[November Tests 2017 EOYT] Ireland vs. Argentina (25/11/2017)

[munstermuffin]

Far from a vintage performance but we have to be realistic, numbers 11-14 had 5 caps between them before today! The 3 replacement backs had 16 caps between them. Was always going to mean the backline were rusty.

Disappointed McGrath didn't get more time off the bench as I thought Murray was very poor today. Disagree with muff about Kearney who played well today but the biggest misses from the November series are Ireland are no further along in developing depth at 15 and 9.

Farrell was much improved on last week. Aki looks comfortable at international level. Centre depth looks a lot better than it did a month ago.

Stockdale has nailed down the left wing spot.

Ryan and Henderson worked well as a second row partnership. The Leinster player has a worrying habit of picking up knocks though.

O'Mahony had his best game since England in the 6 Nations.

Snoop I never said Kearney was poor just I think there are better options. But regardless of my opinion on Kearney you agree with me on depth at 15 and 9.

On Luke McGrath. He got 6 minutes all series which isn't good. Marion style is best suited coming on against tired legs but of Murray is out I think McGrath or Cooney better options starting.

Also FWIW Independent have RK as a 7 which was my original point. For every for there is an against

 

[Emerald Isle]

Not impressed.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/ru...argentina-19-ireland-player-ratings-1.3305755

Rob Kearney

Aggressive carries, still no offloads, but Joe Schmidt looks certain to bet on the veteran fullback all the way to Japan in 2019. Crucial turnover deep in Irish 22 and 47th minute catch over his head are two of many reasons why this will be so. Rating: 8

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

https://www.balls.ie/rugby/ireland-vs-argentina-player-ratings-378375

15. Rob Kearney - 8

Nailed on to be starting full back for next year's Six Nation campaign. His running game has seen somewhat of a renaissance during the November series, carrying a total of 86 meters while beating five defenders tonight. A particular highlight was when he picked the ball from the air close to Ireland's try line.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

https://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/ireland-argentina-player-ratings-stockdale-142660

Rob Kearney - 9

Looked back to his 2008-2013 vintage best at times. That take over his head, with the two arms outstretched? Get out of town! Opened Argentina up on a few occasions in the first half and was a hard man to put down. Try-saving tackle on Sanchez in the last quarter. Threw himself into Leguizamon but was unable to prevent his try in the corner. Chased back well to halt a searing Moyano breakaway.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

https://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2017/1125/922809-player-ratings/

Rob Kearney 9/10

He hasn't been flavour of the month among Irish supporters hungry for variety but he delivered one of the strongest displays for Ireland in ages.

He ran with purpose, beat defenders regularly and was strong under the high ball when required. Didn't miss a single tackle and executed a couple of important last ditch hits in the second half.

A superb display and a rebuke to those eager to see him put out to pasture at international level.

 

[munstermuffin]

Again Snoop I've seen 3 giving Kearney a 7. But regardless I'd say if you'r basing your opinions on 1 game player ratings vs a poor Argentina game then I guess your opinion made. Can I ask would you post ratings of last game?

But on today I said Kearney wasnt9best player on field. And in all your ratings I'v yet to see 1 stating differently. So could you get report saying that too.

Also had look at who did ratngs of each and well it backs my comment earlier Leinster bias guys rated Kearney highly and non Leinster lowly as in 7. Only shock is Cummiskey only gave 8.
And again you going out of way to defend Rob Kearney backs my other comment. Leinster fans will defend him and rate him to the deaths. Munster/Ulster/Connacht think he's done and will attack him and don't rate him as highly.

Not saying I'm right just that the concensus

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Again Snoop I've seen 3 giving Kearney a 7.

Waiting for links....

I'd prefer to see more of an attacking threat at 15 but it doesn't take away from the fact that Kearney was very good today

 

[munstermuffin]

Waiting for links....

