[EOYT] Ireland v Australia 16/11/13

[BRSTLDRGN]

Aviva Stadium, kick off 17:45 GMT​

 

[Feicarsinn]

So we have two of these threads now?

 

[profitius]

Australia have some star players but a few plodders too. Ireland have a better pack, Aus better backs. Cooper, Folau and Genia are the main men for Australia.


Bookies have Aus 1 point favourites but I think Irelands pack can close them down and Ireland were very clinical against Samoa when in the danger zone.

 

[lynam1104]

We know how to beat them and have the players to do it. the biggest thing we need to do is get to Genia, if we do that Aus general don't function. If we can't stop the quick ball then Folua and Cooper could have field day.

 

[InsaneAsylum]

I think that's the key point, everyone is expecting Ireland to repeat what they did to us at RWC2011 and I have to agree, I don't think Ireland can beat us backs vs. backs. Ireland's best chance is to monster our forwards again, and disrupt Genia's ball... the questions is, if it's blindingly obvious to everyone, I hope the coach and the team can see it coming and have already devised something to counter it.

 

[Groundhog]

Well with the return of Johnny Cash, his wheelbarrows of money and his sexy wraparounds I hope to god we don't keep kicking to that Aussie back three because they will punish us badly. Fitzgerald and Jennings called up. I think Jennings has been poor this season but no options otherwise. ****** off to see that Earls is injured. Persistent injuries to such a talented winger is a shame given our lack of creativity there last week. Chuffed for Fitzgerald, he's been great in his snippets, and I expect him to be class. Hopefully Cooper has a trademarked wobbler, our pack eat them and we shut off their back three.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Assuming both packs are fairly even, I expect this one to be decided in the half backs. Both pairs have class outside them, BOD, Folau, Bowe (hopefully), Beale etc..., and looking at them I reckon most would agree that Genia is better than Murray and Sexton is better than Cooper but all are capable of out playing each other. I disagree with people saying their backs are better but our pack is because I reckon aspects of their pack is better than ours, mainly turning over possesion, and aspects of our backs are better than theirs, Physicality and defence and BOD! So whichever pair of half backs does the business on the day their team will win. Therefore I'm praying that Murray bullies Genia like he's done to smaller 9s in the past.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Dominate the Aus pack- very doable for Ireland- and put heavy pressure on Genia and thus Cooper- again, very doable- while containing Folau (how fast has this guy grown into Union, man, what an athlete!) - probably both the easiest and hardest if that makes sense- so I expect Ireland to be favorites at home but if Aus can get parity up front they could look very good indeed. Kuridrani is also a big threat ball in hand but I expect BOD to have him covered or face ridicule.

My prediction; Ireland by 5.

 

[Big Ewis]

Oh mighty Australia, where art thou ?
I've been watching a bunch of 2009-2011 Tri-nations matches lately, the days when Australia could lead against NZ for a large portion of the game, beat S.A. with a ton of tries....God I loved that side. Sooooo damn good for the eyes.

The Aussie backs still are quite substantially superior to those of the Irish...but besides fine work in the loose, that's all Australia has got.
Cooper had his good game against Italy in a match that was "irrelevant". They'd have beaten the Squadra Azzura regardless, and well. Maybe this one in Aviva is the one he starts making random super high kick-passes to no one in particular, throws a pass over the head of his teammate and into the 3rd row in the stands at a crucial moment...

Call this lack of faith in the Irish, but I think the Wallabies are still hungry (despite their most grueling year ever, for sure). I think their stop in Rome gave them a larger appetite seeing how they could dismantle a side. I see they still have plenty of energy yet, maybe by the time they hit Scotland or Wales they'll be corpses (?). And I see that Australian Rugby motto working: no girth up front, but who cares, tries are worth the most points.
They can give away penalties, just as long as they contain the Irish attack and run in a few dazzling scores of their own when Ireland is one step too slow to stay with them, or get a little weary as the minutes keep piling up.

I believe they should have drawn for sure in Twickenham, at least. I don't think Ireland will pose a bigger threat, with all due respect.

Australia by 5-8.

 

[big ginger 8]

Quite superior my ass.

And how are they at liberty to give in penalties, when we'll have a kicker who should be able to punish them from anywhere in there own half.

