thinking of the powers that be.


The Saints have been vocally supportive of the Cobblers' development plans and vice versa.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:31 Jon Sleightholme






11:31


[Comment From Big Bird Big Bird: ]
The council assert that they must protect the town centre and (thereby local traders,) which would be an admirable policy if only it was one that they held for other businesses in the town. Are the Lib Dems being held to ransome by Legal and General or do they simply favour town centre retailers above other businesses. Also, what is the difference between the Saints benefitting from a developer's (in this case Asda's) investment in the local community when the council take similar 'consideration' payments from other developers for rights to develop.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:31 Big Bird






11:31


[Comment From Brian Brian: ]
The bottom line is that without a planning application for a new North Stand there will Never be an HG Quarter Final at FG.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:31 Brian






11:32
Allan Robson:
To Unicobbler: The propsed ASDA would create up to 400 new jobs and would represent a £40million investment in the St James area of the town
Friday January 28, 2011 11:32 Allan Robson






11:33


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Surely a expansion of FG would not have been complete in time for this quarter final anyway so the club would still be in the same position?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:33 Jim






11:33


[Comment From Unicobbler Unicobbler: ]
£1,000,000 planing bid - Rejected... £1,000,000 planning bid - Rejected.... Chron Headline... Saints go Bankrupt. Get real councillor. If you dont change your attitude you will be welcoming the jobs at Asda come may
Friday January 28, 2011 11:33 Unicobbler






11:33


[Comment From Annie Annie: ]
Cllr Hoare keeps going on and on about Saints not putting in a planning application, but £million spent just for a no would be a waste of anyones money.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:33 Annie






11:33


[Comment From Grant Goodlad Grant Goodlad: ]
In response to Cllr Hoare's question to Allan, as a fan I can understand why the club will not put in an application for the stadium development unless linked with the ASDA application to secure funding.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:33 Grant Goodlad






11:33


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
What is the point in submitting an application if any pre-app advice that has been sought has stated that an application would be refused? Would just be a waste of time and money.I take it this must be the case here
Friday January 28, 2011 11:33 Guest






11:33


[Comment From Unicobbler Unicobbler: ]
Jon... I agree, my post was in response to another. Cobblers support Saints on this and Saints Support Cobblers. The only ones not supporting at the council
Friday January 28, 2011 11:33 Unicobbler






11:35


TRF_Bullitt:
95% of the vote saying "yes". PRetty resounding what the residents of Northampton want @libdems @ChronandEcho #saintsdebate [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:35 TRF_Bullitt






11:35
Jon Sleightholme:
Cllr Hoare - Regarding the relationship with L&G, can you explain to me why, when Brian Binley MP put in a freedom of information request about the detail of the agreement, was 95% of it redacted?


This creates an air of suspicion by not being open and honest to the electorate.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:35 Jon Sleightholme






11:35


[Comment From Hackleton resident Hackleton resident: ]
Cllr Hoare your actions have been to the detriment to the Cobblers and the Saints yet National companies have been allowed anti town centre development at Weston Favell, Wellingborough Road, Weedon Road and probably Barrack Road. Do you see a contridiction in you actions? Other councils (including Lib Dems) around the country have allowed sporting clubs to use enabling funds to expand. Why do you think you are right and all the other councils are wrong.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:35 Hackleton resident






11:35


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Nobody said an application would be refused. Its not the NBCs decision. Regardless of whether they support it or not they will not make the choice. The choice is made in line with national policy.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:35 Jim






11:36


[Comment From SA SA: ]
There are a lot of business in St James who's finances are hugely 'bumped' up on a match day and no doubt help to keep these businesses afloat. Without the matchday economy St James could 'roll over and die'. We already may lose our local library, then perhaps the other businesses too if The Saints have to move out of the area.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:36 SA






11:36


[Comment From Grant Goodlad Grant Goodlad: ]
Will the Coucil take notice that the running total of votes in this debate shows 95% in favour of the ASDA/FG development?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:36 Grant Goodlad






11:36


[Comment From Jay Jay: ]
I agree with Chris. Any opportunity to harness investment and job opportunities in this day and age must be grabbed with both hands. Let's get in the real world!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:36 Jay






11:37


[Comment From james james: ]
remember councillor. YOU WORK FOR US.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:37 james






11:38


[Comment From craige craige: ]
Brian I think you are taking all of us as fools the other panelests people writing in and the general voting public with the same respons to almost every question asked.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:38 craige






11:38


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Allan, Your approach is wrong if you want to see a quick development at Franklin's Gardens. By linking the stand development to an Asda application it could be many years before any progress is made at Franklins Gardens.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:38 Cllr Brian Hoare






11:38


[Comment From Lily Lily: ]
I think the town needs a big Asda as the one in Kingsthorpe is very limited. I would definitely use it. If the development helps the club at the same time it really seems to be a no brainer.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:38 Lily






11:38
Allan Robson:
To Cllr Hoare: We would be prepared to submit a joint planning application. However before then we need the Homes and Communities Agency to agree to the change of use from a car park to a food retail store, subject to planning approval being subsequently given and 50% of the proceeds going to the HCA for the taxpayer.
The Lib Dems leadership has made their opposition clear to the HCA, whose "one voice" policy makes it hard for them to go against the wishes of the NBC leaders. This is both denying the Saints funding, the local community jobs and choice of shopping - which the NBC planning committee says that west Northampton needs - and the taxpayer income.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:38 Allan Robson






11:38


[Comment From Pamela Pamela: ]
I cannot understand why the council does not want the ASDA development. People do not go into the town centre to do their weekly shop, so it will have little or no effect having ASDA at Franklins Gardens. Does the council not remember when the Bingo Hall was a supermarket? The only thing we can think is that the council is somehow in the pockets of L & G, and since we have waited for over 10 years for them to sort something out is laughable. The Saints are frankly the only good thing about Northampton, they are a credit to the town and fantastic ambassadors. The fact that we have to travel to Milton Keynes for a very important match is appalling, this makes it an away match when we should have been playing at home. I think the council is being very small minded and parochial, thank goodness the elections are due in the not too distant future so we can get rid of this wishy washy bunch and have a council who are forward looking and energetic.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:38 Pamela






11:39


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
We also already have another ASDA in the Northampton. How many supermarkets do we really need? 2 morrisons, 2 sainsburys the list is endless!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:39 Jim