I'd prefer to see more of an attacking threat at 15 but it doesn't take away from the fact that Kearney was very good today

I gave names can add 4th.
Limerick Leader
Examiner
Echo
Independent

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

http://www.punditarena.com/rugby/bk...s-from-irelands-close-victory-over-argentina/

Winners


3) Rob Kearney

What a performance from the Leinster man. Kearney looked back to his confident and fit self in Ireland's win against Argentina. The 31-year-old has had a torrid time of injuries in the last number of years. However, for the first time in a long time, the fullback looked mentally and physically deserving of his place in this Irish team. His counterattacking and work in the backfield was what was most impressive as his solidity under the highball has always been consistent. For now, the Leinster man needs to simply focus on remaining injury free because as tonight showed, he still has plenty left to give for his country.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

I gave names can add 4th.
Limerick Leader
Examiner
Echo
Independent

Links, not names. I've found the Indo one (https://www.independent.ie/sport/ru...ers-rated-in-win-over-argentina-36353041.html), can't find the others

 

[munstermuffin]

Again Snoop another link and my point proven with you defending. You still on all links haven't proven anything I've said is wrong

 

[munstermuffin]

Links, not names. I've found the Indo one (https://www.independent.ie/sport/ru...ers-rated-in-win-over-argentina-36353041.html), can't find the others

Download app and it there clearly

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

You've got a firmly held opinion of Rob Kearney and evidence in front of you won't change that. We all have a blind spot, I'll never rate Stephen Archer for example. If you're always picking his faults, please be consistent and try to point out when Kearney did well and stop damning him with feint praise. There aren't three better fullbacks on the island.

Kearney played well and firmly justified his selection. I' pick him ahead of all other Irish fullbacks at the moment. I'd also like to see a better option emerge. Tiernan O'Halloran looks the most likely.

 

[munstermuffin]

You've got a firmly held opinion of Rob Kearney and evidence in front of you won't change that. We all have a blind spot, I'll never rate Stephen Archer for example. If you're always picking his faults, please be consistent and try to point out when Kearney did well and stop damning him with feint praise. There aren't three better fullbacks on the island.

Kearney played well and firmly justified his selection. I' pick him ahead of all other Irish fullbacks at the moment. I'd also like to see a better option emerge. Tiernan O'Halloran looks the most likely.

Again. I never mentioned Kearney played poorly today. Simply 1 game doesn't mean all is back. In my opinion and alot others Tiernan O'Halloran, Carbery, Zebo, Conway and Stockdale are better. You disagree. And that your opinion. But way I see it alot others around Munster and others see it same. That's a fact regardless of right or wrong.
But again thanks for proving all my points 100% correct.
1. I said Kearney wasn't best back today. I said Stockdale and all your links agreed.
2. I never said Kearney was poor bit Leinster fans will defend him. And you did.
3. Kearney divides alot. You and me proved that together.

See if you breakdown with what I'm saying what do you disagree with.
Only thing I'm guessing is on where we rate Kearney but what else did I say that you disagree with.

Also alot of reports say Aki wasn't great yet you said he was good. So my point f player ratings are gospel does that mean your opinion wrong?

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Again. I never mentioned Kearney played poorly today. Simply 1 game doesn't mean all is back. In my opinion and alot others Tiernan O'Halloran, Carbery, Zebo, Conway and Stockdale are better. You disagree. And that your opinion. But way I see it alot others around Munster and others see it same. That's a fact regardless of right or wrong.

It's not a fact. It's an opinion!

15 needs to be sorted......................Alot wouldn' but Kearney is not in best 3 15s in Ireland...........................Didn't do bad but still plenty better options. You may disagree. But alot would agree. Alot wouldn' but Kearney is not in best 3 15s in Ireland..................Well seeing as every game outside Leinster everyone is calling for Kearney to be dropped. He isn't rated highly as a player...........................He'l I don't even have Rob as top 3 15 at Leinster. That' just my opinion but fact it' tradition after game that any Munster Ulster or Connacht guy dismiss him and Leinster defend him hugely shows there debate.

