Super Rugby 2018 Calendar

TRF_heineken · Sep 21, 2017

TRF Mr Fish · Sep 21, 2017

But how will teams be ranked??? Will the top team from each conference be guaranteed a home qualifier?

Also why do the South Africans have what is effectively an extra bye week? I assumed it would be to counter travel but given the timing of it that probably isn't the case. Do they have early test matches next year or something?

Interestingly, this will be the fourth time in a row a Stormers v Chiefs match will be held in Cape Town.

TRF_heineken · Sep 21, 2017

TRF Mr Fish said:
But how will teams be ranked??? Will the top team from each conference be guaranteed a home qualifier?

Also why do the South Africans have what is effectively an extra bye week? I assumed it would be to counter travel but given the timing of it that probably isn't the case. Do they have early test matches next year or something?

Interestingly, this will be the fourth time in a row a Stormers v Chiefs match will be held in Cape Town.

Perhaps this explanation might assist:

Each team will play 16 conference matches that include eight matches within their own conference (home and away) and four matches against teams from each of the other conferences (home or away).

The finals series will comprise an eight team, seven match series.

The 2018 tournament starts on Saturday, February 17 when the South African Conference kicks-off with the Stormers hosting the Jaguares in Cape Town. The Lions, runners-up the last two years, host the Sharks in Johannesburg, while Bulls have a bye.

The Australian and New Zealand Conferences will kick-off a week later when defending champions the Crusaders open the defence of their title at home against the Chiefs. The Brumbies, last year’s Australian Conference winners, open the season against the Sunwolves in Tokyo who are now positioned in the Australian Conference.

Essentially, the Australian and New Zealand conferences all have a bye week, the first week....

FNS · Sep 21, 2017

Dreadful calendar for jags. Luckily we can win 2/3 matches.

Cruz_del_Sur · Sep 22, 2017

Thanks for the thread and apologies for me opening a new one, missed this one.

About Jaguares, my first thought after seeing our first three games (Stormers, Lions, Canes) was we got unlucky, but then i thought for a second and realized that given the teams in the competition, we are underdogs against everyone (even at home) bar Sunwolves, Bulls, Reds, Tahs and Rebels, and 2 of those will be 50/50.

The thing is that we are a very temperamental team. I am very interested to see how the team will cope with a (potential) 3 lose streak.

My expectations for the first two seasons was to qualify to the play offs, but i guess that was and still is unrealistic.

unrated · Sep 22, 2017

Cruz_del_Sur said:
Thanks for the thread and apologies for me opening a new one, missed this one.

About Jaguares, my first thought after seeing our first three games (Stormers, Lions, Canes) was we got unlucky, but then i thought for a second and realized that given the teams in the competition, we are underdogs against everyone (even at home) bar Sunwolves, Bulls, Reds, Tahs and Rebels, and 2 of those will be 50/50.

The thing is that we are a very temperamental team. I am very interested to see how the team will cope with a (potential) 3 lose streak.

My expectations for the first two seasons was to qualify to the play offs, but i guess that was and still is unrealistic.

I think for the Jaguars it's going to be more difficult this year (next year) to reach the play offs.
In previous years they just had to fight with either the Sharks or Lions for a wildcard spot. Now that the conferences are combined they need to do better than two of either the Sharks,Stormers or Lions in the final standings.
What the Jaguars do have going for them is it is their Third year in the comp. most of the players now has two years experience in Super rugby. The combined tally of caps in the Jaguars team should be much much larger than it was. In addition because they are basically the national team they have had more continuity and time to play together than any other team in the comp.
many experienced coaches speak of the importance in keeping a squad together for a few years to eventually compete once they have gelled.
Mitchell is starting the project from the beginning at the Bulls now and you can bet he will play down expectations nearer to Super rugby and say they are building for the Future.

So the Jags can now start to reap the benefits of their continued togetherness as a team and hopefully they will be much stronger this year.
It's not only the players but also the coaching staff who will be getting their third crack at it. Surely it can only go up?

Cruz_del_Sur · Sep 22, 2017

I agree, and mentioned it during the regular season. The only reason we appear to have improved (2017 vs 2016) is because we played against NZ teams in the first one and Aus teams in the second one.
Having the "worst" teams removed and including NZ opposition will make it harder for us, no doubt.

