Your 31 man Squad and Starting 15 for Your country in the Rugby World Cup 2019 guys part 2 :)

[George Ford]

Teams usually have an extended training squad of around 50 guys prior to the World Cup. But then only 31 can go to the World Cup. This is due to regulations, and also due to limited accomodation at some venues.

But there's always a group of about 10-15 guys on standby who may be called up in case a player is so severely injured that he won't participate in the World Cup at all.

Anyway here's my Springbok squad as it stands now:

1. Stephen Kitshoff
2. Malcolm Marx
3. Coenie Oosthuizen
4. Eben Etzebeth
5. RG Snyman
6. Siya Kolisi
7. Pieter-Steph Du Toit
8. Duane Vermeulen

9. Faf De Klerk
10. Handre Pollard
11. Aphiwe Dyanthi
12. Andre Esterhuizen
13. Jesse Kriel
14. Cheslin Kolbe
15. Willie Le Roux

16. Schalk Brits
17. Thomas Du Toit
18. Wilco Louw
19. Lood De Jager
20. Jean-Luc Du Preez
21. Embrose Papier
22. Elton Jantjies
23. Damian Willemse

24. Trevor Nyakane
25. Beast Mtawarira
26. Akker van der Merwe
27. Marco van Staden
28. Ivan van Zyl
29. Damian De Allende
30. Roscoe Specman
31. Warrick Gelant

Read as:

FORWARDS (17)
Props: (LHs) Kitshoff, Mtawarira, (THs) Oosthuizen, Louw, Nyakane, (Utility) Du Toit (6) - Malherbe?
Hookers: Marx, Brits, Van der Merwe (3) - Mbonambi?
Locks: (4s) Etzebeth, (5s) Snyman, De Jager (3) - Mostert?
Flanks: (6s) Kolisi, Van Staden, (7s) Du Toit, Du Preez, (4) - Coetzee?
Eighthmen: Vermeulen (1) - Whiteley?

BACKS (14)
Scrumhalves: De Klerk, Papier, Van Zyl (3) - Jantjies
Flyhalves: Pollard, Jantjies (2) - Bosch?
Centres: (12s) Esterhuizen, De Allende, (13s) Kriel (3) - Serfontein?
Wings: (11s) Dyanthi, Specman, (14s) Kolbe (3) - Nkosi?
Fullbacks: Le Roux, Willemse, Gelant (3) - Lleyds?

 

[mdaclarke]

Read as:

FORWARDS (17)
Props: (LHs) Kitshoff, Mtawarira, (THs) Oosthuizen, Louw, Nyakane, (Utility) Du Toit (6) - Malherbe?
Hookers: Marx, Brits, Van der Merwe (3) - Mbonambi?
Locks: (4s) Etzebeth, (5s) Snyman, De Jager (3) - Mostert?
Flanks: (6s) Kolisi, Van Staden, (7s) Du Toit, Du Preez, (4) - Coetzee?
Eighthmen: Vermeulen (1) - Whiteley?

BACKS (14)
Scrumhalves: De Klerk, Papier, Van Zyl (3) - Jantjies
Flyhalves: Pollard, Jantjies (2) - Bosch?
Centres: (12s) Esterhuizen, De Allende, (13s) Kriel (3) - Serfontein?
Wings: (11s) Dyanthi, Specman, (14s) Kolbe (3) - Nkosi?
Fullbacks: Le Roux, Willemse, Gelant (3) - Lleyds?

How badly injured is Pollard?

 

[sCriv]

My England training squad:


Forwards (17)

M.V (even if still injured bring him), George, Sinckler, Hartley (Just come back from injury but I'd still have him despite not playing for a long time. Need these sort of leaders in a dressing room at a WC imo, At least should be in the training squad and make an assessment on his fitness during that period. Even if he goes to Japan and doesn't play hes still a huge dressing room preesence)
Cowan-Dickie, Genge, Williams, Moon, Itoje, Kruis, Lawes, Launchbury, Mercer, Curry, Shields, B.V, Kvesic,.

Backs (14)

Goode, Brown, Daly, Tuilagi (if fit), Slade, Thorley, Atkinson, Spencer, Wigglesworth, Cipriani, Farrell, May, Nowell, Cokanasiga.


Starting XV:

Assuming everybody's fit

15. Goode
14. May
13. Slade
12. Farrell (c)
11. Daly
10. Cipriani
9. Spencer
8. B.V
7. Curry
6. Mercer
5. Kruis
4. Itoje
3. Sinckler
2. George
1. M.V

If Cipriani fails to make an impact, can easily move Farrell to 10 and take your pick of Tuilagi/Thorley/Atkinson to slot in at IC.
Daly can even play centre if need be as he's very versatile, and bring on Big Joe or Nowell late on at 11/14 as super subs.
Goode can even play at 10 if not, and bring on Mike Brown or switch Daly to full back.

