[RWC2019][The Final] England vs. South Africa (02/11/2019)

[Leinster Fan]

I agree, I'd also include Sam Simmonds in the mix, who before he got injured was playing some good stuff and is quickly coming back into form..

Quality player but from what I've seen he's not an international 8. Could be great as a flanker though.

 

[croadymeister]

The stupid thing is, had England been as clinical as they were against the ABs and not kept knocking it on all the time, that would have massively reduced the SA advantage from the scrums. It's ridiculous how when you know you are losing the scrums badly the players were still throwing wild passes and putting ourselves under pressure. Also we reverted to slow 1 out passes to single forwards running at 2 defenders. Why the hall did we revert to this when not doing this had been so successful!? We play a multi distributor setup and yet our gameplan was a bish-bosh-bash one.

4 world cup finals, 1 win. Numerous grand slam chances bottled, there is a serious problem in English rugby and English sport in general of just falling to pieces at the final hurdle. It's not just rugby, our football team has won only 1 world cup as well.

You have got this absolutely spot on, how many chances at major tournaments have we blown by falling either at the final hurdle or just short of it (1990 world cup, 1996 euros, 2018 world cup, could also talk about 2004 euros and 2006 world cup as possible opportunities with the quality teams that we had too). Like someone said earlier we nearly blew the cricket world cup in the summer and only just squeaked home in 2003 thanks to Jonny's last minute drop goal.

There is a real mentality issue with this nation when it comes to the sharp end of competitions, you just don't see other nations falling apart so many times when the going gets tough on them.

 

[Gena_ZA]

I've now read every post from page 20 odd before leaving the comforts of my PC and enjoying the moment, the day, it all.
Only now able to type, day and a half later...
Had a day we as friends will never ever forget
Not going to try and explain what this means to me, you will never know unless you live rugby as I do

Wanted to rub it in a tad, not the arrogance, but the cock sureness of some, just not worth it
To each his own and whatever blows your hair back

Congrats my team, my nation
This is SPRINGBOKS 2.0

 

[Nudger]

TBF to Eddie he seemed to have wanted to select some of the young lads that played a lot sooner.
Underhill especially but his injuries seem to always happen at a bad time.

and TBF no team can react on the fly to a performance like that from SA, look at NZ v Eng.
When a team blitz you generally you have to either match it or ride it.

You can't change your gameplan on the fly in a world cup final the biggest game of your life outside playing for Leicester Tigers at welford road.

Being mullerd in the scrum is not easy to change

 

[Gena_ZA]

 

[Chief Pete]

I've now read every post from page 20 odd before leaving the comforts of my PC and enjoying the moment, the day, it all.
Only now able to type, day and a half later...
Had a day we as friends will never ever forget
Not going to try and explain what this means to me, you will never know unless you live rugby as I do

Wanted to rub it in a tad, not the arrogance, but the cock sureness of some, just not worth it
To each his own and whatever blows your hair back

Congrats my team, my nation
This is SPRINGBOKS 2.0

I thought there were a few players who put their hands up for best in the world in their position yesterday, Duane Vermeulen was outstanding, Eben Etzebeth was great and put Itoje off his game and having 4 props who can scrum at that level is scary, and Pieter Steph Du Toit was imperious.. Not much you can do when world class players turn up with their 'A' game, much deserved...

Last mention to Siya Kolisi,outstanding performance from a very humble man, World class...

 

[Shimano]

The stupid thing is, had England been as clinical as they were against the ABs and not kept knocking it on all the time, that would have massively reduced the SA advantage from the scrums. It's ridiculous how when you know you are losing the scrums badly the players were still throwing wild passes and putting ourselves under pressure. Also we reverted to slow 1 out passes to single forwards running at 2 defenders. Why the hall did we revert to this when not doing this had been so successful!? We play a multi distributor setup and yet our gameplan was a bish-bosh-bash one.

4 world cup finals, 1 win. Numerous grand slam chances bottled, there is a serious problem in English rugby and English sport in general of just falling to pieces at the final hurdle. It's not just rugby, our football team has won only 1 world cup as well.

can I ask the obvius question..... have england taken over from nz as the "chokers" of the rugby world?

 

[croadymeister]

can I ask the obvius question..... have england taken over from nz as the "chokers" of the rugby world?

We have choked in football on many occasions too, unfortunately we didn't learn from our defeat to them 12 years ago but this is a much better side that we faced yesterday but doesn't make the defeat any easier to take.