Regarding the "togetherness", i wish it were true, but i don't see any tangible evidence to support that. You can't compare the stats (say tries or points scored/against) because the opposition was different, but i'd rate our offense in 2016 as WAY better than in 2017.
I have (some) pretty good memories of 2016 (we gave the chiefs and the stormers a fair run for their money). For the lack of a better word, in 2017 we choked in every important game we had. Our game against the Sharks at home was embarrassing to watch. I was expecting jags to throw everything but the sink at them, and ended up watching a team that clearly didn't rise to the occasion. I think we had/have the ingredients to win that game, but we just did not. We knew how important that game was, and we under-delivered.

Brigantine · Sep 25, 2017

We still have to have 2 or 3 games in Singapore...

Hosting the Rebels in Singapore I won't complain about too much, we should be good enough to beat them regardless, even if it seems unnecessary.
The Bulls & (maybe) Stormers games... that's a bit more frustrating, but I can understand it as part of a compromise for SA losing 2 teams.

Having only 5 true home games all season I guess is the main drawback. Here's hoping we can smash the Aussies and get a home QF to compensate.

All eyes on the true home games:
20% 2016: 1/0/4 - beat: Jaguares; lost to: Lions, Waratahs, Force, Rebels
50% 2017: 2/0/2 - beat: Blues, Bulls; lost to: Hurricanes, Cheetahs
??? 2018: 5 games - Chiefs, Blues, Brumbies, Waratahs, Reds (and maybe Stormers)
The Wolves should be competitive for all of those except the Chiefs straight after a 3-week tour to the Sharks & Lions.

Kiwiwomble · Sep 26, 2017

i was hanging out for the highlanders v rebels game to be in Melbourne......

The Jones Boy · Jan 23, 2018

The Blues have a bye in their first week, not a great situation. I have a bad feeling about this year...

Brigantine · Jan 25, 2018

The Jones Boy said:
The Blues have a bye in their first week

So do every team except Lions/Stormers/Sharks/Jaguares...

Technically for teams in the NZ and Australian conferences, it's not even their first week.

Brigantine said:
We still have to have 2 or 3 games in Singapore...

Apparently the Rebels game has been moved to Tokyo. It also appears the Stormers game (which was venue TBD) and Bulls game (originally scheduled in Singapore) are also now going to be in Tokyo. So they quietly pulled the pin on the whole Singapore thing, and the Sunwolves get a full 8 home games this year!

They've signed some top players, the Top League finished early to allow proper preparation, and now they've got a fair draw. No excuses for the Sunwolves any more, it's time for them to get results.

It looks like the only game hosted in a 3rd country is Highlanders vs Chiefs in Fiji.

The Jones Boy · Jan 26, 2018

So they get another bye later?

Brigantine · Jan 26, 2018

The Jones Boy said:
So they get another bye later?

The Blues? Byes in round 6 and round 16. [source: wiki]

The Jones Boy · Jan 27, 2018

Oh thank you, that's lifted my spirits.
The Blues are fragile and they need time (during the tournament) to recoup the young players and reset the focus if they're ever going to make the play off, it's been that long in the wilderness.

TRF_stormer2010 · Feb 5, 2018

I'm very happy with the Stormers' fixtures;

we have a tough trip in facing the Waratahs, Crusaders and Highanders away from home but TBH we are usually at our best weeks 1 to 5. I am thinking a single win is good, 2 is over-achieving. We really do need to take at least 1 game though IMO. I expect the Waratahs will be Aussie's top side and in the finals simply because of that. Crusaders will be a top 3 side for sure. Highlanders are a direct opponent for the 5th through to 8th place spots though. A win there would be HUGE. We do have a higher win ratio against NZ opponents than one would think given our lamentable history in the play-offs. Actually, if you take knock out matches at the end of the season out of the equation we have a positive win %. That tells me there are issues with some combination of factors at the ends of seasons; lack of BMT? / poor focus / poor management of squad / poor fitness IE too many injuries / lack of depth in squad.

Crusaders, Lions, Hurricanes, (top Aus team) are in for a dead certainty.

You could probably put down the Highlanders, Chiefs and Sharks down as 5, 6 and 7. Really our direct opponents are the Blues and next best Aus team (Brumbies?- who knows?) but you never know. Beyond that tour though I think we should be looking to do well. Lions and Sharks away are probably our toughest matches. Think we ought to be favorites against teams traveling here (Rebels, Reds, Blues and Chiefs). Bulls and Sunwolves we should beat on the road I'd hope. All considered I have us down as 7th/8th. Pity we won't be facing the Brumbies as I see them as our biggest rival for the play-offs.

