The Global Season is it really achievable.

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Their are lots of comments in the press from various people talking about a global season but is it really achievable?

From my understanding the stances are as follows.

SANZAR
- Wants 6N's to be moved to April May
- Wants June Internationals to be moved to July
- Wants NH comp to start in October and run to june.
- They want more of a slice in the autumn tours.
European Nations don't want a July tour.
RFU don't want to move the 6n's
NH clubs all want separation between International and Club fixtures.
European clubs are wanting to look at a world club final.
Players want to make sure they have 12 week break.

Looking at it from a week point of view in a non RWC and Lions year.
Domestic rugby
NH
European rugby takes 9 weeks to complete
AP takes 24 weeks to complete
Pro 12 takes 24 weeks to complete
Top 14 takes 30 weeks to complete
LV cup takes 6 weeks to complete
English clubs needs ATM a maximum of 39 weeks to complete
Welsh clubs need ATM a maximum of 39 weeks to complete
Irish clubs need ATM a maximum of 33 weeks to complete
French clubs need ATM a maximum of 39 weeks to complete

SH
Super rugby takes 20 weeks to complete
Mitre 10 rugby takes 11 weeks to complete
Currie Cup rugby takes 11 weeks to complete
NRC takes 11 weeks to complete
meaning all SH clubs need to have around 31 weeks to Complete ATM

Internationals for Tier 1 nations.
6N's need 5 weeks to complete
4N's need 6 weeks to complete
AI's need 5 weeks to complete + an extra week for Bledisloe Cup game 3
Summer tours 3 weeks to complete.
SO
NH internationals need at most 17 weeks for internationals
SH internationals need at most 18 internationals (Aus and NZ at most 19 weeks)

So lets say we replace the LV cup with a full A league of 20 teams (12 AP + LI and Yorkshire + Welsh A teams) with 2 pools of 10 playing each other once with a semi final and final following along the club season.
All clubs (Other than France) would be playing a maximum of 31 - 33 weeks.

To allow players to have a 12 week break rugby would get 40 weeks play everything in.
Assuming that club rugby will not reduce fixtures that means Internationals would get 7 - 10 weeks to be played in. (And this isn't including 6 weeks preseason)

I just don't see how any of this would work TBH not unless major restructure happened everywhere.
I mean AP and Top 14 will not want to reduce their seasons anymore
Pro 12 and Super have no clue what they want ATM other than the desperate need to expand to make their leagues more lucrative.
SANZAR won't want Summer tours scrapped or Lions due to the earnings potential.
NH unions similar prob wouldn't want AI's scrapped esp the likes of WRU, IRFU, SRU.

For me the
AP is perfect in length and competitiveness the quality is improving as well.
Top 14 is way to long IMO.
Pro 12 isn't making money
Super Rugby is a mess, esp compared to the Super 12 glory days.
How the latter 2 develop i'm not sure but both seem to think USA could be the answer.

International wise I would like to see
6N's become 8N's with 2 pools of 4 playing each other once with the highest 2 in each pool playing a SF and F match. (5 weeks)
and I would like to see
The rugby championship get a second tier of Japan, Fiji, Samoa, Tonga with the winner of that playing a promotion game V the bottom of the 4N's at the 4N's team home ground.

I would like to see AI's scrapped and have the Summer tours done on a rotational home basis with 1 extra games v lower teams of the area.
But can't see this happening.
that would mean around a total of 9 weeks worth of internationals for NH and SH teams.

And there are other stuff i would like to see like a North Island V South Island origin type series in NZ, I would like to see a world club challenge as well but i just don't see how any of it could be fit in with the amount of rugby already on the table.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Just remember that the SH's domestic leagues such as the Currie Cup are running the same time as the Rugby Championship.

It seems like the SH has more time available to get this thing rolling than the NH.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

I do like the 8Ns, 2 pool suggestion as well as adding a second tier to the RC.

 

[Brigantine]

Just remember that the SH's domestic leagues such as the Currie Cup are running the same time as the Rugby Championship.

It seems like the SH has more time available to get this thing rolling than the NH.

This is key. The Mitre10 Cup is also running at the same time as TRC.

If we want the weeks in a year to look like:
- 12 week break
- 13+ weeks of internationals
- 15+ weeks of other cross-border competitions
- Domestic competitions any longer than 12 weeks, let alone pre-seasons...

