[2017 Rugby Championship] Round 3: New Zealand v Argentina (09/09/2017)

[Cruz_del_Sur]

Cordero was egregious. Missed quite a few key tackles, he was non existent at chasing high balls and nowhere to be found on offense (this last one not entirely his fault).
He's had moments of sheer brilliance in the past which led me to believe he has the potential to be our best offensive player, but i'm getting the impression i might have been wrong, dead wrong.

 

[mania]

Hansen won't let McKenzie kick as that would be a sign that McKenzie should be a confirmed long term starter. I think that's his mindset anyway. To me every week you should just let your best kicker on the day kick.

and fair nuff. imo dMac hasnt earnt his starting spot yet.
makes too many mistakes and those could prove costly in a tight game....but you gotta love all the opportunities he creates. i'm torn!!
a great player who creates opportunities every time he touches the ball vs someone who makes costly errors.
sorry have to lean towards a player who has a low error rate but dMac is young ,has a lot of evolving to do and will learn to be even better

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

and fair nuff. imo dMac hasnt earnt his starting spot yet.
makes too many mistakes and those could prove costly in a tight game....but you gotta love all the opportunities he creates. i'm torn!!
a great player who creates opportunities every time he touches the ball vs someone who makes costly errors.
sorry have to lean towards a player who has a low error rate but dMac is young ,has a lot of evolving to do and will learn to be even better

Sounds like Beaudie Barrett to a t(ee)...

 

[mania]

Sounds like Beaudie Barrett to a t(ee)...

how ? barrett played well and other than place kicking didnt make any huge glaringly obvious errors. dMac dropped 3 high balls? bad kick that almost went backwards. no other dmac errors come to mind at the mo but he hardly had a perfect game. dynamic and creating heasp of chances but still error prone.

 

[mania]

cant say this about many coaches but hansen gets islanders. no disrespect to robbieDeans but he struggled to get the most out of his PI's when he was coaching the ABS. hammett didnt get it either.
hansen understands that islanders usually wont speak up in front of elders out of (some say misplaced) respect. doesnt mean they have nothng to say just means they want to get onto the field and express themselves and let their actions do the talking.

Respect Hansen

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby...ing-nicknames-and-admiration-in-equal-measure

 

[Larksea]

was an interesting game, I mean it was close for so long but in the end a comfortable 6 trys to 1 victory

Probably the biggest take from this game is the Injury to Joe Moody who was amazing again. It effectively means we will play the remainder of the season without both of our #1 props. Joe Moody has been nothing short of a revelation and I think its safe to say that hes the #1 loosehead in NZ by some margin right now. I would say I have some concerns over an aging Crockett taking over the starting role going against South Aftica. As I said after the lions series, Crockett is am amazing and pretty unique player but well past his prime and maybe not our best option at test level anymore, with Joe Moody our clean #1 I would have liked to have seen a younger/future player taking over that bench role. Its not just that hes 34 but hes got a huge number of miles on the clock.

Anyway... Erly on Barrett missing goal and fantastic goal kicking front the Pumas kept it closer than it should have been. Then for long periods the AB's struggled to get any posession but when they did they looked deadly and did score.

Fifita was excellent but did make some errors of judgement on defense
Dagg & nehe made solid returns but did struggle a bit to get into the game
McKenzie was very good again but also made some errors that were fairly uncharacteristic for him, a couple of high balls went down and the botched high kick. Those aren't the sort of errors he makes he is typically very good in those areas. he did lay on the first try and had a hand in a couple of others. Rest of his game was fairly solid. i'd really like him to have a complete game, the kind of game he is really capable of to boost his confidence. This is an issue a lot of players have, I think its hard for a player like McKenzie coming from the chiefs where he is the man and basically runs the show then to come into the AB's and in many ways be forced to play a reduced role and have a lot more structure. It takes some getting used too. But I really hope he keeps getting game time. he is already showing how good he is and its only going to get better.
SBW was a bit of a mixed bag, soild and not bad at all with one absolutely brilliant play. Probably just expect a bit more from him but he just hasn't hit full form this year and the suspension really halted his progression.
ALB was pretty good I thought, solid all round and a brilliant NRL style finish.
Romano was amazing in the first 20min with some impressive ball carrying and then seemed to vanish from the game somewhat.
Ardie Savea was very busy but I think we did miss Canes influence in the first 40. Savea tackles well but Cane makes dominant tackles and really slows the ball down, he generates defensive pressure. I wasn't surprised to see the early sub.
Barrett had an ok game other than the goal kicking, some really good play but he was also a big target for puma defenders. Clear gameplan targeting him.

 

[Larksea]

cant say this about many coaches but hansen gets islanders. no disrespect to robbieDeans but he struggled to get the most out of his PI's when he was coaching the ABS. hammett didnt get it either.
hansen understands that islanders usually wont speak up in front of elders out of (some say misplaced) respect. doesnt mean they have nothng to say just means they want to get onto the field and express themselves and let their actions do the talking.

Respect Hansen

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby...ing-nicknames-and-admiration-in-equal-measure

Hansen does deserve respect for that but IMO it comes from Grahame Henry. I think that is where Hansen picked up these skills. If anything Henry was an expert at coaching islanders, I think it was the most influential trait of his coaching skills. And that is how he made a name for himself. As a teacher and headmaster, then coaching Grammar then Kelston Boys in Auckland. And just look at the examples of players Hansen talked about, Mealamu, Kaino and Rokocoko... All Aucklanders, all players that came through under Henry.

