[RWC2019][The Final] England vs. South Africa (02/11/2019)

[TRF_heineken]

Spoken like a man who's never been to Birmingham/Walsall

No I haven't bruv. Touring England is on my bucket list.

Perhaps don't use the word despise then mate, it's fairly emotive and didn't come across as a joke, but all good.

When it comes to rugby and cricket, despise is the best word to use. For everything else, I agree to not use it.

People may call us petty for saying this, and that's okay, but just remember to call us Petty World Cup Champions then.

 

[Jer1cho]

Enlighten me Jer1cho.

It's a rugby forum. Not the place.

 

[Pom in Exile]

Not to turn this into politics, but a simple google will help you out here. There are quite a few ramifications for us.



To be fair many people here still hold a grudge from the Boer war and what happened there. (Not justifying anything as I had 2 great grandparents who fought on opposite sides of that war) Besides, it's worse for us here as even our own governments despise some of us (White South Africans.) So we can at least always relate to hate lol. Anyway I said my stance on England already so we can't all be painted with the same brush, and vice versa.

It's a funny one isn't it?! It's considered extremely poor form to reference the war to a German or a Japanese person (or Apartheid to white South Africans) yet any war or **** that happened throughout history is perfectly ok to beat the English with. There's certainly double standards at play.

 

[Pom in Exile]

Nasty pasty x

Huh?

 

[Grizwald]

Interesting listening to some of Rassies comments. Took particular note of the comments re the scrum demolition, his comments were along the lines of the Boks props were much fresher having rotated throughout the competition.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing but got me thinking.

What was the point of taking so many wingers and only 2 loose and tighthead props? Why does Jones think Ben Youngs is England's only international standard scrum half and there was no one else behind him?

 

[Jer1cho]

It's a funny one isn't it?! It's considered extremely poor form to reference the war to a German or a Japanese person (or Apartheid to white South Africans) yet any war or **** that happened throughout history is perfectly ok to beat the English with. There's certainly double standards at play.

I agree. Good thing many of us have different opinions else we would all just be petty and grudgy forever.

 

[ThebigARena]

An observation I have made since the final whistle is the increased Welsh interest in the world cup. Living and working in South Wales, I have a lot of Welsh contacts on social media. Quite a few of them barely posted during the world cup as I guess they were generally disappointed with how their team was playing, despite getting to the SF. Since Saturday morning, they can't stop posting about the world cup. And guess what, apparently, if they'd have got to the final, they'd be world champions now.

Your obsession with the Welsh is getting the better of you . Every post you whinge about Wales or your supposed Welsh mates (which I struggle to believe). If the Welsh annoy you so much why would you drink in Welsh pubs or socialise with Welsh people ? If your aim on here was to get a rise out of a Welsh poster then well done you succeeded and to try and discredit Welsh posters because they are posting on a forum that encourages people to talk about Rugby says a lot about you.

 

[Pom in Exile]

You are a bit too sensitive for the internet....

Thanks for the insight, I have to say that your opinion is important to me so I'll try and work on being less so. It's so hard sometimes though you know...

 

[Pom in Exile]

It's a rugby forum. Not the place.

Fair enough.

 

[ForumWhore]

and watson isn't jrob

Your obsession with the Welsh is getting the better of you . Every post you whinge about Wales or your supposed Welsh mates (which I struggle to believe). If the Welsh annoy you so much why would you drink in Welsh pubs or socialise with Welsh people ? If your aim on here was to get a rise out of a Welsh poster then well done you succeeded and to try and discredit Welsh posters because they are posting on a forum that encourages people to talk about Rugby says a lot about you.

Because I live here, with a Welsh family. I have nothing against Welsh people but in the same way as everybody hates English rugby, I like to hold a mirror up to it and highlight the hypocrisy of Welsh rugby support.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

fuk me did this thread take a turn.

 

[Hydraulxx]

So my boss has given everyone the day off next monday to go check out the Springboks when they come to Cape Town. Still can't believe how well we played

 

[ncurd]

fuk me did this thread take a turn.

Should of read it after the match the amount of anti-English bile was something quite to witness.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I saw it, it wasn't too bad I thought.
I don't know I guess since I rarely post anything serious (Or Grade A quality banter some might say) I might tend to think the same of others when they are in fact being very serious.

 

[ThebigARena]

Because I live here, with a Welsh family. I have nothing against Welsh people but in the same way as everybody hates English rugby, I like to hold a mirror up to it and highlight the hypocrisy of Welsh rugby support.

Nothing need more be said . Amen.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Interesting listening to some of Rassies comments. Took particular note of the comments re the scrum demolition, his comments were along the lines of the Boks props were much fresher having rotated throughout the competition.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing but got me thinking.