Point is there's a lot of options there.

Players I'd personally have nowhere near the squad, but that EJ will likely call up anyway:

Ford, Youngs, Hughes, Cole, Teo.

 

[Scotty]

My England training squad:


Forwards (17)

M.V (even if still injured bring him), George, Sinckler, Hartley (Just come back from injury but I'd still have him despite not playing for a long time. Need these sort of leaders in a dressing room at a WC imo, At least should be in the training squad and make an assessment on his fitness during that period. Even if he goes to Japan and doesn't play hes still a huge dressing room preesence)
Cowan-Dickie, Genge, Williams, Moon, Itoje, Kruis, Lawes, Launchbury, Mercer, Curry, Shields, B.V, Kvesic,.

Backs (14)

Goode, Brown, Daly, Tuilagi (if fit), Slade, Thorley, Atkinson, Spencer, Wigglesworth, Cipriani, Farrell, May, Nowell, Cokanasiga.


Starting XV:

Assuming everybody's fit

15. Goode
14. May
13. Slade
12. Farrell (c)
11. Daly
10. Cipriani
9. Spencer
8. B.V
7. Curry
6. Mercer
5. Kruis
4. Itoje
3. Sinckler
2. George
1. M.V

If Cipriani fails to make an impact, can easily move Farrell to 10 and take your pick of Tuilagi/Thorley/Atkinson to slot in at IC.
Daly can even play centre if need be as he's very versatile, and bring on Big Joe or Nowell late on at 11/14 as super subs.
Goode can even play at 10 if not, and bring on Mike Brown or switch Daly to full back.

Point is there's a lot of options there.

Players I'd personally have nowhere near the squad, but that EJ will likely call up anyway:

Ford, Youngs, Hughes, Cole, Teo.

Alot of changes, thorley is a winger right? Atkinson is uncapped, Cips there is a real case for but he does have defensive issues and without faz issues from the boot and ford is on grest form for tigers in an underperforming team. Goode a squad player if in there.

I really rate mercer but i think its harsh on wilson. Who has been grest for us.

Your squad has too many players who are playing well but arnt within the setup and making that many changes would weaken our side that is going well

Post world cup, thorley, mercer, Atkinson and a few other young talants need to be looked at but its too soon, mercer is the only one who might get the call through injury or injury cover.

 

[sCriv]

Alot of changes, thorley is a winger right? Atkinson is uncapped, Cips there is a real case for but he does have defensive issues and without faz issues from the boot and ford is on grest form for tigers in an underperforming team. Goode a squad player if in there.

I really rate mercer but i think its harsh on wilson. Who has been grest for us.

Your squad has too many players who are playing well but arnt within the setup and making that many changes would weaken our side that is going well

Post world cup, thorley, mercer, Atkinson and a few other young talants need to be looked at but its too soon, mercer is the only one who might get the call through injury or injury cover.

Fair comments all round, and I can see the case you're making.
However, I'd make the following points:

1.) Thorley is a centre
2.) Atkinson may be uncapped, but both him and Thorley have had exceptional seasons for Gloucester; both made the prem team of the year and offer something different.
3.) Cips has been the outstanding player of the season and is the current best fly half in England by a million miles.
4.) My squad is picked from in form players that have been consistent all season. I made this many changes because I don'#t agree that our side is going well and we need to try something different.
5.) Mercer is awesome, and although it may be harsh on Wilson after playing well at the 6N, imo he's not been consistent enough at Falcons.

 

[Scotty]

Fair comments all round, and I can see the case you're making.
However, I'd make the following points:

1.) Thorley is a centre
2.) Atkinson may be uncapped, but both him and Thorley have had exceptional seasons for Gloucester; both made the prem team of the year and offer something different.
3.) Cips has been the outstanding player of the season and is the current best fly half in England by a million miles.
4.) My squad is picked from in form players that have been consistent all season. I made this many changes because I don'#t agree that our side is going well and we need to try something different.
5.) Mercer is awesome, and although it may be harsh on Wilson after playing well at the 6N, imo he's not been consistent enough at Falcons.

I have only seen him play wing and he has played well there,

This is the world cup, they have no where near been tested at this level. We have issues but not massive ones enough to throw 2 uncapped players in the deep end and hope.

