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RWC Home nations chat

scotty507

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Figured id start this for anything home nations, no point to it just a one stop thread for all the home nations to have say through the RWC.

Who got the most out of the warms ups? And is in the best place?

Any thing you wsnt to chst about have your say :cool:
 

TommiG88

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It’s a difficult one to measure.

I thought England looked good generally and a lot of the squad got minutes.

Wales look strong defensively, but lacking in the go forward department. There was glimpses in the first game against England that they could attack.

Ireland are a difficult one. Blown away by England but have come back strongly. Although yesterday’s score should have been a lot bigger, as they left quite a few points out there. Do that in the World Cup, and they would be knocked out. But they were also testing their set piece over taking the points. So again, can’t look too much into that.

I didn’t catch any of the Scottish games so I can’t comment on how they have done.

I’m quite optimistic on England’s chances, but it could come down to injuries. We lose Curry and Underhill and I’ll think we’ll struggle. I think that 7 has made a huge difference to us at the breakdown.

Wales will make it to the knockouts and will test any team. I feel they will need luck on their side to win the whole thing.

Ireland, similar to England. Stay clear of injuries and they’ll go far.
 

scotty507

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I agree with at, curry underhill but also manu. They give him more time by getting quick players but in a carry he makes ground and in a dummy run he draws defenders in.

England went 3 wins from 4. 2 experimental teams and 2 stronger(strong vs opponants in italys case) beat a strong wales team, demolished a strong ireland team and nilled and average italy team. And i dare say scored the most and conceded the least out of any home nations? In the warm up series? I may be wrong.

Wales went 3 losses from 4? Not good but showed signs yet didnt hit 6N form

Ireland. 3 from 4 or 2 from 3? Cant remember but 2 good wins vs wales but a baf loss from england. They havnt hit their stride and line out is failing. I dont think they will do bad but im abit worried for them. If they settle though they csnnot be discounted.

Scotland, beat georgia twice and france once but not great and a few injuries could derail them massivly.

For me england are on top of the home nations.
 

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Definitely agree we had the best/most productive warm up series but I'm loathe to tout us as the best home nation because we're still so mentally fragile.

The Scotland capitulation really isn't that long ago
 

ratsapprentice

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Definitely agree we had the best/most productive warm up series but I'm loathe to tout us as the best home nation because we're still so mentally fragile.

The Scotland capitulation really isn't that long ago
Aye, comfortably the the best team at peak performance, possibly in the world.

Equally capable of just not turning up, and it's not even ******** the bed, it's like they go comatose.
 

scotty507

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Have we done that this series? I think we have put in full performances. Second half performances.
Vs Italy 28 scored 0 conceded
Vs Ireland 35 scored 5 conceded
Vs Wales away 6 scored 3 conceded
Vs Wales home 12 scored 12 conceded

So with the experimental team vs wales we may have dropped off abit but we didnt lose a second half where we dropped of badly and let the team win. We arnt perfect but have improved it seems.
 

The Alpha Bro

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Aye, comfortably the the best team at peak performance, possibly in the world.

Equally capable of just not turning up, and it's not even ******** the bed, it's like they go comatose.
"Comfortably"
 

The Alpha Bro

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Yes. "at peak performance"
Ahhh, I don't see it, maybe the best at running up a score but Wales shut ye down a few months back without doing anything monumentally special themselves. I think if everyone played the entire RWC at their peak without injuries (obviously fantasy land here) either NZ would win or the margins would be so slim the refs interpretation on any given day, or weather suiting one team more than another or any other uncontrollable variable would decide it. Wales are definitely still up there with you on top of the home nations in my opinion, I'd put far more weight into the 6n than a few groggy warm ups for them.
 

ratsapprentice

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Ahhh, I don't see it, maybe the best at running up a score but Wales shut ye down a few months back without doing anything monumentally special themselves. I think if everyone played the entire RWC at their peak without injuries (obviously fantasy land here) either NZ would win or the margins would be so slim the refs interpretation on any given day, or weather suiting one team more than another or any other uncontrollable variable would decide it. Wales are definitely still up there with you on top of the home nations in my opinion, I'd put far more weight into the 6n than a few groggy warm ups for them.
Aye, and the 6N showed, to me, that the side can flit from strong to poor performance very quickly.

You talk about running up a score as if that’s a poor measure of dominance.
 

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You talk about running up a score as if that’s a poor measure of dominance.
No, it's more that you're not going to do it against a good team playing well. England are a better attacking team than Wales and Wales are better defensively than England, at their respective peaks you'd presume they're going to level out.

I don't think England did a whole lot different v Wales than they did v Ireland and France, they just faced a better team away and didn't have the tools to overcome the challenge.
 

The_Blindside

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Aye, and the 6N showed, to me, that the side can flit from strong to poor performance very quickly.

