Why isn't Rugby league much bigger in Ireland? (or Wales and Scotland)

[SimonG]

I say Ireland as that's where I'm from (Co-Tyrone to be precise). I could ask the same for Wales and Scotland also. Is it just that Union took hold and is now established (traditional) in these countries? When I think of both codes in England, I think; working class (play and watch league), middle/upper class (play and watch union), but there isn't that class differential in Ireland, Wales and Scotland. So what is the reason League has never taken hold in these countries? Poor promotion of the sport? Not enough youth programmes?

I am far more of a Union man but that's only because we play it. If league was played in Ireland I more than likely would choose it instead. It's relentless, constant attacking, greater skill set, and everyone has to be a proper athlete. I still recall watching the GB team with Brian Carney that took on the Aussies (think it was about 10 yrs ago) and I probably got as much excitement out of that as watching O'Driscoll waltz through Union defences for nearly a decade. Burgess at the RLWC was the first time I got excited in a long time watching either code. My favourite all time team is the Wales team of the 70s (JPR, Edwards, Barry John etc) for the free flowing Rugby...something that we don't see in Union nowadays. I can see why League folk switch off when Union is on tv. Have never really properly followed League (again as its not established here) but I remember footage on Grandstand of Martin Offiah for Wigan at Wembley...and the likes of Jason Robinson too. Fabulous attacking play.

Is anything being done to promote League?...or is there a lack of cash that is holding the sport back?

 

[William18]

But league isn't really played amongst the lower class. It is popular amongst the lower class in one region of the country. There are plenty of poor people in London yet the league team there can only get crowds of a couple of thousand. A lot is being done to promote league but it is difficult to promote a sport which gets so little coverage. There has been growth in people playing the game but that hasn't turned into many extra bums on seats. League's big problem has always been penetrating new markets. It seems that in the UK people are quite tribal with their sport. In NZ I think you have a better chance of preferring rugby league even if your whole family prefer rugby union.

 

[lynam1104]

I think part of it with Ireland is just Union got there first and the market is already saturated with GAA, Hurling and Soccer +rugby it makes it hard for league to get a foothold. However I think its growing down south.

 

[RoosTah]

From what I have read Rugby League is a little like Cricket in Ireland; both sports were never really grown in the country for the majority of the 20th century, but recently have experienced quite a bit of growth. Ireland now play internationals in League and have a fledgling comp, but with the Super League so close it will inevitably be little more than a feeder comp for some time.

If League continues to grow in Ireland though, you could envisage them getting a Super League team, but not for some time.

Personally, as Ireland are my favourite of the home nations (with a surname like O'Toole that was always a given) I'd love to see them get good at League - I reckon they'd be great at it if they really got into it and given how badly organised and weak Rugby League is in England compared to Australia (where the TV deal is worth over $1 billion and its pushing expansion plans) I reckon that the North needs to focus it's development of the game outside of England now. England have had 100 years to build the game, but it's a basket case and so it's time to put their resources somewhere else.

 

[William18]

Why should the RFL fund rugby league in Ireland. I don't think the RFL should be doing anything but investing their own resources back into the English game. I'm not really sure what you mean by your last sentence. England would get hardly any funding from the RLIF.

 

[RoosTah]

Why should the RFL fund rugby league in Ireland. I don't think the RFL should be doing anything but investing their own resources back into the English game. I'm not really sure what you mean by your last sentence. England would get hardly any funding from the RLIF.

Well maybe... it depends on how you look at it. The NRL puts quite a bit of funding into developing the game outside of its heartland in places like Victoria and even NZ. So with the growth of League in England quite clearly having reached its potential, they RFL maybe should consider looking to develop the game in places like Ireland. After all, their end game is ultimately a strong Super League; it's not just about England - where it's fair to say they have failed to develop the game beyond their narrow norther corridor. They've building interest in the South of England, but the place is just too soccer mad and then rugby owns the rest, so maybe they ought to start thinking a little outside the box.

 

[Saints1]

The RFL funded the domestic leagues in both Ireland and Scotland in 2013 and well previous to that. Both leagues were cut adrift over the winter. The Irish league was getting matches called off regularly because teams couldn't fulfil fixtures.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Ireland is a nation of event junkies. Rugby League has never given us a big event like the 6 Nations, Heineken Cup, soccer World Cup and European Championships, All Ireland Championships, Cheltenham, cricket World Cups (latterly) or Formula One (Jordan Racing era) to get behind. The recent Rugby League World Cup got no media coverage over here with an Irish team made up of heritage players and little local representation.

In some ways RLI are unfortunate that Brian Carney was a big name in the sport when Ireland were experiencing an upturn in it's Union fortunes. If Carney was a superstar in the 13 man game a decade earlier when Ireland couldn't buy a win in Union, perhaps we'd have seen more people take up League and it'd be in a far better state than it is at present.

