Vito called into All Blacks group

Discussion in 'Tri Nations 2009-2011' started by Larksea, Aug 10, 2011.

  1. Larksea

    Larksea First XV

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    interesting move, kinda says to me that at least two maybe even three of the current loosies wont travel to south africa. Which will mean a reat for Read, Kanio and maybe even McCaw.

    I think the Coaches were keen on giving McCaw as much gametime as they could after he looked rusty in the super finals and against Fiji. But he's looked much better in the last two tests which may prompt the coaches to save him a trip to the republic.

    Messam Hasn't been used much yet, maybe because he is one player whio played every minute of every super game this season. Expect him to get a lot mor time over the last two games.
     
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  3. Darwin

    Darwin AKA Dingo_Darwin

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    It has been rumoured for a while now that Read and McCaw wont be going to South Africa - the inclusion of Vito more of less confirms this for me. I think it is a good idea to give the Crusaders players a bit more rest - as you say McCaw has been more impressive in recent weeks. I'm expecting Kaino, Thomson, and Messem will be the starting trio, with Vito getting a chance off the bench late in the game.

    By the sounds of it Carter won't be going over either, with Weepu backing up 10 from the bench. It will certainly be a big test for the AB's taking on South Africa without McCaw and Carter....
     
  4. Sam Owen

    Sam Owen BANNED!!!

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    Vitos been playing very good for the Lions and he deserves his shot at the All Blacks.
     
  5. dan the man

    dan the man Bench Player

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    Personally i really rate Vito, his physicality and workrate are very good and he's also quick enough to be dangerous out wide.

    Vito's definitely the next best option, glad to see that he could get a run :)
     
  6. ZeFrenchy

    ZeFrenchy First XV

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    What do you think this means for WC selection? I think Vito had a better Super Rugby season then Messam and Kaino, and is having a good ITM cup too. Do you guys think he could earn his spot?
     
  7. Darwin

    Darwin AKA Dingo_Darwin

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    I personally don't think it means too much in terms of RWC selection; I believe it is simply a case of the AB's wanting to rest McCaw and Read, and since they only have 3 loose forwards left in the squad needing to add another player. Vito had a good Super Rugby season, but I think Messem (who he is probably competing for the last AB's loose-forward spot) actually had a better season. Unless Messem has a poor game against South Africa, and Vito has a huge match (presumably from the bench), I think the AB's selectors will stick with Messem in the RWC squad.
     
  8. Larksea

    Larksea First XV

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    I dont think Vito had a better season than Messam who as far as overall stats goes shadowed almost everyone though the last couple of games were quiet for messam - as stated he did play every minute of every game for the chiefs and none of the others did that for their sides. Kaino's Season was a bit up and down. Importantly Kaino had a couple of big games near the end to make sure of his selection.

    Vito is a very good player and this is a real chance for him. If he can outplay Messam or Thompson there is no reason why he can't pip one of them for the WC squad. I do have my doubts with him, he's pretty fast for a big guy but not very agile so for me he's more of an all out 8 rather than a 6 who can play 8. Though I know others disagree I think he goes quiet when his team is under pressure, stark contrast to when his team has fast easy ball and he becomes a massive ball runner.

    Messam, Vito & Thompson is a very exciting combination. They have strengths that can complement each others game and their aren't many loosies around with the speed these three have.

    Without McCaw it's up to Messam and Vito in particular to show a lot of leadership and talk. Messam has been brilliant as fill in captian for the chiefs - I think he's been a better captian than Mills. It would be great to see him get serious for the AB's and provide that same leadership & inspiration if McCaw's off the field.

    The great thing about this move is it promotes even more competition in the squad.
     
  9. Siva Tau

    Siva Tau Academy Player

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    I think Messam has been ok at test level without being outstanding. I think he and Vito are neck and neck. These last two tests could decide there fate.
     
  10. dan the man

    dan the man Bench Player

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    I can't see the minds of the selectors being changed too much here... I think that Kiano, Read, McCaw and Thomson are sure things barring injury. But Messam hasn't impressed at in a test match yet and if Vito has a blinder and Messam underperforms in South Africa the two could be switched... I wonder if they'll chuck Cruden on the plane to back up Slade ???
     
  11. Larksea

    Larksea First XV

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    I wondered if they would call Cruden as well but if they were going to I would have expected the call to have come already as the squad has gatherd.
     
