[November Tests 2016 EOYT] Ireland vs. New Zealand (19/11/2016)

[munstermuffin]

I wonder will Henderson bench as backrow cover. After rewatching Canada game I'm not convinced SOB or POM are ready. I mean call it straight SOB still isn't up to fitness or form and despite alot of carries none were really good vs Canada and he's still nowhere near 60mins never mind 80.
POM is back up to 80 but while playing well with Munster still is sluggish at this level. Both need few more weeks. Dan Leavy or Jack O Donoghue would be more effective

 

[The Jones Boy]

I don't have any concerns with the AB's line up, I'm sure Hansen will pick a team to do the job in the cauldron of Dublin. They will be looking to put their top team out and there will be a whole new level of focus that doesn't revolve around sight seeing and being tourists, but more of a boot camp mentality.
Ireland will not be easy but to be fair, they never are...

The only concern I have is the usual one at this time of the year, fatigue.
Fatigue levels can affect energy levels and the AB's will need to keep their intensity at the highest level.
I don't mind seeing Cruden start the game and have the super sub come on later...

 

[nzlizard]

This was the game I thought Ireland had the best chance of winning out of the 2, so I reckon pretty close either way.

Ireland will want to beat the AB's on home ground so this one will be key.

 

[Five Meters Out]

I don't have any concerns with the AB's line up, I'm sure Hansen will pick a team to do the job in the cauldron of Dublin. They will be looking to put their top team out and there will be a whole new level of focus that doesn't revolve around sight seeing and being tourists, but more of a boot camp mentality.
Ireland will not be easy but to be fair, they never are...

The only concern I have is the usual one at this time of the year, fatigue.
Fatigue levels can affect energy levels and the AB's will need to keep their intensity at the highest level.
I don't mind seeing Cruden start the game and have the super sub come on later...

I agree. I would start with Cruden at 1st five and also Cane at flanker. The first half will be a bash fest. Barrett and A.Savea arrive with 30 minutes to go. Hopefully it's not raining as in the Maori v Munster game. Munster played those conditions real well and likely Ireland would do the same.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

This is a hard one to call. Will there be a New Zealand backlash after Chicago? Against that, Ireland only had a few days together before the first test so should be better prepared for this one. Could be a great game.

I doubt Iain Henderson will play this weekend. Three years ago, Ireland ran out of steam and didn't have a bench with enough impact. Henderson is coming back from a long lay off and won't be match fit, even as a replacement. You need everybody firing on all cylinders if you want to beat New Zealand.

 

[Amiga500]

Henderson is coming back from a long lay off and won't be match fit, even as a replacement. You need everybody firing on all cylinders if you want to beat New Zealand.

Correct sir.

SOB or POM are more match sharp than Hendo. I'd have SOB on the bench - he can pretty much cover the entire backrow anyway - although you do lose a jumper if he comes on instead of Heaslip I guess..

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

This one could be won between the ears before it starts. While Ireland will want to prove that Chicago wasn't a fluke, I think NZ will be absolutely hell bent on proving that it was. As excellent as Ire were, NZ were poor and they seldom make the same mistakes twice. And on 19 / 20 occasions when the ABs have the momentum they did in the 2nd half you'd have backed them to go on and win. That they didn't was full credit to Ireland, but I can't help feeling there was a bit of the glorious one-off about it. Seven years since the ABs lost 2 in a row to the same oppo (last week's training runs for both don't count!).

The haka, which to us outsiders can seem a bit routine, might just have a little more bite about it.

 

[Amiga500]

The haka, which to us outsiders can seem a bit routine, might just have a little more bite about it.

Eh?

But sure isn't the haka all about respect. :unsure:

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

The haka's all about laying down a challenge. I just think it might be performed with a bit more feeling this time than before some of their more routine wins. That's all.

 

[Five Meters Out]

The Irish must be favourites for this game. Coming off a strong win with a limited preparation, home ground advantage, two extra weeks to further hone their plans
vs a tired looking, injury plagued All Black team at the end of a long season.
On paper it's the emerald greens all the way.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

The Irish must be favourites for this game. Coming off a strong win with a limited preparation, home ground advantage, two extra weeks to further hone their plans
vs a tired looking, injury plagued All Black team at the end of a long season.
On paper it's the emerald greens all the way.

I think NZ are 16 point favourites with the bookies, that's too much for my money but there's no way we're favourites when you look at players and form this year. Neither side wants to be favourites for this one!

 

[Five Meters Out]

The Bookies are muppets. No way the All Blacks can be fav for the reasons I have given. I hope it rains cats and dogs so we are even bigger outsiders. I'm revelling in the underdog tag. Makes it the best All Blacks test of the year. No more talk of "best Team ever" or "winning streaks" or "are we too good". A one point victory will just do fine.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I think in the 1st Test the All Blacks underestimated the Irish and put out a slightly experimental team, resting some key players. The Irish deserved the win, but had the ABs taken it seriously I reckon they could've taken the win. This time they will rage it VERY seriously. I'm hoping for a Green win, but I'm doubtful.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I think in the 1st Test the All Blacks underestimated the Irish and put out a slightly experimental team, resting some key players. The Irish deserved the win, but had the ABs taken it seriously I reckon they could've taken the win. This time they will rage it VERY seriously. I'm hoping for a Green win, but I'm doubtful.