 

[higgik]

Quality player but from what I've seen he's not an international 8. Could be great as a flanker though.

That is the thing, we have a multitude of mobile back rows, but no real line out options, which means we will have to find some real grunt up top to cope.
Would love to see Dombrandt and Simmonds given a place in the EPS.
Options
A Curry, Underhill, Billy
B Underhill, Simmonds, Wilson
C Curry, Wilson, Billy
D Dombrandt, Underhill, Curry, playing with interchangeable 6,8 like Exeter.

 

[Jer1cho]

All in all this is arguably the greatest year in Springbok history. On par with 2009. We won literally everything there has been to win this year. From absolute rock bottom to top of the world in 18 months. Ranked 1, World Champions, Rugby Championship champions, best player, best team, best coach. Utterly astonishing really.

Just couldn't be prouder. I hope this is the beginning, and not the end. The Lions tour cannot come soon enough, and with the North/South gap being pretty much closed, it could be one for the ages. Damn it's good to be a Springbok fan in 2019.

 

[Hydraulxx]

All in all this is arguably the greatest year in Springbok history. On par with 2009. We won literally everything there has been to win this year. From absolute rock bottom to top of the world in 18 months. Ranked 1, World Champions, Rugby Championship champions, best player, best team, best coach. Utterly astonishing really.

Just couldn't be prouder. I hope this is the beginning, and not the end. The Lions tour cannot come soon enough, and with the North/South gap being pretty much closed, it could be one for the ages. Damn it's good to be a Springbok fan in 2019.

100% this, What Kolisi, Erasmus and the team have done over the past 18 months has been extraordinary. I couldn't be any prouder of the team than i am currently.

 

[40/20]

100% this, What Kolisi, Erasmus and the team have done over the past 18 months has been extraordinary. I couldn't be any prouder of the team than i am currently.

How do you guys think things will go next year with Rassie stepping aside as head coach and moving into the DOR role?

 

[Bada-Bing!]

You have got this absolutely spot on, how many chances at major tournaments have we blown by falling either at the final hurdle or just short of it (1990 world cup, 1996 euros, 2018 world cup, could also talk about 2004 euros and 2006 world cup as possible opportunities with the quality teams that we had too). Like someone said earlier we nearly blew the cricket world cup in the summer and only just squeaked home in 2003 thanks to Jonny's last minute drop goal.

There is a real mentality issue with this nation when it comes to the sharp end of competitions, you just don't see other nations falling apart so many times when the going gets tough on them.

Losing in big finals always brings the worst in terms of Self reflection as a nation. The fact is that it is bloody hard to win at sport at the highest level; so many things have to come together, not just mentality. Compare SA's record in other sports compared to Rugby and I am sure it doesn't look too great either.

The 2003 team was full of special players that came about at the same time, but it still took 6 years to build and win the ultimate prize after going through several hard breaking defeats in 6Ns over the years and getting a major shellacking down under in 1997.

The 2019 team is still full of young players who can be there in 4 years time. They just need to remember this hurt and channel it to get better and for Jones or whoever is managing in 4 years time to build on that and add even better players. Out with Dan Cole, Youngs and in with better quality replacements. France 2023 here we come. Yesterday's final was just the start of this journey for many who played Saturday's final.

England in football - well the pool of countries and players is a hell of a lot bigger than rugby. Yeah 1966 and all that and now the Premiership is akin to the Top 14 in France, which has no interest in serving the National team. But Until England can produce enough technical players who can keep and use the ball well enough, who are rested enough before a major tournament to be at their peak then England's success at international football will continue to be that of nearly men.

But not all bad news England/GB/NI have had a lot of sporting success this decade: Olympics 2012/2016 were pretty unparalleled in terms of number of gold medals won. It's not been all bad. Murray at Wimbledon in 2013 and 2016.

 

[ncurd]

I think it's important when talking about choking that this was not England team topped for top honours. They were always listed to compete but par was a semi-final exit. So they achieved a bloody lot.

Most of the introspection come from the first 30mins if the entire game went like the last 50. I think we'd be saying England just got beasted on the day. But all out troubles in the first half were of our own making. Sure the SA scrum was brilliant but SA weren't forcing the handling errors (this is difference to how we beats the ABs the ABs didn't make unenforced errors like us).

I'm obviously disappointed and annoyed with how we played. Any fan would be but we must also forget nobody really tipped us to make the final. Always talk about being capable but nobody believed we actually would.