Brigantine · Feb 5, 2018

The loss of the Cheetahs/Kings/Sunwolves from the South African conference will make it harder for the Sharks and Stormers to pile up points on the table.

The move from 6 to 8 conference games also gives the Blues and Highlanders a more tortuous fixture list.

And then for Australia, they lost their 2nd ranked team and gained the Sunwolves. Those 8 conference games will suit them just fine thanks.

I think the 5th NZ team can be written off, (not necessarily the Blues), but watch out for that 2nd team in the Aus conf - Probably the Sunwolves

That 8th play-off spot is the exact middle of the table, so the target is roughly 8/16 wins to get there. So in the Australian conference that's more like 6/8 conf wins and 2/8 cross-conf wins, while in the NZ conference it's more like 2/8 conf wins and 6/8 cross-conf wins.

The Jones Boy · Feb 10, 2018

Judging from the pre-season it looks like Tana has raised the fitness level of the Blues.
That's a promising sign.
Here's hoping he has raised the hunger level as well.

Brigantine · Feb 11, 2018

The Jones Boy said:
Judging from the pre-season it looks like Tana has raised the fitness level of the Blues.
That's a promising sign.
Here's hoping he has raised the hunger level as well.

I hadn't been following it, but I see they beat the Chiefs and won the 10s. Def not what I expected.

I had the Blues game down as a potential Sunwolves victory again... Maybe I have to reconsider that.

Panasonic came last in their pool behind the Reds and Rebels... (1 win each but the PD wasn't close) but all their Sunwolves were in Kitakyushu (except Asaeli Ai VALU, Keisuke UCHIDA, Akihito YAMADA) so can't read too much into that result.

Zanella · Feb 13, 2018

Tough calendar for Jaguares, I believe they won´t be able to win more than 3 or 4 games. Even though last game was a friendly one I was expecting them to do better than how they actually did

smartcooky · Feb 13, 2018

New table is up folks

The "S" column is same as last year, for seeding so that you can see where your team is sitting in the quarter finals stakes. the number in here will be 1 to 8, with 1,2 and 3 always being the top team in each conference.

No guarantee this year for any country, except the conference winners. It will be possible for all the teams in one conference to make the quarter finals.

Cruz_del_Sur · Feb 13, 2018

Not sure it's a tough calendar or maybe not the right competition for us. I don't know. Small part of me watches cheetah's games these days and thinks "maybe that should be us". Not sure.

Zanella · Feb 13, 2018

Cruz_del_Sur said:
Not sure it's a tough calendar or maybe not the right competition for us. I don't know. Small part of me watches cheetah's games these days and thinks "maybe that should be us". Not sure.

That´s probably easier to tell after the performances jaguares had the previous years, but i think everyone agreed they should be in the SR after the 2015 rwc. I honestly thought they were going to find it easier as most of their players were part of that wc team. Anyway I agree that there are not many teams in this competition that jaguares could beat, maybe that should be us but it is always nice to see an argentinian team competing with the best teams.

The Jones Boy · Feb 14, 2018

Brigantine said:
I hadn't been following it, but I see they beat the Chiefs and won the 10s. Def not what I expected.

I had the Blues game down as a potential Sunwolves victory again... Maybe I have to reconsider that.

They performed above expectation but it's all pre-season mumbo jumbo until they produce in the contest for real.
The Sunwolves result really hurt Tana...
The Highlanders away is the first task and that's a major opportunity too put a marker down but much easier said than done.
The Blues have to actually beat another Kiwi franchise and climb off the bottom of the Kiwi conference by the end of the competition to show genuine improvement.
The Auckland Blues catchment area is stellar.
It needs to start producing the fruit of the junior coaches labours and not let much of that talent slip away to other franchises or overseas.
Results are the key to changing that problem.
I feel that Tana is the first real chance we have of turning that corner since as far back as Nucifora.
Only results will tell us how that development is progressing into the players.

Cruz_del_Sur · Feb 14, 2018

Bienvenido

Zanella said:
That´s probably easier to tell after the performances jaguares had the previous years, but i think everyone agreed they should be in the SR after the 2015 rwc.

I agree with this, but here, precisely, is where the problem lies. Couple of points so i'll try to structure the answer the best i can.

First, and most importantly, 2015 was an outlier in terms of performance for the pumas. We had our best TRC (if i recall correctly, it was the only time we didn't finish last) and we punched above our weight in the world cup: we gave the All Blacks a decent run for their money and, partly due to 5 key injuries (gotta mention it) we tore Ireland a new one. We all bought into the hype after that.

