• Help Support The Rugby Forum :

[RWC2019][Semi-Final 1] England vs. New Zealand (26/10/2019)

Think Slade will get the nod?

It is interesting now - with Barrett at 6 we should theoretically have an advantage at lineout, but I imagine England will have an advantage at the breakdown.

I guess that will depend on how EJ thought Slade played against Australia, which it appears most others think was pretty meh. But he's used him quite a lot over the last few years, so I think he'll at least be on the bench if anything.

I'm wondering if George Kruis will get the nod over Courtney Lawes; Kruis it seems has more power, but it seems Lawes is taller, which would be great at the lineouts. And what about Joe Cokanasiga; I've heard his defense isn't quite up to snuff, but he brings a mean power game. Probably too much of a risk for EJ to bring him out in a huge game like this weekend, but depending on injuries I could actually see him on the bench in the final, provided England get there
 
it's an interesting call to put scott at 6 and Cane on the bench. I can see some reasoning for it.
1, importantly and maybe the main reason Cane was subbed for barrett early against ireland is that with Savea at 6 we lose strength at the lineout. IMO Savea just shouldn't be jumping that should have been left to Read, Sam and Guzzler with some change up options. So far this WC the AB's have been using Savea and we have lost at least 3 lineouts that have been thrown to him, Ireland got one in the first half. Starting Scott at 6 fixes that. It's something England would have seen and targeted.
2, the loss of Todd changes the dynamics of the bench, the alternative was having Scott and Patrick on the bench - two locks, or the less experienced Frizell. But Tuipulotu has been in great form and his Physical impact will be an asset off the bench later.
3, Sam Cane has never played England in his 66 odd tests, for various reasons and injury timing he's missed out. I don't know how much that fact plays into the selection. I doubt that would phase him he will be looking forward to it.
4, Cane seems to be less of an 80min player than Savea in test rugby. It's not that Cane is unfit its more to do with cane being the guy who puts his body on the line more than most stopping the big opposition ball carriers, slowing ball and cleaning rucks. I think late in games when we are ahead it makes sense just to bring him off and preserve his body a bit from the punishment he takes.

What we give up?
Sam Cane is not the flashiest 7 in the world, he's solid all round with one distinction. He's probably the best defender in the NZ game arguably the world. Against Ireland Savea topped the All Blacks tackle count with 14 in 80minutes. Sam Cane made 12 in his 40 minutes heading for his usual 20 odd he often gets in a full 80. It's not just the number though, he brings guys down before they get to the advantage line. He's great laterally as well and his tackles sting. And he sets the standards for defense early in the game. Savea is a great defender but he's not Sam Cane, against SA the biggest break the boks made against us was after Half time and Cane was in the HIA mixup, Savea moved to 7 and Vermeulen ran straight past Savea in the 7 channel. I don't think people appreciate just how good Cane is in that area. As most keen eyed All Black arm chair analysts will know - in that first few minutes if the All Blacks forwards assert some dominance in the tackle and start trapping ball carriers behind the gain line you know its time to sit back and enjoy what is almost certainly a win.

Barrett is a prodigious talent though, he has spent plenty of time at 6. The Crusaders have Barrett, Whitelock and Romano. With 3 great locks there Scott splits his time between lock and 6. He has a huge gas tank and workrate.

On another note, still sad not to see Bender I think he would be a good bench option for this game.
 
it's an interesting call to put scott at 6 and Cane on the bench. I can see some reasoning for it.
1, importantly and maybe the main reason Cane was subbed for barrett early against ireland is that with Savea at 6 we lose strength at the lineout. IMO Savea just shouldn't be jumping that should have been left to Read, Sam and Guzzler with some change up options. So far this WC the AB's have been using Savea and we have lost at least 3 lineouts that have been thrown to him, Ireland got one in the first half. Starting Scott at 6 fixes that. It's something England would have seen and targeted.
2, the loss of Todd changes the dynamics of the bench, the alternative was having Scott and Patrick on the bench - two locks, or the less experienced Frizell. But Tuipulotu has been in great form and his Physical impact will be an asset off the bench later.
3, Sam Cane has never played England in his 66 odd tests, for various reasons and injury timing he's missed out. I don't know how much that fact plays into the selection. I doubt that would phase him he will be looking forward to it.
4, Cane seems to be less of an 80min player than Savea in test rugby. It's not that Cane is unfit its more to do with cane being the guy who puts his body on the line more than most stopping the big opposition ball carriers, slowing ball and cleaning rucks. I think late in games when we are ahead it makes sense just to bring him off and preserve his body a bit from the punishment he takes.