 

[Dizzy]

Salute to South Africa. They really gave it to the English who definitely looked like they played their final against us in the Semi. It happens unfortunately. Like 2011 when we played our Final against Australia in the Semi then held on to victory by a thread vs France in the Final..
England should keep their head held high though, they did completely outplay the All Blacks in almost every fashion possible. That is something to be said. No one has been that dominant against this All Blacks side for over a decade

 

[JohnKA]

True very proud of our boys but yet it feels as if we have not seen the best of our team .. I think this is only the start.

All in all this is arguably the greatest year in Springbok history. On par with 2009. We won literally everything there has been to win this year. From absolute rock bottom to top of the world in 18 months. Ranked 1, World Champions, Rugby Championship champions, best player, best team, best coach. Utterly astonishing really.

Just couldn't be prouder. I hope this is the beginning, and not the end. The Lions tour cannot come soon enough, and with the North/South gap being pretty much closed, it could be one for the ages. Damn it's good to be a Springbok fan in 2019.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I am so happy right now. Hungover, but happy. Wait, not happy, elated.

What a performance. We did exactly the same thing we did against Japan and Wales. We didn't change a thing. We just improved.

Watched the game now 4 times already, and man it just gets better everytime I watch it.

Our Bulldozer scrums demolishing the English pack.
Our Lineouts disrupting and competing in every lineout.
Our forwards fighting for every inch at every ruck.
Our kicking game, as always, effective even when it frustrates the hell out of a lot of people.
Our goal kicker. Who in a final always kicks over at least 4 penalties. And Pollard just again showed his BMT. Missed the first kick, and came back to knock every single other penalty over like it was target practise.
Our backline ferocious in defence, cutting down any space available, and Kolbe nearly intercepting too!

My standout performers:
1. Duane Vermeulen. THOR!!! He was just immense in every facet. And yet again silenced Billy Vunipola.
2. Lukhanyo Am. Probably the guy I worried about the most, yet, he impressed me so much. Created both tries to seal the victory, and did a fantastic job in keeping Manu in check.
3. The pack. All of them were amazing.
4. Pollard. The silent killer.
5. Faf De Klerk. Hassled and Hustled like a true honey badger. Made Youngs look like an amateur.
6. Willie Le Roux. Cool calm and collected, like he was in the best form of his life. Nice time to come to the party Willie.

7. Prince Harry. Him having a beer with the guys after the game in the Boks locker room, even when Faf is just in his undies.

As for my England supproter-friends. I'm sorry that we are your bogey team when it comes to World Cup Finals. I'm sorry that we are the only team that gave Eddie Jones a gold medal. I'm sorry that Whenever the B&I Lions tour to SA happens, we are the World Champs. I'm sorry that you are going to be the punching bags for a while. I'm just so so sorry for you guys.

But hey, you get us back on a daily basis by shipping that sh***y Land Rovers to our shores and make them spill oil on our beutiful dirt roads...

Yesterday was awesome, and to have shared that match with 4 generations of my family at my house was just extra special. My dad even considered calling everyone from work and telling them we have Monday off... But then he hoped our President would call it a public holiday.

Today I had the best hungover ever. couldn't even be mad that I drank that much. But the celebrations was just awesome, people jumping into their swimming pools, dancing in the street, everybody hooting and cheering in their cars. Just Awesome!!

And then to top it all off, we win Team, Coach and Player of the year. And PSDT deserved that. I keep on picturing him as Gandalf saying "You Shall Not Pass"!

It's 22:40 here now, I think I'll watch the game one more time before I go to bed.

 

[Jimbo]

I realise Ford has been excellent for the most part and this is going to come across as controversial but I have been saying for a while or things are not going England way who do we have to 'spice things up' I would have liked to have Cips, I'm not saying he would have won or changed anything but as a wildcard why not would, could have contributed more than an injured Noel or pierce Francis, this has been my opinion from day once, whilst I cannot say it would have made any difference it would have given us more unpredictable options.

 

[donmcdazzle]

I realise Ford has been excellent for the most part and this is going to come across as controversial but I have been saying for a while or things are not going England way who do we have to 'spice things up' I would have liked to have Cips, I'm not saying he would have won or changed anything but as a wildcard why not would, could have contributed more than an injured Noel or pierce Francis, this has been my opinion from day once, whilst I cannot say it would have made any difference it would have given us more unpredictable options.

What would / could he have done with back foot ball in his own half with 3 massive boks bearing down on him? Nothing

 

[ncurd]

I'll be honest I'll be very surprised if we ever see Cips in an English jersey again barring an injury crisis. It's time to move on.