I think that's being overstated, Ireland's lack of preparation was considered to be a bigger disadvantage going into the game. I think the fact that only McGrath and Henshaw would be shoe ins for a combined team with Furlong, Van der Flier, Heaslip, Murray and Payne being the only other players you could argue for (being quite generous here), is why they have to be favourites.

Ido think we're going to win this one though, if we have a few more ideas to keep their attack well behaved again and be as clinical as two weeks ago we shluld win. Morale is high as **** in that squad right now and Schmidt probably didn't show his entire hand in ALB's and Retallick's absence so we're equipped to do it and if we do we'll have to get used to being not being underdogs thereafter!

 

[Larksea]

while the Irish clearly deserved to win the last one. Because of injuries and relaxed selection/rotation combined with injuries during the game we ended up with the kind of makeshift team on field you may only see once every few years. two hookers on the field, two openside flankers on the field, two first fives on the field, loose forwards playing lock the whole game. I cant remember the AB's being in such a mess. Yet still the game was probably only lost via a silly yellow card that cost us severely. you could even say simply not selecting proper locks cost us the game. I would even say Starting Smith after his issues was enough of a mistake to cost us the game. It was also canes comeback game from his concussion issues. With hindsight being 20/20 I bet the selectors regret disrupting the side so much when they are usually ultra conservative.

The coaches and selectors probably thought the Irish would be easier than they were and injuries during the game added to the pressure and made for a messy situation and it cost us big time.

With a couple of weeks to prepare, players returning from injury and a more serious selection and preparation you would have to expect the All Blacks to be significantly better than they were in Chicago. Like night and day better.

There is the home ground factor but Chicago was basically home advantage to the Irish so it wont change much. They should be better anyway as they did seem to focus a lot on PR while in the US.

The main issue we have is just the current state of our players in terms of injuries, form and fatigue. We've mostly played our top team all the way through from June and key players are really starting to show signs of fatigue and getting injured. I warned about this during the rugby championship. The easy week against Italy enabled us to rest some players and gave the likes of Retalick & Whitelock another week to recover.

Fatigue has always been an issue for the last couple of games for the season but it seems to be worse this year because the players weren't managed as well as they have been in the past. Rotation was binned for a long time then all of a sudden they are making wholesale changes.

Cant really comment more till the side is named. Hopefully Barrett, Ben and Read are well rested and come back fresh and Perenara can continue his amazing year. I expect him to start, he is quite simply in a much better place right now than Smith.

SaveaJ was bad in Chicago, he doesn't usually/ever win us tight games under pressure when he doesn't have a blockbuster in games we would win comfortably anyway hes usually our worst player. cant wait till we have better options here.

 

[RedruthRFC]

The Bookies are muppets. No way the All Blacks can be fav for the reasons I have given. I hope it rains cats and dogs so we are even bigger outsiders. I'm revelling in the underdog tag. Makes it the best All Blacks test of the year. No more talk of "best Team ever" or "winning streaks" or "are we too good". A one point victory will just do fine.

Those of us who like a bet will have checked the weather forecast already!

I wish I could find the post from one particularly bullish member of this forum rubbishing the fact that Brian Retallick's absence could be a problem before the Chicago test - now this is being given as a reason for the loss (legitimately so). That said, we are now being told that Coles' just returning was a factor, so maybe their reintroduction won't be that telling.

I'm looking forward to it already, it's the perfect Saturday. Watch some real live rugby instead of England and get home in time to defrost in front of what I hope is another great test match while I slur about a man from Somerset having his corn stolen, while drinking something black (just to be impartial).

 

[The Jones Boy]

I have a gig this Saturday and I can't get out of it, so I won't be able to watch the match live, gutted.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Those of us who like a bet will have checked the weather forecast already!

I wish I could find the post from one particularly bullish member of this forum rubbishing the fact that Brian Retallick's absence could be a problem before the Chicago test - now this is being given as a reason for the loss (legitimately so). That said, we are now being told that Coles' just returning was a factor, so maybe their reintroduction won't be that telling.

I'm looking forward to it already, it's the perfect Saturday. Watch some real live rugby instead of England and get home in time to defrost in front of what I hope is another great test match while I slur about a man from Somerset having his corn stolen, while drinking something black (just to be impartial).

Ah that player Brian Retallick. Lol. So like 2 years ago when Brian's brother Brodie pointed out Micheal Lawes played for England, I think it's only fair that each AB player is called Brian from now on.

 

[petite]

all blacks by 20! the are back and they are P i s s e d !
i think ireland got lucky last time on some key points: yellows, injuries, ****ty abs second row. good for them that they used that advantage it wasnt esasy!
but no advantages this time i expect a full strength AB coming for pay back

 

[The Jones Boy]

Lets not get carried away.... home advantage counts for a lot and the Irish know how to use it.