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<blockquote data-quote="User1245" data-source="post: 924680" data-attributes="member: 40986"><p>It didn't come across as arrogant. You're in the law field and I'm not, so I appreciate the time you took to provide a detailed explanation.</p><p></p><p>I'm not saying that WR regulations aren't bound by the law in countries because they're an international organisation.</p><p>I'm saying WR already go above countries minimums for national 'entitlements' (for example in Argentina 2 years to citizenship) with the new 5 year residency rule. I don't understand why they follow certain minimum laws but not others, especially when some are more robust than others. Why even bother changing it to 5 years and instead say according to what each country has to meet citizenship status?</p><p></p><p>That said and to back up your point, the fact that they do this even after the review (which Pichot ran) means there must be something stopping WR from closing the granny rule. I'm sure he would have taken that out if he could.</p><p></p><p>Still doesn't make sense to me but then again the law doesn't need to for a lay person. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes both are incorrect as Stander seems to be selling the Cinderella story of rugby which the Irish are eating up.</p><p></p><p>1) He captained the Baby Boks at the 2010 Junior RWC and was included in the extended Springbok squad in 2012 at 22 years old based on his form as a loose forward, the same year he signed with Munster. Doesn't sound like a guy who's career is in danger.</p><p></p><p>His job at the Bulls was not in threat. The Bulls could not match the offer and spoke what a big loss it was when he left:</p><p></p><p><em>Barend van Graan, chief executive of the Bulls, admitted: "We identified CJ at schoolboy level already and he was part of our future planning at the Bulls. However, we couldn't match the Munster offer – such is the reality of professional sport."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>Bulls coach Frans Ludeke offered a brief insight into the calibre of player that is heading Munster's way.</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"Quality players like CJ, who have also shown tremendous leadership abilities, don't come around very often and so it was not a surprise to hear about his overseas offer.</em></p><p></p><p><a href="https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/munster-sign-young-springbok-stander-1.1068000" target="_blank">https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/munster-sign-young-springbok-stander-1.1068000</a></p><p></p><p>Heyneke Meyer (Bok coach at the time) came up with the idea of converting him to a hooker, just like he did for Malcolm Marx later on. Stander makes it out like there was a gun to his head. Convert to hooker or back to the farm with you boy! Nothing actually points to this.</p><p></p><p><em>The conversations about shifting to hooker lasted for six or seven months and Stander said he was initially willing to give it a try, even if his heart wasn't in it. Payne offered him an alternative path.</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"I knew it was on the table to play for Ireland one day and seeing how big rugby is in Ireland, the supporters, the culture. I was getting this feeling that I wanted to play for Ireland that I can't really describe," he says.</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"It was a bigger feeling than I'd had for the Springboks, because when I was a youngster you think you want to play for that team but not really knowing how to get there.</em></p><p></p><p>Instead it looks like it was the case of a big money offer to leave South Africa, which had a time pressure. And it appears that the money instantly made him want to play for Ireland more than anything in the world.</p><p>All I'm saying is that he needs to say it like it is rather than making out that SA rugby unions shunned him. We've had smaller loose forwards than him.</p><p></p><p>2) Rugby players don't live in a bubble to the rest of us. He is following a very well established trend of young white South Africans leaving the country. Top reasons being (1) politics, (2) crime and (3) uncertainty.</p><p></p><p><a href="https://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/were-running-out-of-whites-20170806-2" target="_blank">https://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/were-running-out-of-whites-20170806-2</a></p><p></p><p>Want the best players playing international rugby? Instead of advocating for eligibility regulations to loosen up, why not advocate that WR actually enforces its anti-discrimination regulations based on race so that a developing country like SA can keep its best players? That's why I said 'how convenient'. International rugby didn't gain, Ireland gained.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="User1245, post: 924680, member: 40986"] It didn't come across as arrogant. You're in the law field and I'm not, so I appreciate the time you took to provide a detailed explanation. I'm not saying that WR regulations aren't bound by the law in countries because they're an international organisation. I'm saying WR already go above countries minimums for national 'entitlements' (for example in Argentina 2 years to citizenship) with the new 5 year residency rule. I don't understand why they follow certain minimum laws but not others, especially when some are more robust than others. Why even bother changing it to 5 years and instead say according to what each country has to meet citizenship status? That said and to back up your point, the fact that they do this even after the review (which Pichot ran) means there must be something stopping WR from closing the granny rule. I'm sure he would have taken that out if he could. Still doesn't make sense to me but then again the law doesn't need to for a lay person. Yes both are incorrect as Stander seems to be selling the Cinderella story of rugby which the Irish are eating up. 1) He captained the Baby Boks at the 2010 Junior RWC and was included in the extended Springbok squad in 2012 at 22 years old based on his form as a loose forward, the same year he signed with Munster. Doesn't sound like a guy who's career is in danger. His job at the Bulls was not in threat. The Bulls could not match the offer and spoke what a big loss it was when he left: [I]Barend van Graan, chief executive of the Bulls, admitted: “We identified CJ at schoolboy level already and he was part of our future planning at the Bulls. However, we couldn’t match the Munster offer – such is the reality of professional sport.” Bulls coach Frans Ludeke offered a brief insight into the calibre of player that is heading Munster’s way. “Quality players like CJ, who have also shown tremendous leadership abilities, don’t come around very often and so it was not a surprise to hear about his overseas offer.[/I] [URL]https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/munster-sign-young-springbok-stander-1.1068000[/URL] Heyneke Meyer (Bok coach at the time) came up with the idea of converting him to a hooker, just like he did for Malcolm Marx later on. Stander makes it out like there was a gun to his head. Convert to hooker or back to the farm with you boy! Nothing actually points to this. [I]The conversations about shifting to hooker lasted for six or seven months and Stander said he was initially willing to give it a try, even if his heart wasn't in it. Payne offered him an alternative path. "I knew it was on the table to play for Ireland one day and seeing how big rugby is in Ireland, the supporters, the culture. I was getting this feeling that I wanted to play for Ireland that I can't really describe," he says. "It was a bigger feeling than I'd had for the Springboks, because when I was a youngster you think you want to play for that team but not really knowing how to get there.[/I] Instead it looks like it was the case of a big money offer to leave South Africa, which had a time pressure. And it appears that the money instantly made him want to play for Ireland more than anything in the world. All I'm saying is that he needs to say it like it is rather than making out that SA rugby unions shunned him. We've had smaller loose forwards than him. 2) Rugby players don't live in a bubble to the rest of us. He is following a very well established trend of young white South Africans leaving the country. Top reasons being (1) politics, (2) crime and (3) uncertainty. [URL]https://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/were-running-out-of-whites-20170806-2[/URL] Want the best players playing international rugby? Instead of advocating for eligibility regulations to loosen up, why not advocate that WR actually enforces its anti-discrimination regulations based on race so that a developing country like SA can keep its best players? That's why I said 'how convenient'. International rugby didn't gain, Ireland gained. [/QUOTE]
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