11:39


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Pamela, don't assume everyone works the same way you do. Plenty of people use the town centre for their weekly shop.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:39 Jim






11:40


[Comment From Philip Philip: ]
Bit of a stalemate then. The Saints won't put a planning application in unless they know they are going to be successful and the Council won't comment on how successful the application will likely be unless there is an application. There is therefore NO DOUBT the Saints will soon move to MK.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:40 Philip






11:40


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
I agree with the votes issue.... 95% want the development here. You are elected to represent the people of Northampton - the people clearly want this development to go ahead and be funded by ASDA.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:40 Guest






11:40


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
Wasn't there plans to build an asda on the Wellingborough Rd. between abington and weston favell? Let the saints expand - There a premiership team !! - build the asda in abington, I'm sick of seeing that eyesore building site sitting there doing nothing!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:40 Kieran






11:40
David Summers:
Jon, Cllr Hoare will be picking up your point on L&G next
Friday January 28, 2011 11:40 David Summers






11:40


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
This is the same council that routinely spouts "how they want to save the town centre", yet removed half of the market square and waste massive portions of their budget on naff lights in the town and a fountain on the Market square. They're a joke.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:40 Chris






11:41


[Comment From Big Bird Big Bird: ]
It would seem that Cllr Hoare is suggesting that the Saints should do what the Lib Dems did with their recent Homes project, i.e. spend £1m (or £750k in the case of the Lib Dems) to find out that your proposal has been declined. That is not good business for a sporting club who has a small surplus, nor was the Lib Dems idea of spending £750k to see if they could saddle local taxpayers with £100m of PFI debt which we would have been paying for the next 30 yrs
Friday January 28, 2011 11:41 Big Bird






11:41
Allan Robson:
To Unicobbler: We are supportive of the Cobblers and the Steelbacks.
We have also been discussing with the council this issue. The problem is publicly the Lib Dems say one thing - which usually goes down the line of 'yes, we support the Saints'. But privately they say that they will not change their town centre first policy.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:41 Allan Robson






11:42


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
jim. and all these supermarkets are busy and well used so yea their is room for more
Friday January 28, 2011 11:42 mike d






11:42


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Also as i stated earlier even if everything had gone ahead does not mean the improvements would be complete in time for this match. Meaning the saints would still have had to go to MK.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:42 Jim






11:42


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
A fountain that never works at that!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:42 Kieran






11:42


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
The Market square is far better now than it was. It is also IN the town centre!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:42 Jim






11:42


[Comment From Sally Wilkes Sally Wilkes: ]
Sadly it loks like we will have to wait until May this year to ensure a change of policy in Northampton Borough Council. Were these not the same people who prevented IKEA being at Grange Park? Narrow minded and blinkered,Northampton people need to turn out and vote at the local elections to get Councillors who listen to the people and not bury their heads in the sand to the detriment of the town
Friday January 28, 2011 11:42 Sally Wilkes






11:42


[Comment From Brian Brian: ]
Other Rugby Clubs are moving on and expanding thier grounds. Saints are filling FG week-in week-out. But still management dither about supporting the loyal fans with a viable investment. The ASDA issue is a smoke screen for a Lack Of Business Commitment. If the plan had been sibmitted back in 2009 we could have been hosting the HG QF at FG this year with the revenue going to Saints. Management have let the fans down, stop blaming someone else.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:42 Brian






11:42


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
If Saints move to MK, I will no longer follow them. If Saints move away, I also imagine many people won't have reason to remain in the town.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:42 Chris






11:42


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Mike D: Is there room for a large supermarket in St. James? The road there are bad enough already!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:42 Jim






11:43


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Jon, Stop clutching at straws, what Saints fans want to know is when will the stadium be expanded so that Heineken quarter-finals are played at home. The only way this will will happy is for the Saints to be positive about making an application for the expansion of the stadium.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:43 Cllr Brian Hoare






11:44


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
No your right they would still ahve to play this game in mk. but would be one of the last times we would have to do this
Friday January 28, 2011 11:44 mike d






11:44
Jon Sleightholme:
Cllr Hoare - Isn't the policy of the new coalition government about 'localism?' This means that if the people want it, they will get it. The strength of feeling in this debate from the general public suggests that a massive majority are supportive of the Saints/ASDA plans.


Surely this is localism and you are not listening to the voice of the community?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:44 Jon Sleightholme






11:44


[Comment From Barry Barry: ]
Mr Hoare please explain the logic of the saints spending £1 million pounds on an application that NBC do not support
Friday January 28, 2011 11:44 Barry






11:44


[Comment From JH JH: ]
Cllr Hoare will you not admit that the council is contractually obliged to do L&G's bidding and that even if the Lib Dems are replaced in May it won't make a difference because of the L&G agreement
Friday January 28, 2011 11:44 JH






11:44


polish_giant:
@ChronandEcho #saintsdebate why r the council being small minded n not realised saints stadium lead to more money for the town and more jobs [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:44 polish_giant






11:45


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
And the only way for that to happen Cllr is for the Council to remove their heads from their rectum and realise the ball is in their court
Friday January 28, 2011 11:45 Chris






11:45


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
I am in favour of FG expanding but do not feel that an ASDA store in that location. Mike D: Still can be.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:45 Jim






11:45
Allan Robson:
To Cllr Hoare (11:30): Brian, you are boringly consistent! To reiterate my previous point, you, by putting pressure on the HCA, are effectively preventing them granting us a conditional change of use consent for the car park, without which a planning application would be pointless.
The application would cost in the region of £1million - this is a lot of money.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:45 Allan Robson






11:45


[Comment From Unicobbler Unicobbler: ]
I would love to be in the council offices when the application goes in and the councillors have to have a meeting t think up a new excuse for doing nothing
Friday January 28, 2011 11:45 Unicobbler






11:45


[Comment From John John: ]
Playing for time councillor? Only 15 minutes to go and you haven't said anything that's added to the store of information - what a surprise!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:45 John






11:45


[Comment From Grant Goodlad Grant Goodlad: ]
Cllr Hoare's reply to Jon is disengenuous and evasive - he knows that the ASDA development is the link for funding as the Club very responsibly wants to avoid debt funding.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:45 Grant Goodlad