Then it is simply a mathematical fact that you can't have the same players in all of the above levels in one year. Regardless of the calendar.

South Africa and New Zealand recognize this already, and have domestic competitions based on the expectation that international players will be busy. This is slightly easier because there's more of a clear hierarchy of internationals/Super/domestic, and the domestic and Super teams have some brand separation even if they share a lot of players and often colours and parts of a name.

Ultimately, the questions are in Europe.
1: What is the hierarchy?

2: How important is it that teams in the EPCR and domestic competitions (at least the preliminary phases) have *identical* brands and squads?
(as opposed to Currie Cup/Super type relationship)

3: Alternatively, how important is it that the *pinnacle* phase/division of the domestic competition goes on for 12+ weeks?
(As opposed to Currie Cup type qualifying competition / premier division split, but with all internationals as well as cross-border players available for a pinnacle phase)

Depending on those answers, the options are:

A: [2 and 3 both important, Internationals 1st or 2nd in hierarchy - the stubborn option] - Painfully scale back everything, so all competitions are shorter but all competitions are maximally elite
B: [Internationals last in hierarchy - the french option] - Make space for maximally elite club competitions by turning the international rep side amateur
C: [2 not important, EPCR last in hierarchy - the UK option] - Have EPCR at the same time as 6N/tests/tours, without international players. (A 'talent depth' showdown between the domestic leagues)
D: [2 not important, 3 very important, domestic last in hierarchy - the SH option] - Bite the bullet, have 'premier' domestic competitions at the same time as internationals, using their own players.
Extend EPCR into a maximally elite NH Super league, possibly at the same time as secondary domestic competitions

E: [3 not important - the compromise option] - Divide the domestic competition into an 11+ week preliminary phase (without international players), and a 12 week or less (probably ~7 weeks) maximally elite pinnacle phase (where some preliminary phase squad members get dropped).

 

[Which Tyler]

Brigantine - you may want to look at your very first "if", because the NH answer to that already a clear "no, we don't"

 

[FrenchFan]

The global season is a nice pipe dream. It's not going to happen any time soon.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

The Torygraph's take.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-un...ere-rugby-is-right-to-cold-shoulder-a-summer/

Personally I want to see rugby stick as a true winter game over here. The best team should be the one who can cope with the muddy arm wrestles in December as well as the free flowing stuff in the spring. If your idea of utopia is the ball being flung around all the time, go and watch 7s on artificial pitches.

I like Tigs idea of scrapping the AIs, but they are a cash cow, so it'll never happen. Whichever way you look at it, there's too much rugby, but equally the NH and SH are different beasts and long may those differences remain.

 

[Peat]

My utopia is a game with high quality forward play and the ball being flung around a lot. 7s is just as far from this utopia as muddy arm wrestles in December.

As long as NH rugby sets itself up to play without attacking ambition for 3 months a season, we will remain at a disadvantage in the international arena.

Also, the further the game has got from being 15 men wrestling over a ball in the mud, the more profitable it has become. I am not saying that trend will extend indefinitely, or that it should be the deciding factor, but it wouldn't surprise me if the NH moneymen were to look at continuing the trend and seeking to avoid playing in December/January.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

A super rugby system would never work for England and France we have too big an infrastructure for it.

I do find it interesting that the SH want the most but don't want to change anything of theirs.

My utopia is a game with high quality forward play and the ball being flung around a lot. 7s is just as far from this utopia as muddy arm wrestles in December.

As long as NH rugby sets itself up to play without attacking ambition for 3 months a season, we will remain at a disadvantage in the international arena.

Also, the further the game has got from being 15 men wrestling over a ball in the mud, the more profitable it has become. I am not saying that trend will extend indefinitely, or that it should be the deciding factor, but it wouldn't surprise me if the NH moneymen were to look at continuing the trend and seeking to avoid playing in December/January.

Would like to see the fact for that last statement.

Or are you saying that SH is more valuable than NH rugby money wise?

In the summer you're not going to get the attendances IMO for club games.

 

[ratsapprentice]

My utopia is a game with high quality forward play and the ball being flung around a lot. 7s is just as far from this utopia as muddy arm wrestles in December.