  12. donmcdazzle

    donmcdazzle First XV

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    Vito I don't really rate, but as others have said Messam hasn't stood out for the AB's yet, hopefully this will give him a boot up the backside as I much prefer him to Vito who is good going forward, not good going backwards.
     
  13. TRF_nickdnz

    TRF_nickdnz Super Moderator

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    I think Vito is one of the most skillful backrowers in the world. He's very quick and in my opinion, very agile. He takes the ball in one massive hand and can do amazing passes off of that. He's playing much like he used to in 2009, but he's also brought in a physical part of his game. I'm a huge fan, but I still can't see him making the RWC. I think he has been brought in as cover for trainings. I still think one of his only problems is that he can freeze up in some of the bigger games. He was a workhorse for the Canes (in my opinion by far their best player in a poor forward pack), but has looked quiet for the All Blacks. I think if he managed a couple of big games for the All Blacks he'd gain confidence and become world class, but untill then I don't think he'll make the WC.
     
  14. Larksea

    Larksea First XV

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    The reality is that if they do rest the top three then they had to bring someone in and vito was the natural choice. It may also mean that Hoeata has to cover the loose forward spot on the bench.
     
  15. Larksea

    Larksea First XV

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    Tom Donnelly has now been called up to cover Hoeata who's injured a sholder while playing for Naki

    Good to see Tom back, havn't been that impressd with Hoeata. Think he may just be a tad too small to be a test lock, maybe more potential as a 6
     
  16. Shaggy

    Shaggy First XV

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    According to NZ's radio sport website, Vito will travel, and Mealamu has been named as captain for the South African leg of the tri nations

     
  17. Darwin

    Darwin AKA Dingo_Darwin

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    No surprise to see the key players rested. It will be interesting to see how the returning players like Woodcock, Dagg, Kahui, and Toeava go.

    The full squad
    :
    Forwards: John Afoa, Wyatt Crockett, Ben Franks, Jarrad Hoeata, Andrew Hore, Jerome Kaino, Keven Mealamu, Liam Messam, Adam Thomson, Samuel Whitelock, Ali Williams, Tony Woodcock and Victor Vito.
    Backs: Jimmy Cowan, Israel Dagg, Andy Ellis, Hosea Gear, Zac Guildford, Richard Kahui, Cory Jane, Ma'a Nonu, Colin Slade, Isaia Toeava, Piri Weepu and Sonny Bill Williams.

    Based on that squad I'd pick the starting lineup vs South Africa to look something along the lines of:
    Woodcock, Mealamu, B Franks, Williams, Whitelock, Kaino, Thomson, Messem, Cowan, Slade, Gear/Guildford, Bill-Williams, Kahui, Jane/Guildford, Dagg/Toeava. Bench: Hore, Afoa, Hoeata, Vito, Weepu, Nonu, Gear/Guildford/Jane/Dagg/Toeava.

    The exact make-up of the back three will be the main question - I'd love to see Toeava get a start at fullback.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2011
  18. Shaggy

    Shaggy First XV

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    Yes, i'm not sure that it's good to make so many changes, it will be interesting to see how the new loose forward trio, and the new centre pairing will go
     
  19. TRF Mr Fish

    TRF Mr Fish Your Piscine Overlord

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    Williams and Kahui - what an awesome combination!
     
  20. Larksea

    Larksea First XV

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    yeah that combo is pretty exciting, both can pull off big hits and Kahui is the kind of player that could really punish teams if he gets hold of some BW offloads. He looked good for waikato - not the first time this year he's totally shut down Fruen and there are not many players around that have been able to do that.

    no Mills is interesting, with no Ben smith that will mean Toeava will likely mean Toeava will start at fullback as Dagg hasn't had much rugby. Though I've heard reports that have said Dagg's in good shape, havn't seen him though.

    I think it's a good call to keep key players at home, McCaw and Carter in particular. McCaw in particular and some talk that Aussie were targeting his knee last game. He was obviously targeted for some extra attention as was obvious from the treatment he got from Cooper and Pocock.

    I didn't pick Gear to be rested though, maybe there is more to that....

    Other point is obviously Weepu is going to be covering 10.
     
  21. TRF Mr Fish

    TRF Mr Fish Your Piscine Overlord

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    Gear's not being rested?

    And Zac Guildford's mum said Dagg played really well in his last club outing :p
     
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