11:45


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
the roads are busy on a mach day but so are all the shops in st james
Friday January 28, 2011 11:45 mike d






11:45


[Comment From Annie Annie: ]
I went to Leicester recently and they seem to have it all, good town shopping, good out of town and fantastic stadium, how come they can get it right and here so wrong. This council can say whatever they want today and until May when hopefully we will get a more enlightened one. I would hate Northampton Saints to move anywhere else they belong here.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:45 Annie






11:45
David Summers:
Just for information, we are happy to let the debate go past noon to ensure everyone has an opportunity to have their say
Friday January 28, 2011 11:45 David Summers






11:46


[Comment From james james: ]
There's definitely a need for a supermarket this end of town… what with the St Crispins development and the land earmarked for development the population is growing and we have one only accessible supermarket. I certainly won't go into town anymore with the ridiculous parking policy.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:46 james






11:46


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
Put it this way, If the saints move, I can see a big change in the next elections, It's going to be seen as the council being to fault and the fans will be angry about it. - I just think your all stuck in the past? You want to bring the town to life and your actually deciding over a bigger stadium for Heineken games that will attract people from all over england and parts of europe or an ASDA? madness.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:46 Kieran






11:47


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Mike D So you think making them even busier all the time and ridiculous during match days will help?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:47 Jim






11:48


[Comment From craige craige: ]
Lily Your turn of frase "no brainer" describes the current council leadership and their approach to business development, job creation and support to the local comunity and their sports clubs very well.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:48 craige






11:48


[Comment From richard richard: ]
have counicl done deal with sainsburys and tesco to keep town center stores to keep out asda ??????
Friday January 28, 2011 11:48 richard






11:48


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Allan, HCA will make their own decisions about the disposal of their land and NBC has no interference on this matter what so ever. The Liberal Democrats have not tried to influence HCA on this matter. You can make a joint application at anytime, you do not need the approval of HCA to make your application.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:48 Cllr Brian Hoare






11:48
Allan Robson:
Hackleton Resident (11:35): YOu are absolutely right. 60% of new stadium development - be it stands or new grounds completely - has been funded by retail development, includsing Milton Keynes, which will now benefit from another £1.5million courtesy of NBC's intransigence.
It is worth noting that 'the other Saints', i.e. St Helens Rugby League club, are about to move into a brand new stadium, funded by Tesco and supported by St Helens Council - led by Lib Dems...
Friday January 28, 2011 11:48 Allan Robson






11:49


ChronandEcho:
#saintsdebate heating up on website! Allan Robson called Brian Hoare 'boringly consistent', Hoare urged club to 'stop clutching at straws' [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:49 ChronandEcho






11:50


DJKieranJones:
RT @ChronandEcho: #saintsdebate is getting pretty lively now over on the website, if you have an opinion on Asda, Franklin's Gardens, to ... [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:50 DJKieranJones






11:50


[Comment From Unicobbler Unicobbler: ]
Can we get all the political parties to sign a pledge saying they support both developments like the lib dems did with student fees. O wait, that didnt work did it!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:50 Unicobbler






11:50


TRF_Bullitt:
@ChronandEcho #saintsdebate The Lib Dems are doing an excellent job of earning their P45s in the next local election. [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:50 TRF_Bullitt






11:50


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Also if this area for developemetn is presently a car park then where will all the current fans park? Let alone the extra ones?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:50 Jim






11:50


[Comment From SA SA: ]
The new ASDA store wont be on Weedon road but on Edgar Mobbs Way, so traffic wont impact via St James/weedon road too much.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:50 SA






11:51


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
The council are very narrow minded when it comes to out of town expansion! As someone has already said no one goes into town to do a food shop! Having an ASDA in st James or the expansion of sainsburys at sixfields would have no effect on the town centre! Funnily enough Tesco had no opposition when they expanded at hunsbury!! Does that mean they are stopping growth within the town or just that Tesco line the pockets of the council better! The council needs to the see the town as a WHOLE and not just the centre!!! Look at other cities! They have plenty of out of town expansion and it doesn't stop them it enhances them! Wake Up!!!!!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:51 Guest






11:51


[Comment From Martyn Martyn: ]
Is Cllr Hoare saying 'the only way to resolve this is for the Saints and or ASDA to put in a planning application. If Yes want is the point of this debate? Other to confirm the vast majority of people participating are in favour of the ASDA store and the development of FG.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:51 Martyn






11:51


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
but would it their is that road leading off st james mill road that runs right behinde the saints. if people who didnt want to shop at asda or watch the rugby they could buy pass st james on this
Friday January 28, 2011 11:51 mike d






11:51


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
You say this craige, its not a helpful comment first of all, but also the town centre is improving and being regenerated. So somethings going right clearly!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:51 Jim






11:51


[Comment From Jay Jay: ]
Without wishing to go over 'old' ground again, it seems clear what the public want. As Jon say's, it is the council's responsibility to represent our wishes. Perhaps they (as individuals) are less optimistic about there own futures! Could be??
Friday January 28, 2011 11:51 Jay






11:51


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Allan, You are misleading the public it is a matter your assertion is wrong.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:51 Cllr Brian Hoare






11:51


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
Richard I think the council have done a deal with Tesco!! Massive site in hunsbury! Sainsburys at sixfields not allowed to expand and ASDA not allowed at all!!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:51 Guest






11:51


[Comment From Barry Barry: ]
Cllr Hoare justadmit it you do not support the development of the saints ground.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:51 Barry






11:51


[Comment From Brian Brian: ]
If ASDA wanted to play they'd have put in a planning application, but they have not. Have they got cold feet.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:51 Brian






11:52


[Comment From billingsaint billingsaint: ]
Whilst I have no problem with "Jim" venting his views on here, it does seem that he is the only one that is 100% with Councillor Hoare on just about everything,whether its about Saints, ASDA,town centre policy,are you the only member left of the liberal party?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:52 billingsaint






11:52


[Comment From MODERN MAN MODERN MAN: ]
hmm, not sure the idea of giving a piece of taxpayer-owned land to an american capitalist company (WALLMART) sits too easily for me. i'm out
Friday January 28, 2011 11:52 MODERN MAN






11:52


[Comment From John John: ]
Jim, there's plenty of car parking space the other side of Edgar Mobbs way which has never been opened on a regular basis
Friday January 28, 2011 11:52 John






