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South Africa vs British and Irish Lions - Test 3

Jakedood

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Maybe but the fact is true. Like a good tease they never fully deliver at end.
If anything this Lions Tour has shown how it i becoming a bit dated
As you said, I think it's on the coaching a little

We want to se the best players playing some sublime rugby against good defences, moments of magic. We had it in 2013 with George North on Folau, in 2017 the attack was fairly dull but at least we had that wonder try of O'Briens to marvel at. We've seen next to no attacking ambition at all, and it irks me a little. Like these guys have the ability to offload, play off the cuff rugby, and see things others can't but they're being constrained to a very rigid system. I had a SA friend of mine over to watch the second test on Saturday (he's a tennis player and only follows rugby a little bit) but he couldnt believe the difference between the game he watched, and the game they showed after from '09 with hard running, brutal tackles, and constantly challenging the game as we know it.
Yes SA have an outstanding defence, but have we even seen a kick return with any intent so far? An actual go forward offload?
Brian O'Driscoll said a year or two ago about the death of the game being players who play to a system or pre planned call, especially scrum halves that wait for people to be in position to do a set routine, when he always advocated if the ball's there, get it out and play. The romanticism of the Lions is dying when we play like this. Even if we take on SA by trying to play through them and lose, we can at least be satisfied that we tried to play. This defense hasnt been remotely tested so far

Edit: I think he also said "if the attack isnt ready you can be damn sure the defense isnt either"
 
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Ragey Erasmus

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As you said, I think it's on the coaching a little

We want to se the best players playing some sublime rugby against good defences, moments of magic. We had it in 2013 with George North on Folau, in 2017 the attack was fairly dull but at least we had that wonder try of O'Briens to marvel at. We've seen next to no attacking ambition at all, and it irks me a little. Like these guys have the ability to offload, play off the cuff rugby, and see things others can't but they're being constrained to a very rigid system. I had a SA friend of mine over to watch the second test on Saturday (he's a tennis player and only follows rugby a little bit) but he couldnt believe the difference between the game he watched, and the game they showed after from '09 with hard running, brutal tackles, and constantly challenging the game as we know it.
Yes SA have an outstanding defence, but have we even seen a kick return with any intent so far? An actual go forward offload?
Brian O'Driscoll said a year or two ago about the death of the game being players who play to a system or pre planned call, especially scrum halves that wait for people to be in position to do a set routine, when he always advocated if the ball's there, get it out and play. The romanticism of the Lions is dying when we play like this. Even if we take on SA by trying to play through them and lose, we can at least be satisfied that we tried to play. This defense hasnt been remotely tested so far

Edit: I think he also said "if the attack isnt ready you can be damn sure the defense isnt either"
I think we've seen plenty of offloads go forward from the Lions...
 

The Oggmonster

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Eddie Jones was the one who suggested having four Lions captains - the captain of each home nation. Most of these four shouldn't be near the test 23. If that's a sign of how EJ would be running the show then it's a big fat no from me.
 

Old Hooker

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Brian O'Driscoll said a year or two ago about the death of the game being players who play to a system or pre planned call, especially scrum halves that wait for people to be in position to do a set routine, when he always advocated if the ball's there, get it out and play.
Well he’s bang on the money there.

Too many coaches with too many laptops and too big egos.

Too many players too used to being told what to do from academy upwards.

I mean you need some structure but there has to be a balance - for effectiveness, not entertainment for its own sake.
 

Which Tyler

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Eddie Jones was the one who suggested having four Lions captains - the captain of each home nation. Most of these four shouldn't be near the test 23. If that's a sign of how EJ would be running the show then it's a big fat no from me.
You should know better by now.
Things Eddie Says =/= Things Eddie Thinks / Does
 

ChicagoKid

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Eddie Jones doesn't appear built for the Lions. He is a tinkerer who likes to experiment and control every aspect of building a team. Gatland, IMO, has been so successful because he has a simple system and knows how to win tight matches.

I'd love to see Andy Farrell as the next Lions coach.
 