What was the point of taking so many wingers and only 2 loose and tighthead props? Why does Jones think Ben Youngs is England's only international standard scrum half and there was no one else behind him?

We had 3 LHs. Mako had only 20 minutes before the QF.

Before the final Cole only started one game and was a 2nd half sub in all the others.

And we had a week off.

So I doubt freshness really came into it. That the Saffers still think scrummaging's an important part of rugby union almost certainly does. I think Cole's issue was more simply that Beast's always had his number just as Domingo from Fra did.

But your point about wingers / SH is bang on.

 

[Gena_ZA]

ffs why does anyone want to bring into a rugby discussion past colonial wars, just how frikkin dumb are you (whoever in general) really?
It is 100+ years ago, a different life
Last time that bull was spun Corne Krige and team lost 53-3 to England

Sorry it makes me livid, this is rugby for peet sakes. One place we want to forget about wars, politics and corruption
Rant done
\\

Back to the game, funny thing is that just last week a poster wondered how many SA players would make a tournament team after England blew NZ off the park and SA had a bore fest against Wales.
Wow how opinions change just one week later.

I quote myself from earlier
" The game will be played between four white lines with an oval ball.
No past performance, history or pedigree will matter.
Just this game
Bring it!"

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

It is 100 years ago but those 100 years are what shapes people opinions of the modern age sporting rivalries.
Nothing to do with rugby, but when asked why do nations hate England it is certainly a foundation for many countries.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Why can't we all just be friends

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

I posted this elsewhere but this is where my own preferences lie:

1: Kitshoff (25)
Out: Beast
In (Maybe): Gqoboka (29)
Coming into his own and arguably SAs form loose head this year having lost out to selection because of Kitsie and Beast being the encumbents and TDT able to pack down both sides of the scrum.

2: Marx (27) / Mbonambi (28)
Out: Brits
In (Maybe): Dweba (23) / Van der Merwe (28)
With Akker van der Merwe at 28 I see Dweba as being more likely to compete for the 3rd hooker spot maybe even higher as I see Dweba coming in as a dynamic bench option going forward.

3: Malherbe (28) / Nyakane (30) / Koch (29) / Du Toit (24) / Louw (24) / Oosthuizen (30)
Only 3 max are going to make it. Will be a tough selection headache but a good problem to have.

4: Etzebeth (28) / Snyman (24)

5: De Jager (26) / Mostert (28)
In (Maybe): Van der Mescht (20)
Can JJ mix it at a higher level? Probably. We've seen enough Wu20 now to see the stand outs there do carry on at test level. Is he more of a 4? Can we have 2x dual 4/5 locks in Snyman and VdM rather than a traditional 4 and 5? Mostert first to drop? The Sharks are absolutely going to fast track him as they are short some truely world class locks.

6: Coetzee (28) / Smith (23)
Out: Louw
In (Maybe): Van Staden (24)
I am moving Kolisi to 8. I'm not sure we continue to carry Smith. Surely we bring Van Staden in ahead of SMith going forward? Smith is superb at SR level but that seemingly does not translate to test level (unless we play a vastly different game) so if he is out, maybe we have space for back up at blindside/8 in the form of probably JL du Preez (24) or Ruan Ackermann (23)?

7: Du Toit (27)

8: Kolisi (28)
Out: Vermeulen
My first shifting a player. With Vermeulen out we are short of a world class 8. I can see Kolisi picking up the carrying duties of Vermeulen with aplomb, especially as the loosies we have around can fullfill more of a traditional openside role. At least, more so than Kolisi. Might bring some better balance to our loose forwards seeing as we will be losing Vermeulen's fetching ability.

9: De Klerk (28) / Jantjies (23) / Reinach (29)
We have three excellent running 9s. Someone needs to figure out how do we bring their strengths (as well as Pollard's) into the game.

10: Pollard (25) / Willemse (21)
Out: Jantjies (can only hope)
In (Maybe): Bosch (22)
I am putting both Willemse and Bosch here rather than at 15 because I see them as covering 10/15 at 22 with a centre/wing wearing 23

11: Dyantyi (25) / Mapimpi (29)
Assuming Dyantyi comes back in and Mapimpi isn't too old as 33 is pushing it especially for winger who doesn't have a ton of arrows in his quiver other than being rapid. I could see Am as an able winger.

12: De Allende (27) / Serfontein (26)
Out: Steyn

13: Kriel (25) / Am (25)
In (Maybe): Simelane (21)
Bit early ATM to tell but if Simelane can continue in the current vein he could pose a few selection questions. Might have too look at one of our 13s shifting to wing if we have issues out wide.

14: Kolbe (26) / Nkosi (23)

15: Gelant (24)
With both Willemse and Bosch options on the bench we should be fine here but I really hope we do try Kolbe at 15 to get him into the game more and keep him there for a full year at least to get a decent sample size.