looking through the up and coming talent and current crop of players, i have a feeling that south africa will develop into a truly great team with a number of amazing players coming through in most postions and a good player base at the momen thus leading them to challenge the all blacks for the number one ranking, who do you think will be the great teams of the coming years and why?
-
Help Support The Rugby Forum :
challenge to supremacy
- Thread starter jordiev
- Start date
Big Ewis
Hall of Fame
well I would like to see that (not being sarcastic, I'd literally want to see that happening) but it doesn't seem like it's happening...unless there are some amazing U20 guys I never heard of who'll be there and they'll be great by 2015.
They've had a super solid squad since that 2007 cup, but never close to that excellence of then. A lot of guys from that class are growing old and...I dunno. Who'd you have in mind ?
I (amongst many obviously) didn't think they looked good at all this year. Overall 2012 was a failure I'd imagine as seen by them...there aren't too many positives that let me imagine a much much better next few yrs...
I think ppl who are reading into that last AB defeat (you already see my point...) are far-fetching. And THEY btw do have ways of improving. Lots of guys who can do some maturing, still a lot of room for improvement for the Crudens and Janes etc...Carter n McCaw won't be there by 2015 though right ??..
I dunno, honestly what I've seen this year is the margin between GREAT teams, very good teams and then good teams completely thin up. The Boks look TOTALLY accessible right now, Samoa look srsly dangerous for the first time officially (beyond just one nice RWC upset I mean), Australia (even full force) don't seem like they're going to put 45 with 8 tries on teams like England and France any more...
England, as flawed as they are atm, have shown they could finish 2nd in the 6N already and then draw one in SA and then beat NZ...and it's not like they're perfect right now, yet they still managed to upset/draw with the world's best 2.
France have looked fantastic, but we do often and then under-produce; though it seems a bit different this time around, but surely a match we should have won and will lose is in the making as we speak...but in terms of 'potential' of upsetting the top3, ABSOLUTELY no doubt...
Wales look like Wales again. i.e. a solid team but aren't as imposing as the '11 RWC side...Ireland's looking great...
I dunno, teams are just stacking up in the Top10 there, and the margins are lesser and lesser, with just NZ comfortably ahead of the pack but still mortal nonetheless and forgotten sides surfacing out of nowhere to claim good seeds (ARG, SAM, TON in order...).
They've had a super solid squad since that 2007 cup, but never close to that excellence of then. A lot of guys from that class are growing old and...I dunno. Who'd you have in mind ?
I (amongst many obviously) didn't think they looked good at all this year. Overall 2012 was a failure I'd imagine as seen by them...there aren't too many positives that let me imagine a much much better next few yrs...
I think ppl who are reading into that last AB defeat (you already see my point...) are far-fetching. And THEY btw do have ways of improving. Lots of guys who can do some maturing, still a lot of room for improvement for the Crudens and Janes etc...Carter n McCaw won't be there by 2015 though right ??..
I dunno, honestly what I've seen this year is the margin between GREAT teams, very good teams and then good teams completely thin up. The Boks look TOTALLY accessible right now, Samoa look srsly dangerous for the first time officially (beyond just one nice RWC upset I mean), Australia (even full force) don't seem like they're going to put 45 with 8 tries on teams like England and France any more...
England, as flawed as they are atm, have shown they could finish 2nd in the 6N already and then draw one in SA and then beat NZ...and it's not like they're perfect right now, yet they still managed to upset/draw with the world's best 2.
France have looked fantastic, but we do often and then under-produce; though it seems a bit different this time around, but surely a match we should have won and will lose is in the making as we speak...but in terms of 'potential' of upsetting the top3, ABSOLUTELY no doubt...
Wales look like Wales again. i.e. a solid team but aren't as imposing as the '11 RWC side...Ireland's looking great...
I dunno, teams are just stacking up in the Top10 there, and the margins are lesser and lesser, with just NZ comfortably ahead of the pack but still mortal nonetheless and forgotten sides surfacing out of nowhere to claim good seeds (ARG, SAM, TON in order...).
the Boks have a really good set of forwards coming through etzebeth, botha, coatzee, du toit
then you have the backs three promising flyhalves currently in the setup then taute, joordan, serfoentien and I'm sure a few southafricans could add a few more
obviously theres a lot of what if's and depending on how they develop but from what i can see the group of talented youngsters they have are the only ones that may develop into as you said a great team at this moment.. obviously I'm not a expert on all nations
but Australia cant seem to get all their talented backs fit in a team all at once and they seem to not have much powers in the forwards
England are hyped up a lot more than they are actually capable of in my opinion a brave group of players but no real standout players
and france they have alooooot of talent and a lot of youngsters but a lot of them struggle to get game time at club level to develop and their is also the matter of blowing hot and cold far to often, your french yourself is their a lot of potential about or are their any notable weak spots you fear about in the future?
