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Steyn, Pienaar and James in Bok 37

TRF_Cymro

Cymro The White
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Ruan-Pienaar-training_2526371.jpg


37 players have been called to a Bok planning camp in Durban on Sunday and Monday, the South African Rugby Union said on Wednesday.

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_6970853,00.html

National Planning Camp Group (Durban, June 12 & 13)

John Smit (captain), Victor Matfield (vice-captain), Willem Alberts, Gio Aplon, Andries Bekker, Bakkies Botha, Heinrich Brüssow, Schalk Burger, Juan de Jongh, Jean de Villiers, Bismarck du Plessis, Jannie du Plessis, Fourie du Preez, Jaque Fourie, Bryan Habana, Francois Hougaard, Butch James, Ashley Johnson, Werner Kruger, Pat Lambie, Tendai Mtawarira, Lwazi Mvovo, Odwa Ndungane, Wynand Olivier, Coenie Oosthuizen, Ruan Pienaar, JP Pietersen, Chiliboy Ralepelle, Danie Rossouw, Juan Smith, Pierre Spies, Gurthrö Steenkamp, Francois Steyn, Morné Steyn, Adriaan Strauss, Flip van der Merwe, Duane Vermeulen.
 
Sad to see guys like Habana, Oosthuizen, Ralepelle, Alberts, Olivier and Ndungane when I would have picked guys like Viljoen, Harris, Basson, Liebenberg/Deon Fourie, Robert Ebersohn and Daniel in stead
 
Ruan-Pienaar-training_2526371.jpg

John Smit (captain), Victor Matfield (vice-captain), Willem Alberts, Gio Aplon, Andries Bekker, Bakkies Botha, Heinrich Brüssow, Schalk Burger, Juan de Jongh, Jean de Villiers, Bismarck du Plessis, Jannie du Plessis, Fourie du Preez, Jaque Fourie, Bryan Habana, Francois Hougaard, Butch James, Ashley Johnson, Werner Kruger, Pat Lambie, Tendai Mtawarira, Lwazi Mvovo, Odwa Ndungane, Wynand Olivier, Coenie Oosthuizen, Ruan Pienaar, JP Pietersen, Chiliboy Ralepelle, Danie Rossouw, Juan Smith, Pierre Spies, Gurthrö Steenkamp, Francois Steyn, Morné Steyn, Adriaan Strauss, Flip van der Merwe, Duane Vermeulen.​


If these guys can do for SA what they do for their clubs then welcome aboard!

Sad to see guys like Habana, Oosthuizen, Ralepelle, Alberts, Olivier and Ndungane when I would have picked guys like Viljoen, Harris, Basson, Liebenberg/Deon Fourie, Robert Ebersohn and Daniel in stead

Agreed for the most part. I'd prefer Dean Greyling at prop though until Oosthuizen can sort out why he gets pinged at the scrum the whole time. No Riaan Viljoen or Bjorn Basson are big misses IMO. The others wouldn't have been near top pick in any case.

The fact that there is no Ricky Januarie or Kirschner makes up to some extent though IMO.

Where is Bjorn Basson?

Good question. If Habana is there on rep I'd have Basson ahead of Mvovo; just as good a finisher and better workrate with bigger range of skills.​
 
I agree pretty much with Stormer2010,

apart from I would of dropped Habana, I would probably put him back for the Tri Nations, but I think perhaps leaving him out of an initial training squad could give him a nudge that his form needs to pick up

how long can his **** form carry on for before he is dropped anyway?

I would have had Basson and Viljoen there, probably for Habana and Mvovo

I don't really like players being selected who are out of favour at their franchise, and this goes for Flip van der Merwe, I think another lock who has played well this season should have been given his spot, I know Muller has done well for Ulster, and I've heard Wilhelm Steenkamp has done well for the Cheetahs and Elstadt for the Stormers

John Smit:wall:
I don't want to re open that debate again though

as far I'm concerned, Pieter de Villiers is nearly there in getting rid of all his rubbish Springboks

:hunt:Januarie
:hunt:Jacobs
:hunt:Kirchner

3 down 1 to go
:rtfm:Smit
 
Habana should stay in the squad, no matter how bad form he is in. He's Bryan Habana. He doesn't have to start, but I want to see him at the RWC in some capacity, even if he is misfiring.
 