What we give up?
Sam Cane is not the flashiest 7 in the world, he's solid all round with one distinction. He's probably the best defender in the NZ game arguably the world. Against Ireland Savea topped the All Blacks tackle count with 14 in 80minutes. Sam Cane made 12 in his 40 minutes heading for his usual 20 odd he often gets in a full 80. It's not just the number though, he brings guys down before they get to the advantage line. He's great laterally as well and his tackles sting. And he sets the standards for defense early in the game. Savea is a great defender but he's not Sam Cane, against SA the biggest break the boks made against us was after Half time and Cane was in the HIA mixup, Savea moved to 7 and Vermeulen ran straight past Savea in the 7 channel. I don't think people appreciate just how good Cane is in that area. As most keen eyed All Black arm chair analysts will know - in that first few minutes if the All Blacks forwards assert some dominance in the tackle and start trapping ball carriers behind the gain line you know its time to sit back and enjoy what is almost certainly a win.

Barrett is a prodigious talent though, he has spent plenty of time at 6. The Crusaders have Barrett, Whitelock and Romano. With 3 great locks there Scott splits his time between lock and 6. He has a huge gas tank and workrate.

On another note, still sad not to see Bender I think he would be a good bench option for this game.

Yup. All the emphatic wins we have had in the Hansen era usually start out with us belting the other teams forwards at the start of the game. Cane was immense against Ireland. Cane is a proper workhorse on defence, and like you say, his tackles are usually pretty powerful which would be nice against Tuilagi, Vunipola x 2 and Sinkler.

Our defensive lineout will be awesome now, but still would have been great as it was with 3 jumpers.
 
This is where England's lineout could get exposed and where the Undercurry back row limits our targets to 3 v ABs 4. It was always my worry with Binny so limited at the lineout.

Interesting to see Coles get the nod over Taylor. Better lineout thrower than Taylor and with Read playing tighter will revert to being loose I expect in the wider channels.
 
I guess that will depend on how EJ thought Slade played against Australia, which it appears most others think was pretty meh. But he's used him quite a lot over the last few years, so I think he'll at least be on the bench if anything.

I'm wondering if George Kruis will get the nod over Courtney Lawes; Kruis it seems has more power, but it seems Lawes is taller, which would be great at the lineouts. And what about Joe Cokanasiga; I've heard his defense isn't quite up to snuff, but he brings a mean power game. Probably too much of a risk for EJ to bring him out in a huge game like this weekend, but depending on injuries I could actually see him on the bench in the final, provided England get there

we'll know the England team in less than 40 mins. I also prefer Kruis to Lawes. Even though we may be screwed more at lineout time. I hope Eddie doesn't choose Lawes at 6 now he has seen ABs choose Barrett at 6. England will now have to target and get the better at the breakdown. There will be more of them in the game than lineouts, anc we've got to up possession to over 40% at least..
 
Last edited:
So early reporting this morning suggests that Ford/Faz/Manu will be the shout, and Kruis coming in for Lawes. May apparently fit and so will start and Nowell also fit.

seems to make sense. We need to have some good palymakers running the show. Where we win this game is in relentless, vicious, powerful defence. We have to hit them hard in the tackle, stop them dead on the game line, or hit them back (which with the lighter backs NZ now have is more than possible) and then slow things right down. Frustrate them. They will fear a solid white line, and rightly so, and will look to break it up. We can't be sucked into the trap of rushing out of the line. I also hope we take the approach of having a tackler and then a jackal on the side ready to get hands on ball the second the tackle is complete.

we also need to challenge them properly at the line outs and scrums. Get at them at every single opportunity.

England can win this, and NZ know it. This is the first game Hansen has actually had to worry about in some time, and I'd suggest he is indeed worrying. His last World Cup, his final legacy, his captains last shot. All Jones has to do is put in a decent performance and most England fans will be happy, and would probably ask for 4 more years.
 
This is where England's lineout could get exposed and where the Undercurry back row limits our targets to 3 v ABs 4. It was always my worry with Binny so limited at the lineout.

Interesting to see Coles get the nod over Taylor. Better lineout thrower than Taylor and with Read playing tighter will revert to being loose I expect in the wider channels.

Taylor starting this one again.

Who is the third jumper for England? Curry?
 
Taylor starting this one again.

Who is the third jumper for England? Curry?

Ah right. Was going by Cooper's earlier post of the team where he included Coles to start. But I see it was before the team was announced.

Curry is our third jumper.
 
Aye, sack off the breakdown

4. Itoje
5. Kruis
6. Lawes
7. Launchbury
8. Tom Wood (send Binny home because he's not a lineout specialist and is therefore useless)
 
Right and doing that while laughing with celebrating Welsh fans is exactly the same as explaining the card at the time?
I really don't think it is, but also am not overly fussed.

You could tell that from a photo?? I know a picture tells a thousand words, but I don't see him celebrating...

Yes he smiled, but then again most of us do when a picture is being taken. That's just common courtesy to make the picture look better. Unless that picture is taken completely out of context, and they were all doing the Mr. Roboto dance when the picture was taken.
 
Reports ive read, Ford Faz Manu, Slade Nowell.
Kruis for lawes and otherwise the same.
 
No changes apart from Ford and Slade swapping, like to see Kruis start but we are where we are.

I'm happy enough.
 

Latest posts

Top