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I think he needs to accomplish a bit more as an International HC before he gets anywhere near the Lions. 3rd place in 2 6Ns and the Autumn cup doesn't scream selection to me

Agree on Jones
 

BPM

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Eddie Jones doesn't appear built for the Lions. He is a tinkerer who likes to experiment and control every aspect of building a team. Gatland, IMO, has been so successful because he has a simple system and knows how to win tight matches.

I'd love to see Andy Farrell as the next Lions coach.
Love?

What has Farrell achieved to date to warrant that level of endorsement?

I’m not even sure the majority of Ireland fans rate him that highly.
 

Kripke

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Interesting hearing BOD on off the ball talking about the centre selections. I agree with him that it feels a bit of a travesty in a way that somehow we're at this point where it feels like Gatland doesn't have the centre he needs despite having a number of guys to choose from - where is your Henry Slade who is physical and can defend but also has something extra, great left foot, and can link to the back 3? Or Ringrose if you prefer, but Slade's recent form is better.

I mean there's Daly but he barely ever plays at 13 anymore and compromises a bit of physicality. And yes Henshaw can do a job there - but the point is Henshaw is one of the best 12s in the world, that's where you want him.

I dunno, maybe a bit harsh because hindsight is speaking but some selections which raised eyebrows at the time are now looking pretty dumb
 

Gena_ZA

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Jakedood

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Just seen the squidge analysis, kinda interesting

Murray chasing back got in the way of a fair few efforts under the high ball (9 is usually a primary blocker)
Also commented on the speed of the box kick, so the opposition cant set up their blockers quite so well

That and he noted one scrum where SA were grouped together but didnt bind or set or anything for a minute and a half after the scrum was called. Just standing around chatting, pretty pathetic. Took 4 minutes for the ball to leave the scrum
This on top of the regular "injury breaks", I hope the ref this week doesnt allow quite so much shithousery in this area. Just for the good of the game, we want some tempo, and gaps opening up in final 20

The other thing he noted, which really shocked me, was Lawes in the build up to Mapimpi's try... Dan Biggar was screaming at his to fold round, and Lawes just stood there in LCD's area beside the ruck (so basically useless having 2 defending there), and then Biggar slapped him on the ass trying to alert him to fold, and Lawes still didn't budge. Pretty poor, nearly never seen at this level, and that extra man would have allowed Watson to cover the crossfield kick. Even more surprised with things like that that he's starting again this week
Given the slow pace of the game, fatigue should be no excuse either
 
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Kripke

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Love?

What has Farrell achieved to date to warrant that level of endorsement?

I’m not even sure the majority of Ireland fans rate him that highly.
Yeah..feel like Farrell was one or two results from oblivion at one point not all that long ago - pulled it back somewhat but I feel like he could still fail at Ireland
 

Don't Skip Leg Day

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Just seen the squidge analysis, kinda interesting

Murray chasing back got in the way of a fair few efforts under the high ball (9 is usually a primary blocker)
Also commented on the speed of the box kick, so the opposition cant set up their blockers quite so well

That and he noted one scrum where SA were grouped together but didnt bind or set or anything for a minute and a half after the scrum was called. Just standing around chatting, pretty pathetic. Took 4 minutes for the ball to leave the scrum
This on top of the regular "injury breaks", I hope the ref this week doesnt allow quite so much shithousery in this area. Just for the good of the game, we want some tempo, and gaps opening up in final 20

The other thing he noted, which really shocked me, was Lawes in the build up to Mapimpi's try... Dan Biggar was screaming at his to fold round, and Lawes just stood there in LCD's area beside the ruck (so basically useless having 2 defending there), and then Biggar slapped him on the ass trying to alert him to fold, and Lawes still didn't budge. Pretty poor, nearly never seen at this level, and that extra man would have allowed Watson to cover the crossfield kick. Even more surprised with things like that that he's starting again this week
Given the slow pace of the game, fatigue should be no excuse either
What’s even more bizarre is that Lawes and Biggar play together at the saints so it’s not look it’s a new players coming together thing either.
 

Groundhog

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Another draw would be maximum chaos
 
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