11:52


[Comment From Barry Barry: ]
Cllr hoare it is not Mr Robson misleading the public. It is you and your fellow councillors on NBC
Friday January 28, 2011 11:52 Barry






11:53
Jon Sleightholme:
Cllr Hoare - The fact that you haven't answered my question or been open with the information that Brian Binley requested indicates that there is something that you are trying to keep from the public. It begs the question, who is actually in charge of planning, you or L&G?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:53 Jon Sleightholme






11:53


lemayol:
RT @ChronandEcho: #saintsdebate heating up on website! Allan Robson called Brian Hoare 'boringly consistent', Hoare urged club to 'stop ... [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:53 lemayol






11:53


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
Has pre-application advice been sought from planning, and if so, what did it indicate?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:53 Guest






11:53
Allan Robson:
Cllr Hoare (11:38): The only reason it would be many years is because of your blind opposition!
We're not asking for it to be approved in advance. We're asking for the freedom to put in an application that should be considered on its own merits and in conjunction with your planning committee's acknowledged requirement for west Northampton, and taking into account the views of the local community. Last year over 2,000 people in Northampton overwhelmingly supported the idea of a new ASDA store in the area. 89% of the survey said that out of town supermarkets would be even more acceptable if they brought additional benefits. Are you suggesting that the Saints do not bring additional benefits to Northampton?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:53 Allan Robson






11:53


[Comment From mkSaint mkSaint: ]
Are there any thoughts on a "clean" protest at the QF at Stadium:mk, in support of the clubs plans.Nothing silly or disruptive.Maybe a pull out from the Chron with some sort of slogan on it that could be displayed to the worlds media at the game.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:53 mkSaint






11:54
Allan Robson:
Cllr Hoare: Just give the HCA the free ability to give CONDITIONAL consent to changing the use of the land. In other words, fulfil the wishes of the NBC motion back in early December!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:54 Allan Robson






11:54


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
There is another Brian who seems to be supporting as well. Simple fact is I have investigated the facts for myself and not relied on the word of councillors, the club or the chornicle, all of whom are likely to be biased in some way.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:54 Jim






11:55
DanielOwens:
Jim - news editor of the Chron here, I can guarantee you we are not biased in any way, shape or form!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:55 DanielOwens






11:55


jharrisonchron:
It's all kicking off in the #saintsdebate. I can hear a constant whisper and frantic tapping of keys from the blue corner sat behind me. [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:55 jharrisonchron






11:55


[Comment From MODERN MAN MODERN MAN: ]
disappointing too that the saints are totally in bed with these venture capitalists. what would edgar mobbs say?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:55 MODERN MAN






11:56


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
I dont understand what it is that we are defending in Northampton Town Centre that ASDA would impact.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:56 Chris






11:56


[Comment From Paul - Duston Paul - Duston: ]
I live in Duston and to me and many other people, Jimmy's End is effectively the town centre anyway. The Asda development would be attracting people in to the area who might otherwse shop elsewhere and so surely that would be to everyone's benefit? Also, I find the council's support for the expansion os Sainsbury's Weedon Road store (one mile away from Franklins Gardens) baffing. It's entirely inconstent with it's position regarding the Saints/Asda plans. I feel strongly that our councillors are more interested in wielding power and protecting their own interests than in taking a holistic view of the benefits the development would bring to the town as a whole.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:56 Paul - Duston






11:56


jharrisonchron:
#saintsdebate I've been corrected. The yellow corner is sat behind me... [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:56 jharrisonchron






11:56


TRF_Bullitt:
@ChronandEcho #saintsdebate 94% of your voters say they want the ASDA Cllr Hore, are you going to give them what they want? [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:56 TRF_Bullitt






11:57


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Allan, I invite you to put in an application to be judged on its merits.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:57 Cllr Brian Hoare






11:57


[Comment From Mike Brown Mike Brown: ]
Editor: you will say what sells papers.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:57 Mike Brown






11:57


[Comment From Brian Brian: ]
As a matter of LAW. All planning applications have to be considered on their own merits
Friday January 28, 2011 11:57 Brian






11:57


[Comment From truth truth: ]
The council appear to have a hidden agenda, is it Tesco's? do the council want to kill off Northampton. Why do we have to pay 5p per litre extra for fuel because Asda are being squeezed out by the Council.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:57 truth






11:57


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
Isn't there already an asda AND and iceland in St. James, How many groceries do you need!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:57 Kieran






11:57


[Comment From james james: ]
@jim - how about a "saints park and ride". or a park and ride in general? there' too much reliance on cars here and there's no integrated policy from the council on this score either.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:57 james






11:57


JeffersonLake:
#ntfc fans who like deja-vu - have a read of the #saintsdebate on the Chron website. Lots of familiar things being said on both sides... [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:57 JeffersonLake






11:58


80pies:
#saintsdebate same old same old [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 11:58 80pies






11:58
Jon Sleightholme:
Cllr Hoare - You haven't answered any of my questions. Wasn't that the purpose of this whole debate?!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:58 Jon Sleightholme






11:58


[Comment From JH JH: ]
Cllr Hoare. Why won't you answer questions about L&G?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:58 JH






11:58


[Comment From Annie Annie: ]
A fountain and lights do not regenerate a town, most people do not even notice them and I cant see any company saying 'oh they have a lovely fountain, lets work there'. Business is more likely to come if we have good sports teams which provide a focus for the town.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:58 Annie






11:58


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
Didn't realise there was support for the sainsburys store expansion at sixfields thought that was due to be rejected as well!!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:58 Guest






11:58


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
@kerian - no
Friday January 28, 2011 11:58 Chris






11:58


[Comment From Annie Annie: ]
No Asda in St James Kieran
Friday January 28, 2011 11:58 Annie






11:59


[Comment From Paul Flatt Paul Flatt: ]
If we want our town to be successful, we should be backing winners. Just count the number of empty shops in the centre, count the charity shops and slot machine arcades. The town centre first policy is a busted flush and the Saints & Cobblers are hung out to dry to protect pride. Shameful.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:59 Paul Flatt






11:59


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
@james No objection to a park and ride scheme. Who pays for it though?
Friday January 28, 2011 11:59 Jim