You say all of this after he plays well. Give the man some credit when he deserves it and stop knocking him at every opportunity! Argue rationally when he plays poorly.

Confirmation bias kicks in when you discuss Rob Kearney. Try be a bit more balanced. That's what I'm trying to get across.

I've said for the last while that I think Rhys Ruddock should be in the team ahead of Peter O'Mahony. O'Mahony was fantastic today. One turnover around the 50th minute stopped an Argentinian attack when they were trying to get back into the game and was very important for Ireland today. It was his best performance in a green shirt since he was brilliant against England and earned a Lions call up as a result. I don't feel the need to say "he isn't rated highly as a player and many in Leinster, Connacht and Ulster think Ruddock, Stander, Conan, van der Flier, Leavy, Henderson and Reidy are better, that's a fact" at every mention of the man's name. I don't believe you need to bring your dislike of Kearney into every discussion.

 

[munstermuffin]

It's not a fact. It's an opinion!


You say all of this after he plays well. Give the man some credit when he deserves it and stop knocking him at every opportunity! Argue rationally when he plays poorly.

Confirmation bias kicks in when you discuss Rob Kearney. Try be a bit more balanced. That's what I'm trying to get across.

I've said for the last while that I think Rhys Ruddock should be in the team ahead of Peter O'Mahony. O'Mahony was fantastic today. One turnover around the 50th minute stopped an Argentinian attack when they were trying to get back into the game and was very important for Ireland today. It was his best performance in a green shirt since he was brilliant against England and earned a Lions call up as a result. I don't feel the need to say "he isn't rated highly as a player and many in Leinster, Connacht and Ulster think Ruddock, Stander, Conan, van der Flier, Leavy, Henderson and Reidy are better, that's a fact" at every mention of the man's name. I don't believe you need to bring your dislike of Kearney into every discussion.

But again I didn't say Kearney was poor did I? Did he do well today yes but equally I think other guys I mentioned could have done just as well of not better. That' my opinion.
And O'Mahony comment is BS. You look at alot of Leinster fans they gave Stander same treatment Kearney gets and Zebo and he'l even Earls so that' utter bull what you are pointing out. You might not but sorry it is 2 way traffic. Alpha is just as critical on Zebo at times as I am on Kearney.

And you are stating it not a fact alot of people don't rate Kearney as Best 15 in Ireland. Wow. Is all I will say there. You think if a poll was done on that question Kearney would come out at #1?
Run that in any province outside Leinster and see results.

And of what you quoted that is my opinion on how I rate him overall. How is that being rational. In some views people will look at block down. It's just as I say. You'll defend him as a Leinster fan. I'v done same on here for Earls Stander Zebo and now that you mention O'Mahony I think you should take trip back to RWC15 or England game to see views on POM and Stander. Even new Zealand game in Chicago re Stander. If you think it only bias when it come to Kearney you simply choosing what you want to see.
Expected better of you.

As I said you still haven't shown where I'm personally wrong. And don't have personal dislike for Kearney. Think he was a great player in top form just think he's lost that top form and there are better options. Am I only 1 in world who thinks that? I'm guessing no and think that is a FACT.
Am I right? Never said once I was

Fact is it annoys alot that 1 game against a poor Argentina team didn't change my find.
As I said Earls got no credit after RWC by alot on Leinster. It normal. It not 1 way traffic but just way it is

 

[mosfeldt]

I felt a bit meh after winning. I didn't like seeing Ireland ship 19 points so carelessly (although that last try was a bit of a fiasco and iffy but whatevs). But Argentina played really well and credit to them, I'm glad they finished the season on a bit of a high (relatively speaking at least). Also when you think of how inexperienced the backline was, it doesn't seem as bad. At the end of the day we still won, and the Pumas troubled England in much the same way they did us today. They're just a tough team to break down.