Cips is a tough one because attack hasnt been our weak point. And thoughing a better attacking player who has known defencive issues in would not fix the problems

I think we agree on the class of mercer and is not a bad bench option but i believe wilson is an experienced head we need in the team. Has done alot in the 6N and has been part of a failing falcons team.

 

[sCriv]

I have only seen him play wing and he has played well there,

This is the world cup, they have no where near been tested at this level. We have issues but not massive ones enough to throw 2 uncapped players in the deep end and hope.

Cips is a tough one because attack hasnt been our weak point. And thoughing a better attacking player who has known defencive issues in would not fix the problems

I think we agree on the class of mercer and is not a bad bench option but i believe wilson is an experienced head we need in the team. Has done alot in the 6N and has been part of a failing falcons team.

Hmmmm. I'm not so sure. I think we had clear issues at the 6N, and I think we need to do something different at the WC rather than the same old, same old. This is why I think Cips/Goode/Thorley/Atkinson etc should all be there as they are all bang in form, had consistently brilliant seasons and all offer something different.
Imo they can all perform at international level. Mercer certainly has the ability as well.

Would hardly call Wilson an experienced head with only 13 caps to his name either, and the fact he's been in a failing Newcastle side is why I'd leave him out, even it is harsh based off of his 6N performances.

 

[BPM]

Fair comments all round, and I can see the case you're making.
However, I'd make the following points:

1.) Thorley is a centre
2.) Atkinson may be uncapped, but both him and Thorley have had exceptional seasons for Gloucester; both made the prem team of the year and offer something different.
3.) Cips has been the outstanding player of the season and is the current best fly half in England by a million miles.
4.) My squad is picked from in form players that have been consistent all season. I made this many changes because I don'#t agree that our side is going well and we need to try something different.
5.) Mercer is awesome, and although it may be harsh on Wilson after playing well at the 6N, imo he's not been consistent enough at Falcons.

I quite like your squad, but I don't understand some of this.

Thorley is not a centre. He's a winger and while he may be able to cover centre, I don't believe he has ever played there at senior level. I only ever saw him play on the wing at age grade level too, so I'm not sure why you are so adamant he is a centre?

I think he is a fantastic player, but without a single cap to his name, it would be an extremely bold call to pick him.

Mercer is very good at club level, but unproven at test level. Wilson may well have struggled to single-handedly win games for a very poor Falcons team, but he hasn't been inconsistent. I'm not sure what you're basing that on? Not to mention that he has been England's player of the year. George Ford pretty much kept Tigers up on his own yet you'd have him nowhere near the squad?

I think I said earlier this thread that I really like Atkinson and would love to see him get a shot ahead of Te'o, but I also think it's unlikely we're going to parachute an uncapped bolter in at this late stage.

Harsh to leave out Underhill too.

When you say the uncapped players can all perform at test level, how can you back that up?

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

When has Thorley ever played centre? He's the most erratic winger in the Prem, playing him in the centres would be an absolute sh*t show.

 

[argie]

Argentina's extended roster named by Mario Ledesma.