11:59


[Comment From james james: ]
@kieran the population is expanding this side of town. there's already a lack of infrastructure. what infrastructure there is, is badly thought out
Friday January 28, 2011 11:59 james






11:59


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
I agree with the park and ride idea, good for the environment too!
Friday January 28, 2011 11:59 Kieran






11:59


[Comment From Grant Goodlad Grant Goodlad: ]
Cllr Hoare simply repeats the invitation to put in an application. Please respond to the debate
Friday January 28, 2011 11:59 Grant Goodlad






11:59


[Comment From Philip Philip: ]
Jon, Allan. Don't you get it yet? You have to apply for planning first. If you feel that this cost is too high or that you feel it would probably be rejected then fine. But that is a business decision and its clear from this stubborn Cllr that this is your ONLY option if you want to develop FG. If the application is rejected then you can canvas for support but until then this whole discussion is pointless.
Friday January 28, 2011 11:59 Philip






12:00


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
I'm sure there is another supermarket opposite Iceland? - And there is a large sainsburys on sixfields which is a 5 min walk from st. james?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:00 Kieran






12:00


therugbyforum:
It's all kicking off in Northampton!!! Viva la revolution! #saintsdebate [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 12:00 therugbyforum






12:01


[Comment From Brian Brian: ]
I am a season ticket holder of many years an find Mr Robsons blaten politicing excetionally objectionable. Mr Robson please put your money where your mouth is and make a planning application to extend FG without further dalay.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:01 Brian






12:01


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
Kieran, there is an Aldi opposite Iceland
Friday January 28, 2011 12:01 Guest






12:01


[Comment From Mike Brown Mike Brown: ]
see if you wernt biased you would of my last comment
Friday January 28, 2011 12:01 Mike Brown






12:01
Allan Robson:
To all: To answer the recurring point as to the question of whether the Saints would move out of Northampton.
Firstly, we are called Northampton Saints. Our home is here and has been for 130 years. We do not wish to move anywhere, and given the size of our site we should not have the need to.
The chances of success on the pitch are greatly improved with investment in the team and players and the support operations. Saints are forced to survive on revenues generated from a 13,500-capacity stadium, which is now only the sixth smallest in the Premiership. Some of the other clubs - Bath, Wasps etc - have plans to build bigger grounds, enabling them to generate further income. This would put us further behind in relative terms and therefore less likely to be able to compete on the pitch.
Furthermore, if the team remains successful, as it stands Northampton as a town will see fewer and fewer games at the Gardens as we will be forced to move games elsewhere. For 18 months we have been saying this - now it is happening.
Surely the people of Northampton should be entitled to watch their team play in their town. But this can't be done in a 13,500-capacity stadium.
And surely we shouldn't have to make a choice between success as a club and presence in Northampton.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:01 Allan Robson






12:01


[Comment From james james: ]
mmm Aldi. nice
Friday January 28, 2011 12:01 james






12:02


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Jon, I have answered the questions in the limited time available, I am to meet and give fuller answers to your questions. I would like an answer to the question why haven't the Saints made an application for a new stand, 16 months after raising the expectations of the supporters of a 17k seater stadium
Friday January 28, 2011 12:02 Cllr Brian Hoare






12:02


[Comment From Sally Wilkes Sally Wilkes: ]
Putit to the vote of the electorate- that will sort it one way or the other, the local elections could be intersting this year- provided the other parties voice their support for the devlopment! I like the idea ofa supporters "protest" at stadium MK just to show the rest of the country and europe rugby supporters what we have to put up with in trying to be the best team in Europe
Friday January 28, 2011 12:02 Sally Wilkes






12:03


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
If you don't like Aldi james, why don't you go to sainsburys which is up the road, Asda is in the same "Budget supermarket" category as Aldi so that remark is pretty invalid.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:03 Kieran






12:03


[Comment From MODERN MAN MODERN MAN: ]
but i'm always reading in the chron about how much money the saints are making every year???
Friday January 28, 2011 12:03 MODERN MAN






12:03


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
Cllr Hoare - You have answered NOTHING. Please stop pretending otherwise ande let's for once have an honest answer.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:03 Chris






12:03


[Comment From Emma Emma: ]
Why does the Cllr not realise a chance to heineken cup matches at the Gardens could benefit the entire town.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:03 Emma






12:04
Jon Sleightholme:
Philip - Everyone knows that whether you are building a garage or a food store, you speak to the planners first to gauge wheter your plans are acceptable or need adapting. It is evidently clear from converstions that the Saints have had with the authorities that there is no way they will accept the proposals on the table with ASDA. So why bother wasting £1million on the planning process when you know it will be rejected?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:04 Jon Sleightholme






12:04


[Comment From Grant Goodlad Grant Goodlad: ]
Cllr Hoare - your last response to Jon simply repeats yourself. You are insulting our intelligence
Friday January 28, 2011 12:04 Grant Goodlad






12:04


[Comment From james james: ]
so my choice is sainsbury or sainsbury then? you missed my point that the population is growing with HCA earmarking land south of St Crispins. You need to have infrstructure BEFORE you build all these new houses.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:04 james






12:04
Jon Sleightholme:
Cllr Hoare - See previous response to Philip!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:04 Jon Sleightholme






12:05


[Comment From craige craige: ]
i thought at first it was a bad idea having this debate at this time of day but i now beleave if it had been later on the website would have gone into melt down.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:05 craige






12:05


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Sally Wilkes: The other parties will probably say they support the clubs, all of them. that is just popularist politics. It won't change the situation other than to say if the council changes hands they will have to admit its not their decision and they cannot sway the planning office.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:05 Jim






12:06


[Comment From Brian Brian: ]
Question for Mr Robson; Is the vast expansion of Tigers ground at Welford Road being funded by a supermarket?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:06 Brian






12:06


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
cllr Hoare is that an open invertation to the the whole of northampton to come and speek in more detail ?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:06 mike d






12:06


[Comment From Philip Philip: ]
Jon. Exactly. So move on.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:06 Philip






12:06


[Comment From Sally Wilkes Sally Wilkes: ]
NBC would like the cost of the planning application to go in their pockets- and then reject the application-simples!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:06 Sally Wilkes






12:06


[Comment From mkSaint mkSaint: ]
A good example of how this will hurt local buisness is the fact that the land lord of the foundry arms took more money in a day when we played Munster last year then he ever has in a week.Im sure the Ulster supporters will be just a thirsty.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:06 mkSaint






