Rugby World Cup 2021 Draw

[Al Bangor]

Pools confirmed for Rugby World Cup 2021 | World Rugby

The pools have been confirmed for Rugby World Cup 2021 with less than 10 months until the ninth edition of the tournament kicks off in Auckland on 18 September, 2021.

www.world.rugby

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

WTF is this!!!

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

bloody hell, you nearly gave me a heart attack.

 

[Goodey]

Wish the men's game grew a pair and did the draw less than a year out.

Speaking of which, why not just rename the men's cup as just that, rather than having two competitions with the same name, not ruddy hard was it

 

[EdBirch]

Wish the men's game grew a pair and did the draw less than a year out.

Speaking of which, why not just rename the men's cup as just that, rather than having two competitions with the same name, not ruddy hard was it

It's so then it's gender neutral isn't it? At least i think that's what i heard

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

Speaking of which, why not just rename the men's cup as just that, rather than having two competitions with the same name, not ruddy hard was it

Seconded.

 

[Goodey]

It's so then it's gender neutral isn't it? At least i think that's what i heard

Yeah and that's perfectly valid. Having one 'rugby world cup' and then also 'women's rugby world cup' is off balance.

Having 'men's world cup' and 'women's world cup' as the official names would make more sense than doing this though.

 

[ncurd]

It's so then it's gender neutral isn't it? At least i think that's what i heard

It would make sense your trying to make the womans game not sound like its lesser alternative. Part of issue delves that the men's game is only a mens game in so far as no woman has been capable of playing at that level of it yet (to reference an earlier conversation they perfectly capable of commentating on it). In sport the mens game actually is usually an open category in terms of the rulebook.

Its unfortunately a bit issue to resolve on one hand you have tournament where its the best people to ever have played the game. And the other people who have physical charcteristics that stop them from being the best human that played. On the other that group of physicaly charactersitics represent just over 50% of population of the planet within societies which considers those distinctions highly important and for centuries (millennia) taken that population and considered them lesser than the other group.

Add in market forces where you want to sell the product you currently have to that population but know they idenitfy better with your category that isn't best human at playing product but they turned off because its not given the same weight. And the marketing department does something silly by not making it clearly identifiable which product is which.


I don't actually have a good answer. All I know is nothing good from it comes when you talk to women who care about equal rights but don't actually watch or understand sport, there is a group out there who think gender doesn't have anything to do with it and well they are wrong. Otherwise rugby would of found a woman of Youngs' size and build, trained them to better and EJ would still pick Youngs.

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

I see your point, and kinda agree but what are you going to do? I dont have an answer either. Or maybe i do but i guess a group of very loud people will not like it.
Force people to watch it? Trick people into believing they are about to watch the men's by mixing up the names in the ads and then lock the bar's doors? That will backfire.
You can (and should) give them exposure, but after that it's up to them and what the audience wants.
I don't care what the names are. Wanna call the woman's cup Rugby cap and add a special "men's" to the other one? Fine. It's semantics. I just care about being able to differentiate so i can adjust accordingly.

50% of population of the planet within societies which considers those distinctions highly important and for centuries (millennia) taken that population and considered them lesser than the other group.

Many of those societies also granted them quite a few very significant and tangible advantages. It's quite telling that the banners and taglines generally state something along the lines of "equal rights", never "equal rights and responsibilities".

 

[ncurd]

Many of those societies also granted them quite a few very significant and tangible advantages. It's quite telling that the banners and taglines generally state something along the lines of "equal rights", never "equal rights and responsibilities".

I'd suggest you talk to virtually any successful woman in any field academia/science/business/sports broadcasting and actually listen you may find out incredibly stupid that statement is. Because believe society as a whole gives vastly more tangible benefit to men than women in just about every culture on this planet its not even a close run thing.

Men are disadvantaged in a couple of very distinct ways but the fact you could probably list them by just using your fingers. Shows how much they are overblown compared to what women face.

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

What a brutal display of ignorance. Outstanding stuff. Lot of innuendo and ridiculous claims without a shred of evidence.

I'd suggest you talk to virtually any successful woman in any field academia/science/business/sports broadcasting and actually listen you may find out incredibly stupid that statement is.

Why are you assuming my gender?
Why are you assuming i am unsuccessful? Are you assuming that because i am a woman?
Are you transphobic? Why do you hate trans people?

I can play that game, too.

Men are disadvantaged in a couple of very distinct ways but the fact you could probably list them by just using your fingers.

Sure....
The odds of dying a violent death are 3/4 times higher for men (depending on jurisdiction, time you use), but who the cares about how they die, right?
Walk into family court in western democracy and ask how the gender split is with regards to custody sentences. But hey, I'm sure the men who go there don't really want to get custody of their kids. They just like to through away money on expensive lawyers.
Look at the life expectancy in virtually any jurisdiction in the planet since we have records. But sure, men don't want to live.
Go look at the figures from any high risk jobs, from high sea fishing to deep shaft mining, from firefighting to oil rigs, etc and ask them what's the applicant split by gender (use applicant and not actual workers to eliminate/minimize any ulterior discrimination bias)

You are talking about something you clearly know nothing about. While i was being drafted for conscription when many of the women that today cry foul were laughing at us. And it was ok. I probably would have done the same in their shoes. But none of them would dare look us in the eyes and tell us they didn't get a considerable advantage due to that.