Second, media and fans, home and abroad. Instead of acknowledging it was, precisely an outlier, we believed we had the tools not only to compete against the best, but to beat them. That prooved to be dead wrong. Again, this wasn't just Argentine media/fans, i recall international media saying things of the like "we might have created a monster" when discussing jaguares pre season in 2016.

Third, we seem to have a lot of trouble learning from our mistakes. You can claim "i was surprised"/ "we are not familiar with competition/opponents" only once, and Jaguares management did so in 2016. Ironically, i wholeheartedly believe we played better in 2016 than in 2017. I recall Jaguares throwing everything but the sink at the Chiefs in 2016 and losing by an inch, even unfairly.
The untrained eye will tell you: "wait a min, look at the stats, we did better in 2017." ********! The only reason we appear to have done better is because we faced weaker opposition (NZ teams in 2016, Aus conference in 2017).

In 2016, at least i knew what the team was trying to do: open, offensive and borderline suicidal rugby. I thought it was the wrong decision given our skill set, but at least i understood the rationale behind it: this is the rugby we want to play, it takes time to develop it, we will make mistakes, lose games. I understand, and again, even thou i disagreed with it, i even found it entertaining to watch.
Then 2017 came along and, to be completely fair, i have no idea, whatsoever, what they are trying to do. I don't think we can blame players for this. I see no evidence for that. The change in style was evident and not for good.

Historically the pumas' (didn't have Jaguares pre 2016 so have to use this as a proxy) strengths were defense, scrum and pressure. 2015 came along and suddenly we showed moments of brilliance in offense.
So, at least my mind but i'm pretty sure i am not alone here, the idea of combining strong defense, good set pieces and fast open play when we get the ball was an easy sell, i bought the cool aid, the store, the lot.

So not only did we not manage to improve our attack, but our scrum is not even the shadow of what it once was, and some of our defenses are embarrassing to watch. Sometimes it's as if they were not even trying.

Silver lining is that i believe we have enough talent to give most a run for their points and beat nearly all in a good day. We need to channel that talent properly and we've been doing that so badly that i don't see anywhere else to go but up. A natural optimist, that's me.

Zanella · Feb 15, 2018

Cruz_del_Sur said:
Bienvenido

I agree with this, but here, precisely, is where the problem lies. Couple of points so i'll try to structure the answer the best i can.

First, and most importantly, 2015 was an outlier in terms of performance for the pumas. We had our best TRC (if i recall correctly, it was the only time we didn't finish last) and we punched above our weight in the world cup: we gave the All Blacks a decent run for their money and, partly due to 5 key injuries (gotta mention it) we tore Ireland a new one. We all bought into the hype after that.

Second, media and fans, home and abroad. Instead of acknowledging it was, precisely an outlier, we believed we had the tools not only to compete against the best, but to beat them. That prooved to be dead wrong. Again, this wasn't just Argentine media/fans, i recall international media saying things of the like "we might have created a monster" when discussing jaguares pre season in 2016.

Third, we seem to have a lot of trouble learning from our mistakes. You can claim "i was surprised"/ "we are not familiar with competition/opponents" only once, and Jaguares management did so in 2016. Ironically, i wholeheartedly believe we played better in 2016 than in 2017. I recall Jaguares throwing everything but the sink at the Chiefs in 2016 and losing by an inch, even unfairly.
The untrained eye will tell you: "wait a min, look at the stats, we did better in 2017." ********! The only reason we appear to have done better is because we faced weaker opposition (NZ teams in 2016, Aus conference in 2017).

In 2016, at least i knew what the team was trying to do: open, offensive and borderline suicidal rugby. I thought it was the wrong decision given our skill set, but at least i understood the rationale behind it: this is the rugby we want to play, it takes time to develop it, we will make mistakes, lose games. I understand, and again, even thou i disagreed with it, i even found it entertaining to watch.
Then 2017 came along and, to be completely fair, i have no idea, whatsoever, what they are trying to do. I don't think we can blame players for this. I see no evidence for that. The change in style was evident and not for good.

Historically the pumas' (didn't have Jaguares pre 2016 so have to use this as a proxy) strengths were defense, scrum and pressure. 2015 came along and suddenly we showed moments of brilliance in offense.
So, at least my mind but i'm pretty sure i am not alone here, the idea of combining strong defense, good set pieces and fast open play when we get the ball was an easy sell, i bought the cool aid, the store, the lot.