12:06


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
Sainsbury or Ice Land, I live in Abington, We have a choice of Weston Favell (TESCO) or lidl and i'm sure as hell people can make do with it, I'm pretty sure a lot of this is just down to lazyness, People want an asda in St. James because they don't want to go that extra half a mile to another store.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:06 Kieran






12:06
Allan Robson:
To Cllr Hoare (11:48): That is not what the HCA have said to us, Brian.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:06 Allan Robson






12:06


[Comment From Sally Wilkes Sally Wilkes: ]
Jim: the planning comittee is the elected councillors!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:06 Sally Wilkes






12:07


[Comment From Paul Flatt Paul Flatt: ]
Will the Borough undertake a study of the economic contribution to the town from the Saints, (and Cobblers and Steelbacks) - not in terms of business rates, but in terms of turnover contributed to local businesses and in terms of free publicity to the town? Let's measure what we might start to lose.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:07 Paul Flatt






12:07


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
I would like to see what happened on appeal if an application is turned down.... overwealming local support, creation of jobs, funding provided to a very successful local sports team that does lots of work in the community...
Friday January 28, 2011 12:07 Guest






12:07
Allan Robson:
To Cllr Hoare (11:51): We are misleading no one, but to what do you refer?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:07 Allan Robson






12:08


[Comment From Emma Emma: ]
I have to agree with Paul Flatt has the council looked into this?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:08 Emma






12:08


[Comment From billingsaint billingsaint: ]
Councillor Hoare, as a fellow season ticket holder, I would not like to be in your shoes if the unthinkable happens and we are forced to turn up at MK for the first match of the season. Hold on a minute,I would not go there in the first place!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:08 billingsaint






12:08
David Summers:
Thank you to everyone who has taken part in the debate, we will be asking for closing statements from each of the panellists shortly. Readers, please make any further comments as soon as possible
Friday January 28, 2011 12:08 David Summers






12:08


[Comment From Paul - Duston Paul - Duston: ]
I'm proud of Northampton and the Saints but I'm ashamed of our council. I voted Liberal llast time but never again.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:08 Paul - Duston






12:09


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
Typical politicians if you ask me. They're only out to line their own pockets and in reality don't give a stuff about the people they supposedly represent.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:09 Chris






12:09


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
@Sally Wilkes : Nope, it is not
Friday January 28, 2011 12:09 Jim






12:09
Allan Robson:
To Brian (not Cllr Hoare): No ASDA have not got cold feet, indeed they have this week extended their agreement with us by a further 12 months confirming their commitment to the project
Friday January 28, 2011 12:09 Allan Robson






12:09


[Comment From Michael Reid Michael Reid: ]
This is a deeply depressing read. We have a town that is a dreaful state. We have a suyccess in the aints providing work and revenue to the town and all the Council leader will say is the same boring ''put in an application'' - having made it crystal clear that the council will not supporter the ASDA development to pay for it.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:09 Michael Reid






12:09


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
Allan, We do not know what the HCA have said to you but we do know that the Borough Council have not sought to influence the HCA on this matter.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:09 Cllr Brian Hoare






12:09


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
if the saints moved to mk. what would happen to fg would it stay empty because it couldnt get the backing.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:09 mike d






12:09


[Comment From Brian Brian: ]
A reply from Mr Robson about Tigers expansion would be interesting please.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:09 Brian






12:10


[Comment From james james: ]
politicians. ugly or untrustworthy. or both. where's the passion?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:10 james






12:10
David Summers:
Okay, thank you for all your comments. Brian, Jon and Allen, would you please make your closing statements
Friday January 28, 2011 12:10 David Summers






12:10


[Comment From MODERN MAN MODERN MAN: ]
i don't see how anyone can accuse the council of looking to line there own pockets. its the saints that are getting into bed with the american venture capitalists
Friday January 28, 2011 12:10 MODERN MAN






12:10


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
I also did not vote liberal, as i knew there narrow minds would destroy our town.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:10 Kieran






12:10


[Comment From Philip Philip: ]
Allan. Moving out of Northampton is not your only option so stop threatening your supporters with this. If you are adamant that you will not get planning to develop FG but want to keep Northampton Saints in Northampton then find a new site in the Town and apply for planning there. If you move to MK for instance you would have exactly the same costs and the same process involved.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:10 Philip






12:10


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
mike d - This council would probably build an Asda on it.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:10 Chris






12:10
Jon Sleightholme:
Excellent idea on behalf of the Chronicle & Echo for making this debate happen. It is evidently clear that the vast majority of people in the town support the Saints/ASDA plans, as I have stated on many occasions. Democracy means people power and I am sure that the verdict of this ongoing debate will be felt at the ballot box. Thank you to everyone who has taken part.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:10 Jon Sleightholme






12:10


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
Good luck john with this and you have large backing and support keep up the fight
Friday January 28, 2011 12:10 mike d






12:11


[Comment From Anon Anon: ]
I'd like to see the civic reception this council give the Saints when they bring home the HK again...should be fun...if they are still there that is
Friday January 28, 2011 12:11 Anon






12:11


[Comment From Grant Goodlad Grant Goodlad: ]
It's just occurred to me that Beacon bingo used to be a supermarket so what's the problem in replacing it with another one?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:11 Grant Goodlad






12:11


[Comment From Paul Flatt Paul Flatt: ]
Roll on the local elections in May.!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:11 Paul Flatt






12:11
Allan Robson:
To Cllr Hoare (11:57): You want Saints to submit an application without ASDA so that you can recommend its approval, although we would be able to do nothing about it without the funding from ASDA.
Brian, the electorate are not stupid. The comments on this debate show that.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:11 Allan Robson






12:12


TRF_Bullitt:
#saintsdebate I think it's fair to say the council lost that "debate" be nice if they actually had anything to say at all mind... [via Twitter]
Friday January 28, 2011 12:12 TRF_Bullitt






12:12


[Comment From Michael Reid Michael Reid: ]
Tigers have a 24000 stand - but then their council supported their development- their council wanted to keep Tigers. Ours seems to want to drive Saints elsewhere. You cannot run a top club with less than 15000 capacity.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:12 Michael Reid






12:12


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
chris wouldnt put it past them
Friday January 28, 2011 12:12 mike d