You talk about running up a score as if that’s a poor measure of dominance.
Which I think is a sign this England side still don’t know how to adapt as the game unfolds before them. This is a quality of pretty much all the rugby World Cup winning sides and I just don’t see that yet with this England side.
 

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You can tell Geech used to be a teacher. In today’s Torygraph he rated England:

Attitude: A+. “Most significantly they kept the decision making on the pitch and didn’t need any direction from the stands” Against Italy B I’d bloody well hope not. Not a great benchmark.

Game Plan: A. Apparently we have real tactical clarity.

Strength in depth: A+. Apparently this squad runs deeper than 03.

Overall: A

Whatever, Geech, whatever.

We could go far, but that really would mean all the stars aligning and a couple of key players avoiding injury. The mental aspect remains one big Achilles heel and we’ve done the lack of cover / experience in certain positions to death.

The warm ups were irrelevant. Nothing has changed except perhaps for Wales. They’ve lost their first choice 10 and possibly their 3rd choice too. But whoever wins will have to have a reliable defence, and Wales certainly have that. I reckon a couple of NH teams might put up a good fight, but ultimately I reckon Bill’s heading south of the equator yet again.
 

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I think overall this is the strongest set of UK/Ireland teams we've probably ever had going to a world cup. I wouldn't say it's the best ever set of NH teams because France are far weaker than in the past but there's a lot of cause for optimism in the English-speaking part of Europe.
 

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Listening to all my various podcasts, I've noticed that Ireland seems to be the nation quickest to hit the panic button ... after these warm-up results, there was a lot of The sky is falling! talk, but I still feel like they could do really well. But from my noob perspective, England look to be top in the NH. I wish Scotland looked better, they really seem stuck in place, hard to imagine them elevating past where they're hovering right now...
 

scotty507

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Listening to all my various podcasts, I've noticed that Ireland seems to be the nation quickest to hit the panic button ... after these warm-up results, there was a lot of The sky is falling! talk, but I still feel like they could do really well. But from my noob perspective, England look to be top in the NH. I wish Scotland looked better, they really seem stuck in place, hard to imagine them elevating past where they're hovering right now...
Really well being the term, they dont want to do well they want to win it. The team that downed the ABs twice and were smashing it and then just before the RWC some of their top experience players start losing form and not being what they were and then they lose that badly to England.

I dont think they think that they arnt going to do well its they want to be contenders for the champions not yet another QF.

They are contenders and a great team and deffinstly can win it all i have no doubt but getting beat like they did before the WC will start some panic in supporters. Leading to alot of the sky is falling talk as you put it.

England are currently the top NH nation baised purely on form in these warm ups. But we sre travelling with mako nowell and slade all injured for most of the pool stages so its about player management with 3 less players during the pools
 

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From an outsider's perspective, I think Ireland, Wales and England have painted a big target on their backs. England more so than anyone else. Now this isn't just because of the overall hatred teams tend to have for England, but also the whole Owen Farrell high tackles which seems to go unpunished. I wouldn't be surprised at all if teams go out of their way to hurt the English team. You have a coach who isn't well-liked, you have a cocky captain in Farrell and there seems to be this aura around the team where they think they are better than what they actually are...

Ireland and Wales have targets on their backs purely because they have been winning a lot more against SH teams than in the past, and the frequency of their victories are a sign of their improvements in key areas in the game. For Ireland, should they get a QF with SA, there will be issue of poaching of players rearing it's ugly head, with their most recent squad member in Jean Kleyn being the latest victim.

Again, I'm speaking from an outsider's perspective, but I think the NH teams will need to be ready for an onslaught.
 

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High tackles,
Everyone hates England,
Arrogance,
Poaching


That's a bingo!
Don't oversimplify it like that. There's more to it than that.

I just gave you my perspective on how I'm seeing the UK/Ireland's presence at the WC. I do however think that England have the opportunity to make it to the final.
 

The Alpha Bro

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I think this is the tournament where the NH top three should be most comfortable facing SH sides. Wales are a bit more precarious because they have only just started beating SA and Aus but since breaking long droughts without beating Australia and SA in 2002 and 2004 respectively Ireland have a 50/50 record against them, that's not recent at all. NZ is still a different kettle of fish, Wales haven't come close to beating them, England probably still rue letting them back into that game in the minutes before HT last year and Ireland beat them for the first time ever only three years ago but with the exception of England in 03 I reckon all three are more confident they can beat them than ever before going into a world cup.

Personally I think our best chance of a QF win is if SA lose a close and high quality game v NZ and proceed to stomp the rest of their pool, confident Boks sides are made for us to beat. I don't see it being anything other than a 50/50 call regardless of who we play granted we top our pool though.
 
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