 

[munstermuffin]

In fairness though Rugby League has grown here over last few years. Limerick has seen 6 previous AIL guys go over and secure deals in recent seasons with clubs. It's not massive and as Snoop says that's partly because there's no event to excite us but it is growing

 

[Saints1]

It is a shame the Irish haven't taken to it. The World Cup tried taking the Kangaroos to Limerick for one of the games. The crowd was decent, nothing more.

 

[McTallshort]

Troll must troll harder

 

[munstermuffin]

It is a shame the Irish haven't taken to it. The World Cup tried taking the Kangaroos to Limerick for one of the games. The crowd was decent, nothing more.

Agreed but that game was marketed poorly and well was a very 1 sided game

 

[Saints1]

Neither of which helps. Especially the marketing. Unless you make them play with one arm tied behind their back the Aussies were always winning that game to 0...

 

[munstermuffin]

Neither of which helps. Especially the marketing. Unless you make them play with one arm tied behind their back the Aussies were always winning that game to 0...

Agreed but as I say it is growing here slowly. I know a lot who before never watched rugby league but now prioritise around catching super league on a Friday night

 

[Saints1]

And those are the people to which we will market. The best idea about Irish rugby league entrapment I ever heard was having the "Magic" Weekend (which I hate) in Dublin. Sure, it would price most of us out but plenty of people from Ireland would go to that if it was properly marketed I reckon.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

It'd be a good way of testing the market in Dublin anyway.

I really think the only way we'll back Rugby League over here is if there was a Super League franchise and it was linked to a province. Flights from Manchester, Liverpool and Leeds/Bradford to Dublin are only about 30 minutes so it's closer than Perpignan. Such a move would be fraught with danger as seen by the Harlequins debacle and what happened with Crusaders. League in England doesn't have a lot of cash to throw on a gamble.

 

[munstermuffin]

I think another factor is how fast season goes here. I don't play league but have seen it here in Munster and format is poor. There are 4 teams who play each other home and away (6 games). But out of 6 you can guarantee 2 walk overs. Anyways after this the team plays in an All Ireland Semi-Final and Final but basically it ran off fast and I know Limerick team use a local AIL teams pitch but some pitches are horrific. The team in Clare actually play on a farmers field and you have to side step cow crap while also being careful of not breaking an ankle the ground is that uneven

 

[Saints1]

It'd be a good way of testing the market in Dublin anyway.

I really think the only way we'll back Rugby League over here is if there was a Super League franchise and it was linked to a province. Flights from Manchester, Liverpool and Leeds/Bradford to Dublin are only about 30 minutes so it's closer than Perpignan. Such a move would be fraught with danger as seen by the Harlequins debacle and what happened with Crusaders. League in England doesn't have a lot of cash to throw on a gamble.

Exactly - the game needs to concentrate on getting it right where we're strong, let alone where we want to go.

 

[SimonG]

Heard Brian Noble on five live radio, and he was talking about the world club challenge game (the one taking place in Sydney) and that it would help develop the sport. Really? Isn't that game just catering to its own market?

He made a really interesting comment about London being an important market, and that the London Broncos should be given more leeway (less restrictions than the teams along the M62 corridor) as regards salary caps, home grown player quota, in order to have a more successful team and as a result have a greater following. I do agree with him on that one.

I get the feeling (and it's just a personal observation) that those who run RL are not as business savvy as the Union folk. To not even have an international calendar planned is inept in my opinion. Brian Barwick (is he still in charge?) was excellent at the FA and with football on ITV in particular, so it puzzles me as to why more isn't being done. Another ridiculous move was discarding the GB team.

Union thrives because of the international game...tbh 95% of Union games I watch are internationals, barely (if ever) watch an English Premiership/Pro 12 match...just the odd Heineken Cup game. I'd love to know the comparative viewing figures for an English Premiership match and a Super League game. Wouldn't expect there to be much in it. The big difference is internationals...Union has its house in order on that one. Rugby league needs to learn from Union on that score. The RLWC...apparently we had a team in it...the wolfhounds...full of Aussies and Yorkshire folk. This ain't gonna get people here interested. It's not the way to grow the sport. It has to be done at grass roots.

 

[Saints1]

People who run rugby league are clueless.

The problem with an international calendar is that simply put there aren't enough teams of the requisite quality. There are always end of season internationals but unless the number of games is cut (which I am all for) there can't be an international programme mid-season. There isn't the talent pool for players to disappear for weeks at a time on international duty.

Meanwhile, the London debate again... nrgh. They've been hopeless for 10 years and longer. They've been afforded so many chances and opportunities to get it right and still get crowds of 2000. They need to be cut adrift - it is as simple as this: London doesn't care about Super League. We need to grow the game in the areas of strength and forget wanton expansionism for the foreseeable future.