So not only did we not manage to improve our attack, but our scrum is not even the shadow of what it once was, and some of our defenses are embarrassing to watch. Sometimes it's as if they were not even trying.

Silver lining is that i believe we have enough talent to give most a run for their points and beat nearly all in a good day. We need to channel that talent properly and we've been doing that so badly that i don't see anywhere else to go but up. A natural optimist, that's me.

I totally agree with your reply, and i would add that hiring for Jaguares the exact same guys that were playing in the pumas that year was something kind of hurried. That rwc made the uar believe that we were at the same level with the powerhouses. I am convinced that the fact of not allowing the boys playing in the northern hemisphere to play in the pumas has harmed their level.
I also believe that everyone sees jaguares super rugby performances as failures because they were expecting the players to perform as they did in that wc, maybe if they would have been considered as underdogs from the beggining (as the sunwolves) we wouldn´t be talking about failures but about a new team that has lots of things to improve, as they actually are.
I also think that 2016 was way better than 2017, but i thought i was the only one who did, 2017 looked as if we were trying to offload and play the ball just as the nz teams without knowing how to do it. We had too much handling errors.
As i said at the top, i couldn't agree more with your post.

FNS · Feb 15, 2018

We came into SR with half a team from RC15 and no idea how to play. with Ledesma probably we are going to have some idea of how to play but you cant growth talent out of thin air. We still lack some key players in several positions.

We need Aus group to be better and take a toll on Sharks, Bulls and Stormers. So the gap in points is no bigger than 6/7 points.(off course all should lose to NZ teams also xD)

Brigantine · Feb 15, 2018

Brigantine said:
The loss of the Cheetahs/Kings/Sunwolves from the South African conference will make it harder for the Sharks and Stormers to pile up points on the table.

The move from 6 to 8 conference games also gives the Blues and Highlanders a more tortuous fixture list.

And then for Australia, they lost their 2nd ranked team and gained the Sunwolves. Those 8 conference games will suit them just fine thanks.

I think the 5th NZ team can be written off, (not necessarily the Blues), but watch out for that 2nd team in the Aus conf - Probably the Sunwolves

That 8th play-off spot is the exact middle of the table, so the target is roughly 8/16 wins to get there. So in the Australian conference that's more like 6/8 conf wins and 2/8 cross-conf wins, while in the NZ conference it's more like 2/8 conf wins and 6/8 cross-conf wins.

This draw is even better for the Sunwolves than I realized.

The conventional wisdom about the South African teams seems to be that the Lions and Sharks are the strong ones this season. So if your target is 2 cross-conference wins, then the teams you want home games against are the Stormers and Bulls, and then the Jaguares and Blues. (and write off the away games)

The Sunwolves' home cross-conference games - all in Tokyo, where home advantage has made a big difference for them - are the Chiefs, Blues, Stormers and Bulls.

3 out of 4 ain't bad!

TRF_heineken · Feb 15, 2018

Brigantine said:
This draw is even better for the Sunwolves than I realized.

The conventional wisdom about the South African teams seems to be that the Lions and Sharks are the strong ones this season. So if your target is 2 cross-conference wins, then the teams you want home games against are the Stormers and Bulls, and then the Jaguares and Blues. (and write off the away games)

The Sunwolves' home cross-conference games - all in Tokyo, where home advantage has made a big difference for them - are the Chiefs, Blues, Stormers and Bulls.

3 out of 4 ain't bad!

True, But the big question will be how will the Jaguares and Sunwolves perform this year. It's the first time they are part of the 15-team format, and South Africa dropped 2 teams and Australia 1 team with the teams remaining, only getting stronger with regard to forming stronger squads.

Brigantine · Feb 15, 2018

Yeah, if the Wolves get poor results despite the stars all aligning in their favour, it will be a really damning indictment.

The Jaguares will be made to look terrible regardless, but they will at least have excuses. (unless they seriously over-perform)

If the winnable games are vs Jags/Reds/Rebels/Wolves and at home vs Stormers/Bulls/Waratahs/Brumbies/Blues... then the Sunwolves have 9 winnable games and the Jaguares only 5. The Jags will have to show real consistency to be even vaguely mid-table. The Wolves only need to be firing half the time.

unrated · Feb 15, 2018

Im positive that the Jags and Sunwolves will massively improve this year. The tournament is going to be tight until the last round. Looking forward to one of the most entertaining Super rugby tournament in years.

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