Pro12 Round 16

[psychic duck]

Again you are selecting clips, congrats. YouTube clips can be very misleading. I don't need to see any further clips of what he can do, it's what he can't do what concerns me.

This is silly. I could say somebody breaks the line and creates try assists often, but then if I bother finding a clip as an example then it is just an isolated clip. Perhaps I shouldn't bother finding clips and just blag about what a player can do, instead of finding evidence of it.

It doesn't matter how many times you have seen him, your an Ospreys fan so of course you are going to defend him, wouldn't expect anymore.

Rubbish. I am not biased and that is a lazy comment. In fact if you read my posts I criticise many Ospreys players. I've never defended Rhys Webb for Wales just because he plays for Ospreys, or claimed Tom Smith is a useful player as people built them up to be. Nor I am I claiming Cai Griffiths is the answer to Wales' tighthead depth problems.

Fact is, I have seen Fussell a lot this season. He has his faults, and can take wrong options, but your criticisms are off the mark about running away from support.

But really ... from a coaching perspective he does it quite a bit, he does select the wrong options which will always hold him back from international honours. He did it tonight and probably cost Ospreys a bonus point.

One game is not regularly. He can't be blamed for bonus point either, especially considering it was his break that created the field position for the third try. Beck's failed miracle ball and Dan Baker's poor control and Nipper's pass were worse. Also having no proper wingers as support runners doesn't help either.

You say I just find an isolated clip of an incident. You yourself are just finding one incident. Where else has this happened a lot this season? It hasn't.

Also, considering all of Tom James, Chris Czekaj (no rugby brain whatsoever), Morgan Stoddart, Will Harries (can't tackle whatsoever), Liam Williams (overhyped, little attacking threat), Harry Robinson, Tom Prydie (on the back of achieving nothing at regional level) all got caps at international level all despite having flaws in their game. Fussell deserves an opportunity too, even if he isn't perfect, neither are the other options and he is on much better form than Liam Williams.

 

[dullonien]

Personally think you're being very harsh on Fussell Cymro.I'm always impressed with his ability to both spot a gap and link with his support players. He may occasionally run away from support, but it's not something I've noticed more than any other player. He's easily the most dangerous Welsh fullback (if not the most dangerous Welsh qualified player full stop). I think I know the instances you are referring to from tonight's game, and I'd say more 'getting caught in two or three minds' were the issue, and not deliberately running away from support, and this is the one criticism I have of him. However this comes from him always looking to counter, and I like to see that. I can see that indecision like that could certainly be more exposed at international level where there is less time and space, so that would be my big reservation now that his defence, position play and general reliability has improved significantly.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Dull it may well be harsh, but his indecisiveness has meant wasted opportunities for the Ospreys. It's a weakness that was once again on show. I mean even the commentators mentioned it, so I'm defiantly not the only one to not see it.

Duck, wise up. It's not a lazy comment, it's what is expected. Again you go over the top about the likes of Tom Smith and Cai Griffiths. If people didn't know they were rubbish then lord help us. Anyway both players are irrelevant to the argument as it is.

My comments are also not wide of the mark. Far from it infact. It was funny that down the rugby club, where I was watching the game, many people commented about it and how it seems to be a regular thing ... so I know I am not the only one who thinks this. His indecisive not only leads himself into trouble but others also.

Duck you are loving making this a massive deal. It's a fault of his game, if he works on it and other parts then he could well make the Wales 'squad'. Currently he's not good enough.

 

[psychic duck]

Yup, missed that one. Nice to see one of those runs of his. Still not seen many of them for the Ospreys.

I'm still okay with Matthew Morgan as a second choice 10 for the Ospreys. Has a lot he needs to improve on to challenge Biggar as first choice and makes a few too many errors, but I have seen enough potential to give him time and a couple more seasons. Doesn't help that he always seems to be paired up with Webb as well, I saw him put in a much better performance alongside Fotuali'i in November against the Blues. No coincidence that Biggar's progress has been boosted by Fotuali'i coming in, Kahn can help carry the burden of a lot of pressure and responsibility from the fly half in a way that Webb can't. Pienaar at Ulster has helped Jackson's progress massively as well in this regard too.

Dull it may well be harsh, but his indecisiveness has meant wasted opportunities for the Ospreys. It's a weakness that was once again on show. I mean even the commentators mentioned it, so I'm defiantly not the only one to not see it.