Don't bash Jacobs. He might not be good enough to start in the Bok XV, but he is a massive impact player when he comes on as a sub. He and de Jongh are the best centers to have on the bench imo
 
Habana should stay in the squad, no matter how bad form he is in. He's Bryan Habana. He doesn't have to start, but I want to see him at the RWC in some capacity, even if he is misfiring.

Totally agree, at the end of the day Habana is a real impact player and there isn't much of a bigger incentive than the world cup to motivate himself with. He knows how he's playing just now and he knows the level he needs to get to - it's camps like this that are gonna help players like Habana get into the world cup mindset
 
Surprised to not see Mujati in there, he's well deserving of a spot

Could be that PRL aren't releasing them, or that SA aren't trying because they don't want the hassle of working with PRL, or that they just don't want Brits/Mooj in general

Could just be that they'll use them in a later camp though
 
Sarel lacks defensive skills, Mujati and Brits are not better than the other hookers and props besides Ralepelle and Oosthuizen. The first being guaranteed a call up as the illegitimate son of Mr. Pringles
 
I've seen and expected far worse! I'd happily take that team to the RWC.

No January is a huge change of habit for PdV. Well done that regard.

HOWEVER we still got a Tri-Nations coming up so who knows how close this is too the RWC squad. Very strong squad nevertheless. With the exception of John Smit <_<
 
Sarel lacks defensive skills, Mujati and Brits are not better than the other hookers and props besides Ralepelle and Oosthuizen. The first being guaranteed a call up as the illegitimate son of Mr. Pringles

Yeah, Sarel to get a call-up and battle it out with Hougaard and Pienaar post RWC.

I also understand the ommision of Brits and Mujati; we have better anyway and while I would prefer both ahead of Oosthuizen and Smit/Ralepelle as back-up think of the message we are sending (have allready sent actually but it needs some tempering at least); guys, it's okay to go overseas, you're likely to make it anyways and you boys battling it out here, you might as well go as you have nothing to achieve here that you can't do earning more bucks.

I've seen and expected far worse! I'd happily take that team to the RWC.

No January is a huge change of habit for PdV. Well done that regard.

HOWEVER we still got a Tri-Nations coming up so who knows how close this is too the RWC squad. Very strong squad nevertheless. With the exception of John Smit <_<

Exactly. No Januarie or Kirschner is HUGE IMO. And considering this is 37 we might see some more wood being cut although 2 of the big 4 culrpits IMO have been cut allready. I would have been happier with Spies and Smit out but hey, like you said it could have been worse.



Of these 37, who will likely make the fianl 30? Is there someone who is missing?

The forwards:
What stands out for me is that there are too many loosies;
Burger, Brussow, Smith, Spies, Alberts, Vermeulen, Johnson and though utility Rossouw. That makes 8. 6 at the most are needed. Burger, Smith and Rossouw select themselves; Smith the best there is, Rossouw is just such quality back-up and it would be great to have him start though his versatility is a curse and Burger can play 6-8 well and you need his energy. Brussow has had little gametime but he needs to be there if only to see what he's still got in the 3N. That leaves Spies who we all know gets a free pass. Alberts, Johnson and Vermeulen are too similar anyway for it to be worth it taking more than one 'em along. Their roles are similar to Burger and Smith and even Rossouw so I think it might have been a good idea to take another specialist fetcher in FLouw. But anyway, cut 2 loosies out of Johnson, Vermeulen and Alberts. Difficult; Alberts has had the test experience EOYT and passed off of the bench but the other 2 have been in better S15 form...

4 hookers.. eh, it seems like a lot. Chiliboy and Strauss will probably not see play in any case. Smit they won't drop and that I think everyone has accepted. The question is hwat does it do for a team to know your captain deserves to be on the bench (at best). Smit is an able hooker but needs to sharpen up. He should NOT be considered at prop. Cut one. Would it be suicide to cut Smit at this stage? I guess only the players would know.

The locks pecking order has been sorted for a while now and if the old firm in Botha and Matfield can keep up the improvements they have shown towards the latter stages of the S15 then they will be invaluable. 5 for two spots is fine when considering Rossouw cover the backrow as well.