 

[Big Ewis]

Quite superior my ass.

And how are they at liberty to give in penalties, when we'll have a kicker who should be able to punish them from anywhere in there own half.

:lol: wow, what a reaction !!
Uhmmm, what can I tell you...I'm an Ireland fan too...Australia seem like they're going to take this one imo. Anything else in my text you'd like to address and discuss ?

Let me ask you this: your national side is hosting Australia, and the only comments you've made so far on this whole thread are that they don't have superior backs, and that Ireland has a good kicker. How about you give me your own sentiment on how you'd imagine things will go.

 

[big ginger 8]

:lol: wow, what a reaction !!
Uhmmm, what can I tell you...I'm an Ireland fan too...Australia seem like they're going to take this one imo. Anything else in my text you'd like to address and discuss ?

Let me ask you this: your national side is hosting Australia, and the only comments you've made so far on this whole thread are that they don't have superior backs, and that Ireland has a good kicker. How about you give me your own sentiment on how you'd imagine things will go.

Well I made another thread but it was cut down in it's prime.

You're not an Ireland fan you say it a lot but yeah...you're not really. You have shown numerous times that you know little of Irish rugby. You said a lot but much of it's rambling. We should have no fear of Australia, they've been woeful this year and we have a good recent record against them. They could go out and give a masterclass but it's unlikely and if we're anywhere near the team we want to be we should win.

Here's the likely starting backlines.

9. Murray vs Genia: Genia's a better player but has been by his standards overall poor this year. Murray has been continually improving, still needs to show he can continually deliver quick ball.
10. Sexton vs Cooper: Cooper's had a bit of a resurgence this year improving his kicking and tackling. However he has still shown he does not have the full mental strength required and when stuff starts going wrong he can easily snowball. I don't need to say much on Sexton given how much I've said before. Just this will do; Sexton in a Joe Schmidt backline is a sight to behold.
11. McFadden vs Cummins: Both in my mind at least kind of similar players Both very hard working and strong carriers. Cummins is more standout at the winger stuff but as McFadden is really a centre he has some skills which come in handy.
12. Marshall vs Toomua: Both new on the international scene and both have overall impressed in the chances they've had. Both have experience at 10 with Toomua obviously having more there and both are strong carriers but Marshall's better there.
13. O'Driscoll vs Kuindrani: Not much I can say on BO'D that hasn't been said. Kuindrani has done well since getting his chance but O'Driscoll has contained bigger, faster, stronger centres.
14. Bowe vs Ahsley-Cooper: Personally I think AAC is a much better 13, he'll do well but nothing wow. Bowe has a strike rate of neary 1 try every other international game also very strong in the air. Will probably still be nursing a slight injury and was quiet in the last game, will be interesting to see how he gets on.
15. Kearney vs Folau: The aerial battle between these two should be fantastic. Folau has been outstanding this year while Kearney merely solid.

So I wouldn't easily call one backline superior and definately not call one quite substantially superior. I alos think that you don't get the difference that Schmidt makes to attack compared to Kidney.

Are you quite happy now?

 

[Darwin]

I agree with big ginger 8. There is no way that the Aussie backline is substantially superior to the Irish backline. BG8 has summed up the players well already so I don't need to go into much furter detail, but this is one of the least threatening Aussie backlines I have seen in some time.

It is interesting what has happened to the Aussie side this season. Traditionally they have been stacked with x-factor players in the backs and even in the loose-forwards. They had a huge number of threats on attack, but had a number of glaring weaknesses too. They are far more conservative this season - they don't have near as many threats, but they don't have as many obvious weaknesses either.

 

[Big Ewis]

big ginger:
well that sure is better than the first comment, but that attitude ! That attitude ! So unnecessary...
And no I'm not particular happy, but you should be. You've written a complete, articulate post.

Allow me to correct terminology: when I say I'm an Ireland fan, I mean I support Ireland. In deed, I don't know much about Irish Rugby at all. I just support Ireland, and like to watch them play when they're hot (Wales 2013 first half), and like to watch them succeed, most of the time.

Australia's backline is the one thing that have kept them alive this year (that and loose forwards). Globally, they most certainly have impressed me a whole lot more than the Irish backline so far in 2013. We'll just have to see how they both perform.