12:12


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
I think moving the saints would be a waste of a stadium and valuable resources ! Environmental issues should be considered? do you need to move if you don't get what you want? (although I am backing saints expansion)
Friday January 28, 2011 12:12 Kieran






12:12


[Comment From JH JH: ]
A debate is only a debate if people join in. Sadly we have not had a debate here today. Cllr Hoare seems to be afraid to answer questions
Friday January 28, 2011 12:12 JH






12:12


[Comment From Philip Philip: ]
A change of council wont change council policy, we've seen the Torries, they are no different.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:12 Philip






12:13


[Comment From SA SA: ]
FG can only EVER be used for Rugby, nothing else!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:13 SA






12:13


[Comment From Michael Reid Michael Reid: ]
No top club can survive without being at least the size of their competitors. And Saints dosn't lose money and depend on handouts.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:13 Michael Reid






12:14


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
Philip - At least Brian Binley would have influence then. He's in favour. Whatever happened to hi going over the councils head and taking the issue to parliament?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:14 Chris






12:14


[Comment From mike d mike d: ]
think the cllr has set an outo responce and is having a free lunch at sainsburys
Friday January 28, 2011 12:14 mike d






12:14


[Comment From Grant Goodlad Grant Goodlad: ]
Phillip (12.10) I haven't noticed Allan threaten supporters with moving
Friday January 28, 2011 12:14 Grant Goodlad






12:15


[Comment From Brian Brian: ]
Brian Binley is only in favour of what is popular
Friday January 28, 2011 12:15 Brian






12:15


[Comment From MODERN MAN MODERN MAN: ]
@mike d-- i dread to think how many 'free lunches' asdaWALMART has bought mr robson and co
Friday January 28, 2011 12:15 MODERN MAN






12:15


[Comment From Michael Reid Michael Reid: ]
Simple question. Will the Council help the Saints to ensure the necessary permissions are legally obtained for their scheme ? - or not ?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:15 Michael Reid






12:16


[Comment From graham v graham v: ]
northampton need's a long term plan in general for the whole town.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:16 graham v






12:17


[Comment From Emma Emma: ]
All I can say is that if we had a top flight football club this would not be happening as they get what they want everytime
Friday January 28, 2011 12:17 Emma






12:17


[Comment From billingsaint billingsaint: ]
All I can say is Councillor Hoare-roll on May 2011. Even if it makes only a slightly better situation, it will hopefully see the end to you and your colleagues self feeding arrogance and intransigance. Remember you were put there to serve the people, not dictate to us.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:17 billingsaint






12:17


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
@Michael Ried: they can't do that. The Borough councillors are not the ones making the decision.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:17 Jim






12:17


[Comment From Unicobbler Unicobbler: ]
Cardoza and Summers to stand for office in May!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:17 Unicobbler






12:17


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
Brian - And what IS popular is the proposed developments of Asda and Franklins Gardens. That's why he's likely to keep his seat while Cllr Hoare is much more unlikely to retain his place in a council at this rate
Friday January 28, 2011 12:17 Chris






12:18


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
This expansion funded by ASDA is clearly popular.... The population clearly wants it... APPROVE IT!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:18 Guest






12:18


[Comment From Michael Reid Michael Reid: ]
We need to back winners now. Backing developers who don't deliver has proved an error for many years.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:18 Michael Reid






12:18


[Comment From Paul Flatt Paul Flatt: ]
Someone send Bernie out to find the Councillor! We're waiting for his closing remarks.....
Friday January 28, 2011 12:18 Paul Flatt






12:19


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
Clearly the Guild Hall is being as indecisive as per usual.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:19 Chris






12:19
David Summers:
We're just letting reader comments come in, along with the closing remarks from Allan Robson and Cllr Hoare
Friday January 28, 2011 12:19 David Summers






12:19


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
the population don't want it, only those who debate at 11 in the morning, I'm sure a public vote would see otherwise!!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:19 Kieran






12:19


[Comment From Michael Reid Michael Reid: ]
Only 93% want it !
Friday January 28, 2011 12:19 Michael Reid






12:19


[Comment From Adviser1958 Adviser1958: ]
Is the Modern Man simply a traditionalist in conspiracy theorist's clothing. The partnership proposed is quite benign. Councillor Hoare is a consumate politician in his avoidance of the answer to a simple question. I trust his future lies elsewhere where he can do less harm.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:19 Adviser1958






12:19


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
The public vote attained 89% in favour Kerian. You I assume were one of the 11% minority?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:19 Chris






12:20


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Also people stating the "93% of voters want the stadium to go ahead" does not represent the whole town. there must be approx. 50-80 odd people here and not all of them will have voted. Hardly a wide spread vote. Kieren beat me to it.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:20 Jim






12:20


[Comment From Unicobbler Unicobbler: ]
Is there a full poll on the Chron Website? If not can you put one up
Friday January 28, 2011 12:20 Unicobbler






12:20


[Comment From Emma Emma: ]
Keiran (12.19) really and you speak for the population do you?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:20 Emma






12:20
Allan Robson:
Closing statement:
Thank you to everyone for taking part, and especially the Chron for organising the debate this morning. We have certainly welcomed the opportunity to clarify our position. We are a little bit disappointed, however, that we have heard nothing new from Cllr Hoare other than 'submit your application'. There have been some succinct questions and we have tried to answer the ones aimed at us.
The support on the poll today echoes the survey conducted in March 2010, and I hope that Brian Hoare and the rest of the Lib Dem leaders have taken note, who are here to represent the community of Northampton rather than push their own agenda.
Brian, remember that it's not too late to change your mind. If this debate today is reflected in the local elections (just three weeks after the H Cup quarter final) you will have led your team to a dismal defeat, completely unnecessarily.
However our doors are always open for further, proper and constructive discussion.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:20 Allan Robson






12:20


[Comment From Scotty Scotty: ]
Guest, Approve what? wont counicl need am application before they can approve or refuse anything?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:20 Scotty






12:20


[Comment From Philip Philip: ]
Grant. Then read Allan's post of 12:01
Friday January 28, 2011 12:20 Philip






12:20


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
93% means nothing, 10 people could have voted and shifted that poll, silly!
Friday January 28, 2011 12:20 Kieran






