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nam97
Guest
True that. I like to think about some of it such as big bang theories and such, but when it comes to stuff like "how did it get there in the first place", and "what is outside the universe" my brain gets fried.
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True that. I like to think about some of it such as big bang theories and such, but when it comes to stuff like "how did it get there in the first place", and "what is outside the universe" my brain gets fried.
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BLR
Guest
The point where the big bang occured matter was extremely small and extremely dense....not really bigand unstable.
I think the only real explanation is that it has always been there.....it's one of the reasons that confused me about creation, to create something you must have matter already existing to create it from....but then how is it possible to create the dense matter in the first place without somethign that goes against the basic laws of science? Or perhaps a creator? Stephen Hawking says before the big bang as matter and all the dimensions etc. were condenced in this hugely dense point time and space did not exist so everything before that point does not exist as the universe is nothingness in every way at that point of time....a diversion but still doesn't answer the origin...
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Sir Speedy
Guest
True that. I like to think about some of it such as big bang theories and such, but when it comes to stuff like "how did it get there in the first place", and "what is outside the universe" my brain gets fried.
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Well, consider that our universe is just an atom in what would be the real and much larger universe, imagine the scale of that universe to us! A grain of sand could be a trillion miles in diameter!!!
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BLR
Guest
The thing is though the universe is everything though, you can't have multiple 'everythings' unless it is in a different dimension, which would mean that two versions of the universe could not exist in the same plain of existence...
I feel dirty doing this but a quote from Wikipedia 'The Universe is most commonly defined as everything that physically exists: the entirety of space and time, all forms of matter, energy and momentum, and the physical laws and constants that govern them.' It doesn't mention differing dimensions so either its a oversight of the particular dimension or the other universes can only possibly be in a differing dimension....
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nam97
Guest
True that. I like to think about some of it such as big bang theories and such, but when it comes to stuff like "how did it get there in the first place", and "what is outside the universe" my brain gets fried.
[/b][/quote]
Well, consider that our universe is just an atom in what would be the real and much larger universe, imagine the scale of that universe to us! A grain of sand could be a trillion miles in diameter!!!
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[/b][/quote]
Yeah lol. Our universe could be just one tiny atom out of trillions and trillions that make up a tiny grain of sand in another dimension. I love thinking about stuff like that.
The thing is though the universe is everything though, you can't have multiple 'everythings' unless it is in a different dimension, which would mean that two versions of the universe could not exist in the same plain of existence...
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Exactly, there must be infinity number of dimensions outside ours. Makes perfect sense. It's just a bit of basic quantum mechanics....
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BLR
Guest
I think the number of dimensions is limited, I saw some video thing on it a while ago but I forget the number that they said....
Dimensions aren't the same as having universe outside ours on the same plain of existence though....does anyone remember that Transformers cartoon episode where they go into another dimension and the only thing that changes is the colour of thier armour type things.
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Steve-o
Guest
The point where the big bang occured matter was extremely small and extremely dense....not really bigand unstable.
I think the only real explanation is that it has always been there.....it's one of the reasons that confused me about creation, to create something you must have matter already existing to create it from....but then how is it possible to create the dense matter in the first place without somethign that goes against the basic laws of science? Or perhaps a creator? Stephen Hawking says before the big bang as matter and all the dimensions etc. were condenced in this hugely dense point time and space did not exist so everything before that point does not exist as the universe is nothingness in every way at that point of time....a diversion but still doesn't answer the origin... [/b][/quote]
It's all relative on what your definition of 'big' is really.
Also I can't take a humans explanation too likely as we only understand what's in our realm, since we've only experienced our realm. And if there is a creator then screw him/her/it, why did he/she/it leave all this uncertainty? He/she/it could of cleared up a whole lot if we just knew what's going on. Then we wouldn't have to spend our precious little time wondering about this stuff we'll never understand.
True that. I like to think about some of it such as big bang theories and such, but when it comes to stuff like "how did it get there in the first place", and "what is outside the universe" my brain gets fried.
[/b][/quote]
Well, consider that our universe is just an atom in what would be the real and much larger universe, imagine the scale of that universe to us! A grain of sand could be a trillion miles in diameter!!!