1 TETAZ CHAPARRO, NAHUEL – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
2 VIVAS, MAYCO – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
3 ZEISS, JUAN PABLO – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
4 DÍAZ, JAVIER – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
5 GARCÍA BOTTA, SANTIAGO – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
6 CREEVY, AGUSTÍN – JAGUARES – UAR – HOOKER
7 MONTOYA , JULIÁN – JAGUARES – UAR – HOOKER
8 SOCINO, SANTIAGO – JAGUARES – UAR – HOOKER
9 FIGALLO, JUAN – SARACENS – RFU – LOOSEHEAD PROP
10 HERRERA, RAMIRO – STADE FRANCAIS – FFR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
11 MEDRANO, SANTIAGO – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
12 PIERETTO, ENRIQUE – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
13 SORDONI, LUCIO – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
14 PETTI, GUIDO – JAGUARES – UAR – LOCK
15 LAVANINI, TOMÁS – JAGUARES – UAR – LOCK
16 ALEMANNO, MATÍAS – JAGUARES UAR – LOCK
17 PAULOS, LUCAS – JAGUARES – UAR – LOCK
18 MATERA, PABLO – JAGUARES – UAR – BACK ROW
19 LEZANA, TOMÁS – JAGUARES – UAR – BACK ROW
20 ISA, FACUNDO – TOULON – FFR – BACK ROW
21 ORTEGA DESIO, JAVIER – JAGUARES – UAR – BACK ROW
22 KREMER, MARCOS – JAGUARES – UAR – BACK ROW
23 BRUNI, RODRIGO – JAGUARES – UAR – BACK ROW
24 LEGUIZAMÓN, JUAN MANUEL – JAGUARES – UAR – BACK ROW
25 CUBELLI, TOMÁS – JAGUARES – UAR – SCRUM-HALF
26 BERTRANOU, GONZALO – JAGUARES – UAR – SCRUM-HALF
27 LANDAJO, MARTÍN – JAGUARES – UAR – SCRUM-HALF
28 EZCURRA, FELIPE – HINDÚ – URBA – SCRUM-HALF
29 SÁNCHEZ, NICOLÁS – STADE FRANCAIS – FFR – FLY-HALF
30 URDAPILLETA, BENJAMÍN – CASTRES – FFR – FLY-HALF
31 DÍAZ BONILLA, JOAQUÍN – JAGUARES – UAR – FLY-HALF
32 MIOTTI, DOMINGO – TUCUMÁN L.T. – URT – FLY-HALF
33 GONZÁLEZ IGLESIAS, SANTIAGO – JAGUARES – UAR - FLY-HALF/CENTRE
34 DE LA FUENTE, JERÓNIMO – JAGUARES – UAR – CENTRE
35 ORLANDO, MATÍAS – JAGUARES – UAR – CENTRE
36 MORONI, MATÍAS – JAGUARES – UAR – CENTRE
37 MENSA, LUCAS – PUCARÁ – URBA – CENTRE
38 MALLÍA, JUAN CRUZ – JAGUARES – UAR – CENTRE
39 EZCURRA, BAUTISTA – JAGUARES – UAR – CENTRE/WING
40 MOYANO, RAMIRO – JAGUARES – UAR – WING/FULLBACK
41 DELGUY, BAUTISTA – JAGUARES – UAR – WING/FULLBACK
42 CANCELLIERE, SEBASTIÁN – JAGUARES – UAR – WING
43 BOFFELLI, EMILIANO – JAGUARES – UAR – WING/FULLBACK
44 TUCULET, JOAQUÍN – JAGUARES – UAR – WING/FULLBACK
45 MONTERO, MANUEL – PUCARÁ – URBA – WING
46 CARRERAS, SANTIAGO – JAGUARES – UAR – WING/FULLBACK

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Disappointed not to see Cordero in there.

 

[Scotty]

Disappointed not to see Cordero in there.

Was just thinking this, im still disappointed hes not staying at chiefs tbh.

 

[Leinster Fan]

Now that the season is over, I'm going to do this again (this is the last one I swear).

Strictly my team, don't think Joe will pick it

1. Healy
2. Cronin
3. Furlong
4. Henderson
5. Ryan (C)
6. O'Mahony
7. Van Der Flier
8. Conan

9. Murray (provided we find* the actual version and get rid of the imposter that's pretending to be him currently)
10. Sexton
11. Stockdale
12. Henshaw
13. Ringrose
14. Earls
15. Kearney

16. Scannell
17. Kilcoyne
18. Porter
19. Toner
20. Stander
21. Cooney
22. Byrne
23. Larmour

John Ryan, Rory Best (as squad captain), Tadhg Beirne, Jordi Murphy/SOB (see above with Murray), Keiran Marmion, Joey Carbery, Bundee Aki and Will Addison (or Baloucoune/Byrne if Addison isn't).

Sticking with the exact same starting team isn't going to work, something needs to change to freshen things up. The most obvious way to go about this is to drop Best, a legend of Irish rugby, but one whose ability to influence a rugby game has been nonexistent for years. We have two obviously superior hookers in Cronin and Scannell, I don't see how we can justify leaving one of them out of the 23 in favour of a player who brings significantly less than them. I'd be perfectly happy with Scannell as a starter too, the main reason I've got him on the bench is because a replacement front row of Kilcoyne, Cronin and Porter is going to have me far too stressed for every scrum after the 60 minute mark. The other obvious swap is to bring in Jack Conan who is just straight up better in every area than Stander off the evidence of this season.

Henshaw and Ringrose showed again today that they're the easily the best centre pairing Ireland have had since D'Arcy and BOD, their ability to stay fit is going to be a deciding factor, as is the nation and the coaches moving on from the idea that Henshaw is a fullback and realising that playing one of the best 12s in the world at 12 instead of a position he's played twice in five years might actually be a good idea. Other than that, we just need to hope that Murray can refind himself over the summer, despite some wishful thinking in some quarters that his form has been better since the Six Nations he's still by and large been utter s****, flashes of his old self overshadowed by woeful service. We beat the All Blacks without him which shows he isn't integral to our game, if he isn't doing it come September we need to back the other options. I'd say the same about Sexton but he's actually been good in his occasional appearances for Leinster, one of the best players on the pitch against Toulouse, a non-factor in a game decided upfront against Saracens (he wasn't poor, just uninvolved, not really his fault), excellent off the bench against Munster and then overall good today despite a poor start.