then you have the backs three promising flyhalves currently in the setup then taute, joordan, serfoentien and I'm sure a few southafricans could add a few more
obviously theres a lot of what if's and depending on how they develop but from what i can see the group of talented youngsters they have are the only ones that may develop into as you said a great team at this moment.. obviously I'm not a expert on all nations
but Australia cant seem to get all their talented backs fit in a team all at once and they seem to not have much powers in the forwards
England are hyped up a lot more than they are actually capable of in my opinion a brave group of players but no real standout players
and france they have alooooot of talent and a lot of youngsters but a lot of them struggle to get game time at club level to develop and their is also the matter of blowing hot and cold far to often, your french yourself is their a lot of potential about or are their any notable weak spots you fear about in the future?
Big Ewis
Hall of Fame
well hey I'll say this about France, thing I've been saying all along since the first test against Aus this past Nov. I think we've got it all. It's just a matter of coming through...
Good backs, fast wingers, can be excellent at the breakdown, very inspired (the french flair type fast execution and good ball movement is there...but not every night though !!), Michalak and his play-making, good/excellent kicking.
Then we've got a reputed scrum, we've got some flankers/no.8's that can do some serious damage (Picamoles, Nyanga and his monster try against ARG, Dusautoir not even back yet) on both attack and defense.
And overall our defense has been absolutely spot-on in November...which in itself could have been enough to win with a few kicks added..
Our depth is definitely a strength, as you've said.
But then: every major team has its own attributes, its own strengths, and on a given day, we can easily succumb to any good side playing a good match where everything they usually do fits well. Surely we'll start committing silly fouls as usual, look lost at the breakdown all of a sudden, lose our rhythm and ultimately the game.
That may be our flaw (on par with the inconsistency issue): that we don't have something divinely great enough to rely on that can save us at all times. But I think only the AB's have that...to jack a try or 3 out of their asses and all of a sudden win the match.
All I'm saying here (bragging about our many qualities) is both realistic but also will be tested of course in Feb. We've got some tough ones, like one in Twickenham. And we've got some sort of mental block there, not a good record historically...that'll be a good test. We all know about the psychological aspect/game with France, a live by it die by it affair...but "physically" or structurally, our abilities are right up there at the top I can say with confidence, yeh.
Boks: yeah I know what you mean...but I just don't see anything close to a 2007 "challenge to supremacy". If it happens, I'm happy. I'm a Bok fan. But I wouldn't bet my money on them being no.1 any time soon, like...
Good backs, fast wingers, can be excellent at the breakdown, very inspired (the french flair type fast execution and good ball movement is there...but not every night though !!), Michalak and his play-making, good/excellent kicking.
Then we've got a reputed scrum, we've got some flankers/no.8's that can do some serious damage (Picamoles, Nyanga and his monster try against ARG, Dusautoir not even back yet) on both attack and defense.
And overall our defense has been absolutely spot-on in November...which in itself could have been enough to win with a few kicks added..
Our depth is definitely a strength, as you've said.
But then: every major team has its own attributes, its own strengths, and on a given day, we can easily succumb to any good side playing a good match where everything they usually do fits well. Surely we'll start committing silly fouls as usual, look lost at the breakdown all of a sudden, lose our rhythm and ultimately the game.
That may be our flaw (on par with the inconsistency issue): that we don't have something divinely great enough to rely on that can save us at all times. But I think only the AB's have that...to jack a try or 3 out of their asses and all of a sudden win the match.
All I'm saying here (bragging about our many qualities) is both realistic but also will be tested of course in Feb. We've got some tough ones, like one in Twickenham. And we've got some sort of mental block there, not a good record historically...that'll be a good test. We all know about the psychological aspect/game with France, a live by it die by it affair...but "physically" or structurally, our abilities are right up there at the top I can say with confidence, yeh.
Boks: yeah I know what you mean...but I just don't see anything close to a 2007 "challenge to supremacy". If it happens, I'm happy. I'm a Bok fan. But I wouldn't bet my money on them being no.1 any time soon, like...
Similar threads