Steenkamp, Jannie and Beast have been the go-to test props for SA and have stood firm, hell, Steenkamp was the best Bok by a mile in 2010. No reason reason why they shouldn't continue to do so. I am very happy with Werner Kruger getting in ahead of CJ and BJ. It shows a good balance in showing faith in the core players but here and there also rewarding form and Kruger has been great this year. Oosthuizen has been the best around the park and I'm happy to see him there but his scrummaging is a worry. I don't know the tech side of it but he gets blown up a lot and that is not a good thing for a RWC fianl.

The backs;
FdP, Pienaar and Hougaard. Morne Steyn, James and Lambie. It seems they see Pienaar at 9 which is good IMO. It is where he has played. 3 for each is more than enough. Pienaar, Hougaard and Lambie bring versatility so I wouldn't say 6 players to cover the halves is too much. The question mark will be what is the pecking order? No Januarie!!! :D I can hardly belief it!

JdV, Fourie, JdJ, Olivier, Jacobs. Nah, drop Olivier; JdJ can play both 12 and 13 and with Steyn and Lambie there we really don't need 5 centers. Oliveir gets the cut IMO because he is a dead end when it comes to moving the ball. Simple as that. He does what he does well but it won't be effective at test level. Jacobs a a far better creative force which is what we need more of in midfield.

Habana, Pietersen, Mvovo, Ndungane, Frans Steyn, Aplon. We only need 4 of these players; we only need 2 specialist wingers and here I'd go with Pietersen and Habana though it would have been nice to have Basson as an option. Steyna and Aplon cover 15 and also center and wing respectively. Hougaard can cover wing and Lambie or Pienaar 15 at a real pinch. Drop Ndungane and Mvovo. Here I am glad we have seen Kirschner dropped! The real miss for me here is Riaan Viljoen. I would have rather dropped Steyn and played Viljoen as first choice 15; The man has what makes Steyn valuable, a freak HUGE boot and accuracy at goalkicking. Viljoen is better at dropped kicks though and is a far more potent attacking force. With Steyn having played at 12 and in France I think picking him is a bit of a gamble. It's not as if he had set the field ablaze the last time he ran... sorry, jogged out in a green jersey.

Hmm, I see I only cut 6. I wouldn't know who else. I might be able to say closer to the time who I would like to see (Spies but I can't see it happen). All in all, I am a happy camper at this stage.
 
What? no Januarie, Kirchner, Maku, McLeod or Stegmann? As an AB's supporter I am throughly disappointed!

To me this actually looks like quite a promising Boks training squad, the only players I think may have been a bit unlucky not to be included are Bjorn Basson, Peter Grant and Sarel Pretorius (though de Villiers has pointed out that exclusion from this squad doesn't mean they are not in the picture for Tri-nations/RWC selection).
 
Whilst I understand why Schalk Brits has not been considered, it's rather sad as I believe he is a much better hooker than most of the men who have been picked for this Bok 37.
he's definitely miles ahead of Chillyboy and Maku, and I'd rate him as an all round better played than Strauss and definitely better than John Smit at the moment. So that's only Bismark that I really would rate as the player he wouldn't be able to replace in that line up.

Still, as awesome a player as he is we always have Deon fourie who has a very similar play style, and Tiaan Liebenberg is another brilliant player who always gets overlooked. So at the end of the day while I don't think PDV has the best 5 hookers in that squad we definitely have the home talent to fill it up with the best 5. (Smit will obviously be going no matter what anyway).

Bjorn really should have been picked, excellent under the high ball and one of the best finishers I think this country is going to see for a long time, the man scored 22 tries in a single currie cup season last year for petes sake !
I would also drop Wynand Olivier, for goodnes sake the man has been pretty average for a while now, and has probably never been in our top echelon of centers anyway.
 
I would have liked to have seen Schalk Brits in the squad as well and Basson's exclusion is also suprising. Good to see Ashley Johnson in there, he's been brilliant for the Cheetahs this season. In fact, a loose trio of Smith, Brussow and Johnson sound pretty decent. This team certainly look dangerous. Wonder who will miss out.
 
Brits in my opinion is one of the best hookers in the world...probably the one I would have in my world XV can't understand why SA sont want a bit of dynamism in the front row as the rest of their pack is completely and utterly hard nosed...a bit of flair in my opinion would not go astray
 

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