*I wouldn't surprised if Warren Gatland has kidnapped them and they're trapped in his basement, especially O'Brien.

 

[argie]

9 FIGALLO, JUAN – SARACENS – RFU – LOOSEHEAD PROP
10 HERRERA, RAMIRO – STADE FRANCAIS – FFR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
11 MEDRANO, SANTIAGO – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
12 PIERETTO, ENRIQUE – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP
13 SORDONI, LUCIO – JAGUARES – UAR – LOOSEHEAD PROP

My bad. All of them are Tighthead Prop.

 

[BPM]

Was just thinking this, im still disappointed hes not staying at chiefs tbh.

Yeah me too. I have always enjoyed watching him.

As an England fan, I'd rather not play against him though!

 

[Umaga's Witness]

What I think they'll pick but not what Iwant

1. Moody
2. Coles
3. Franks
4. Retallick
5. Whitelock
6. Squire
7. Cane
8. Read
9. Smith
10. Barrett
11. Ione
12. Crotty
13. Goodhue
14. Smith
15. Barret
16. Karl
17. Taylor
18. Lomax
19. Barrett
20. Savea
21. Perenara
22. Mo'unga
23. Sbw

Tuungafasi
Harris
Tuipolotu
Frizell
todd
Ttt
Alb
naholo

What I'm most unsure of is Todd and frizell. They could go with papalii and another back, eg josh Ione or Sevu Reece.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

1. Karl
2. Coles
3. Lomax
4. Retallick
5. Whitelock
6. Barrett
7. Savea
8. Read
9. Smith
10. Barrett
11. Ione
12. Alb
13. Goodhue
14. Naholo
15. Smith
16. Moody
17. Taylor
18. Franks
19. Hemopo
20. Cane
21. Perenara
22. Mo'unga
23. Crotty

Tuungafasi
Harris
Todd
Squire
Ttt
Ione
Laumape
havili

Adjusted my team above based on form. Note that my philosophy in World Cup games is that you finish with your most experienced and or reliable players, which means typical 'impact' players might be in my starting team.

 

[Jack Reacher]

What I think they'll pick but not what Iwant

1. Moody
2. Coles
3. Franks
4. Retallick
5. Whitelock
6. Squire
7. Cane
8. Read
9. Smith
10. Barrett
11. Ione
12. Crotty
13. Goodhue
14. Smith
15. Barret
16. Karl
17. Taylor
18. Lomax
19. Barrett
20. Savea
21. Perenara
22. Mo'unga
23. Sbw

Tuungafasi
Harris
Tuipolotu
Frizell
todd
Ttt
Alb
naholo

What I'm most unsure of is Todd and frizell. They could go with papalii and another back, eg josh Ione or Sevu Reece.

Like this team - I have been personally watching all the right wing options this season as I really don't like Jordie playing fullback when Ben is available. Right now I would go for Braydon Ennor on the wing but a few weeks ago I wanted Reece. Unproven players in superb form is a b***h for selectors!

I think 3rd halfback is up in the air but realistically nothing to worry about - not really a high attrition position.

they will go with squire I think but this position has been Hansen's black mark over the last 2/3 years.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Like this team - I have been personally watching all the right wing options this season as I really don't like Jordie playing fullback when Ben is available. Right now I would go for Braydon Ennor on the wing but a few weeks ago I wanted Reece. Unproven players in superb form is a b***h for selectors!

I think 3rd halfback is up in the air but realistically nothing to worry about - not really a high attrition position.

they will go with squire I think but this position has been Hansen's black mark over the last 2/3 years.

Really good points here. Note the team you quoted was what I think they will pick, not what I'd pick. I was struggling with my last outside back option for the squad too and also dont like the idea of Jordie at 15. I would pick naholo to start but I am thinking of changing my mind for the backup, as I currently have havili but potentially a wing backup rather than fullback would fit better. I think George bridge is still a possibility in the selectors minds. I haven't really noticed how ennor and Reece fare under the high ball. Have you? Alaimalo would be another option

 

[Roady]

Mako
George
Sinckler
Itoje
Kruis
Wilson
Curry
Billy

Youngs
Faz
May
Tuilagi
Slade
Nowell
Daly

Hartley
Genge
Cole
Lawes
Underhill
Care
Cipriani
Big Joe

Moon
LCD
Williams
Launch
Robshaw
Spencer
Ford
T'eo