 

[mania]

was an interesting game, I mean it was close for so long but in the end a comfortable 6 trys to 1 victory

agree. moody is the biggest talking point from the game. huge loss, tho saying that i have a lot faith in hames coming in and delivering.
agree about crockett. he's not a starter and def an impact prop. crockett struggles vs the big boys in scrums and they dont get much bigger than the boks.
fifita is good offensively but has work to do on his defence and contact areas. showed a big tackle by fifita but his head was on the wrong side and he's lucky he didnt knock himself out. a bit absence in the clean outs and securing rucks /mauls but then so is squire so they have an equal footing in the race to be kaino's replacement. imo this is still kaino's jersey to lose. kaino is up against 2 players that are physically and athletically better than kaino is but he's an old wily campaigner that has a lot of experience on his side.
dmac needs to cut out his errors
SBW imo got a pass mark...just. was physical without being creative or overly clever. SBW is trying to improve his physical game and imo it doesnt suit him . he needs to play smarter coupled with his new found physicality.
imo ALB and crotty are our incumbent centre pairing. whilst they give away size and power i prefer their intelligence and desire to contribute.
romano did exactly what he was brought in for.
ardie was busy but agree that cane is still the starting openside with his agression and brutality.

 

[mania]

ps retallick as ever was awesome

 

[mania]

Hansen does deserve respect for that but IMO it comes from Grahame Henry.

agree. teds book has a chapter of when he started coaching auckland and the team was full of islanders. ted was asked if he could tone down his colourful language as most of the islanders were churchies. henry was surprised but started his road of getting to understand and how to maximise utility from his islanders.
lots of coaches dont get it and if youre coaching in NZ you gotta learn it quick.

best coach who didnt understand islanders imho was laurieMains. he struggled with the young islanders and just didnt get them. to his credit he knew he didnt get them and he knew they didnt get him. so mains got bunce, walterLittle and ericRush to translate for him.
a young guy name jonahLomu performed wonders under mains

 

[Kiwiwomble]

thoughts on sopoaga? he had the benefit of coming in against i tiring opposition but thought he played well, sat a bit deeper and trusted in the skill of the guys around him to get back over the advantage line and to give himself a little more time to unleash the backline

ok, so some mixed views on a few guys...how good was Fifita with ball in hand though? if we can nurture the rest of his game, between him and squire i think blindside is covered for a while

 

[Larksea]

I like Sopoaga's (no n ) game, I think he has improved some aspects of his game like his defense this year and he is a genuinely reliable goal kicker unlike what we have had from Barrett & Cruden over the last few years. he's a different sort of 10 as well which is good because he changes the mode of attack when he is on, he has good established combinations with the Smiths & Naholo.

He's hardly put a foot wrong but he is behind Barrett in the pecking order, Barrett is a bit off his game right now but still playing well enough to retain his spot. And you only have to go back a week earlier and his goal kicking won us a game...

All Blacks are at their best when they have world class players on the bench, we aren't really missing Cruden right now because Sopoaga's doing such a good job. We need a lift in other areas of the bench.

Fifita's ball carrying was impressive, I think he will need to adjust his style a bit against the boks but if he hits gaps he will still be effective.

I still see squire as the main man at 6, I see him above Kaino right now. Kaino had a poor lions series by his standards, he has struggled a bit and squire has made huge improvements and operates at a high intensity for long periods.

I think we need to manage Reads workload better, last year he was worked to the brink and had to have a lot of time off this season and only really came back into the frame not long before the super rugby finals. 80min every test is going to take its toll. I think we need to get Squire/Fifita to the point where we can rest Read at key times. I would have liked to have seen Luke Whitelock in the squad he seems like a very good natural replacement for Read.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

Can't argue with any of that

 

[Nubiwan]

From far away, and listening to folk mention Crockett, my impression is that scrums often collapse on his side, and he is rarely penalized for it. He's a tall prop, and I find he's often bent at the waist and cannot support the load. Just drops himself. Often, his opponent has been penalized.

Noticed this mainly in SR Games with the crusaders. Might be nothing, but it goes back few years this theory of mine. Be interesting to see him V the boks, with a few more miles under his belt.

 

[The Jones Boy]

Hansen definitely deserves respect from NZ as a coach who can harness the Polynesian players. He learned it well from being understudy to Henry.
Graham Henry was the second, and greatest architect of bringing Polynesian players forward as leaders.
John Hart was the code breaker.
At Auckland he developed loads of players some who went on to grace the black jersey.
Michael Jones (the archetypal christian polynesian role model) being the stand out but other players of undeniable quality came through Hart as well; Olo Brown, Joe Stanley and he oversaw players like Tuigamala and Eroni Clarke.
Hart and Henry understood the difference in psyche that the Polynesian players had and worked to effectively to integrate them into one unit.
Over the last 30 years it has often been said that Auckland only achieve greatness when the brown and the white players find a balance in the team. When that balance is not struck then Auckland suffer.
Hart laid down the template, Henry took it up and pushed it further.
With Auckland being the biggest Polynesian city in the world there is a monster resource there that needs to be fostered and cultivated through a lens of understanding the cultural differences.
It clearly isn't an easy task as only two coaches have managed it... but when they get it right, the results speak for themselves.