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I get where you coming but, I thought about that often a few years ago, but that still doesn't explain where anything that exists was first "created". The sad thing about this topic/subject is that there is no right and wrong answer, which really just makes me frustrated and sometimes angry. I used to think about this stuff all the time, ALOT. But nowdays I'm at peace with just 'being'. I'm not discouraging anybody in any way from sharing their ideas as I think it's something we all have to discuss and think about sometime in life. It's a beautiful twisted tragedy that we'll never find the answer/meaning to something that defies us. Unfortunately religion doesn't cut it for me, in some ways I wish it did, but I'm too wrapped up in this reality/realm and in this reality/realm a 'creator' isn't plausible. The whole 'creator' concept was thought up to put our ever thinking minds at rest imo. Sort of a voluntary ignorance to ease our answer seeking mind. Like I said, that concept doesn't work for me, so people should respect that as I respect peoples decision who believe in it (not say anybody did, just sharing my view). As long as whatever you believe doesn't negatively impact the part that's really important, the 'here and now' and the very real people that exist in it, then I say it's all good.
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BLR
Guest
The thing that the creation itself shows a huge loop hole in science, for me at least throws the inplausibility argument of a creator out of the window, if we can't figure out how it started scientifically who is to say that a power we cannot comprehend had a hand in it, and who is to say that they even still exist? Whatever created the mass and the laws which govern the universe etc. is the biggest question in science and I think it is wrong to discount a creator as any other options try to brush over the issue without adequately explaining it. I'm not saying there is a christian god, I'm not saying there was a concious entity at all. Just something that triggered the creation of the building blocks of the universe....and according to a few of my readings the fact that this would of occured before the big bang means there was no space and time therefore is outside of the realms of our universe and we cannot possibly know what it is...no matter how much mathematic equations the smart blokes do....and that is freaking depressing if you ask me....
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dullonien
Guest
I think that sums everything up perfectly. No matter how long you spend thinking about or researching, we just don't have the equipment, understanding not ability to comprehend something on such a huge scale. No-one 'knows' what happened or what will. It's all guess work, so as you said, everyone should respect other peoples opinions. If that's religion, that's fine, if it isn't then fine also. This is how things should be. Pitty it isn't.
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nam97
Guest
I think that sums everything up perfectly. No matter how long you spend thinking about or researching, we just don't have the equipment, understanding not ability to comprehend something on such a huge scale. No-one 'knows' what happened or what will. It's all guess work, so as you said, everyone should respect other peoples opinions. If that's religion, that's fine, if it isn't then fine also. This is how things should be. Pitty it isn't.
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Exactly. Still, for the sake of amusing myself I like to think about it. I don't get angry because there are no answers, I just like to formulate bullshit ideas and theories in my head for fun.
We don't even know all the secrets of our own solar system. Take that into account and the fact there are billions of other galaxies in the universe, you'd have to think it would take millions of years to even remotely explore the boundaries in the deepest of space. And even then, how insignificant will that be on an even larger scale?
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Steve-o
Guest
I think that sums everything up perfectly. No matter how long you spend thinking about or researching, we just don't have the equipment, understanding not ability to comprehend something on such a huge scale. No-one 'knows' what happened or what will. It's all guess work, so as you said, everyone should respect other peoples opinions. If that's religion, that's fine, if it isn't then fine also. This is how things should be. Pitty it isn't.
[/b][/quote]
Exactly. Still, for the sake of amusing myself I like to think about it. I don't get angry because there are no answers, I just like to formulate bullshit ideas and theories in my head for fun.
We don't even know all the secrets of our own solar system. Take that into account and the fact there are billions of other galaxies in the universe, you'd have to think it would take millions of years to even remotely explore the boundaries in the deepest of space. And even then, how insignificant will that be on an even larger scale? [/b][/quote]
And that's what's so cool about non-religious theories, they're not pushing an agenda.
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Sir Speedy
Guest
It all depends whether scientists can find a convenient method of space travel. The furthest we've explored is the moon, merely a light-second away, whereas the edge of our solar system (near Pluto) is over 4 light-hours away! Unless we develop a way of travelling at the speed of light, then we most likely will not leave our galaxy. I've heard of a theory that some sort of bubbles travel through space, and they travel much faster than the speed of light. I mean, it would take an extreme amount of luck for one to head near the Earth and it would require perfect calculating for us to put a space ship in the right place as the bubble passes by (that's granted that the bubble isn't travelling directly towards the Earth or that when the bubble hits the ship, it carries it inside instead of destroying it due to the impact).