A large majority of the voting people on Planet Rugby have voted for Ireland winning this weekend, I thought it was interesting to see such a majority.

 

[big ginger 8]

The attitude is becaue you're forcing me to explain stuff when I should be working.

Here's the backline that finished the 6 Nations as in on the pitch at the end of the Italy game.

9.Murray
10. Jackson (at the time suffering a huge crisis of confidence)
11. O'Mahony (a flanker)
12. Madigan (a 10)
13 O'Driscoll
14. Gilroy (new on the scene, not first choice)
15. Kearney (not too long back from injury and not playing well)

In 2013 we have well and truely been ****ed over by injury. I don't want to moan becaue you'll very rarely have a fully fit team but it was an epidemic. The backs were also being coached by a defense coach and the overall gameplan decided by a gombeen. We now have one of the best backs coaches in world rugby. What yo have see in 2013 cannot really be properly counted


Darwin that's a very well made and good point about the swing from both extremes to conservatism from the Aussies.

 

[Big Ewis]

The attitude is becaue you're forcing me to explain stuff when I should be working.

well I'm not responsible for that, but I'll still apologize as a gesture of sympathy towards you
I just prefer debate over criticism, negative remarks etc...

Good luck to both sides. I *SUPPORT* both sides, so I can't be disappointed by the outcome of this. And yes, I'm aware of Ireland's injuries.

 

[Darwin]

big ginger:
well that sure is better than the first comment, but that attitude ! That attitude ! So unnecessary...
And no I'm not particular happy, but you should be. You've written a complete, articulate post.

Allow me to correct terminology: when I say I'm an Ireland fan, I mean I support Ireland. In deed, I don't know much about Irish Rugby at all. I just support Ireland, and like to watch them play when they're hot (Wales 2013 first half), and like to watch them succeed, most of the time.

Australia's backline is the one thing that have kept them alive this year (that and loose forwards). Globally, they most certainly have impressed me a whole lot more than the Irish backline so far in 2013. We'll just have to see how they both perform.

A large majority of the voting people on Planet Rugby have voted for Ireland winning this weekend, I thought it was interesting to see such a majority.

Out of curiosity how many times have you watched Australia play this season? Who in their backline has impressed you?

As I have mentioned before, the Australian backline has been very average this season. In general they have been no more effective than their tight-five. Likewise their loose-forwards have been very average (apart from Hooper). In previous years it would be fair to say they have had strong a strong backline and good loose-forwards but a poor tight-five, but that hasn't really been the case this season. They really only have one attacking move in their backline this season and that is giving the ball to Isael Folau (and hope he pulls off some magic) - I would imagine over half Australia's tries this season would have been either scored or set up by Folau.

 

[Big Ewis]

all int'l matches. It's true Folau was doing absolutely everything at a point, and I'm aware of course of their issues this year and all...but I don't think the Irish backline can come remotely close to doing what Australia did in Argentina, in NZ in Bledisloe 3, or more recently in Rome. Point made ?

Let's not forget they've scored tries in every game this year, at least one (except against he Boks). And the Australian back play is always putting something interesting together, whether they go all the way for a try or get a penalty or whatever.
Lealifano also had some awesome moments. Ashley-Cooper hasn't as good this year, but still has had some fine Wallaby moments. And just overall man, the Wallabies have managed some excellent attack, some good, and then some not so great.

Yes, Hooper has been very good, but the other loose fowards have been meh, but sometimes good too.

To me there's no question, but my stance has been declared, no need to rub it in, I'll attract more angry comments again...

 

[big ginger 8]

Argentina last year, Wales 6N...they're intermittent performances but we are capable of them. If you want to see how our backs should hopefully do look at Leinster highlights from the 201/11 season to the one just gone, that should give you a much better idea. Australia when they get going will likely blow a team out of the water due to a high pace around the team but they find it hard to get going when it's a proper tight match and they need a score.

Btw I think it was you who said they didn't see the Samoa match. Yes they were weakened but there is some nice back play and invention particulary in the 2nd, 4th and 5th. That is all I'll say on the subject because I don't see you changing your rather set point of view.

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[irelandfan123]

http://cdn.greenandgoldrugby.com/80...2013/11/2013-Grand-Slam-Tour-Week-1-and-2.jpg
You'll have to zoom in