12:21


[Comment From Chris Chris: ]
If more then 7% of the population are not keen on the idea, they should have voted. If you don't vote, you don't have a say. This IS a public vote.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:21 Chris






12:21


[Comment From Jim Jim: ]
Nothing new from you either Mr Robson.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:21 Jim






12:21


[Comment From John John: ]
Little point waiting for Councillor Hoare's closing remarks, we all know they will just be regurgitation of his single and only comment on the situation
Friday January 28, 2011 12:21 John






12:22


[Comment From Kieran Kieran: ]
I only knew this was going on because I logged on to twitter before my lecture this morning, are you saying the population of northampton should all be out of there beds and logged on to the chrons website by 11 each day to await polls?
Friday January 28, 2011 12:22 Kieran






12:22


[Comment From Cllr Brian Hoare Cllr Brian Hoare: ]
All, Through this debate many issues the public may not have been aware of have been raised. Unlike Allan I do not believe this is about an election, it is about the future of our town. The Saints have identified a key issue which relates to the HCA and the Saints/Asda requirement for their conditional consent. I repeat this is a matter entirely for them. The Borough Council remains committed to supporting the Saints and as we said in November 2009, when I met with Keith Barwell, and reaffirmed at a recent meeting. The only things the fans want to see is the Saints playing at home in a bigger stadium, promoting Northampton and the local economy. Thanks to all contributors, Cllr Brian Hoare.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:22 Cllr Brian Hoare




12:23David Summers:
I would like to take this opportunity of thanking everyone for taking part this morning, our panellists Councillor Brian Hoare, Allan Robson and Jon Sleightholme, and to all the readers who submitted comments. Reaction and extracts from this debate will be in tomorrow's Chronicle & Echo.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:23 David Summers






12:23


[Comment From Michael Reid Michael Reid: ]
This isn't the EU- you don't get folk to keep voting until they agree with you.The debate was widely publicised. If folk choose not to vote that is their right. But to claim 93% isn't a majority is silly.
Friday January 28, 2011 12:23 Michael Reid


12:23


[Comment From Guest Guest: ]
I think the decision will have to be escalated... take it out of the hands of local planning and concil.
 

TRF_Olyy

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I didn't read the majority of that, I'll admit, but the general jist of it seems to be:
the council are f**ing retarded not allowing Saints to upgrade FG.
Not just because of any potential finals that could be held there, but for the new ASDA that'll be built creating jobs in the area

Stubborn @r$€holes.
 

Teh Mite

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I didn't read the majority of that, I'll admit, but the general jist of it seems to be:
the council are f**ing retarded, Stubborn @r$€holes.

To paraphrase. And yes.

Cllr Hoare didn't even have the decency to answer a question, instead copy-pasting the same answer again and again. It'll be a Tory or Labour council come may.

Oh, and the vote on there went 93% in favour of the development, 7% against.
 

Feicarsinn

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Hardly surprisng that, the people want to keep the team in the town and if development of FG is needed then so be it. How long has this been raging on now? 4 years?
 

gingergenius

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OK, the issue seems to be that Saints want to expand FG, with the help of a new Asda store. They won't apply for planning permission because it's expensive they think it'll be rejected.

Northampton isn't a part of the countryside. So there can be no environmental reasons why a town wouldn't want a new supermarket. And surely the people of the town would not only want a new supermarket; those that are Saints fans would want a bigger stadium and businesses would make more money from matchdays.

Opposition? Well it would have to come from competition, either other food retailers or other sporting clubs. Starting with sport, I cant believe the football club would care. I've only heard of Northampton Town because of Football Manager; it's a rugby town. So food retailers are the competition. Fair enough, in a lot of places supermarkets but local butchers, grocers etc. out of business. However, there's no petition from these guys against the construction of a new Asda, and petitions from small businesses tend to get ignored anyway. It's big business that has influence on politicians.

The conclusion to draw? The Northampton council are in the pockets of Sainsburys/ other supermarkets in the area. An Asda would mean more competition and less profit. And the council probably needs any extra money they can get from big business just to survive the cuts.
 

TRF_Cymro

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OK, the issue seems to be that Saints want to expand FG, with the help of a new Asda store. They won't apply for planning permission because it's expensive they think it'll be rejected.

Northampton isn't a part of the countryside. So there can be no environmental reasons why a town wouldn't want a new supermarket. And surely the people of the town would not only want a new supermarket; those that are Saints fans would want a bigger stadium and businesses would make more money from matchdays.

Opposition? Well it would have to come from competition, either other food retailers or other sporting clubs. Starting with sport, I cant believe the football club would care. I've only heard of Northampton Town because of Football Manager; it's a rugby town. So food retailers are the competition. Fair enough, in a lot of places supermarkets but local butchers, grocers etc. out of business. However, there's no petition from these guys against the construction of a new Asda, and petitions from small businesses tend to get ignored anyway. It's big business that has influence on politicians.

The conclusion to draw? The Northampton council are in the pockets of Sainsburys/ other supermarkets in the area. An Asda would mean more competition and less profit. And the council probably needs any extra money they can get from big business just to survive the cuts.

There are:

Morrisons
Sainsbury
Waitrose
Tescos
Iceland
Costcutters etc

So there are loads there already, depends if the area needs another one. It is very likely that the supermarkets are well pumping money into the local council to stop anymore arriving.
 

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Wouldn't be surprised if it was Tesco...
 

Teh Mite

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Sainsburys actually. They've ironically just been approved an extension at their Weedon road site no more then 500 yards up the road.

It a complete farce:

- The NBC don't want developments that aren't directly in the town centre
- Legal and General run roughshot over the town because they effectively own the Grovesnor Centre but are refusing the re-development (a project which has so far been dragged out for 15 years)
- The NBC won't give any indication if the development will be approved but insist that the club put forward the application (which will cost almost a million pounds)
- Despite that, they are adamant that Asda won't be approved
- Instead of selling the land to Asda for the funding, the NBC insist that Saints should take a loan out to pay for the extension

Copy paste all of that for the Cobblers, exchanging "Franklins Gardens" for "Sixfields" and "Asda" for "garden centre".

Absolute ******* wankers. The best part is they're ignoring the £1.5m the local economy will miss out on come the Ulster game because they stonewalled the issue over 18 months ago. The development was originally due to be completed by Halloween last year.
 
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