The Home Nations are on a bit of a buzz at the moment, the next 6N could be vintage. Even Wales who are the weakest of the 4 at the moment are showing signs of promise. Plus they always ramp it up for the 6N especially against Ireland. I have to say I'm particularly pumped for the Scotland match!

FWIW I thought Kearney was class today and for big games, I would still start Kearney. I've never really been in the anti-Kearney train of thought anyways but I really thought this game showed that he still has it. Maybe not to the capacity he used to, but still more so than any FB at the moment. "Fact is" that bar Kearney, Conway is our only real FB with Test experience atm and he is still fresh. I honestly can't see Schmidt not starting Kearney for the 6N and I think we all know that so if people could stop going on and on and on and on and on about Kearney that'd be great. I hope he has kids who also develop into FBs and continually get picked for Ireland.

Also, I cannot stand Irish commentary. It is so bad. So annoyingly biased it made it hard to watch at times. In one way I was glad Argentina started scoring just so they would shut the fvck up.

 

[munstermuffin]

I felt a bit meh after winning. I didn't like seeing Ireland ship 19 points so carelessly (although that last try was a bit of a fiasco and iffy but whatevs). But Argentina played really well and credit to them, I'm glad they finished the season on a bit of a high (relatively speaking at least). Also when you think of how inexperienced the backline was, it doesn't seem as bad. At the end of the day we still won, and the Pumas troubled England in much the same way they did us today. They're just a tough team to break down.

The Home Nations are on a bit of a buzz at the moment, the next 6N could be vintage. Even Wales who are the weakest of the 4 at the moment are showing signs of promise. Plus they always ramp it up for the 6N especially against Ireland. I have to say I'm particularly pumped for the Scotland match!

FWIW I thought Kearney was class today and for big games, I would still start Kearney. I've never really been in the anti-Kearney train of thought anyways but I really thought this game showed that he still has it. Maybe not to the capacity he used to, but still more so than any FB at the moment. "Fact is" that bar Kearney, Conway is our only real FB with Test experience atm and he is still fresh. I honestly can't see Schmidt not starting Kearney for the 6N and I think we all know that so if people could stop going on and on and on and on and on about Kearney that'd be great. I hope he has kids who also develop into FBs and continually get picked for Ireland.

On bit about Kearney and other options. I did state that was an issue. Our depth at 15 too. But agree with rest of post too

 

[Emerald Isle]

But again I didn't say Kearney was poor did I? Did he do well today yes but equally I think other guys I mentioned could have done just as well of not better. That' my opinion.
And O'Mahony comment is BS. You look at alot of Leinster fans they gave Stander same treatment Kearney gets and Zebo and he'l even Earls so that' utter bull what you are pointing out. You might not but sorry it is 2 way traffic. Alpha is just as critical on Zebo at times as I am on Kearney.

And you are stating it not a fact alot of people don't rate Kearney as Best 15 in Ireland. Wow. Is all I will say there. You think if a poll was done on that question Kearney would come out at #1?
Run that in any province outside Leinster and see results.

And of what you quoted that is my opinion on how I rate him overall. How is that being rational. In some views people will look at block down. It's just as I say. You'll defend him as a Leinster fan. I'v done same on here for Earls Stander Zebo and now that you mention O'Mahony I think you should take trip back to RWC15 or England game to see views on POM and Stander. Even new Zealand game in Chicago re Stander. If you think it only bias when it come to Kearney you simply choosing what you want to see.
Expected better of you.

As I said you still haven't shown where I'm personally wrong. And don't have personal dislike for Kearney. Think he was a great player in top form just think he's lost that top form and there are better options. Am I only 1 in world who thinks that? I'm guessing no and think that is a FACT.
Am I right? Never said once I was

Fact is it annoys alot that 1 game against a poor Argentina team didn't change my find.
As I said Earls got no credit after RWC by alot on Leinster. It normal. It not 1 way traffic but just way it is

What would your starting fifteen be if everyone was available for this team?