Duck, wise up. It's not a lazy comment, it's what is expected. Again you go over the top about the likes of Tom Smith and Cai Griffiths. If people didn't know they were rubbish then lord help us. Anyway both players are irrelevant to the argument as it is.

My comments are also not wide of the mark. Far from it infact. It was funny that down the rugby club, where I was watching the game, many people commented about it and how it seems to be a regular thing ... so I know I am not the only one who thinks this. His indecisive not only leads himself into trouble but others also.

Duck you are loving making this a massive deal. It's a fault of his game, if he works on it and other parts then he could well make the Wales 'squad'. Currently he's not good enough.

Your said "running away from support" is a regular problem. It really isn't. You criticise me for pointing out examples and say how they don't mean anything, and then you claim a couple of people mentioning something over a beer as meaning it is fact.

Also I mentioned Smith and Griffiths as you accused me of bias. If I was bias then I would be claiming Rhys Webb could still be Wales scrum half, and Jonathan Thomas should be called up to the Wales squad. I don't call every Ospreys team a must have in the Wales team.

He is currently good enough for the Wales 'squad' actually. Liam Williams is in it despite not making nearly as much impact as Fussell has on form, and there are a a handful of back three players worse than Fussell who received opportunities. Fussell isn't perfect and makes mistakes, but he's very underrated and currently better than Williams and Byrne and offers more attacking impact, both who have their own flaws we could go through as well. If Liam Williams, Tom Prydie, Daniel Evans, Tom James, Harry Robinson are good enough then Fussell is.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

You criticise me for pointing out examples and say how they don't mean anything, and then you claim a couple of people mentioning something over a beer as meaning it is fact.

Ye I do, considering they are quite knowledgeable people. Sadly for you, no beers were being consumed at the time because some of them including myself had finished helping to coach the junior section at the rugby club. But let me get pedantic ... and really off topic. Just because it doesn't fit into your gifs and YouTube clips doesn't make it any less of a fact as you are claiming. The guys I was sitting down and talking about the game as I mentioned are knowledgeable and it wasn't just one man and his dog ... it was close to dozen. But of course, I can't provide the evidence so it can't be fact . But I am sorry we can't discuss it and we can't draw conclusions because mentioning it over a beer can't be true <_< .

I'm not going to carry on de-railing the thread. I know what I saw, and have seen a few times by him over the seasons. Carry on all you want, be my guest.

 

[dullonien]

Doesn't help that he always seems to be paired up with Webb as well, I saw him put in a much better performance alongside Fotuali'i in November against the Blues.

Whilst Webb makes crazy errors on a regular basis, this doesn't necessarily affect the 10 when he plays. I actually think that Webb's general scrum half play is very good, getting to the ruck quickly, mostly quick clean service, and he ties in the opposition fringe defence better than anyone, which should free up a little space for the outhalf. Whilst I agree that Fotuali'i takes presure off his 10 by making more of the decisions, this is unlike most 9's, so Morgan is still being fairly judged, even when playing alongside Webb. I am also happy with Morgan as a 2nd choice, but I was still hoping to see him progressing a little more by now. He's worked hard on areas that were previously weak, and improved on them somewhat, but he's got a lot of way to go before he properly challenges Biggar or for a position in the Welsh squad.

Regarding Webb quickly. He get's a lot of deserved flak, but I'm not ruling him out making it at the top level. He's got all the attributes, but is prone to brain farts and can be petulant. Both can be worked on and ironed out of his game. His box kicking can also be erratic mind....

 

[psychic duck]

Ye I do, considering they are quite knowledgeable people. Sadly for you, no beers were being consumed at the time because some of them including myself had finished helping to coach the junior section at the rugby club. But let me get pedantic ... and really off topic. Just because it doesn't fit into your gifs and YouTube clips doesn't make it any less of a fact as you are claiming. The guys I was sitting down and talking about the game as I mentioned are knowledgeable and it wasn't just one man and his dog ... it was close to dozen. But of course, I can't provide the evidence so it can't be fact . But I am sorry we can't discuss it and we can't draw conclusions because mentioning it over a beer can't be true <_< .

I'm not going to carry on de-railing the thread. I know what I saw, and have seen a few times by him over the seasons. Carry on all you want, be my guest.

Not what I said. I said it was silly that you rule out what I say because it is just a clip. Then say what you say must be fact just because somebody else said so.