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nam97
Guest
It all depends whether scientists can find a convenient method of space travel. The furthest we've explored is the moon, merely a light-second away, whereas the edge of our solar system (near Pluto) is over 4 light-hours away! Unless we develop a way of travelling at the speed of light, then we most likely will not leave our galaxy. I've heard of a theory that some sort of bubbles travel through space, and they travel much faster than the speed of light. I mean, it would take an extreme amount of luck for one to head near the Earth and it would require perfect calculating for us to put a space ship in the right place as the bubble passes by (that's granted that the bubble isn't travelling directly towards the Earth or that when the bubble hits the ship, it carries it inside instead of destroying it due to the impact).
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Yeah that's the thing. But as we know it, the speed of light is the fastest speed known to man, that still is farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr to slow to travel really deep into space in ones lifetime.
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Sir Speedy
Guest
It all depends whether scientists can find a convenient method of space travel. The furthest we've explored is the moon, merely a light-second away, whereas the edge of our solar system (near Pluto) is over 4 light-hours away! Unless we develop a way of travelling at the speed of light, then we most likely will not leave our galaxy. I've heard of a theory that some sort of bubbles travel through space, and they travel much faster than the speed of light. I mean, it would take an extreme amount of luck for one to head near the Earth and it would require perfect calculating for us to put a space ship in the right place as the bubble passes by (that's granted that the bubble isn't travelling directly towards the Earth or that when the bubble hits the ship, it carries it inside instead of destroying it due to the impact).
[/b][/quote]
Yeah that's the thing. But as we know it, the speed of light is the fastest speed known to man, that still is farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr to slow to travel really deep into space in ones lifetime.
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When you think about it, inside the bubble, you aren't travelling faster than the speed of light, because the light in that bubble is still moving faster than you. It's just outside that the bubble is moving faster, or so I've read (not sure where though).
There's also the theory of bending spacetime to get to two different points without having moved (I don't need to explain this do I? I bet some of you know more of it than me), however, it's just a question of whether it's possible or not.
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BLR
Guest
What's this bubble thing you speak about?
Wormholes are the only viable way of travelling large distances in a short amount of time, but messing with the fabric of time and space to artificially create such things isn't exactly something I would reccomend...we don't really want to mess up and cause a rip or whatever it is called where we destroy all of existence....
Steve-O, I look at religion like many judges look at the law, they put aside all thier prejudices and put aside the political aspects and apply the reason the laws were put in place. Religion was a way to try to explain the universe and to put a moral code into place. It tries to explain many things which has since been proven by science to be far more complicated yet the original idea of a creator in all religions is still a viable option, science has not disproven it and the simple fact is that it never can....because of the nature of the creation of the universe that has been theorised and moddeled through the big bang. Keep in mind many of the greatest minds in science were at the same time deeply religious, hell, the written word in Western Europe and research during the dark ages were almost exclusively conducted by religious men, just because a few yankee A-Holes decide to go overboard doesn't mean it has no place in society and science....
Wormholes are the only viable way of travelling large distances in a short amount of time, but messing with the fabric of time and space to artificially create such things isn't exactly something I would reccomend...we don't really want to mess up and cause a rip or whatever it is called where we destroy all of existence....
Steve-O, I look at religion like many judges look at the law, they put aside all thier prejudices and put aside the political aspects and apply the reason the laws were put in place. Religion was a way to try to explain the universe and to put a moral code into place. It tries to explain many things which has since been proven by science to be far more complicated yet the original idea of a creator in all religions is still a viable option, science has not disproven it and the simple fact is that it never can....because of the nature of the creation of the universe that has been theorised and moddeled through the big bang. Keep in mind many of the greatest minds in science were at the same time deeply religious, hell, the written word in Western Europe and research during the dark ages were almost exclusively conducted by religious men, just because a few yankee A-Holes decide to go overboard doesn't mean it has no place in society and science....
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Steve-o
Guest
Ok, I'm not gonna get into religion because people are gonna take it personally. I never mentioned any specific religion for a reason.
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BLR
Guest
Well religion has a specific place that you cannot take away from the stupid of the beginning, it is IMPOSSIBLE to decide what created everything unless just to take the easy route and say all mass has always been in existence, which itself goes against what much of science is about. And that is where religion comes in, even if it isn't an established religion down the track it will be the ONLY way to attempt to guess what created the universe, because religion is about belief, and so is theories about what occured before the existence of space and time eg. before the big bang.
We're all in this together my dear Steve-o.