You need to know your facts before you come to lecture me about this particular subject.

When the ***anic was sinking and the officers said "women and children first" no one said "absolutely not, i would like equal treatment".

 

[ncurd]

I count 5, so you could not even make it to the second hand of the 10 I gave you.

Men are disadvantaged in a couple of very distinct ways but the fact you could probably list them by just using your fingers. Shows how much they are overblown compared to what women face.

I'll give you fair due conscription was not one I've seen before. The rest are almost a template from the ignorant sexist playbook though.

Yes men get disadvantaged in custodial courts that's a remnant of mysigionistic idea of a woman being nothing more than breeding apparatus. Therefore they can't have careers as they need to look after the children. That stop women gaining power and the means to not need men. And this culture still prevails whilst men do want to.interact with Thier children far more than they once did it culturally relevant that women are seen as primary carers. This is a completely sexist and dare I say it mysigionistic viewpoint. But it's artefact of disadvantaging women not the other way around. Just sensibilities have changed .

Gender disparity in male dominated fields? Say it isn't so!....I work in one that isn't high risk that women are more than capable at it going to take very very long time before those things get even out. It points to litreally nothing.

Life expectancy honestly why not just suicide rates which are tragic. Most of which come from societies pressures of what a man should be and their failure to live up to that. Whilst not as tragic we have similar issue in gender disparity in eating disorders.

I'm probably giving you way more credit on this topic than you deserve though.

 

[ncurd]

It's simple to understand until relatively recently various people on the planet who weren't rich white men were deliberately disadvantaged it become easier to create the lens through which to understand why disparities exist. Some thing exist to disadvantage based on race, some based on sex and others wealth, sometimes all three. The key thing to keep power with those with it and to make sure those without it don't or at very least don't gain it.

Ask with conscription who actually got constricted and who managed to get out of it? You focus on the women but who really benefitted I'll place a really high bet it was wealthy people who could through various loopholes skip out, most of which would be men. Your turning your bias on the wrong people. Your looking at someone with the same socio-economic background and going ha they lucked out (not considering this a historical incident of yes women should have no power and are only required to breed more men, they can't fight for our more power so lest send out expendable men and then use thier women for breeding, oversimplified but that's the general gist) and not blaming it on say Donald "I can't drafted due to bone spurs/my daddy can pay for me not to fight" Trump

 

[ncurd]

The entire way most forces are divided is.analogue to this where enlisted and officers were of different classes, risk is far higher in enlisted ranks. And the wealthy would by their safety with a commission.

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

I'll give you fair due conscription was not one I've seen before.

That because, as i said, you have no idea of what you are talking about. None.

Yes men get disadvantaged in custodial courts that's a remnant of mysigionistic idea of a woman being nothing more than breeding apparatus.

So the reason men are at a disadvantage is because men created a legal system that puts them at a disadvantage while at the same time pulling the strings from a heteropatriachal society that oppreses women.
Sure, that make a lot of sense.

I count 5, so you could not even make it to the second hand of the 10 I gave you.

Really? The length of a list? That's how you wanna measure this? Fine, here are the 10

Conscription
Retirement age
Quotas
Affirmative action
Life expectancy
Differential probabilities of dying a violent death
Inversion of the burden of proof in several legal matters (not for sentencing but still gets you jailed on the spot)
Custody battles
Suicide rates
Radically lower incarceration rates and sentences, even for same the exact same crimes
There are quite a few welfare programs who's target is single mothers and not single parents

There you go.




The fact you decided to drink the woke cool-aid and read a two pamphlet doesn't mean you know about the subject. Let me say it again; you do not know what you are talking about.

 

[ncurd]

Cant be arsed to reply as per usual I've given you a fairly detailed and complex response. And you took one quote and just went 'doesnt make sense' when I had given a detailed explanation. Then not engaged on any other level.

That's typical of you frankly on any topic but I've been accused of not knowing what talking about....

This has nothing to do with topic at hand. If anyone want to bring it back to the complexities of what to name world cups I'm happy to do so.

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

as per usual I've given you a fairly detailed and complex response.

You've unlocked a new level of ignorance and delusion right there.

 

[Al Bangor]

 

[miccloarch]

Having 'men's world cup' and 'women's world cup' as the official names would make more sense than doing this though.

It's been tried with football/soccer and it doesn't stick. People still say FIFA World Cup and FIFA Women's World Cup, and like it or not that pretty much reflects reality. The men's tournament is superior in quality, and brings in more money and media coverage. Better to improve the women's game at grassroots than get stuck up on political nonsense.