Back on topic though. You say Fussell "isn't good enough", so I assume you think the guy who he would replace in the squad Liam Williams is. But why? On form there is no contest between the two in my opinion. Liam Williams has done very little noteworthy in attack since the couple of weeks in the season. Also been conceding a disproportionate amount of penalties for his position of late as well.

Whilst Webb makes crazy errors on a regular basis, this doesn't necessarily affect the 10 when he plays. I actually think that Webb's general scrum half play is very good, getting to the ruck quickly, mostly quick clean service, and he ties in the opposition fringe defence better than anyone, which should free up a little space for the outhalf. Whilst I agree that Fotuali'i takes presure off his 10 by making more of the decisions, this is unlike most 9's, so Morgan is still being fairly judged, even when playing alongside Webb. I am also happy with Morgan as a 2nd choice, but I was still hoping to see him progressing a little more by now. He's worked hard on areas that were previously weak, and improved on them somewhat, but he's got a lot of way to go before he properly challenges Biggar or for a position in the Welsh squad.

Regarding Webb quickly. He get's a lot of deserved flak, but I'm not ruling him out making it at the top level. He's got all the attributes, but is prone to brain farts and can be petulant. Both can be worked on and ironed out of his game. His box kicking can also be erratic mind....

This. Far, far too many I'm afraid (see cameo in Leicester away match, Scarlets home match and Dragons LV Cup match). The majority of Ospreys fans now want to see Habberfield ahead of him now. I really don't rate Webb that highly. I also think he got in the Wales squad last year purely on the basis of having a big advantage of playing behind the on form Ospreys pack. If you swapped Jonathan Evans and Rhys Webb regions, then I bet it would be Evans getting called up and Webb would look even worse and his true level would be found out.

 

[LittleGuy]

Good game between Glasgow and Ulster and the Warriors played well but shocking goal kicking....Pienaar was poor by his standards(I think he was 3 from 6) but Peter Horne was embarrasing 0 from 5 and one conversion was missed from dead on in front of the posts, in fact it was so bad that the crowd were cheering assuming he'd made it and the announcer called out his name but the flags hadn't gone up LMAO.

Van De Merwe is also OK, he was taken off via stretcher but it was completely precautionary and the staff have cleared him as fit.

Edit: Also looks like Josh Tyler has been left off of the Dragons side for their game vs. Zebre....was it an injury after all? Or just shocking stuff?

 

[big ginger 8]

11-5 at half time Leinster missing 4 kicks. Goodman with all the points completely smashed Owen Williams out of the way for his try.

 

[Tribesmen-ce-123]

Noel Reid is a cack fly half, how the hell did he miss that penalty in front of the posts there?

 

[psychic duck]

For those who missed it. Here is the Nick de Luca "tip tackle" incident that saw him red carded. I guess he may have ruled himself out of appearing at all in this year's 6 Nations (not that it would hurt Scotland much anyway).

 

[Tony Manx]

For those who missed it. Here is the Nick de Luca "tip tackle" incident that saw him red carded. I guess he may have ruled himself out of appearing at all in this year's 6 Nations (not that it would hurt Scotland much anyway).

......and next year's!!

 

[SelimNiai]

On first view I knew it was red, on these there's more of a driving/pushing downwards move by de Luca. This needs a hefty ban attached. Worse bit is that he walked off looking bemused as to what he'd done wrong

 

[Feicarsinn]

Great win for the boys. 5 points against a Scarlets side whilst playing one of the most useless out halves I've ever seen. We should really be aiming to finish top of the league now, considering that we have Ulster at home.


What is evident now is that we're going to need a new replacement 10. The question is who, and how much we're willing to spend.

 

[jcahill1]

Great win for the boys. 5 points against a Scarlets side whilst playing one of the most useless out halves I've ever seen. We should really be aiming to finish top of the league now, considering that we have Ulster at home.


What is evident now is that we're going to need a new replacement 10. The question is who, and how much we're willing to spend.

You mean Goodman I hope,

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

What is evident now is that we're going to need a new replacement 10. The question is who, and how much we're willing to spend.

Probably not as primary backup but I suspect Craig Ronaldson of Lansdowne will pick up a contract next season.

 

[Draggs]

For those who missed it. Here is the Nick de Luca "tip tackle" incident that saw him red carded. I guess he may have ruled himself out of appearing at all in this year's 6 Nations (not that it would hurt Scotland much anyway).

13 weeks.

 

[Tribesmen-ce-123]

I haven't enough words to describe how useless O Gara and Duncan Williams are, cost Munster the match with their terrible play.