As long as NH rugby sets itself up to play without attacking ambition for 3 months a season, we will remain at a disadvantage in the international arena.

Also, the further the game has got from being 15 men wrestling over a ball in the mud, the more profitable it has become. I am not saying that trend will extend indefinitely, or that it should be the deciding factor, but it wouldn't surprise me if the NH moneymen were to look at continuing the trend and seeking to avoid playing in December/January.

Here, here, Sister.

 

[Peat]

Would like to see the fact for that last statement.

Or are you saying that SH is more valuable than NH rugby money wise?

In the summer you're not going to get the attendances IMO for club games.

The game as described and shown in the 80s and early 90s was a lot more forward-centric, in no small part due to lower skill levels. The idea you'd get the current TV deal for what we had then is laughable. I think we've come a very long way from that.

If SH rugby was played in countries with the same populations as NH rugby, it would be more valuable (at a guess).

 

[ratsapprentice]

If SH rugby was played in countries with the same populations as NH rugby, it would be more valuable (at a guess).

There is no doubt in my mind that is the case.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

The game as described and shown in the 80s and early 90s was a lot more forward-centric, in no small part due to lower skill levels. The idea you'd get the current TV deal for what we had then is laughable. I think we've come a very long way from that.

If SH rugby was played in countries with the same populations as NH rugby, it would be more valuable (at a guess).

You're comparing a time when rugby was amateur to professional of course it would be night and day it's a stupid comparison.

And I'm not so sure about that last part.

Personally I would love summer rugby but to say it would earn more money is total guesswork.

Drier ground isn't the issue with the NH skill set IMO (it would help sure) but IMO the problem lies much deeper ESP at grassroots rugby.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Do attendances for NH club games significantly drop during the coldest / wettest months?

Kind of see the point about more rugby played in dry conditions maybe benefiting us internationally, but i dunno. We already play well into May and start again in August, and it's not like our summers are 6 months of solid sunshine.

To be honest I can't really see why we should give up our winter game to fit in better with the SH which seems mainly to be what's being discussed. I'm not spending December-January with only Football on the telly, hell no.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Drier ground isn't the issue with the NH skill set IMO (it would help sure) but IMO the problem lies much deeper ESP at grassroots rugby.

And grass roots rugby isn't going to follow the global season, school and junior representative rugby etc. is still going to be played through the depths of winter

 

[Peat]

You're comparing a time when rugby was amateur to professional of course it would be night and day it's a stupid comparison.

And I'm not so sure about that last part.

Personally I would love summer rugby but to say it would earn more money is total guesswork.

Drier ground isn't the issue with the NH skill set IMO (it would help sure) but IMO the problem lies much deeper ESP at grassroots rugby.

The change from amateur to professional rugby has brought a change in mindset. The change has continued to develop. Would teams be laying down artificial pitches if they thought 30 guys wrestling in the mud was what the game should be and what customers want to see?

And 2-3 months of bad weather isn't the direct reason for our weak skillsets, no. People obsessed with the 2-3 months of bad weather and/or 30 men wrestling for the ball in the mud is the reason for our weak skillsets. Remove the bad weather and the dinosaurs will die out quicker.

And I'm not *certain* that SH rugby would be worth more if the population numbers matched, but I'm pretty close. Its simply a better product for entertainment. I know plenty of NH people who watch SH rugby just for the hell of it. Hell, I know some who only watch SH rugby. I know next to nobody from the SH who'll tune in to NH club rugby for entertainment.

 

[FrenchFan]

Seriously, why do we need a global season?

 

[Which Tyler]

Seriously, why do we need a global season?

We don't; but the Aussies and Kiwis think it'd be more convenient for them for some reason.

 

[TheOvalBall]

Seriously, why do we need a global season?

Player welfare has been a big talking point for years now, and a global season with streamlined competitions could be the solution. The amount of rugby being played needs a serious investigation.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I want to see arm wrestles all the time as much as I want to see basketball rugby all the time i.e I don't. What I do want to see is rugby played in different ways in different conditions asking different questions of the players and it remaining a game for all shapes and sizes.

As for the conditions determining playing style, that's largely a red herring and far more to do with mindset in the era of pro players, better surfaces and grippier balls. Apparently it rains in NZ and the sun comes out in RSA....