Referee decisions during World Cup

Discussion in 'Rugby World Cup 2019' started by Umaga's Witness, Sep 23, 2019.

  1. TRF_heineken

    TRF_heineken RIP #J9

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  3. Which Tyler

    Which Tyler First XV

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    Then either I didn't understand your original post, or you don't understand that pdf
    So, in relation to yellow cards accumulating to an automatic citing, they're (temporarily) reset.
    In terms of considering a players precious disciplinary history as mitigation or otherwise - no mention in the section titled "Accumulation of yellow cards / citing commissioner warnings" (page 4, paragraph 1).

    However, the paragraph just above, on "citing hearing" states (page 3, paragraph 4, and indeed 6, which looks identical, at a glance).
    Emphasis mine
     
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    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
  4. scotty507

    scotty507 First XV

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    Aki red pretty clear red. This new frame work has come in but it seems alot of these reds were reds well before this? How many reds dod we see last world cup? Is it a dramatic rise?
     
  5. TRF_Olyy

    TRF_Olyy English Arrogance

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    I think this world cup matched the highest number of reds quite early on, so we're way ahead now
     
  6. Yoshimitsu

    Yoshimitsu Academy Player

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    I think there's a real issue with reds only becoming reds when the TMO is used to confirm the evidence thereof. I'm not here to claim whether that is right or wrong but the TMO is now taking centre stage. Lets take the Lavanini example. On the field of play Nigel Owens (one of the world's best refs) call "no foul play, play on" the TMO armed with super slow motion and multiple angles intervenes and suggests that foul play has occurred.

    Refs are very keen to defer decisions to the TMO and as soon at that happens the framework begins to apply. Any direct contact to the head = Yellow at minimum. Without mitigation it = red..................
     
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  7. ncurd

    ncurd International

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    The thing is most the reds we've seen have been reds for some time very little to do with the new framework.

    As I noted earlier on I think I've seen more head hits this world cup than in any previous incarnation. Which is madness when you consider they are looking more closely rather than less.
     
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  8. Which Tyler

    Which Tyler First XV

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    Exactly this.
    I don't recall a single red this year that shouldn't have been red in 2015 most should have been red in 2011 or 1991 - even if they would have been more likely to get away with it.

    Yellows are a different matter on this, as mitigation that would (probably) have reduced it to a penalty now only reduce to a yellow.

    Hitting someone in the head has been illegal in rugby since I started watching in 1987. There's just less leeway, less mitigation, and more scrutiny these days. Laws have changed for hitting someone at the top of the shoulder, on taking someone in the air, on lifting in the tackle etc, but the head has always been officially off limits. It's just being done more with less chance of getting away with it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2019
  9. TRF_heineken

    TRF_heineken RIP #J9

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    Isn’t the directive to confirm with the TMO and AR’s before sanctioning? I’m sure I read somewhere after the EOYT last year that the referee has to consult with the other’s before sanctioning.

    also there were a few red cards that the referee didn’t see in real time, and the TMO informed them of foul play. Which has been a directive for a while now.

    The red card in the SA vs. Canada for example, was spotted by the AR, not the referee, and the TMO informed the referee of potential foul play.

    anyways, I don’t care how they do it, just as long as the right decision is made...
     
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  10. Larksea

    Larksea First XV

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    I think its OK for the IRB to change the rules and regulations. Its important to the evolution of the game.
    But doing it Day one of a RWC is completely fricken stupid in so many ways.
    The game is always evolving and changing, after rules or the application of rules change it takes time for the players and referees to adjust.
    Really, there shouldn't be any changes to the rules application of the rules of management of the referees in the 6 months or so leading upto a WC. So all teams can go in knowing where the lines are drawn.
    I think as it is right now the referees are more likely to decide the fate of WC games than ever before.
     
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  11. Which Tyler

    Which Tyler First XV

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    Just out of interest. When was the last time that a direct hit to the head without mitigation wasn't a red card offence?

    As it is, I can't remember a time when so many players were knowingly committing red card offences, let alone so many are skirting so close to a red card offence that it's essentially out of their hands.
     
  12. Nudger

    Nudger Bench Player

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    Apparently Moriarty's swinging arm to head was only yellow wtf
     
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    Last edited: Oct 20, 2019
  13. Reiser99

    Reiser99 First XV

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    For me it's right on the border.

    Contact with head: Yes
    Mitigation: No

    The question is force. It didn't look the worse but then the French players chin shudders from the hit. With another ref it could have been red.
     
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  14. OwenPB

    OwenPB Academy Player

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    What's going on with the total lack of offside officiating this WC?
    That & clearing out at the ruck have been ignored.
     
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  15. Reiser99

    Reiser99 First XV

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    Thing is World Rugby have periods of focusing on certain rules because if you police too strictly it kills the game and especially at the world cup there is enough issues around the rules. I can see some new ref directives after the world cup.
     
  16. The_Blindside

    The_Blindside International

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    So England v NZ likely to be reffed by Garces, Peyper or Owens.

    Wales v SA - Garces or Barnes.

    lf these 4 are considered WR’s top 4 refs.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2019
  17. themole25

    themole25 First XV

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    So historically the semi finalist and finalist referees don’t always get games at the quarterfinals. The only non quarterfinal referee I see getting a semifinal is raynaul.

    I think garces and raynaul get the semi finals and the final would go to: (in order)
    1. Barnes
    2. Owens
    3. Peyper

    I bet world rugby wants England to lose since the gap between Barnes and the rest is huge imo.
     
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  18. The_Blindside

    The_Blindside International

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    2015 RWC

    Owens reffed NZ v France
    Wales v SA was reffed by Barnes
    Arg v Ireland was reffed by Garces
    Aust v Scotland by Joubert

    semis were reffed by Garces (SA v NZ) and Barnes (Arg v Aus).

    Owens reffing the final.

    got to wonder if WR will be sentimental and give Barnes the final if England don’t make it. Or Owens if Wales don’t. As this tournament will be their last; certainly Barnes’ last one. There’s always the case that Owens reffed the last one so shouldn’t get two in a row. But then it didn’t stop Andre Watson getting picked for the 1999 and 2003 finals.

    The other choice would be Garces for the final as France are out.

    Peyper couldn’t ref the final if SA make it
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2019
  19. ncurd

    ncurd International

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    I don't know how Barnes and Peyper don't ref the semis. I bet we get ******* Owens though.
     
  20. The_Blindside

    The_Blindside International

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    Joubert reffed a QF, SF and the final back in 2011.
     
  21. The_Blindside

    The_Blindside International

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    I suspect we get Garces or Peyper; Barnes the choice to ref Wales v SA.
     
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